Topic: The future of Bitcoins (Read 2263 times)

I do hope that you are right.

Meanwhile, "Iranians are resorting to virtual currency to move money into and out of the country in a way that Western authorities find hard to detect." http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2012-11-29/dollar-less-iranians-discover-virtual-currency

I also found this interesting article by Neil Fincham, the MineForeman: http://mineforeman.com/2012/12/10/want-to-destroy-bitcoin-i-am-going-to-tell-you-how/

I'd imagine that it wouldnt be overly difficult per se to carry out the 51% attack, i mean, everyone here is assuming they will just build a massive mining rig and take over the network, although if bitcoin was being targeted to be shut down i'm guessing it would be more than one government.

what would probably happen is all domain names linked to bitcoin, exchanges and mining pools would be turned off, as many servers as possible seized then every government that was aiming to shut it down turns on there own mining rigs and takes control of a lot more than 51%. If bitcoin was to threaten the monetary system then globally i'd be worried about a lot more than just a goverment pool harvesting 51% or more of the hashes.

Of course this would all happen after an official banning and some high profile arrests splashed all over the media to scare people into not doing it, under the pretence that bitcoin is used for buying drugs, building weapons (if they believed that dork who did that talk at the confrence in london i forget his name), and other such things that require money laundering.

Before they carried out a 51% attack they sure as hell would reduce the network hash rate a fair bit using more conventional methods (then probably use the impounded equipment to carry out the attack or fund it with money seized from accounts)

It seems pretty unlikely that there would be a successful 51% attack.  I think even the richest people or governments in the world would have a hard time pulling it off.

Bitcoins will end when deflation finally becomes unmanageable enough to kill the economy. Deflationary currencies are not good.

That's not new. It's called Godwin's Law and is about 20 years old or more.

There should be some thread locking program that scans for the word Hitler - it seems all threads eventually go there, one way or another.  Maybe "Hitler" can be a new term meaning "And now it's time to end the thread" = Hitler ?  Just a thought.

Remebers me of how some people failed at trying to kill Hitler, except the part of mining rigs.

You're so cute, how you all worry about 51% attacks and incredibly complex setups to achieve such an attack.

Wanna kill bitcoin? Here's how you kill bitcoin.

Wait for bitcoin conference, wait till all the movers and shakers are there, blow up the building, then claim it was a meeting of terrorists building doom machines, post pictures of mining rigs as evidence.

The concern here is that it is not just disruptive, it can threaten government control of money at which point they can consider destroying it. The purpose of this discussion is to see what can be done to prevent such a thing instead of just sitting and convincing ourselves that such a thing would not happen.

Thanks for providing the suggestion. This can indeed be one way. What else can be done?

bitcoins will survive

An entity with enough money can do a lot (but not anything). Go fishing, buy icecream, fly into the orbit, burn the money, start a war...

I've seen this concern many times, but never seen a satisfactory explanation as to how exactly Bitcoin would threaten anyone or anything more than any other technology.  After some struggle, the automotive industry is starting to embrace the electric car. The Internet is embraced by even most totalitarian regimes and corporations (for perfectly rational reasons), just like the printing press was embraced. If Bitcoin is a robust, effective, and disruptive technology, more smart people will recognize it than deny it - regardless of their ideological background.

***

As for the ease of >50% disruption (I wouldn't call it an attack) - hash rate, ASICs, etc. have nothing to do with it. Network security is simply determined by the total investment in Bitcoin mining. Assuming most miners use best available technology, and the same best technology available to a malicious entity, this malicious entity would need to invest at least that much money to claim >50% of the network. Current estimates are on the order of several tens of millions of USD. While this would disrupt validation of new payments, it would also become obvious to everyone. My coins would be perfectly safe, even if I am temporarily unable to spend them. I am not qualified to discuss counter measures, but I imagine the community could quickly set their nodes to only accept connections from known honest miners and nodes as a temporary fix.

Well, if nobody is interested in discussing, I will close the thread.

Off to find Plato for some philosophical entertainment.

The idea of a future security, it's because every day the BTC can change it's code for block generation and many other things.
Godammit, we already said if the government wants it today, he can.
Now close the thread.

The government can also purchase ASIC's and mobilize miners. Not to mention bribing/coercing existing miners.

BTC Network is too small, that's why a 51% attack is so easy.
Want to prevent it? Wait for ASIC's and call more miners.

How so? From what I am reading, a 51% attack is all that is needed to cripple the system. Why an entity would do so or have the resources to pull it off is secondary. I am more interested in seeing if the technology can provide or it can be improved to prevent such a thing from occurring.

In today's terms, the money needed to launch a 51% attack is insignificant compared to what is spent on wars. If needed, it is not inconceivable that money will not be a factor. Which returns me back to the original question. Does the technology have anything to prevent a 51% attack or is the bitcoin system helpless against such an attack? No one has addressed this. I believe this is the part that needs to be discussed, not whether governments will attack or whether they have resources to do so.

If the technology can have some way to prevent a 51% attack or a strategy can be formulated to prevent it, it is well worth discussing.

The future is a mystery = No one can know what tomorrow will bring, so there is no reason to worry about it.

Probably. I still think Bitcoin is one of the biggest spit stirrers (both politically and socioeconomically, despite Bitcoin being a currency and apolitical) since JFK got the "red bills" printed up, though.

Because they don't give a f*ck about BTC?