Tell me why Satoshi Nakamoto didn't spend a Satoshi from his 1 Mio BTC - page 4.

gentlemand

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Quote from: AGD on March 02, 2016, 04:41:00 PM

Imagine you have a million Bitcoins and the price goes to 1000$ and more. Wouldn't you or any normal person sell at least some part of it? Don't tell me he doesn't care about money or he wants to wait for a higher price. This makes no sense.

What price anonymity? Only he can tell you what value it has for him.

A $1000 price means thousands of people will be constantly scanning his known coins for signs of life. As soon as something did twitch people would be going all out to find out where they were headed. He couldn't use any type of exchange for fear of being dug out. He'd be depending on exchange owners to be secure and they don't exactly have a great track record nor could they resist digging around either.

You couldn't use them to pay for a product because it has to be shipped somewhere. You couldn't buy anything digital just in case it's been marked somehow. He kind of scuppered himself a bit.

AGD

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Keeper of the Private Key

Quote from: gentlemand on March 02, 2016, 04:34:14 PM

Because up until the time he disappeared there pretty much wasn't anywhere to spend a single Satoshi? Maybe some socks but even they might have come long after. Even if there had been a healthy commerce scene I assume he would've been wary of spending on digital or real products for paranoia reasons.

Imagine you have a million Bitcoins and the price goes to 1000$ and more. Wouldn't you or any normal person sell at least some part of it? Don't tell me he doesn't care about money or he wants to wait for a higher price. This makes no sense.

gentlemand

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Welt Am Draht

Because up until the time he disappeared there pretty much wasn't anywhere to spend a single Satoshi? Maybe some socks but even they might have come long after. Even if there had been a healthy commerce scene I assume he would've been wary of spending on digital or real products for paranoia reasons.

tyz

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I asked this question myself and I came to the conclusion that there could be only two reasons (except of possible death, I did not really think about this yet Roll Eyes

) First, he (deliberately or not deliberately) lost the key(s) of his wallet(s). Second, he would like to exchange the Bitcoin for cash but he need to reveal his identity then. It is impossible to exchange such an amount without revealing identity. Even if he would decide to find someone who is buying bigger amounts for cash, he could not be sure that this person is not selling his/her knowledge of Satoshi's identity to a news magazine or to the authorities (FBI, CIA, whatever).

DimensionZ

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Shit, did I leave the stove on?

I think it's a mix of options 4 & 5. Satoshi probably doesn't want to draw any attention to himself right now in these turbulent times and is waiting for that rocket to reach the Moon upon which he will be the richest man alive Wink

hv_

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Clean Code and Scale

Quote from: AGD on March 02, 2016, 02:08:51 PM

Quote from: Kakmakr on March 02, 2016, 01:47:19 AM

Just take a look at Dash as a example, the developers pre-mined the shite out of the coin within the first 8 hours of it's existence and then people started to complain and scream pump n dump. Nobody wants to invest in something that may end up as a scam or a Ponzi.

If Satoshi touch those coins, people will scream Pump n Dump again, and investors will pull out.

There are many ways to avoid this situation. He could step forward, dox himself and donate his Bitcoins to charities for example. He could even stay with a good part of it, without a great panic. He could also invest in a Bitcoin company or whatever. I even think, that this status quo weakens Bitcoin, because we never know, when this pandoras box will be opened.

I had also speculated he would donate some to the unbanked.
Or he could use some for solving some hard Future problems, e.g. fixing scalability or buying and running some miners for better decentralisation & trust.

hv_

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Clean Code and Scale

Quote from: franky1 on March 01, 2016, 08:53:27 AM

all the block dots are NOT owned by satoshi.

the angle of the dots is the easiest way to work out who is who. because the angle is the eqivelent measure of CPU speed. the more vertical it is (10degrees) is super fast cpu. but the closer to 90degree's they get those are slower and slower cpu's

satoshis 'angle' can be easily counted.. if you have the time to manually do it

so far, this is an example.. the light blue is satoshi. the other colours are other people/other PC's

(my image is not exact because first i sorted out the satoshi angles and then moved onto colour coding different users individually.. but still not perfect)

as for saying satoshi never spent the coins.. he did move some coins. even on the first day he and hal finney were mining.. just not all of them were moved/spent.. for him it wasnt about selling for profit but for testing purposes.
as for other people, they also spent coins too.

by block 500(day 4) i can easily see 4-5 different patterns that represent 4-5 different users/computer mining. (still trying to manually sift through the data)

Nice Graph. How did you retrieve that and what are the axis?

Anno MMXVI

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He trust in his invention. He know that a lot more exxciting things are coming. I think that we'll have to wait until 2028 to know what happened. In this year, Bitcoin would be 20 years old, and would be used wordwide or forgotten. I think that it will be used worldwide, and Satoshi thinks the same I think.

AGD

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Keeper of the Private Key

Quote from: Kakmakr on March 02, 2016, 01:47:19 AM

Just take a look at Dash as a example, the developers pre-mined the shite out of the coin within the first 8 hours of it's existence and then people started to complain and scream pump n dump. Nobody wants to invest in something that may end up as a scam or a Ponzi.

If Satoshi touch those coins, people will scream Pump n Dump again, and investors will pull out.

There are many ways to avoid this situation. He could step forward, dox himself and donate his Bitcoins to charities for example. He could even stay with a good part of it, without a great panic. He could also invest in a Bitcoin company or whatever. I even think, that this status quo weakens Bitcoin, because we never know, when this pandoras box will be opened.

Kakmakr

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Just take a look at Dash as a example, the developers pre-mined the shite out of the coin within the first 8 hours of it's existence and then people started to complain and scream pump n dump. Nobody wants to invest in something that may end up as a scam or a Ponzi.

If Satoshi touch those coins, people will scream Pump n Dump again, and investors will pull out.

aardvark15

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I doubt that Satoshi Nakamoto would lose the private keys. Of all people, he would know to protect that. Could it also be possible that he purposely sent some coins to an address that can't be used? They weren't worth much at the time.

QuestionAuthority

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You lead and I'll watch you walk away.

Because he's a space alien from Alpha Centauri and has no need for bitcoins. He only created Bitcoin to keep libertarians, anarchists and Bernie Sanders supporters busy to keep them from learning of his plan to take over the world.

cjmoles

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I don't know. I've always imagined Satoshi to be like Victor Frankenstein in Mary Shelley's, Frankenstein; or, The Modern Prometheus. Maybe Satoshi created Bitcoin but then looked at his creation and thought, "Ugh, Oh! I created a monster!" And then disassociated himself from his creation to avoid any type of repercussions, either legally or morally. Just a thought....

As for the private keys: They're probably in Hal Finney's safety deposit box which is waiting to be unlocked on a future date. One never knows!

nickenburg

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Quote from: franky1 on March 01, 2016, 05:26:25 PM

Quote from: 7788bitcoin on March 01, 2016, 10:45:31 AM

I guess many people are monitoring these addresses. The moment one of them is spent, the whole world will know => resulting will be massive drop in bitcoin value to close to nothing due to fear.

Satoshi is a smart guy and he definitely understand that he will not be the richest guy in this world. All we know is that he wanted Bitcoin to be successful and therefore he will not be moving those coins.

mass sell off is not bad.. because you can then imagine the massive buyup of cheaper coins. and eventually back to equilibrium. so dont waste days of thought on worry. even in a flashcrash. it will recover

Ye I don't think he will be so stupid to sell them all in on time, then Bitcoin will fall hard.
He is a smart guy, I just wonder why he wouldn't be active in bitcoin anymore.
But maybe he is still under us just under another name or he is working on a new project.

franky1

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Quote from: 7788bitcoin on March 01, 2016, 10:45:31 AM

I guess many people are monitoring these addresses. The moment one of them is spent, the whole world will know => resulting will be massive drop in bitcoin value to close to nothing due to fear.

Satoshi is a smart guy and he definitely understand that he will not be the richest guy in this world. All we know is that he wanted Bitcoin to be successful and therefore he will not be moving those coins.

mass sell off is not bad.. because you can then imagine the massive buyup of cheaper coins. and eventually back to equilibrium. so dont waste days of thought on worry. even in a flashcrash. it will recover

STT

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Quote

3. Satoshi lost the private keys of his early wallets

I think you want to talk or think this through with some software engineers. Its not always a mistake to lose something like this. When I tie a knot sometimes, I never want it to come undone ever and I would rather just buy a new rope then let that happen. There is a usefulness in a lock that can not be easily opened, obviously we know this and thats the basis of bitcoin and that logic is easily extendable to these foundation stones that are the very big wallet deposits that were never touched.

You can say well its wasted money but this whole deal is virtual. Bitcoin should be appraised by its total worth, move these never before seen coins and you will certainly devalue every other persons wallet in my opinion. A market speculator I do expect to react almost instantly in that respect and sell on margin, in fact it'd probably happen before the news the wave of selling so much would touch every exchange

AGD

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Keeper of the Private Key

Quote from: NUFCrichard on March 01, 2016, 09:24:26 AM

Why can it not be that he has morals and doesn't want to hugely profit from essentially premining Bitcoin?
The whole idea of bitcoin is that it is for the people, if the creator crashed the market by selling out for a few million dollars, that wouldn't make him or his idealogy look very good!

I would assume that someone who came up with cryptocurrencies, and put it together as well as Satoshi did, would be rich enough or content enough with themselves that they wouldn't need to sell out.

I guess over time option 1 becomes ever more possible, but I would rather believe my reasoning.

I added the "Idealist" theory, which is good, but why his short good bye and disappearance? Wouldn't he be better off helping with the process of evolving Bitcoin instead of hiding and letting everybody think he could one day crash the price? Pretty strange for an idealist, I think.

Bitcoinpro

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Quote from: tommorisonwebdesign on March 01, 2016, 11:00:05 AM

I'm going with theory number 5. The CIA and the big banks of the world would want him arrested as Bitcoin disrupts their financial power of the world. As of now, the fed can simply print US currency and control the wealth of the world. With Bitcoin, this is decentralized, so nobody can control Bitcoin. This also means the modern citizen in the future would have more control over their finances.

its dudes that still use IRC and know how to program machine code

do you realize how much cash these guys make, they where aleady

making a killing of preventing spam attacks selling Hash cash to email

servers, the choice of a Japanese name is not surprising as their

first take down target was also a Japanese base ceo whom they

pilfered off more coin than they prob own,

pereira4

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Quote from: tommorisonwebdesign on March 01, 2016, 11:00:05 AM

I'm going with theory number 5. The CIA and the big banks of the world would want him arrested as Bitcoin disrupts their financial power of the world. As of now, the fed can simply print US currency and control the wealth of the world. With Bitcoin, this is decentralized, so nobody can control Bitcoin. This also means the modern citizen in the future would have more control over their finances.

I think they wouldn't arrest him... they would simulate a suicide, or they would make it as if he disappeared, but I don't think they would even want him alive and captive since he could become some sort of hero like Julian Asagne has become for a lot of people, and this would bring worldwide fame for Bitcoin pretty much overnight. I hope Satoshi is good but that's what I think. The dude is rivaling the status quo at the most fundamental level and some people aren't aware of this yet it seems. This isn't a game.

AliceWonderMiscreations

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If he spent any of his known addresses, there would be a massive hunt for him from governments to see if they can tax what he hasn't spent.

I think it would be funny if every now and then he chose a random address from the web to send a small amount to, just to watch various governments hound the poor clueless recipient for info on who Satoshi is.

Topic: Tell me why Satoshi Nakamoto didn't spend a Satoshi from his 1 Mio BTC - page 4. (Read 8828 times)