Topic: The paranoid user's security guide for using Electrum safely. (Read 387 times)

While using the computer, the encrypted volume will be unlocked and anyone with physical access could send funds if there's no password. So I'd recommend to use a password.

Especially for Newbies, it can't be repeated often enough to be secure, and use different passwords.

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That being said: I use some wallets (inside a VM, of course) for low-value altcoin dust, and it's very convenient to send cents without the hassle of typing a password. I just wouldn't recommend it to anyone, by the time they understand what's at stake, they can decide this on their own.

If you use Tails with LUKS encrypted volumes, I don't think using a password to guard Electrum wallet access is needed. I'm saying this, because your audience is newbies as you said, and I think an airgapped Tails is the best choice for a newbie. Installation instructions are very detailing.

I suspect this isn't for cold storage wallets. Paranoid users would never load their private keys on a non-airgapped device, unless there's some functionality to manage a lightning channel without internet connection I'm not aware of.

Haha, good one! 

Actually, you are 100% right but if you are using Windows, why should you double the number of spies? It will also slow-down your computer too. If I had to use Windows and Electrum, I simply would not visit malicious websites, unknown URLs, wouldn't open unknown emails or would use only separate email.
I really don't think one needs to use Antivirus if the person only visits certain reputable websites from specific device.

Btw in ideal case, one should dedicate one pc/laptop to privacy and another one for public activities, gaming and everyday life.

Yes but sadly for the people they only choose between the "less bad", so instead of share their info with X they want to share they info with a big tech, because you know..... "its a wellknow and reputable company..." 

But its understable thinking about they are not gonna scam you but if you have one problem with goverment.... GG for you. Anyways i think the  mos flawed privacy we have its in the smartphones and with google, we spend more time and we generate much more info in smartphones than in PC.

Windows spies on you more than any antivirus software. Windows is a privacy nightmare. Check out the links I shared in this post. Even if you try to sanitize Windows, turn off all the extra features, block or disable as much of the privacy invasion as you can, it still transmits data back to Microsoft and a variety of third parties about your device and what you are doing on it hundreds or even thousands of times an hour.

If you are using Windows, then whether your antivirus is spying on you is the least of your concerns.

I think it's not always the best to immediately update your wallet software. Personally, what I do is that I read release notes and news. There have been cases when update had some bugs and was dangerous. For that reason, I always wait a little and if I don't hear complains, then I update the software. Of course that highly depends on release notes because sometimes you need to immediately update your software because of critical bugs in current version.

I'm afraid antiviruses spy on you, especially free ones. Instead, I would use Virustotal to check whether websites I visit are safe or not and I would also check some files there too.

Really nice thread, everything is done well and said shortly but I would change the title. A true paranoid user is the one who thinks about hardware backdoors too

No, except for the Tor SOCKS5 proxy.

Completely agree. One back up is no back up at all, especially when most people store their only back up in the same location as their computer or hardware wallet (i.e. at home). Two back ups in two separate geographical locations should be the minimum.

Sure, but here we are talking about privacy focused users, not random users. If you are privacy focused, then there is no escaping that you must run your own node or you will be leaking data to a third party.

If your 2 devices are stolen, the robber will still need to know the PIN code of your smartphone, the password of your computer, and the one of your Electrum wallet, because using the 2FA feature don't prevent people to also using a "strong password" for their wallet. So it wouldn't be so simple.

Yes I agree with you but personally, I'm not confortable with having one single backup of my seed, even if I would carve it in stone.

So, this is not risky unless you are holding a large amount into this address.

Running a full node is not an acceptable solution for a random user, and Bitcoin is supposed to be safely usable by everyone.
There is neither any reputed SOCKS 4/5 proxies?

Two devices. Both formatted, clean install of good Linux distro of choice, full disk encryption. All software verified prior to installation. Both devices used for nothing else and kept physically and digitally secured.

Device 1, internet connected:
Your own node running over Tor.
Your own Electrum server of choice.
Your watch only Electrum wallet connecting exclusively to your own server.

Device 2, permanently airgapped at a hardware level:
Your Electrum wallet containing seed phrase/private keys.

That's the basics of it for maximum security/privacy while still being fairly easily usable. I could write a guide spelling out each step in detail, but what if I use Debian and someone else chooses to use Mint? What I choose Electrs and someone else wants to use EPS? How can I possibly write a guide for how to remove the WiFi card from every model of laptop in existence? What if someone's threat model is different to mine? Maybe they place more emphasis on $5 wrench attacks, so want to use passphrases for decoy wallets. Or perhaps they want to delete their watch only wallet when not in use. Maybe they want to run mempool.space or JoinMarket on Device 1 as well. And so on.

As Loyce says, people need to understand why they are doing things and what those things achieve, not just blindly follow a list of instructions.

I won't do it any time soon, especially since o_e_l_e_o just made me realize I'm not nearly paranoid enough yet:

You don't even need multiple devices for offline signing, but it would require rebooting into a Live OS at least once. Or multiple times, if you're like me and realize too late that your offline Electrum is an incompatible version, followed by the next reboot once you realize offline signing with minimum fees creates a signed transaction with less than 1 sat/vbyte and can't be broadcasted. In short, it is a lot easier with a dedicated offline device. Luckily, old laptops are very cheap nowadays.

There's another reason I can't really write a detailed guide: if someone's doing offline signing, they should understand all the steps, and they should be able to fill in the blanks to match their own situation. If you're only following a tutorial to the letter, chances are you're making a mistake. That's why I prefer to stick to just this summary:

Thanks Loyce, oeleo, and notatether for the answers, it was what i tinked, but its more safety to re ask to the wise of the forum instead of make a huge mistake in terms of security.

Yeah but thinking of future it can be a good think to have a "white" adress and a few more in the shadows, so when any ask, you only show a part of your funds and you dont have to say a lie like, "i dont have any". But yes you need to be very carefull.

In generally, users would be far better setting up their own 2-of-3 multi-sig rather than relying on a third party, sacrificing all their privacy, and paying the excessive fees charged by TrustedCoin.

The only safe Electrum server is your own one.

Don't reuse addresses when you can. If you must, such as in recurring payments from a third party, use it for that one purpose and one purpose only - never reuse the same address for different purposes. And then as mentioned above, mix the coins you have received to prevent other tracking where they are going and what you are doing with them.

Hence why it's recommended you mix your campaign funds using a mixer, or use a wallet that does it for you (exactly which wallet(s) I recommend for that I will not say, as people are having some tug-of-war on another thread about these kind of wallets).


Actually, please do I'd love to see it from a perspective of having multiple devices at your disposal which can all be used for securing a wallet.

In that case, it should be called "the slightly careful user's guide for using Electrum"
Now you make me want to write a "truely paranoid user's guide for using Electrum" But I won't, as I think it's futile. Whoever wants to do that can do it already, and people who aren't into it, should probably not even try to work with offline wallets and offline signing. The same for multisig: I wouldn't recommend it to inexperienced users.

Address reuse is bad for privacy, but doesn't add a security risks (unless you also leak part of your private key). For signature campaigns, where you post your address publicly, your privacy is gone already.

Hi to all, and thanks to Notatether for this usefull thread.

I have one question , we allways read its a bad behavior to use the same adress  everytime, but here we use the same adresse everytime in signatures campaigns and its ok for practicall purpouse also in some statics adreses needs to be in that way.

So what its the solution? or what its the risk on use the same? Or its only for tracking matters? I think its for that everyone recomends to change the adress so no one can follow/track you so easily. But im forgotten something and its any more risk that im making?

I disagree because Electrum 2FA makes a 2-of-3 multisig. This will prevent you from getting robbed if just one device is stolen, but if all of them are taken? Then your funds are screwed.

If you are OK with placing Electrum on many devices, I guess there's no problem with that as long as you move your funds quickly, but this guide is more oriented to using Electrum on a single device, without additional peripherals (hence why LiveUSB is not included cc. @LoyceV)


You're right about bare seed phrases being handled as little as possible, and frankly that's how it should be treated. As seed phrases with bitcoin on them are more like physical assets, such as gold or a stack of cash, you should be moving it around as little as possible.



Not only is that bad for privacy, it's easy to mess up writing it and if you do it electronically, you could get robbed by specialists inspecting the peripheral's NVRAM.


Not all hardware wallets are closed-source.


I don't think there's a way to determine the safest server, with the exception of the one hosted on electrum.org. You're basically trusting the node operator to not leak your privacy.

A private electrum server is much better than a public one for this reason, maybe I'll add that. It does require a connection to a bitcoin full node though - usually you have to run those yourself. Or maybe Getblock will do provided that wallet RPCs are not used (they are disabled over there).

I would add: And put the User Account Control (UAC) to the highest level you can.

I'm sorry but you can't say that, Electrum password and Electrum 2FA protection are not the same thing at all. The 2FA feature will protect your funds even if your password, your computer or your wallet are compromised, since the one-time passcode from your smartphone will always be needed to move your funds.
https://api.trustedcoin.com/#/faq

I disagree with that, if you store your seed in one single place you are more likely to lose it, if you store it in several places you are more likely to expose it.
Using a BIP39 password or a Shamir's secret sharing scheme(SLIP39) is a must if you want to safely store your seed in several places. Seeds without passphrases or SSS should be handled as little as possible actually.

It's way safer to export one single private key, than to play with the seed of dozens addresses.

No if you have large sums of money it's safer to use a real air gapped software wallet than a plugged and close-source hardware one.


It's an interesting "How to" thread. But unfortunately you haven't talked about the Electrum servers. Which ones are the most reputed and safest to use?
Same thing for SOCKS 4/5 proxies, which reputed ones can be used with Electrum?

You can disable autoplay easily in settings, but USB are usually much worse than CDs because you can easily add more stuff there and modify it.
Biggest problem I have with USB drives is that they can go crazy with no specific reason and make all data unusable.

I am not a fan of iPhones but they have longest support from all smartphones, and for Android devices Samsung and Pixels are one of the best with longest support.
Everything else is trash and I would not waste money on this devices, but maybe they can be used as alternative offline wallets for bitcoin (if done correctly).

I don't like that Mint is based on Ubuntu, so Debian version is a bit better, but Fedora is much better in recent years and it's supper easy to install and use it.

No, having it enabled is not intrinsically dangerous. The risk comes by allowing any external media such as DVDs or USBs to automatically execute whatever software happens to be on said media. If it's a DVD you burned yourself of some home movies, then no harm done. It it's a USB drive you just received from a friend or colleague, then you actually have no idea what is lurking on it and if their devices were free from malware when using the USB drive previously.

I would +1 to DireWolfM14's suggestion above of Linux Mint. It is as simple to set up as you can get, and has a very "Windows" feel to the GUI, making the transition much easier. There are pretty comprehensive guides available as well: https://linuxmint-installation-guide.readthedocs.io/en/latest/

That's a good point. There is a similar problem with smartphones, especially android ones, where we have many producers and many OS versions, distributed by phone producer. Sooner or later they stop publishing a new OS updates, then users should think twice if still want to use banking app etc. on not-updated phone.

Warning before you read my message: there’s a good chance I didn’t understand what you meant lol

I think it’s pretty much just about it being a vector for malware. Since it’s autorunning by itself, I think it’s pretty unsafe when inserting USB drives and CDs or DVDs in case the inserted device is infected. I guess autorun/autoplay isn’t dangerous on its own, but combined with an infected drive you’re basically gonna accept possible malware with open arms lol

That's a good thing

So, basically, to use Electrum safely, you shouldn't use it for much. After reading the title, I was expecting a topic about offline usage after closing the curtains and running from RAM.

That was in response to another member, but to explain; by "hardware" I'm referring to the computer in question, and it's construction.  Old computers or those with low processing power and low amounts of RAM often won't meet the minimum requirements for newer Windows distributions.  Most Linux distros don't need a very powerful computer to run properly, so Linux can be great for keeping otherwise obsolete computers in working order.

Wait a sec, I think I need an explanation geared toward a 5-year old child.  I know what the autoplay thing is on Windows, because on my previous PC that had a DVD drive I kept it on so I wouldn't have to be hassled with having to choose to play a DVD each time I put one in.  Is enabling it dangerous in and of itself, or is it just a vector for malware as NotATether described? 

Not sure what you mean by my hardware limiting me from using W10, but the suggestion of using Linux is an excellent one.  The problem is that I'm an absolute retard when it comes to learning new things in the realm of coding, which Linux does require you to do a little bit of if you want to use it like a boss (just like knowing command line *stuff* in Powershell, which I also haven't grasped fully).  I have fooled around with Raspberry Pi's and also tried making a PC with a Linux distro, but I freakin' got stuck at the installation stage, threw up my hands in frustration, and subsequently sobbed silently and alone in a corner until my house cats became concerned.

What appeals to me about Linux primarily is that you're not being exploited by Microsoft and, as highlighted very nicely by Ledger, you just never know what's in those goddamn updates.

The same is true of seed phrases, and yet we all write those down. Just ensure it is stored somewhere securely.

They definitely can by coming up with some memory system, but that doesn't mean anybody should. You shouldn't rely on your memory for anything really sensitive, be that seed phrases or long and complex passwords/passphrases.

That's a fair point, but making a blanket statement of "do not use passphrases" is not helpful, I think. Rather you should avoid them initially but spend some time learning about how they work to make you confident to use them one day.

The guide was written with newbies in mind, so naturally, advanced users will disagree with some of the things.


You gotta be able to remember your password, otherwise if you have to write it down and you get physically robbed, you're going to be SOL as bitcoin transactions are not reversable after the 1st confirmation.

The US military has a language program where students learn thousands of foreign-language words under intense conditions for 2-3 years. Memorizing 12 English words in a particular sequence should not be that difficult by comparison. Regular passwords on the other hand, the truly random ones with numbers and symbols, cannot be memorized at all. Especially once we get to 20+ characters.


It's also a foot gun (re: c++ jokes).

Yes if you know how to use these features, nothing bad will happen. It's like the about:config in Firefox or the Windows Registry. But imagine telling a new bitcoiners about BIP39 passphrase. When you combine that with the fact that not all wallets support it (and those that do place it in very different GUIs and screens), it's easy to see how someone can accidentally mess up.

I myself just deal with 12/24 word BIP39 seeds using whatever default derivation path is given to me by the wallet software, and I make a note of that in my head.

I disagree with a few of your points.

If you cannot write it down and cannot remember it, then what? No password at all? That's even worse. I have no problem with people writing down long and complex passwords - the key is to store that password safely. If you can store a seed phrase on paper, storing a password on paper is less risky, since the seed phrase is enough to compromise your coins on its own whereas with the password an attacker also needs access to your computer.

I assume by BIP39 password you mean extending your seed phrase with a passphrase. I would suggest everyone uses this. It is a fantastic tool. Write it down on paper separately to your seed phrase and back it up securely in a separate location to your seed phrase. It provides another layer of safety should your seed phrase be compromised, and provides you with plausible deniability in the event of a physical attack. Even better to use multiple passphrase if you can, as well as helping you keep coins from different sources entirely segregated and therefore better for your privacy too.

If your hardware is limiting you from using Win10, then you're better off switching to a Linux distribution.  Linux Mint is a good gateway OS for Windows users to get their feet wet in the Linux pool.  It's basically Debian with the Cinnamon desktop environment and a bunch of tweaks that make the OS behave a lot like Windows.

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Hardware wallets are not that difficult to use, the learning curve is about 10 minutes.  Pick one that's open source and supports the coins you collect.


The danger was far more significant in the olden days of Windows, like XP and before.  Remember when you would insert a CD or DVD into your drive reader, and the OS would automatically start the application?  On Win10 or Win11 that sort of thing now requires user confirmation with a couple of clicks.  The risk is still there, but significantly reduced.


This thread might be better off in the "Wallet Software" sub-board since these safety measures really apply to any software wallet, not just Electrum.

Back in the day, it was also a really popular vector for infecting computers with malware. You'd receive a sketchy USB stick or find it somewhere on the ground, and then insert it into your PC, and *bam* you're compromised. Sometimes you might even accidentally infect your USB by sticking it into some infected work computer somewhere and plugging it inside somewhere else. And the malicious files are using OS properties to "hide" themselves.

The only reason this is falling out of favor is because most people are using mobile devices now (which do not support Autoplay).

When you insert an USB drive, you’re asked if you’d like Windows to open the folder for you or do other actions. If you insert an install disc now, you’ll find out there’s also the option for Windows to AutoPlay the disc which basically makes Windows execute a .exe. If the disc has music on it and you choose Windows should automatically play the disc, it’ll launch those files by itself. But you also have the checkmark under the launch options in case you’d like Windows to do the same thing every time (e.g. you want Windows to automatically open the folder showing contents of a USB drive every single time you insert one). Now I guess you get why it’s a risk

Christ, this thread makes me want to break down in tears until I'm a snotty-nosed quivering mess.  You just made me more paranoid, because it takes some technical knowledge to follow your suggestions and, as I've said a million times before, using bitcoin for me is like driving a car with little understanding of what's under the hood and I lack the skills to get said car roadworthy again in case of a breakdown. 

What's this about the autoplay function being a big risk?  I run Windows but I'm not sure if I have that activated or not.  I'll check after I post this, but it isn't clear to me what the danger is.

In any case, I very much appreciate the suggestions, NotATether.  The only other software wallet I like is Sparrow, but I much prefer Electrum.

I just use cracked windows 7 for long time, i don't know how it safe. I can't upgrade to windows 10 too, What can i do?

If Windows 7 supported newer versions of Electrum, then my answer would've been: only if you use it as an offline, airgapped (never connected to the internet) wallet.

However, now that Electrum does not support Windows 7, you should not be using this operating system to store your wallet as there may be unpatched security vulnerabilities inside old versions of Electrum in the future.

Yes.  Irrespective of using it with old versions of Electrum, unsupported OSs are risky for all kinds of reasons.  The web browser your using is likely not supported anymore, and you're likely using it to log into your bank account, right?  As long as you're careful you're probably safe, but the risk is still there.

Microsoft still allows you upgrade to win10 or win11 with your win7 key, although it is technically a violation of their terms of use.

Yes because the security patch of Windows 7 is outdated and ended support by Microsoft 3 years ago and Electrum's latest version no longer supports Windows 7 since the release of version 4.2.0.
It's not safe if you stay using Windows 7 so to ensure you are safe use the latest Electrum and better upgrade to Windows 10 and follow all suggestions from the OP.

is it unsafe if I used Windows 7?

We all know the basic stuff like "double-check addresses you are pasting" and "only use Electrum.org" and "verify the GPG signatures after downloading", but what if you wanted to have true piece of mind that your funds are indeed safe inside Electrum? That's why I have created this short guide of things you should be checking so that you can always be at peace of mind that your funds, no matter how little they might be, are safe in your wallet. So without further ado, let's begin.

Verifying OS integrity

Even if your Electrum is genuine, if your OS is compromised then it's game over. So these measures can help you control the software running on your computer.

- Do not download cracked software from random websites, because almost of the time, it is just cheap malware. Resist the urge of taking the cheese, so the mouse trap does not fall on you.
- Do not click on random links in your email that ask you for bitcoins or say that you have won some bitcoins. These are specialized phishing attempts designed to steal all of your crypto.
- Research the domain of the link or the email address sender before clicking on any links in your email message. Even this can be a malware infection attempt of some sort.
- Always keep the OS with your wallet on it up-to-date with the latest security patches.
- Antivirus software should be used if your wallet is running on Windows.
- Ensure that AutoPlay or any kind of "opening applications on USB/DVD insert" is switched off. This is a massive security risk.
- Make sure you have a firewall running and that it's blocking all inbound connections.
- Do not store your wallet on any removable media/device that you frequently carry around with you, to prevent theft. Even if you use it on TailsOS, this isn't something you want to carry with you.
- Monitor the processes running on your system and make sure you are familiar to every process name, its location, and what it does.
- Use a clipboard monitor such as Sysmon (12.0+) and regularly track the text that is being written to the clipboard.
- Use Google Enhanced Safe Browsing, uBlock Origin, DNS server's like 1.1.1.1 or those provided by VPNs such as Proton, or similar software/extensions/features that block malicious and phishing domains from your browser.
- Note the IP address of Electrum.org, and make sure that visits to the website match this IP address.
- To detect keyloggers, use an anti-virus or set up Process Monitor, start it, type some keys and then stop it and analyze the events.
- Periodically inspect all shortcuts to Electrum programs to make sure they aren't bugged.
- Check Electrum program files to make sure they haven't been tampered with after the date you installed/updated it.

Verifying Electrum integrity

- Use these methods of installing Electrum, in order of decreasing preference:

Python source tarballs
Python PIP packages
Prebuilt binaries eg. AppImage, EXE, DMG
Any kind of portable Electrum binary

The reason why portable binaries are the least preferred is that if you make a shortcut to them, it is very easy to place a malicious binary in a similar-looking place, and most likely you wouldn't notice it.

- Of course, you must ALWAYS VERIFY THE AUTHENTICITY OF ALL ELECTRUM PACKAGES THAT YOU DOWNLOAD. this thread is a good start.

- Use a diceware password for guarding Electrum wallet access. Diceware passwords are multi-word strings of words taken from a dictionary similar to BIP39, but is 10x more secure than using a regular password. It is best to use at least 8 or even 12 words and memorize them - using screen readers to hammer the words in your head is a good start. Once you set a diceware password, you don't have to change it unless it has been compromised as it provides no security benefit in doing so. Ignore this advice at your own risk!
- If you have a strong password, you don't need 2FA protection, especially not the one that's bundled with Electrum.
- Do not write your password down on paper even if you cannot remember it. That is counter-intuitive and can result in your wallet getting hacked physically.
- Only seed phrases should be written on paper and stored in a secure location.
- Do not use advanced features like custom wordlist, BIP39 password, custom derivation path, Shamir's secret sharing, etc for your seed phrase. All of these are easy to screw up and will destroy your seed phrase copy as they can't possibly be remembered.
- Create a "sentinel" wallet without a password or with an easy password and load it with $5-$10. And always open this wallet first before opening your main wallet so that a possible compromise can not wipe you out.
- Do not use the "Export wallet" feature for any reason, you can just copy the wallet from the AppData or local folder. Older versions do not encrypt the exported wallet. Same goes with exporting private keys - do not do it at all.
- Do not use the Console feature at all. You are running a wallet not a Jupyter notebook.
- Don't open a Lightning channel unless you have a watchtower running 24/7, or you might lose channel funds to inactivity.
- Don't click on update dialogs from Electrum, instead navigate to Electrum.org manually.
- Double check that addresses are fully correct before sending money to them.

OpSec (user integrity)

- Do not tell people how much funds you have for no good reason. Especially do not write it on the public internet.
- Do not flaunt your wealth or brag about how much money you have on social media, or you could get robbed by criminal enterprisers and $5 wrenches.
- Do not piss tons of people off with decisions that could potentially impact thousands of users (particularly if you provide some internet software or service). Disgruntled people will make an example out of you - Luke-jr was a victim of this. For a more recent example (or at least an attempt of doing one), look up "Reddit API hackers" on Google.
Do not store any wallet passwords or seed phrases inside password managers, even if they are encrypted and the software is open-source. All it takes is one flaw, vulnerability, or backdoor to undermine the security.
- Make sure all of your passwords are unique and strong so you don't become a victim of extortion.
- Similarly, use disposable emails whenever possible such as SimpleLogin, to avoid getting phishes and threats in the first place. And if you do get those, simply create a new alias and discard the original address.
- Use HaveIBeenPwned to see if your email address has been caught in a data breach.
- Don't keep large sums of money on a software wallet. Use a reliable hardware wallet for cold storage.

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