Topic: Store your seed phrase offline (Read 712 times)

Instead of storing your keys on a piece of paper, how about you store them on a memory stick that can only be accessed via a password? I don't worry about a fire breaking out in my house because I always check the stove/oven every time I leave the house to make sure it's turned off and even check it during the day when no one else is around.

be careful that your method of storing your keys, is not so complicated that it will protect yourself in the end...

storing seed phrases online is stupidity, but if you shuffle the phrases and store them in a different location by memorizing the combination it may be safe to store them online. Although I don't see any point to store your wallet seed online, store them offline will be lesser riskier than storing them online or in a Gmail or online note application.
I used to do the same, I saved them on a note connected to my email address, for accessing them both on my phone and laptop or any device I use. But now memorize my password and tweaked them to use in different places.

Aside from the fact that it is a seed phrase, any information involving passwords should be saved offline. I used to save my passwords in my email, but when I started seeing people get hacked, I changed my habits and started saving everything offline in multiple locations to protect it from natural disasters like fire outbreaks or any other type of disaster because, as the adage goes, "Not your keys, not your coin."

That's a good one to store you're phrase offline, because using email to save your phrase or private key is very high risks in the sense that, the email account maybe compromised alongside for hacker to have access towards your phrase code, therefore is better to saved your details offline than online.

Hmm, private keys and .dat files. I assume you are talking about Bitcoin Core's wallet.dat files or are you using some other software? It must be difficult to make physical backups of every single private key that corresponds to a new address you funded.

That's all? One digital copy on a single piece of hardware. Have you ever thought about what you are going to do if it malfunctions, you misplace it, or the kids you mentioned break it?

I still haven't done everything like you two. I just save everything in a file that I keep on the USB. recording the manual in a book and keeping it for me is still quite risky to lose. because I don't have a safe enough place to store everything yet.
drawer or cupboard, I think it's still too risky when a place like that is still accessible to children. maybe I'll buy a safe or a place that no one but me can access. I already have a plan for it all.

Yes, from my case i learn about how i can lost everything when store any .dat, seed phrase, or password note in any online service. Same like you, as i say I alread move from cloud to store my key and password offline. I wrote down all the passwords, passphrases and private keys in a book and I prepared a backup book that was placed separately. for the last 4 years I have not experienced any problems anymore. As for the .dat files, I save them on a USB.

No one is going to bother to go through a bunch of school notes, that's for sure, or at least it's unlikely. But you're right, concealing a piece of paper with a 12- or 24-word phrase will make someone suspicious if they end up finding it somewhere well hidden; even if you're clueless, a simple Google search is likely to reveal what it is.

In my opinion, a notebook hidden in plain sight is above suspicion; a bookshelf with school books is the perfect example. However, I believe that we're overcomplicating things. Just write them down in a notebook or two, place them on your desk or bookshelf, and simply don't forget where you wrote them.

If you have a diary or a notebook you used back in school, that would be a good hiding place for a seed. If the book is already filled with your class notes, you could add a seed in there somewhere. Just don't forget where it is. What you do after is very important. If that notebook is hidden away and someone finds it, that person might consider the content important. Otherwise, why would anyone look to hide it, right? But if you keep it in a visible place, preferably among a bunch of other books then it doesn't look like anything is out of the ordinary. 

Another thing worth mentioning. I agree that a thief wouldn't go through your old chemistry notes that you took back in high school searching for a seed. But if you have one of those recovery cards that are given out when you purchase hardware wallets hidden there, the thief will probably consider the card as something valuable. Valuable enough to be hidden like that.

You said that even if someone finds the seed, chances are they won't realize what it is. It's a gamble I wouldn't like to partake in. I saw a link to a video posted on the forums a few weeks ago recorded from a police cam. Anyway, the police was searching the car and belongings of a suspect and they found a piece of paper. The paper contained a list of words written down by hand. I don't remember if it was 12 or 24 words. One of the cops didn't know what it was, however, his colleague commented and said that's that bitcoin thing. It's like a password. People know about seeds, and they will know even more in the future.   

I'm mostly referring to coming up with your own encryption method, as the previous poster mentioned. As you've already mentioned, standard encryption methods are fine; there's no objection to that.

No method is foolproof, but forgetting the location of my seed phrase is purely my own fault. The notebook method is actually extremely reliable if you're not careless like me. No one will ever bother going through a notebook, and even if someone encounters your seed phrase, they won't realize what it is.

You shouldn't deviate away from standard encryption methods that have proven to be resilient and work for the majority of people. I agree with you on the part of not creating your own standards or reinventing hot water, as they say.

But misplacing or losing your seed that was written down in a notebook is your own fault. You didn't create something non-standard that failed you. You simply forgot where you wrote down your recovery phrase in the most natural of ways. This could have happened to you with any paper wallet backups. Even if you had a metal seed backup, you could have lost it somewhere or buried it and forgot where. It's your responsibility to remember these things. However, such backup standards aren't unusual in any ways to be avoided and not be recommended.     

Seed phrases are safer on a notebook than anywhere else, the only thing to watch out for is natural disasters like water and fire, if you want to take this to another level then carve the words on a stainless steel and keep that in a safe location that only you knows and have access to.

Anything online is not friendly to crypto wallet and keys.

Use your imagination? Trust me, this is probably the worst piece of advice. I've lost quite a few seed phrases which I had written in a notebook in the past, thinking I'd remember where it is a year later. Trust me, I didn't have a single clue. Let alone coming up with your own encryption or randomizer of the seed phrase. It's a 99.9% guarantee that you'll lose it.

Moreover, I'm not fond of password managers either. I could be wrong, but in my opinion, it's best to avoid third parties in such a delicate matter.

Both methods have benefits and drawbacks; both can be lost in a variety of ways or even destroyed. I'm yet to apply this myself, but the best option out there seems to be to write it down on a few pieces of paper and hide them around the house, such as under a drawer or a cupboard. You can even use some hints for the locations on your phone; hardly anyone will ever suspect such a thing, and I also find it exaggerated for anything to happen that way.

I guess the paparazzi thing engulfing cryptocurrency is because of the preponderance of youngsters coming into the industry who erroneously equate the industry with the entertainment industry where public display of cash and affluence is a thing. We all know how exuberant youngsters can be. Being in this industry is supposed to entail secrecy and privacy. Those who keep and shield themselves from public scrutiny enjoy their new found riches quietly and in peace. Those who don't find themselves constantly harassed by the public.

They should do their works silently.

If nobody knows they are rich, they are less likely become targets of thieves. If nobody around you knows you are cryptocurrency investor, you will less likely be in their radars.

If your devices are broken, learn to fix them by buying hardware stuffs and replace them by yourself, at home. With Youtube, Internet, you can replace a lot of things for your devices by yourself.

If it is out of your ability but a device is low in value like an old smart phone, let it be and buy a new one to use. Don't bring it to any store. Restoring your phone to factory condition won't make it completely impossible to be hacked.

I read all the arguments you put out there against saving seedphrases on paper. They're valid points but you also have to know that no system is infallible. Every system has its peculiarity and can't be said to be perfect. I think the greater part of the task in security our wallets lies with us. Individuals must learn how to tighten the safety of whatever they use in securing their funds, whether offline or online; whether software or hardware.

The more complicated your setup is, the greater the danger that you will make a mistake while setting it up or not remember what exactly you did in the future. A copy of 12/24 words written down in order is pretty self-explanatory. If you play around with the sequence or use any other memory tricks and systems, it can create unnecessary problems for you and your future heirs.

Whatever you own, you are going to leave it to your family if something happens to you. They shouldn't suffer trying to figure out what exactly you did. It's easier to explain to them to import a set of words in the order they were written down instead of having them memorize or write down your personal system.   

I think it's a tough way to learn something we have been saying for a while. The less failure points the better, when you have your seed phrase stored online there is ONE failure point, you.

Paper has even more limitations. It burns, it breaks, it can get lost, it can be read by random people if they find it, the ink can be damaged by water...
If you want to use paper make sure to store it in a steel or aluminum, waterproof container. I like storing things in electronic form but I do it offline on good old hard drives. They're pretty robust and can sustain more beating than a memory card or an ssd and can be recovered even after taking some serious beating. The upside is they can be encrypted and can fit more data than a simple piece of paper.
The important thing is to keep the offline at all times and only connect to machines you know are safe. It's really cheap to build a dedicated PC these days. A cheap, small computer cost about 2 times more than a hardware wallet and with some tweaking makes a secure access point.

This is by far the best approach to it and that's the method I adopt. However, the downside to it is how do you assess it when you're far from home? I believe it's because of this hiccup that makes people want to save their seedphrase or passwords online/electronically so that they can easily assess them from anywhere without minding the danger of a leak. This is where being old fashioned pays, if you asked me.