Testing C-Lightning v0.10.2 Offers! [BOLT12]

Rath_

legendary

Activity: 1876

Merit: 3131

Quote from: n0nce on August 27, 2022, 04:52:31 PM

The receiver needs to reveal it! Cheesy

The only reason I know BlackHatCoiner's public key is because we considered opening a channel. There's no way to do keysend without revealing node ID.

The receiver needs to reveal their node id in an invoice as well. If the node id is not provided directly, it is recovered from a signature which proves that the invoice has not been modified by any malicious third-party.

Also, it looks like c-lightning doesn't support blinded paths for BOLT 12 offers yet. Run the following command:

lightning-cli decode [any BOLT12 offer]

You will see that your node id is encoded in the offer.

n0nce

hero member

Activity: 882

Merit: 5814

not your keys, not your coins!

Quote from: Rath_ on August 26, 2022, 04:12:31 PM

Quote from: BlackHatCoiner on August 25, 2022, 12:53:10 PM

To send with keysend, you need to reveal your node's public key. With invoices, that's not necessary.

Do you need to, though? At what point do you have to reveal it as the sender?

The receiver needs to reveal it! Cheesy

The only reason I know BlackHatCoiner's public key is because we considered opening a channel. There's no way to do keysend without revealing node ID.
Meaning if I just want to receive donations non-interactively for instance, people will know how many channels I have, with whom and how large.
In my opinion, spontaneous keysend payments are practical to transact with direct peers whose node ID you already know, but for anything else I prefer BOLT12 offers.

Rath_

legendary

Activity: 1876

Merit: 3131

Quote from: BlackHatCoiner on August 25, 2022, 12:53:10 PM

To send with keysend, you need to reveal your node's public key. With invoices, that's not necessary.

Do you need to, though? At what point do you have to reveal it as the sender?

Quote from: BlackHatCoiner on August 25, 2022, 12:53:10 PM

"Loss of being able to use the preimage and invoice signature as proof-of-payment"; again, which part is different and I don't get the pre-image? Isn't it a core part of Lightning to get the pre-image? Isn't there a payment hash involved?

A payment secret and its hash are involved in the process in both cases. Here's the difference:

1) Invoice: A payee generates a payment secret and makes a hash of it. They put the hash in an invoice.
2) Keysend: A payer generates a payment secret and makes a hash of it. They construct an onion routing packet which includes encrypted routing instructions for each hop. The payee learns the secret once they decrypt their instructions.

The end goal is the same: the payment hash is used by all intermediary hops. The payee reveals the secret first. There is no security risk here - the payer can't steal any funds even if they generate the secret. I can elaborate on that if you are interested

The reason why the payment secret can't be used as a proof-of-payment in the latter case is that the person who tries to use it as a proof is also the person who generated it. Not a convincing proof, right?

BlackHatCoiner

legendary

Activity: 1344

Merit: 6415

Farewell, Leo

Quote from: n0nce on August 25, 2022, 11:29:34 AM

Great, I think this was my first keysend transfer actually! It feels unfamiliar doing Lightning transfers without invoices / interaction, but also super practical and cool!

It does come with some drawbacks, even though I understand none of them. "Inability for the payee to specify their preferred min_final_cltv_expiry"; why is true for keysend and not for invoice? "Loss of being able to use the preimage and invoice signature as proof-of-payment"; again, which part is different and I don't get the pre-image? Isn't it a core part of Lightning to get the pre-image? Isn't there a payment hash involved?

One drawback I expected to see but didn't is privacy. To send with keysend, you need to reveal your node's public key. With invoices, that's not necessary.

n0nce

hero member

Activity: 882

Merit: 5814

not your keys, not your coins!

Quote from: BlackHatCoiner on August 25, 2022, 11:07:53 AM

Received and sent back with keysend!

Great, I think this was my first keysend transfer actually! It feels unfamiliar doing Lightning transfers without invoices / interaction, but also super practical and cool!
Now we just have to let people know that they can use this e.g. to easily receive donations privately. So much better than needing to set up or even develop a dynamic website that has a connection to your node and fetches a new invoice every time.
Not to speak of increased security by not having to expose the node more to the internet.

BlackHatCoiner

legendary

Activity: 1344

Merit: 6415

Farewell, Leo

Received and sent back with keysend!

n0nce

hero member

Activity: 882

Merit: 5814

not your keys, not your coins!

Quote from: BlackHatCoiner on August 25, 2022, 08:35:37 AM

Someone help me test it. Thanks. Once I receive the hundred sats, I return them back.

Worked fine for me!

Quote from: BlackHatCoiner on August 25, 2022, 08:55:19 AM

Can you send me more than 100 sats with the given offer or do I have to generate another one?

This offer is fixed to 100 sats. So you would have to generate one with higher amount or without amount, so the sender can specify.

BlackHatCoiner

legendary

Activity: 1344

Merit: 6415

Farewell, Leo

Quote from: Rath_ on August 25, 2022, 08:41:34 AM

You can send back the coins either via keysend

Don't know what's that yet, so I sent them via offer. Thanks.

Quote from: Rath_ on August 25, 2022, 08:41:34 AM

Is your offer a single-use one?

No.

Can you send me more than 100 sats with the given offer or do I have to generate another one?

Edit: Sent you 150 sats with keysend. You can send them back if you want.

Rath_

legendary

Activity: 1876

Merit: 3131

Quote from: BlackHatCoiner on August 25, 2022, 08:35:37 AM

Someone help me test it. Thanks. Once I receive the hundred sats, I return them back.

Paid. You can send back the coins either via keysend or my offer which I posted in my first post. Is your offer a single-use one?

BlackHatCoiner

legendary

Activity: 1344

Merit: 6415

Farewell, Leo

Code:

lno1pqpsrp4qpgj5ymrpvd45sct5gdhkjmn9wgsxsetjv5hzq3mfd4kk2grndakk2grnv968xts5zpxxjemgw3hxjmn8yptx7un5v4upugxdxggs23m9gyepslcgugtmyr3uu605nhl4zxw62kt6ts8c5tr6tmcyqdl8f49namw5l3ep2e5rcf56c8dajx02l7r5k62wkxn920s499vwcgc3j2qx0ylkzyuhdvphemrts6ew8lghmk9gs787lr26xmuu4nns

Someone help me test it. Thanks. Once I receive the hundred sats, I return them back.

n0nce

hero member

Activity: 882

Merit: 5814

not your keys, not your coins!

Quote from: Rath_ on February 25, 2022, 04:50:37 AM

I was able to send 1 satoshi through your offer, but 100 and 1000 satoshi payments still fail. Well... if you're interested, we can open a dual-funded channel Wink

It seems that either my or your node is underconnected or lacks liquidity.

Wow, that's a little bit anticlimactic. Grin

Yes, we can. I will PM you later!

Rath_

legendary

Activity: 1876

Merit: 3131

Quote from: n0nce on February 24, 2022, 06:30:18 PM

Hey Rath, thanks a lot for trying! It's really good to know that I'm apparently unreachable or at least not well reachable. I just opened a new channel with good inbound liquidity; maybe retry tomorrow or whenever that's locked in, if you wish.

Edit: @Rath_ got the new channel on-chain now!

I was able to send 1 satoshi through your offer, but 100 and 1000 satoshi payments still fail. Well... if you're interested, we can open a dual-funded channel Wink

It seems that either my or your node is underconnected or lacks liquidity.

n0nce

hero member

Activity: 882

Merit: 5814

not your keys, not your coins!

Quote from: Rath_ on February 24, 2022, 06:14:57 PM

Your offer seems to be working fine as my node can fetch an invoice, but I can't find a route to you. I have already tried sending as little as 1 satoshi with no luck.

Hey Rath, thanks a lot for trying! It's really good to know that I'm apparently unreachable or at least not well reachable. I just opened a new channel with good inbound liquidity; maybe retry tomorrow or whenever that's locked in, if you wish.

Edit: @Rath_ got the new channel on-chain now!

Rath_

legendary

Activity: 1876

Merit: 3131

Quote from: n0nce on February 20, 2022, 07:49:37 AM

Code:

lno1pgyhgetnwss8getnws2q2m3sde3k283q2lpjlt6ze9es9je8c5xdxzcry7yz5flpwcnq84lxx2pcvu5v36hlqsyt78v7gcwx7az9aanft87whfedvey8gvm68f9uygrypnwe5r4578el5tlxznasdp8rjql9ulavwyadpxnmaeh9v0l4xc5lvq3qqrurq

Of course will also send anything right back; preferably using one of your offer codes posted in here (that's what they're made for; reusability & statically receiving sats without interaction from the 'receiver'

).

Your offer seems to be working fine as my node can fetch an invoice, but I can't find a route to you. I have already tried sending as little as 1 satoshi with no luck.

n0nce

hero member

Activity: 882

Merit: 5814

not your keys, not your coins!

Finally I got around to generating an offer as well, looks like you guys are having fun! Cheesy

Code:

lno1pgyhgetnwss8getnws2q2m3sde3k283q2lpjlt6ze9es9je8c5xdxzcry7yz5flpwcnq84lxx2pcvu5v36hlqsyt78v7gcwx7az9aanft87whfedvey8gvm68f9uygrypnwe5r4578el5tlxznasdp8rjql9ulavwyadpxnmaeh9v0l4xc5lvq3qqrurq

Of course will also send anything right back; preferably using one of your offer codes posted in here (that's what they're made for; reusability & statically receiving sats without interaction from the 'receiver'

).

darkv0rt3x

hero member

Activity: 1176

Merit: 647

I rather die on my feet than to live on my knees

Quote from: Rath_ on February 03, 2022, 08:46:52 PM

Quote from: darkv0rt3x on February 03, 2022, 05:51:38 PM

Reply to me with a new BOLT12 offer of a fixed amount of 1515 sats (forget the 10 sats).

I will disable it once you pay it. Here you go:

Code:

lno1pqp3w80cpg09getdwphhyctj0ysx7enxv4ezqen0wgsxgctjddmrqun5xdupgrjjv96xsgzmddjhjum9dej9683qw0dq55jnjrpks4uyrcsg78fgjf6uwm4l5lk0me5hcm9lfu34kn6lqsqs6jevw9z0nhhr2pxvu6fpzaxvk0al52um3pp4j4c7shn5rhy6nueka0aug8h5lcudj0egp090mulku0kxes4998wtwfvsxf7ycgndw

Why don't you reuse my previous offer, though? I made sure that anyone can request an invoice with any amount using it.

Indeed. I don't know why I didn't think of it. lol

Edited;
Payment returned!

WhyFhy

hero member

Activity: 1423

Merit: 504

I find it fascinating how someone so new to the community has contributed so much , you also tread like you've been here 10 years! Keep up the good work!

@microlancer

Rath_

legendary

Activity: 1876

Merit: 3131

Quote from: darkv0rt3x on February 03, 2022, 05:51:38 PM

Reply to me with a new BOLT12 offer of a fixed amount of 1515 sats (forget the 10 sats).

I will disable it once you pay it. Here you go:

Code:

lno1pqp3w80cpg09getdwphhyctj0ysx7enxv4ezqen0wgsxgctjddmrqun5xdupgrjjv96xsgzmddjhjum9dej9683qw0dq55jnjrpks4uyrcsg78fgjf6uwm4l5lk0me5hcm9lfu34kn6lqsqs6jevw9z0nhhr2pxvu6fpzaxvk0al52um3pp4j4c7shn5rhy6nueka0aug8h5lcudj0egp090mulku0kxes4998wtwfvsxf7ycgndw

Why don't you reuse my previous offer, though? I made sure that anyone can request an invoice with any amount using it.

darkv0rt3x

hero member

Activity: 1176

Merit: 647

I rather die on my feet than to live on my knees

Quote from: Rath_ on February 03, 2022, 05:55:58 AM

Quote from: darkv0rt3x on February 02, 2022, 07:57:10 PM

If I receive any payment of this amount, I will return it!

Paid. I also received the 10 satoshis which you sent me yesterday through my offer. Feel free to deduct them from the refund payment.

Reply to me with a new BOLT12 offer of a fixed amount of 1515 sats (forget the 10 sats).

Rath_

legendary

Activity: 1876

Merit: 3131

Quote from: darkv0rt3x on February 02, 2022, 07:57:10 PM

If I receive any payment of this amount, I will return it!

Paid. I also received the 10 satoshis which you sent me yesterday through my offer. Feel free to deduct them from the refund payment.

Topic: Testing C-Lightning v0.10.2 Offers! [BOLT12] (Read 469 times)