Topic: There is nothing funny in The DAO "attack" - page 3. (Read 6179 times)

Lets examine who are the real group at fault here based on the extent to which each stakeholder acted in a professional manner according to their role in the whole debacle:

Ether Devs: As far as I can see have acted in good faith. Tested the network for a long time before going live. Network has performed more or less as expected.

DAO Devs: Wrote a script to run on the Ethereum network. Tested it. Not well enough as it turns out but no software can ever be tested to production standards without actually being in production so there's nothing new there. Maybe 6 out of 10 but not jail material.

DAO Investors: Bought a product with no assets, no equity, no premises, no projects, no clients. no staff and no reserves. Did not attach any conditions to their funding. Did not request any security nor any quantification of return on investment.

Lets compare the due diligence carried out by the DAO investors compared to a regular benchmark - a bank lending on a property purchase.



I'm maybe being a bit harsh on the equity front because DAO holders did actually receive tokens for their investment which gives them a share in the fund that's tradeable. However, the difference is that the loan is always owed back to the lender whereas the DAO was always going to get drained, whether by hack or through spending.

Also, note this: A good while before the DAO got going, I messed around with the concepts on this page here which show you how to create your own cryptocurrency on top of Ethereum:

Copy, Paste and make your own DAO  
https://www.ethereum.org/token

I found this very interesting and saw lots of uses for it. However, when the DAO emerged, I did get a bit of a fright when I realised that somebody had basically just applied that bit of code and asked people to invest in the resulting tokens. It's something that anyone can do - make your own money and sell it.

Obviously, since it's just a piece of code and not an actual asset with a long and robust trade history like, say Bitcoin which has nearly 8 years of growth behind it, its value is basically zero unless the investment has some other conditions backing it that help to insure the veracity of the contract.

So who is really at fault here ? To me, the DAO was ridiculously overvalued and the blame for that lies squarely at the door of investors for not doing due diligence.

Also, as far as the subject of the thread goes, despite the serious side, there is some humour to be had out of the sight of such a frenzied feeding fest that turns its participants so abruptly into a hapless flock of newly shorn sheep.

Agreed, but I did in on purpose. And do you know why? Because most of the people are measuring their holdings in fiat (or Bitcoin), and like the "attacker" said - "Money talks". I hate it, but its the truth...

I do not understand why the Ethereum Foundation does not drain the DAO to a child DAO? That could save something.

Just one point of observation. Although I've got sympathy with people who lost money, this practice of quoting everything in fiat like the OP has done is a bit over dramatic.

Nobody forked over $270 million for anything.

If I have 1 million worthless Ether that I bought for $1, then a market trade occurs where 100 Ether are exchanged for $20 each, that suddenly values my $1 Ether at $20 Million. Doesn't mean I paid $20 million for them. I still only paid $1.

So, I say to the original poster - yes, bugs occured and people lost money, but nobody ever had $270 Million and it's disingeneous to keep quoting fiat values for anything other than notional appraisal.

An exchange rate movement is not the same thing as an actual trade so if you're being honest, the amount lost in terms of $dollar trade is very small compared with the figures you're quoting.

In the attacker's original interview, he stated he stopped draining the DAO at 30% drained, as an olive branch of sorts. But this depends of course of you not stealing his rightfully gained tokens with your attempted insecure 51% attack hard fork.

Since you've all voted to steal his tokens, he is forced to drain the rest of your tokens and redistribute them to a new set of miners who will replace your existing miners.

You guys passed up the best chance you had to not lose it all.

What are you taking about 30% haircut?

Do you really believe this?

People on here don't even know what some of those mean after years of participation. Do you really believe that Joe and Jane public will hear about a Russian cartel stealing $50m in digital currencies (0.5% of the entire industry) and will run to the web to school up on blockchain tech? IMO they will run the other way holding on TIGHT to their fiat wallets.

I've always been an advocate for adoption. sometimes even to a fault. I believe that all our techno-babble is complete and utter bullshit where the public is concerned. I don't think they care if it's centralized, decentralized, turing complete or Nashed hash cakes with Kim Kardashian's butthole tied to the helm. They just want it to work, be easy to use, and they don't want their money lost or stolen. If we can't achieve that then we are all living in cloud cuckooland. End of.

I'm just letting you know what I think we as an industry are up against.

Damn fucking right and all these guys are side stepping this ugly issue.
Admitting we witnessed the largest obviously paid hype / spam campaign here and across Crypto
..is bullshit !
They had a LOT of "Stories" pre-made and submitted and approved on Coindesk going back to 2014.

NONE of this was possible with out a few millionairess to start the Pump for the dump too.
And there was a dump too !
V. Butterin admitted to dumping a massive fortune (how did he get his coins ?)

Don't forget about the million dollar secret ETH cash-grab in 2014 on launch day.
This was a cold calculating ICO scam from the start !

SO i laugh at them as it all collapses around them as i predicted.

AND..

I laugh at you all when you say it's bad for the Crypto Currency scene when scams are busted.
Sorry but busting up and killing scams is a good thing Investards.
..don't bother trying to lump together your scammy ICO "Scheme" tokens
with the far older and far more respectable Alternative Currency scene.

The public ?
You mean the one i have been railing away at you all for fucking years on end
as you ALL bent over backwards to deny it ?
All of a sudden you are trying to use that against me ?
AHAHHAH I THINK NOT !

The public can do a quick Google search on the difference between ICO scheme and ALT-Currency.
They are not that stupid.

The public is not blown away by techno-jargon & catch phrases..

Turing Complete, Crowd-funding, Block-chain, APP's, platform, ICO, Immutable, Recursive, Angel Investing, ITO, Line trends, MARKETING  ...for profit "schemes" 

We have ICO scams and we have currencies period .

..i support currencies that are intended as such.
..I laugh at all the other "For profit" crap.

By the way i just had yet ANOTHER new account here ask me AGAIN for trade advice via PM.
And it was not very difficult..
This is what i told him people (so bear that in mind when you think scams being killed is a problem for Crypto-CURRENCIES)


PS:
@Minecache
As usual you are a deceitful Fraud who refuses to stop pushing your scammy bullshit.
Even after the gig is up and the game is over. 
Desperate little noob bag-holder ..awww i feel sorry for you (NOT) 

Nope. You all had a chance to only get a 30% haircut, but you were determined to vote, thus commit 2 wrongs and break Nash equilibrium and lose 100%:


Stoopid.

If the DAO puffs itself up as a corporation, I do think it pretty funny when it's revealed that its assets are stored in something as secure as a kid's piggie bank.

I also find it funny when its participation rate is some 2%, lol...

FFS.

Firstly why dilute any argument you try to bring to the table with petty immature name changing? Like or loath him his name is Vitalik so what issue do you have with referring to him as such?

Secondly, crypto is still an embryonic market? Exactly how you expect Vitalik to adequately respond in a crisis situation is beyond me. He is learning on the job and there is nothing wrong with that especially in such a new market/technology.

Seriously, grow up a bit. Or at least learn some humility. Pathetic.

Do it faggot!!!11!!

So 2 wrongs make a right?

Don't incite me to quote your banal (irrelevant) references to Biblical verses in our prior technical debate.

Aha.

I'll repeat again:

Probably, but you forgot 4 things:

1. The thread is not about who/what we are.
2. I have never ever traded ETH or DAO's and I did said it about 450 times already.
3. I am here with my realname.
4. It is me on the picture.

So, please, tell me... are you sure you are not with schizophrenia?

*Looked around, saw no meth heads, just one lonely troll that nobody listens to any more or pays attention to his supercoin crap talk*.

Some mETH heads are really butthurt.

This iamnotback guy is really something. He would post replies asap, then edit them, adding more sentences and put about 12 million more quotes, which are irrelevant to the subject of the thread.