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Topic: The Multi-level Marketing scheme argument - page 3. (Read 5988 times)

hero member
Activity: 896
Merit: 1000
Seal Cub Clubbing Club
Don't really need an argument on /. for this one, as it's obvious and should be apparent to anyone who's ever read:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multi-level_marketing

From the wiki:


"Criticism has focused on their similarity to illegal pyramid schemes, price-fixing of products (BITCOIN BOTS, "EARLY ADOPTERS," EXCHANGE OPERATORS MANIPULATING MARKET PRICE), high initial start-up costs, emphasis on recruitment of lower-tiered salespeople over actual sales (RAMPANT SPECULATION VS. REAL ECONOMY), encouraging if not requiring salespeople to purchase and use the company's products (BITCOIN "ECONOMY"), potential exploitation of personal relationships which are used as new sales and recruiting targets (DITTO), complex and sometimes exaggerated compensation schemes (DITTO), and cult-like techniques which some groups use to enhance their members' enthusiasm and devotion (NEED I SAY MORE)."

AND:

"Independent, unsalaried salespeople of multi-level marketing, referred to as distributors (or associates, independent business owners, dealers, franchise owners, sales consultants, consultants, independent agents, BITCOIN MINERS, BITCOIN EVANGELISTS, etc.), represent the company (BITCOIN P2P NETWORK) that produces the products or provides the services they sell (ONLINE TRANSACTION PROCESSING, COMMODITY SPECULATION). They are awarded a commission based upon the volume of product sold through their own sales efforts as well as that of their downline organization (USD ENTERING THE MARKETS).

Independent distributors develop their organizations by either building an active customer base (BITCOIN EVANGELIZING), who buy direct from the company (BITCOIN EXCHANGE OPERATORS), or by recruiting a downline of independent distributors who also build a customer base (BITCOIN MINERS, BITCOIN MERCHANTS) thereby expanding the overall organization. Additionally, distributors can also earn a profit by retailing products they purchased from the company at wholesale price (EARLY ADOPTERS, BITCOIN MINERS)."

I'm not sure I'm following you.  The part you quoted is full of references to Bitcoin, but the link you provided has absolutely no mention of it.  Or did you interject Bitcoin references into the original text to effect some kind of Weird Al Yankovic parody of the actual definition?  It almost looks like you're trying to link the Bitcoin cryptocurrency to MLMs through a painful path of logic based on barely analogous points.  Almost...
legendary
Activity: 1050
Merit: 1000
Which very few people chose to do because it makes no sense to take the unnecessary risk and put up with the associated problems inherent to the medium.*

* at this very early stage.
member
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
Profits are not distributed, whoever finds solution first to the next block gets reward.  Bitcoin is and was never intended solely for mining. As Bitcoin grows and matures miners will be minority group performing a task of processing transactions and being rewarded for their effort.

Yeah but what gives the blocks any actual value?

Answer: New blood injecting real currencies into the markets.

No. Demand for Bitcoins sets  any real value to it. You don't have to inject real currencies to acquire them, you can sell products or provide service in exchange for bitcoins.

Which very few people chose to do because it makes no sense to take the unnecessary risk and put up with the associated problems inherent to the medium.
legendary
Activity: 1050
Merit: 1000
Profits are not distributed, whoever finds solution first to the next block gets reward.  Bitcoin is and was never intended solely for mining. As Bitcoin grows and matures miners will be minority group performing a task of processing transactions and being rewarded for their effort.

Yeah but what gives the blocks any actual value?

Answer: New blood injecting real currencies into the markets.

No. Demand for Bitcoins sets  any real value to it. You don't have to inject real currencies to acquire them, you can sell products or provide service in exchange for bitcoins.
hero member
Activity: 711
Merit: 500
Fight fire with photos.
I've edited my OP to more clearly illustrate the parallels.

Your parallels make very little sense.

"price-fixing of products (BITCOIN BOTS, "EARLY ADOPTERS," EXCHANGE OPERATORS MANIPULATING MARKET PRICE)" Early adopters have fixed the price? Did they fix it to the 25 dollars it was a few weeks ago or the 13 it's at now?

"emphasis on recruitment of lower-tiered salespeople over actual sales (RAMPANT SPECULATION VS. REAL ECONOMY)" So Bitcoin users are encouraged to get new people involved rather than use their Bitcoins.

Oh, wait, Bitcoin users ALSO encourage each other to spend Bitcoins to support Bitcoin businesses: "encouraging if not requiring salespeople to purchase and use the company's products (BITCOIN "ECONOMY")" Scandalous

I would continue, but it would take me all night to go point by point. So goodnight my brothers in Bitcoin, may the Bitcoins shine on you in the morning and may we all bathe in the glorious light of the future with which Bitcoins will blanket us. All hail Bitcoins!
(NEED I SAY MORE)
member
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
I eagerly await someone's attempt to refute my revised OP.
member
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
Profits are not distributed, whoever finds solution first to the next block gets reward.  Bitcoin is and was never intended solely for mining. As Bitcoin grows and matures miners will be minority group performing a task of processing transactions and being rewarded for their effort.

Yeah but what gives the blocks any actual value?

Answer: New blood injecting real currencies into the markets.
legendary
Activity: 1050
Merit: 1000
Profits are not distributed, whoever finds solution first to the next block gets reward.  Bitcoin is and was never intended solely for mining. As Bitcoin grows and matures miners will be minority group performing a task of processing transactions and being rewarded for their effort.
member
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
I've edited my OP to more clearly illustrate the parallels.
member
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
Bitcoin's requirement of a continuing injection into the market for a currency which isn't used as one, bears similarity to the token-product, recruitment-focused nature of MLM schemes.

Bitcoin is not multi-level marketing. Triplemining is.

Isn't that how any commodity works? Somebody exchanges dollars for something that isn't currency (like Coca Cola) only to later exchange it back to dollars.

Wait, I'm still new to this stuff. What's the Coca-Cola in this example, the Bitcoin or the Dollars?

The Bitcoins. Although really it doesn't matter, because you could look at either the dollar or the Bitcoins as commodities that one might exchange for the other. When we talk about MLM, we're talking about selling a system of selling a system. When we talk about Bitcoin, we're talking about a digital commodity whose value depends (just as any other commodity) on supply and demand. I can't profit directly just because I get 100 friends to use Bitcoin who then each get 100 of their friends to use Bitcoin.

Again, I said closely resembles an MLM scheme, not perfectly mirrors it.  It's unique in that the "profits" are distributed, not singular.

Unlike a regular commodity, there is no value inherent to bitcoins, so it's actually even worse of a scheme than true MLM's where you at least end up with some token crap to play around with.

It can be argued that any commodity is merely what people will pay for it, and the next phrase usually involves some assessment of how gold isn't anywhere near as valuable as it's spot price. However, stripped of all speculative value, it DOES still have value.  Any tangible asset does.  Even Beanie Babies are still fun for children to play with...

However bitcoins only have value relative to real currencies as long as people keep injecting value from real currencies.
full member
Activity: 153
Merit: 100


Ok so Camp bx pays for referrals therefore bitcoin is a MLM... got ya.

 Roll Eyes

I was simply highlighting the irony there, that's all Wink
full member
Activity: 182
Merit: 100
Please tell me the different % payouts I get from the different levels of referrals.  Thanks.

I dunno, depends on what you get from CampBX, apparently.



Even better.  Apmex pays me for referrals, therefore gold is a MLM.
member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
GROUNDED FOR TROLLING
Quote
Wait, I'm still new to this stuff. What's the Coca-Cola in this example, the Bitcoin or the Dollars?


The Bitcoins. Although really it doesn't matter, because you could look at either the dollar or the Bitcoins as commodities that one might exchange for the other. When we talk about MLM, we're talking about selling a system of selling a system. When we talk about Bitcoin, we're talking about a digital commodity whose value depends (just as any other commodity) on supply and demand. I can't profit directly just because I get 100 friends to use Bitcoin who then each get 100 of their friends to use Bitcoin.

Oh, see that makes a lot more sense.  I got confused by the Coca Cola example because beyond being a commodity, it is also a consumer product.  The relationship between Bitcoin and Dollars is more like the relationship between Gold and Dollars.  
hero member
Activity: 711
Merit: 500
Fight fire with photos.
Bitcoin's requirement of a continuing injection into the market for a currency which isn't used as one, bears similarity to the token-product, recruitment-focused nature of MLM schemes.

Bitcoin is not multi-level marketing. Triplemining is.

Isn't that how any commodity works? Somebody exchanges dollars for something that isn't currency (like Coca Cola) only to later exchange it back to dollars.

Wait, I'm still new to this stuff. What's the Coca-Cola in this example, the Bitcoin or the Dollars?

The Bitcoins. Although really it doesn't matter, because you could look at either the dollar or the Bitcoins as commodities that one might exchange for the other. When we talk about MLM, we're talking about selling a system of selling a system. When we talk about Bitcoin, we're talking about a digital commodity whose value depends (just as any other commodity) on supply and demand. I can't profit directly just because I get 100 friends to use Bitcoin who then each get 100 of their friends to use Bitcoin.
member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
GROUNDED FOR TROLLING
Refferals only become MLM like when the people you recruit pass a cut of their own recruits up the line.  As I said before, that system works just fine as do refferals but we should be clear about what is what.
full member
Activity: 182
Merit: 100
Please tell me the different % payouts I get from the different levels of referrals.  Thanks.

I dunno, depends on what you get from CampBX, apparently.



Ok so Camp bx pays for referrals therefore bitcoin is a MLM... got ya.

 Roll Eyes
member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
GROUNDED FOR TROLLING
Bitcoin's requirement of a continuing injection into the market for a currency which isn't used as one, bears similarity to the token-product, recruitment-focused nature of MLM schemes.

Bitcoin is not multi-level marketing. Triplemining is.

Isn't that how any commodity works? Somebody exchanges dollars for something that isn't currency (like Coca Cola) only to later exchange it back to dollars.

Wait, I'm still new to this stuff. What's the Coca-Cola in this example, the Bitcoin or the Dollars?
full member
Activity: 153
Merit: 100
Please tell me the different % payouts I get from the different levels of referrals.  Thanks.

I dunno, depends on what you get from CampBX, apparently.

hero member
Activity: 711
Merit: 500
Fight fire with photos.
Bitcoin's requirement of a continuing injection into the market for a currency which isn't used as one, bears similarity to the token-product, recruitment-focused nature of MLM schemes.

Bitcoin is not multi-level marketing. Triplemining is.

Isn't that how any commodity works? Somebody exchanges dollars for something that isn't currency (like Coca Cola) only to later exchange it back to dollars.
full member
Activity: 182
Merit: 100
Bitcoin's requirement of a continuing injection into the market for a currency which isn't used as one, bears similarity to the token-product, recruitment-focused nature of MLM schemes.

Bitcoin is not multi-level marketing. Triplemining is.

Please tell me the different % payouts I get from the different levels of referrals.  Thanks.
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