The collapse of central banks...Inevitable? - page 6.

Smack That Ace

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Quote from: MainMan79 on April 24, 2024, 05:17:03 AM

As long as there's military and the police, there will be central banks.

You're posting this on a Bitcoin forum, you're ok. Now go out to the real world in 2024 and talk to an average person, or try to make some sort of a public declaration insinuating that governments and central banks ARE THE PROBLEM.

At best, you'll have one of every 10 people hear/support you. At worst, you'll get several days to several years in prison.

To be more precise, as long as governments exist, banks and fiat currencies will never disappear, and no decentralized currency can replace them, not just bitcoin.

We still live in a world that is centralized and completely controlled by the government. Many people are gradually forgetting that and they think that bitcoin will be the savior that can help them completely escape the government. It's true that bitcoin was created to help us achieve privacy and financial freedom, but that doesn't mean we will be completely free from government regulation. Or will bitcoin dominate and replace everything the government is creating to control us. As bitcoin investors, we have the right to be optimistic about bitcoin but don't be too delusional and think it is divine.

BD Technical

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Quote from: Abiky on April 17, 2024, 01:10:11 PM

With central banks struggling to keep inflation under control, people are beginning to lose trust in the traditional financial system. Some politicians (eg: Javier Milei) even suggested to abolish central banks as they're the main cause of the world's economic problems.

If the global economy continues to deteriorate, do you think central banks will collapse? If that happens, it will be the end of Fiat for good. In such a scenario, do you think Bitcoin will become the currency of the world?

What's your opinion? Your input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Not only is this problem happening to the central bank, but it is happening to you in the middle of the central bank. The cause of price memory has been starting since 2019 In 2019-20, the corona epidemic has caused many economic problems. But if you notice one thing now, If you see Russia, the economy has been affected by the Ikram war, and now the war between Palestine and Israel is on the brink of destruction. A few days ago, Iran's rocket attack on Israel has affected our economy, and the economy has a lot of products around the world that have an economic impact and this is for many countries. The damage is getting worse because you live in a war where the central bank cannot be responsible for the state of the country's economy.

MainMan79

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As long as there's military and the police, there will be central banks.

You're posting this on a Bitcoin forum, you're ok. Now go out to the real world in 2024 and talk to an average person, or try to make some sort of a public declaration insinuating that governments and central banks ARE THE PROBLEM.

At best, you'll have one of every 10 people hear/support you. At worst, you'll get several days to several years in prison.

btc78

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Quote from: ZippyPixL on April 23, 2024, 05:46:25 PM

their collapse seems unlikely in the near term. Central banks play a crucial role in economic stability and have tools at their disposal to address various economic issues.

There are over 8 billion people in the world and 195 countries. Not everyone will lose trust and confidence in central banks no matter how bad it becomes. Not all governments as well would deteriorate even if it seems that way.

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If hypothetically, trust in fiat currencies were to erode significantly, it could lead to increased interest to Bitcoin.

Like you said total domination of bitcoin is not gonna happen soon but as everyone slowly realizes the potential of bitcoin let us take advantage of it.

fikrett

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Quote from: Abiky on April 23, 2024, 11:54:45 AM

Quote from: stompix on April 22, 2024, 06:06:06 AM

You have people keeping their coins on centralized platforms, you have a few companies dominating mining, you have users unable to spend because of jpg monkeys and you're talking about bringing down central banks. Much hopium?

The dream was always to eliminate the middleman from the system (banks included). Why do you think Satoshi created Bitcoin in the first place? Unfortunately, people haven't moved away from centralizing powers out of convenience. It's much easier to entrust someone else with your funds (banks, exchanges, etc) than doing it yourself (self-custody). This is why the odds of central banks collapsing are very slim. Even if the economy is in a very bad shape. They can manipulate it by either printing more money (inflation) or raising interest rates to protect the value of Fiat currencies.

What will happen is the extinction of paper money via the introduction of CBDCs (government-issued digital currencies). This means more power/control over people's financial lives. As long as governments exist, don't expect central banking to go away anytime soon. I'm yet to see if Javier Milei's promises to abolish Argentina's central bank will materialize. I'm certain the legislative chamber won't allow it. Expect crypto to live alongside Fiat currencies for generations. Grin

Absolutely. It's unlikely that governments will give up control over finances anytime soon. So, probably, fiat and digital currencies will likely coexist for the foreseeable future.

ZippyPixL

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Quote from: Abiky on April 17, 2024, 01:10:11 PM

With central banks struggling to keep inflation under control, people are beginning to lose trust in the traditional financial system. Some politicians (eg: Javier Milei) even suggested to abolish central banks as they're the main cause of the world's economic problems.

If the global economy continues to deteriorate, do you think central banks will collapse? If that happens, it will be the end of Fiat for good. In such a scenario, do you think Bitcoin will become the currency of the world?

What's your opinion? Your input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

their collapse seems unlikely in the near term. Central banks play a crucial role in economic stability and have tools at their disposal to address various economic issues.

If hypothetically, trust in fiat currencies were to erode significantly, it could lead to increased interest to Bitcoin. However, for Bitcoin become the dominant global currency, several substantial hurdles need to be overcome. So while the role of digital currencies is likely to grow, the complete replacement of fiat by Bitcoin in the near future seems improbable.
Economic systems are intricate and usually change gradually over time rather than suddenly shifting all at once.

Abiky

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Quote from: stompix on April 22, 2024, 06:06:06 AM

You have people keeping their coins on centralized platforms, you have a few companies dominating mining, you have users unable to spend because of jpg monkeys and you're talking about bringing down central banks. Much hopium?

The dream was always to eliminate the middleman from the system (banks included). Why do you think Satoshi created Bitcoin in the first place? Unfortunately, people haven't moved away from centralizing powers out of convenience. It's much easier to entrust someone else with your funds (banks, exchanges, etc) than doing it yourself (self-custody). This is why the odds of central banks collapsing are very slim. Even if the economy is in a very bad shape. They can manipulate it by either printing more money (inflation) or raising interest rates to protect the value of Fiat currencies.

What will happen is the extinction of paper money via the introduction of CBDCs (government-issued digital currencies). This means more power/control over people's financial lives. As long as governments exist, don't expect central banking to go away anytime soon. I'm yet to see if Javier Milei's promises to abolish Argentina's central bank will materialize. I'm certain the legislative chamber won't allow it. Expect crypto to live alongside Fiat currencies for generations. Grin

tottong

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Quote from: taufik123 on April 22, 2024, 04:19:48 PM

In real terms now Fiat is still the main and so currency needed to buy the necessities of life and Bitcoin only as an option for trading commodities and also only as a speculative asset.

You are right because fiat currency is still an option given by the government to use it and at any time fiat currency will be a legal transaction tool in a country as the basis is outlined in regulations

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So it's still not a replacement for Fiat, and it's still not going to happen.
Some countries have their own regulations regarding Bitcoin, and in my country Bitcoin is only a commodity asset and nothing more.

That means we are in the same country because bitcoin is still used only as an investment asset and official fiat currency is still the best choice for buying anything and I don't see any chance that bitcoin can be used as a substitute for fiat, especially in our country.

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Fiat won't collapse because of bitcoin or crypto, but Fiat will remain mainstream with the addition of crypto as another more revolutionary payment option.

I agree that bitcoin is an alternative as a revolutionary step and the use of bitcoin and crypto in general is much more appropriate as an investment asset or as another option as a means of payment. Speculative assets may be difficult to implement as a legal means of transaction even though El Salvador has done it and a country that has its own currency will find it quite difficult to change the previous payment system by implementing bitcoin.

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Quote from: taufik123 on April 22, 2024, 04:19:48 PM

Fiat won't collapse because of bitcoin or crypto, but Fiat will remain mainstream with the addition of crypto as another more revolutionary payment option.

Its the other way round. Crypto without Fiat could not exist.

taufik123

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Quote from: tottong on April 21, 2024, 11:59:14 PM

Quote from: Abiky on April 17, 2024, 01:10:11 PM

If the global economy continues to deteriorate, do you think central banks will collapse? If that happens, it will be the end of Fiat for good. In such a scenario, do you think Bitcoin will become the currency of the world?

How sure is FIAT will collapse when humans really need it. Bitcoin is an alternative and I don't think it is a replacement for any fiat currency. It is too naive to say that fiat currencies will collapse while we have to use them to buy cigarettes, coffee and so on.

In real terms now Fiat is still the main and so currency needed to buy the necessities of life and Bitcoin only as an option for trading commodities and also only as a speculative asset.

So it's still not a replacement for Fiat, and it's still not going to happen.
Some countries have their own regulations regarding Bitcoin, and in my country Bitcoin is only a commodity asset and nothing more.

Fiat won't collapse because of bitcoin or crypto, but Fiat will remain mainstream with the addition of crypto as another more revolutionary payment option.

topbitcoin

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Quote from: angrybirdy on April 22, 2024, 05:52:49 AM

Quote from: Abiky on April 17, 2024, 01:10:11 PM

With central banks struggling to keep inflation under control, people are beginning to lose trust in the traditional financial system. Some politicians (eg: Javier Milei) even suggested to abolish central banks as they're the main cause of the world's economic problems.

If the global economy continues to deteriorate, do you think central banks will collapse? If that happens, it will be the end of Fiat for good. In such a scenario, do you think Bitcoin will become the currency of the world?

What's your opinion? Your input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

I don't think central banks will collapse even if economy are experiencing downfall because banks is the main source of storing and producing money as their savings and investments and majority of people are using bank, especially nowadays that everything is in digital usage, online banking is essential so I think it's unlikely to happen because it will cost too much negative effect to everyone.

A storage service and a money generation facility are created by the central bank in which people place their savings and investments as assets. However, most of the financial transactions take place online with online banking, so the role of banks in everyday life is significant. Everyone will be badly affected if there is any failure from the central bank as it does not only hit an ordinary person but also an economy in its entirety.

With this in mind, governments and financial authorities would always take all measures to avoid the failure of a central bank through different policy and intervention approaches that are essential. They will check if the central bank has enough backup and high solvency to keep functioning even at tough times of economic crisis. Though there is no certainty that a central bank will be free from such problems, with a robust banking system and government backing, the chances of it collapsing into oblivion seem very low.

bangjoe

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Quote from: Marvell1 on April 21, 2024, 10:36:16 PM

Quote from: bangjoe on April 21, 2024, 05:49:01 PM

I also think that FIAT is very difficult to get rid of, considering that this is like a disease that has spread to the tip of the nail, and banking will not become extinct, for me the reason is quite simple, it's a profitable business so there are some people who will definitely adopt it again with a digitized or decentralized system but still has the nature of banking.

Maybe that can happen, but if you look at the development of banks today they are withdrawing their branch outlets and prefer agencies in mass to show affiliation and spread money more simply to people in remote areas, so the removal of their branch buildings that are being carried out and switching to a digitalization system, allows banking to compete again, and if you look at it, many banks are trying to adopt blockchain technology so that they are not disrupted by the massive development of bitcoin.

That will never happen. Banks' move away from physical branches and toward digitalization is just a way to adapt to the evolving technological age, not a sign that banking dominance is waning. Furthermore, the role of banks is considered the backbone of any country's economy, while many countries do not need bitcoin. So it would be naive to think that banks are trying to counteract the popularity of bitcoin.

Bitcoin is just a speculative asset, or peer-to-peer currency not recognized by governments, while banks and fiat currencies are considered the core of the world economy. Even bitcoin replacing fiat currency will never happen, let alone bitcoin competing with banks.

Maybe yes and maybe no, what we are talking about now is also a mere speculation whether banking will still be maintained or not as the monetary standard of the world's financial system which is still very much believed and starting to be doubted today.

I know that it is not possible to be replaced easily if it is the system, but some elements may be depreciated and also disrupted by the digitalization of finance, if that does not happen there will certainly be others, considering that every century there will be a change in the financial system, it is impossible to last long with Fiat, but maybe we will last long with the banking culture.

stompix

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Quote from: Abiky on April 22, 2024, 05:48:30 AM

Volatility is only a problem when the world still uses Fiat as a unit of account. But once goods and/or services gets valued in BTC terms, this should no longer be a problem. 1 BTC = 1 BTC, right? Bitcoin can already scale to millions of users worldwide via the help of sidechains and L2 networks. It's just that most people don't know yet how to use these solutions to save time and money. Developers must improve UX (user experience) if they want to get people on-board off-chain scaling solutions and sidechains.

Yeah, yeah, I've kept hearing that years, how is the scaling going?
Do you know how long it will take to switch everyone to LN?
Do the math for opening a channel for everyone in the US assuming no ordinals, no consolidation, and no other traffic, and then I will tell you when CB will die.

Quote from: Abiky on April 22, 2024, 05:48:30 AM

Without central banks in the way, the world's economy would be decentralized.

Lol, what does CB have to do with the centralization of the economy?
You're telling me that once CB is gone everyone will be free to trade how they want, that TSMC will not have an almost monopoly on chips, that countries will not restrict or tax imports, that you will have the same taxation everywhere, you will be able to deal with every trading partner in the world and everything will be unregulated and permissionless? Again, lol!

You have people keeping their coins on centralized platforms, you have a few companies dominating mining, you have users unable to spend because of jpg monkeys and you're talking about bringing down central banks. Much hopium?

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Quote from: Abiky on April 17, 2024, 01:10:11 PM

With central banks struggling to keep inflation under control, people are beginning to lose trust in the traditional financial system. Some politicians (eg: Javier Milei) even suggested to abolish central banks as they're the main cause of the world's economic problems.

If the global economy continues to deteriorate, do you think central banks will collapse? If that happens, it will be the end of Fiat for good. In such a scenario, do you think Bitcoin will become the currency of the world?

What's your opinion? Your input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

I don't think central banks will collapse even if economy are experiencing downfall because banks is the main source of storing and producing money as their savings and investments and majority of people are using bank, especially nowadays that everything is in digital usage, online banking is essential so I think it's unlikely to happen because it will cost too much negative effect to everyone.

Abiky

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Quote from: slapper on April 19, 2024, 12:36:23 PM

"collapse of central banks" – that's some strong stuff. Some want to tear it down due to high inflation and declining faith in the system. I understand impatience. But eliminating central banks? That's drastic, like throwing away your toolbox because the hammer's rusty

Bitcoin as the savior? Okay. Bitcoin is great; a digital bunker for protecting your wealth. But as daily cash? Not yet. This is too volatile and difficult for most people. A true next-gen cryptocurrency is needed. Something stable, usable by anyone, and lightning fast. Bitcoin helped, but it's not the goal. Certainly, the system has issues. Don't despair yet. Tech is advancing rapidly, and smart people are solving problems. Not yet, but the answer is out there

Volatility is only a problem when the world still uses Fiat as a unit of account. But once goods and/or services gets valued in BTC terms, this should no longer be a problem. 1 BTC = 1 BTC, right? Bitcoin can already scale to millions of users worldwide via the help of sidechains and L2 networks. It's just that most people don't know yet how to use these solutions to save time and money. Developers must improve UX (user experience) if they want to get people on-board off-chain scaling solutions and sidechains.

Without central banks in the way, the world's economy would be decentralized. Not to mention, inflation will be a thing of the past. "Fix the money, fix the world". But the odds of this happening are slim, especially when central banks have a lot of power invested in them. If things keep going south, they could "reset" the economy to remedy the situation. At least, temporarily. As long as governments exist, don't expect Fiat currencies to disappear anytime soon.

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Quote from: Abiky on April 17, 2024, 01:10:11 PM

With central banks struggling to keep inflation under control, people are beginning to lose trust in the traditional financial system. Some politicians (eg: Javier Milei) even suggested to abolish central banks as they're the main cause of the world's economic problems.

If the global economy continues to deteriorate, do you think central banks will collapse? If that happens, it will be the end of Fiat for good. In such a scenario, do you think Bitcoin will become the currency of the world?

What's your opinion? Your input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Central banks are one of those "too big to fail" shit and that's true, the thing is that they can lose all their money and traction on the market and they still won't run out of business and people trusting them. To top it all off, all banks, centralized or not are supported by the government as they are an essential part of the whole economy that losing them would literally cause chaos and turmoil to everyone. And if we push for the abolishment of central banks just as what Javier Milei is suggesting, they would need to implement a replacement for it which at the end of the day, is still the same shit only running on different brands of gears.

So as much as I hate central banks with a burning passion as well, given the fact that they are part of the reasons why the current economy incentivizes being rich to begin with at the expense of the poor people's welfare and labor, we can't really reliably take them down or whatever. A replacement will just get reinstated and the cycle continues.

What needs to happen is a complete revision of how we look at money, how we use it. How we create and supplant money, bitcoin is a great start, but frankly speaking, we have to look or create something else.

tottong

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Quote from: Abiky on April 17, 2024, 01:10:11 PM

With central banks struggling to keep inflation under control, people are beginning to lose trust in the traditional financial system. Some politicians (eg: Javier Milei) even suggested to abolish central banks as they're the main cause of the world's economic problems.

Banks are a place for citizens to store money and banks function in many ways for the benefit of society. Although banks are one of the main causes of world economic problems, they will still be a necessary center and governments will continue to encourage financial institutions such as banks to become a sure place
The reason bank abolition doesn't actually happen is because they are protected by regulations as part of the process and fiat is still used by most people so it is impossible for banks to disappear in this world.

Quote

If the global economy continues to deteriorate, do you think central banks will collapse? If that happens, it will be the end of Fiat for good. In such a scenario, do you think Bitcoin will become the currency of the world?

How sure is FIAT will collapse when humans really need it. Bitcoin is an alternative and I don't think it is a replacement for any fiat currency. It is too naive to say that fiat currencies will collapse while we have to use them to buy cigarettes, coffee and so on.

Marvell1

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Quote from: bangjoe on April 21, 2024, 05:49:01 PM

Quote from: harapan on April 21, 2024, 04:38:56 PM

Quote from: Plaguedeath on April 18, 2024, 08:03:48 AM

If the central banks collapse, it means the whole country will collapse too.

Since there was country that no longer exist due to crisis i.e. Yugoslavia, so it's possible there will be a country that in debt and bankrupt, rich country might occupy that country. If you think Bitcoin will replace fiat due to central banks collapse, then you're live in your own imagination.

Honestly,at this point there's no way to eliminate fait or central banks.Bitcoin remains bitcoin,bitcoin still serves as bitcoin.Fait will continue to exists and execute and carry out its normal activities.

Central banks collapse will be a huge fallout for many.All segments are going to experience a big breakdown that initializes terrible and dangerous decline in growth and unemployment.
Such collapse can hinder the lives and survival of many.But I still think fait can still act and stand for fait lovers/users.

I also think that FIAT is very difficult to get rid of, considering that this is like a disease that has spread to the tip of the nail, and banking will not become extinct, for me the reason is quite simple, it's a profitable business so there are some people who will definitely adopt it again with a digitized or decentralized system but still has the nature of banking.

Maybe that can happen, but if you look at the development of banks today they are withdrawing their branch outlets and prefer agencies in mass to show affiliation and spread money more simply to people in remote areas, so the removal of their branch buildings that are being carried out and switching to a digitalization system, allows banking to compete again, and if you look at it, many banks are trying to adopt blockchain technology so that they are not disrupted by the massive development of bitcoin.

That will never happen. Banks' move away from physical branches and toward digitalization is just a way to adapt to the evolving technological age, not a sign that banking dominance is waning. Furthermore, the role of banks is considered the backbone of any country's economy, while many countries do not need bitcoin. So it would be naive to think that banks are trying to counteract the popularity of bitcoin.

Bitcoin is just a speculative asset, or peer-to-peer currency not recognized by governments, while banks and fiat currencies are considered the core of the world economy. Even bitcoin replacing fiat currency will never happen, let alone bitcoin competing with banks.

bangjoe

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Quote from: harapan on April 21, 2024, 04:38:56 PM

Quote from: Plaguedeath on April 18, 2024, 08:03:48 AM

If the central banks collapse, it means the whole country will collapse too.

Since there was country that no longer exist due to crisis i.e. Yugoslavia, so it's possible there will be a country that in debt and bankrupt, rich country might occupy that country. If you think Bitcoin will replace fiat due to central banks collapse, then you're live in your own imagination.

Honestly,at this point there's no way to eliminate fait or central banks.Bitcoin remains bitcoin,bitcoin still serves as bitcoin.Fait will continue to exists and execute and carry out its normal activities.

Central banks collapse will be a huge fallout for many.All segments are going to experience a big breakdown that initializes terrible and dangerous decline in growth and unemployment.
Such collapse can hinder the lives and survival of many.But I still think fait can still act and stand for fait lovers/users.

I also think that FIAT is very difficult to get rid of, considering that this is like a disease that has spread to the tip of the nail, and banking will not become extinct, for me the reason is quite simple, it's a profitable business so there are some people who will definitely adopt it again with a digitized or decentralized system but still has the nature of banking.

Maybe that can happen, but if you look at the development of banks today they are withdrawing their branch outlets and prefer agencies in mass to show affiliation and spread money more simply to people in remote areas, so the removal of their branch buildings that are being carried out and switching to a digitalization system, allows banking to compete again, and if you look at it, many banks are trying to adopt blockchain technology so that they are not disrupted by the massive development of bitcoin.

harapan

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Quote from: Plaguedeath on April 18, 2024, 08:03:48 AM

If the central banks collapse, it means the whole country will collapse too.

Since there was country that no longer exist due to crisis i.e. Yugoslavia, so it's possible there will be a country that in debt and bankrupt, rich country might occupy that country. If you think Bitcoin will replace fiat due to central banks collapse, then you're live in your own imagination.

Honestly,at this point there's no way to eliminate fait or central banks.Bitcoin remains bitcoin,bitcoin still serves as bitcoin.Fait will continue to exists and execute and carry out its normal activities.

Central banks collapse will be a huge fallout for many.All segments are going to experience a big breakdown that initializes terrible and dangerous decline in growth and unemployment.
Such collapse can hinder the lives and survival of many.But I still think fait can still act and stand for fait lovers/users.

Topic: The collapse of central banks...Inevitable? - page 6. (Read 1594 times)