Topic: [Teaser!]Wasp Based Mining GB, Collecting Reservations For The Coming SWARM! (Read 7132 times)

NP!

Aight thanks man! Haven't decided if I want to drop some cash yet, will watch the thread as more info is released.

This GB (when made active) will provide the option to purchase Wasp & Hive based modular miningware on a continuous bases. The purpose is to provide a method of rapid investment into Bitcoin (and eventually Altcoin) mining by providing the shortest possible path between purchasing miningware and actually getting that miningware hashing. This thread is an informative dialogue intended to provide information about what will be provided by SWMC when the Wasp and Hive miningware is made available. This thread is also intended to gage the overall support for this model of GB, gain valuable customer opinions and provide SWMC with a better understanding of what miningware purchasers believe to be important so SWMC can address those concerns in an informative manner. This GB is (being) designed to serve YOU better than that which you are accustomed to.

Alrighty then, so what is this group buy for then?

I thought that might be what you were referring to, that just means that the project is in an active stage of development. It does not mean that there are working prototypes or that the product design is finished or is available. To date, the only designs that are close to being production ready are the Coindesk A1 Wasp and the Hive backplane. Below are the specifications for the A1 Wasp:

In the first post they had a green dot and said "live"

I am not aware of any of the WPC projects going "Live." Could you provide a link to what you are referring to?

Newb question, but it says they are live. Does that mean they are ready to purchase now or what? Also is there a link I can get more info on this? Specs are enticing xD

 Following.

Cool I will look forward to checking it out.
It really sounds like you are well on your way. 

Until the final specs are out, there is no way to know for certain. I will be working on a spreadsheet to provide a best guess estimate based on the currently advertised information from friedcat.

Does it use the same or less power as well as being less buggy?

Small Update:

Considering changing the chip from the Coindesk A1 to the upcoming ASICMiner chip. There are issues with the A1 that will make it difficult to reach the full 40GH/s turbo performance.

Glad to hear from you!

interdesting, will be watching

It's difficult to say, ETA is on the order of weeks, not months.

Interested in this project.

Any ETA when we can see some pictures of the "Wasps" and "Hives"?

Add me on the list to +1

OK, done!

Reserve two wasps for me.

Thanks.

Looking forward to having you aboard too!

I'm glad it is.
I am going to be ready to invest when yo are ready.
Thanks

@cannachris, looking forward to having you aboard!

@ManeBjorn, accessibility to Bitcoin mining for everyone is crucial to preserve Bitcoin's Decentralized Network, this is something very important to me on a personal level. I want keep Bitcoin mining as level a playing field as possible.

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Also great news on being able to buy gh/s until I have the cost of a WASP.  I do not have even close to enough to buy one but being able to buy in and eventually get it is excellent.
I like that.  I makes this whole project more approachable for people like me with limited funds.

Chalk me up for one A1 Wasp! Awesome project!

The Hive is a backplane specifically designed to power and hold 8 Wasps. A Hive is not required because (in the current design) Wasps have 2 USB connectors, one for power and the other for communication, you can stack Wasps just like block eruptor blades. The Hives will give cleaner power and convenience. In SWMC's case, the The Hives will allow for easier rack mounting and custom cooling.


You have to know which chips are going to go on a Wasp before the PCB is fabricated so you can mount those chips with the correct connections. A polymorphic socket is not currently part of the design, but I suggested it to the collective once as a means to replace bad chips easily. Nevertheless, I already have plans for just such a modification. SWMC will be fabricating its own boards, so making adjustments like that will be easy. I would like to be able to replace malfunctioning, defective, outdated or dead chips with an easy 'plug and play' option. The Wasps are designed to work with any chip, even a combination of different chips on the same Wasp! Adding a polymorphic (or similar) socket would make chip RMAs and chip upgrades much easier. Yep, that's my plan.


No, The WPC does all of those things. The WPC has created its own custom OS to run the Wasps which includes its own mining software. The firmware will automatically identify what chips are on the Wasp and adjust the settings as needed.


That depends, if you have a standard hosting contract, then yes... you'll have full control over your units if you wish. If you own H/s on the SWMC Hashing Exchange then you will be able to pick any mining pool you want for your hashing pleasure using an account at your chosen pool that SWMC has setup for you, but it will not be possible to have direct control over your H/s because they may be spread over different units.

Good questions, Thanks!


[EDIT] Ahh... Beat me to it! Thanks Beastlymac for helping out!

A hive is like a back plane that can be used when controlling multiple boards at once. If a new chip comes out we will make a wasp board for that chip and it will be compatible with the current hive and you would be able to run them both at the same time. The hive is the controller so that will be sorted out for all our compatible chips.

I am in for at least 10 full wasps, maybe more .. IF the price targets end up at the lower end of the range, IF the boards can be fabricated relatively soon, IF you can get the data center up and running before difficulty kills any chance of profit.

Love the idea, it could really be killer if enough people sign on.  Could really push chip prices down, and commoditize a lot of the industry which is great for miners.  Cool.

Questions:

1) What is a hive?  How does that relate to a wasp?  A wasp is a single fully populated board, correct?   Is a hive a collective of wasps under a single controller?  Is there a more robust definition than that?

2) If a wasp board is populated with something like the A1, and then next year the A2 comes out at 20nm and 4x the power (I am making this up, not a real example!), would it be possible to just swap in the new chip?  I assume not, unless the "A2" in my hypo was pin compatible with the A1.  Or is there there some magic polymorphic socket idea embedded in the wasp project? 

3) Firmware and controllers will be needed for each chip... will you be doing that work, or will you just wait until it is done by the manufacturer or the community first?

4) If I purchase an entire wasp (or an entire hive depending on the definitions, not sure), will I be able to get control (VPN/ssh) over my unit(s)?

I will add a few more points.

To start off, you can simply just buy any number of Wasps and Hives that you can afford and they will be delivered to you if you wish.

But let's say that you can't afford to buy a whole Wasp right away. Well, then you can buy as many GH/s as you can afford, just to start out with. Once you own a full Wasp's worth (or many Wasp's worth) of GH/s, just as CEX offers, you can request to have the physical miningware delivered to you at any time you desire.

And there are plenty of individuals that want to invest in Bitcoin mining, but do not want to hassle with or do not have the expertise to the maintain the mining gear. Having SWMC host the miningware is a good solution for them. Additionally, SWMC will be using industrial strength cooling like oil cooling and other techniques that involve recovering heat energy to reduce mining costs. Not something most individuals can provide for themselves, so that's one advantage over self-hosting.

SWMC is also committed to moving towards using renewable energy resources like solar and wind power (hence the name SolarWind) among many other common and novel technologies. Doing so will give SWMC a monetary advantage over the industry's standard practice of generating tons of unused waste heat and drawing then paying for electricity off of the grid. When I first presented this plan to the community, many said that it couldn't be done. I would like to point out that KnCMiner just recently announce that they are building a data center to host their customers (and their own) miningware and that the data center will be completely powered by renewable energy sources... maybe I wasn't as nuts or off track as some implied! Again, that's not something that the average individual will be able to do, so SWMC offers that as another advantage over self-hosting.

So lets say that you receive your miningware and start it hashing away on your own premises. Then, at some point in time, your gear burns out a component. You'll either have to repair it yourself, send it to someone who can repair it (all the while, losing valuable hashing time) or just trash it and lose any chance of ever reaching ROI. Then what? Well, with SWMC's cloud hosting and Hashing Exchange, you will own X-GH/s, no matter what. If equipment breaks down, SWMC is responsible for repairing it, but the customer will not lose any hashing time at all during the repair period. Lost hashing power will come out of SWMC own hashing count and not from our customers. So, as long as there isn't a mass failure, the customer won't lose any income from hardware failures. That is an advantage that SWMC offers over self-hosting, because it is simply impossible for an individual to do at all.

There are other bonuses as well, but I'll leave that for another time. CeeCee, I'm sure that there are many others whom have wondered the same thing but didn't bother to ask. So... Thanks for the chance to answer your question!

~James

thanks for clarification. *thumbsup*

Thanks philipma1957,

You summed it up well.

Can anyone vouch for this guy? I'd be interested in this if so...

 that is not what he said.  you misread his post.

the minimum would be  3.66 usd a hash  that is 180 gh for  658 usd  or 1.04 btc  an ant-miner is higher then the low price

an ant miner can not be purchased for that price.

the high end price is 5.66 usd a hash that is 180 gh for  1018 usd or 1.62 btc  an ant miner is lower then his high price

I'm certainly interested. I love the Wasp project, can't wait to start seeing the hardware!

so you want 2BTC for 216GH/s while i can get an antminer with ~200GH/s for under 2BTC and i will have real hardware in my hand. not this cloud hashing miner that i dont really own. can now someone explain me why i should invest in you? maybe i dont have understand something right.

I will follow this as well. I would like to support the Wasp project.

Thanks philipma1957! I'll will work some more on getting something more solid going for you guys.

Yeah my 1 or 2 or 3 btc  won't buy much attention from him.

I do have an interest in this and I book marked it.   I am good for at least 2 coins.

Getting a hold of friedcat or ASICMiner is not so easy these days, unless you have a few million dollars you desperately want to hand over to them.  

I hope you can manage to get in contact with ASICMiner... some of the other chip options look a bit expensive to me.

NOTE: I changed the title of this thread because some of the other members in The WPC were concerned that it may be confusing to some by seeming to be an official WPC post. I am a member of The Wasp Project Collective, but I do not speak for or represent the WPC in any official capacity. Just to be clear, this isn't a GB for Wasps per say, it is a GB for a mining farm and Hashing Exchange. Quite frankly, it doesn't matter if SWMC uses The Wasp and Hive format or some other type of custom miningware, the structure of the GB will be the same.

I have chosen The Wasp and Hive format for two main reasons: One, the flexibility of the WPC design allows SWMC to increase its hashing power no matter what chips are available and without having to make special accommodations for differing types of miningware. Two, because I am a member of the WPC and I want to support it to best of my ability.


This can't be know for sure just yet, there are a few things that need to be worked out. The EEs are working hard to get the prototype finalized. There is also the matter of ordering the chips and waiting for those to be delivered. Once the Wasp PCBs are fabricated, chips delivered and the licensing is sorted out, the time frame between the assembly and hashing of the first batch of Wasps should be a matter of a day or two. Actually, the Wasps will be plugged in and hashing, one by one, within minutes after the solder cools. That's the power of using this model of GB, with an assembly line opperation, there no shipping delays for assembled units.


With BTC being at $600, and if a Wasp is $1200, then 2 BTC would be 216 GH/s on turbo mode. So 1 BTC would be 120 GH/s (of course this is with 6 CoinCraft A1s on a single Wasp.) A single Wasp at $950 would make 1.58 BTC equal to the same 216 GH/s.

$5.66 a Gh/s is likely the maximum price, the cost will likely be lower and could be as low as $3.75 a GH/s. The price will also vary depending on the chip used. With the ASICminer chips, the price could be significantly lower. I wish I could tell you a definitive date, but we are waiting for the Wasp prototype to be finished and the design released with a working license. The Wasps will work with any chip, so even if we have to wait awhile, when the Wasps are finally ready, we will be able to put new miningware in action faster than most any other source.

The Wasps should be available soon, but it may still be 1 or more weeks before they are released. Wish I could tell you more.

to follow up.  I have at least 1 btc even 2 btc but details would be helpful.  

For instance I can buy an antminer s-1 for  1400 on ebay with paypal /ebay protection.   that is about 7 usd a hash if I clock to 200. I would get it in a few days.

So paying 5.66 usd a hash to  is a better price only if it is pretty fast to ship.

 So if I send 1 btc today when does it hash? 

  and what is my hash power.


 I am trying to compare your offer to an s-1 antminer.

What would be the ETA for having it up and hashing?

Hello everyone,

Here is an update.  

In order to bootstrap the SWMC Hashing Exchange, I am considering offering 120 Contracts for 1 fully populated CoinCraft A1 Wasp @$10 each contract. The Contracts will be exclusively for the SWMC Hashing Exchange. A single Wasp hash rate will be 120 GH/s (on Low Power), 150 GH/s (in Nominal Power) and 240 GH/s (with Turbo Power) with a ± 20% variance per chip. Each contract will be for 1.85 GH/s since not all chips will operate at top performance, That makes the Maximum price $5.56 per GH/s. The range for the estimated cost of a whole Wasp is estimated between $1200-950 per Wasp. For the contracts on the Wasps themselves, if the final price turns out to be less than $1200, then anyone who purchased a Contract will have the GH/s increased accordingly. The owner will be able to keep or sell their GH/s on the Hashing Exchange and there will be no hosting fee. There will be a small trading fee if you trade your hashes and a fee to cover the costs of operation (i.e. Electricity, Maintanace, etc...) Here is the link to the Estimated Costs for the Wasps. The prices vary because of a volume discount on the purchase of the CoinCraft A1 Chips.

Estimated Cost of Wasp

Thanks again railzand for your contribution, I am learning a lot from your questions. Sorry for the 'long winded' explo's, its just my nature, but I'll work on it. 

I do have a website in the works, there is a lot of work yet to be done, but it is in process as we speak. It will contain most of the information that you asked for. I'll start a project page in the project development subcategory so everyone can voice their opinions and make suggestions to make it the best site that we can.

Thanks!
James

hi james railzand here, your favourite thorn in the proverbial.

the above is really shaping up well and in principle I'm in for a btc or two.

in practise i'm a nervous nellie when sending dosh. i need to understand more

i'd frankly like to see a business plan, a statement of accounts and idk what else yet.

i'm sure all that's coming soon, perhaps you've said so already.

but when i see your great paragraphs of wisdom, i'm daunted and i wish you'd use bullet points or something /rant

edit: one more ranty thing, i'd prefer every last thing from your upcoming website to be available here too so that all on this forum can input their wisdom

Thanks for the support and I'll find that info out if I can, but we are still in the prototype stage of development.

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Very forward-looking project. I like! Do you have an estimation on the power draw for the a1 wasp & minion wasp?

Good luck with your operation and definately interested!!

Primarily, we will offer populated Wasps, but offering empty boards are always possible.

The number of chips per Wasp depends on the chip being used. For Example:

Very cool.
I look forward to the rollout.
Are you getting closer on a pricing structure?

OK, sounds very interesting.

I will be following this thread for news.

Hello S4VV4S,

SWMC will be offering hosted Hashing Power that is built on the Wasp and Hive platform. This should provide the GB'er with a faster turn around on their investment. You won't have to wait for several months for your investment to start hashing for you. And no guessing on when the hardware will be delivered because the Wasps are designed to be built using any chip, we will be able to mine Bitcoin as well as other altcoins including Litecoin, Protoshares, Bitbar or any one of them you can imagine. We will know exactly how many chips we can get and approximately when they should arrive. Our goal is the speedy implementation of available miningware. This is a no-preorder service, your purchase funds are put to work building a Wasp as soon as there are enough funds to pay for the components. And, SWMC will not sell a Contract for Hashing Power if the time frame for delivery doesn't have a reasonable amount of assurance.

The cost to build one Wasp is not nearly as much as buying a whole unit from most of the companies out there. The result, fewer GB'ers have to purchase a contract in order for SWMC to acquire the miningware and you don't have to wait as long. SWMC will also serve as a retail provider of the miningware, so, if you have a group of people that want to purchase and receive the physical miningware, you'll have that option. If you bought hosted miningware (and you own the entire Wasp or pay for it over time) and you want to have physical possession of YOUR miningware, SWMC will ship it to you!

Have your own chips? SWMC will be providing a fabrication/assembly/hosting service as well. Want to sell your own hardware? Use SWMCs fabrication/assembly service and will also warehouse and dropship your branded product orders for you.

You will also have the option to sell your Hashes on SWMCs own Hashing Exchange when it is ready (a similar process as with CEX, but with needed improvements.)

There is one additional option that SWMC is offering, in order for our service to function properly, we need to have chips on hand, or at least paid for and being shipped, at all times. That will take some serious upfront cash if we want to get the lowest price possible, so SWMC will serve as a chip distribution center. To accomplish this, SWMC will serve as an organizer of Raw Chip Buy Co-ops. This is a great opportunity to make some extra profits for anyone who wants to contribute. For Chip Buys, a GB'ers funds will be used to purchase the chips needed in higher volumes, so we can get the lowest prices possible. Once the chips are in hand, SWMC will mount them to a Wasp PCB, then either use them to fill GB orders, sell them retail or use them to add to the Hashing Exchanges pool. If a GB'er invests in a Chip Buy Co-op, they will receive a profit on the resale of the chips once they are mounted to a Wasp PCB and sold. Or, the GB'er will have the option to sell the Hashes that their chips provide on the SWMCs Hashing Exchange. If a GB'er wants to sell their hashes on the exchange, they'll only have to pay SWMC for their portion of the fabrication/assembly fee. Think of this offer as being a way to get in on the retail side of the crypto-coin mining industry. Instead of buying miningware to mine with, you will be on the side of selling miningware. If you really want to mine, then diversify as a hedge against Bitcoins volatility by using your profits from a Chip Buy Co-op to leverage your own funds into more Hashing Power than you can now afford.

SWMC will also coordinate with other chip buyers so that we can pool funding together to buy higher volumes, saving money for us all. SWMC will not charge a markup fee for Chip Buy Co-ops, just a shipping and handling fee. So if you are wanting to purchase Raw Chips for your own company's production, join SWMC in a Raw Chip Buy Co-op and reduce your chip cost as much as 25% or more. It shouldn't just be the big mining farms and manufactures who benefit from large volume purchases, let us work together for the benefit of all.

So what are we buying exactly?

Are you selling populated or unpopulated boards?

What's the min # of chips requred to populate the board?

We have to get the chips first, but I'm all for supporting the WPC mining pool.

Good luck!
I hope you do well!
Hopefully we will see some of that power over on our pool

Thanks, see you on the WPC forum!

Good luck with your sales.

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