They say hardware wallets are the safest - page 3.

Reid

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This is why in the beginner's section you can still find tips on how you can improve your security.
Here is a good list.
Good topics on security and privacy
CTTO

In my opinion, it will always depend on you.
You can do all the security which was told in the link provided but, I will still go back to the old school.
Keep that seed in a piece of paper.
Laminate it to avoid getting wet.
Put it somewhere dry and secured.
If you are still paranoid for its security then put another wall which is 2fa.
Now, before they can access your account, they will need your phone and that laminated paper. Grin

It's not about the hardware wallet. It's about keeping what you did from it.

yazher

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You own the pen

The hardware wallet is the safest crypto wallet you can use out there because simply you are the one controlling your funds. Unlike web wallets or you simply put your BTC into an exchange, you can't do anything when they suddenly go offline. there are lots of exchanges who suddenly closed and never came back. one of them is Octaex and many others. this is the worse cases and they sometimes happen without a warning. as you can see base on the past history and some statistical analysis, there are many cases of exchanges who got hack than the Hard wallet itself.

o_e_l_e_o

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Quote from: witcher_sense on July 07, 2020, 01:50:07 AM

As far as I know, with watch-only wallets one can only track balances and recieve funds.

You can also use watch only wallets to create, but not sign, a transaction. You can then move these unsigned transactions to an airgapped wallet to sign them, and then back to your watch only wallet to broadcast.

Quote from: witcher_sense on July 07, 2020, 01:50:07 AM

If I sign a transaction on a completely offline PC with my airgapped hardware, can I broadcast a signed transaction using watch-only wallets?

Correct.

Quote from: witcher_sense on July 07, 2020, 01:50:07 AM

It is safe to broadcast an already signed transaction on a compromised online computer?

Yes. If you import an already signed transaction in to a watch only wallet, then it cannot be changed in a way that would result in your coins being stolen.

bearexin

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Quote from: BlackHatCoiner on July 04, 2020, 08:50:00 AM

Why do they say that? Correct me if I'm wrong. Isn't, hardware wallet, a hardware like usb, that generates private keys without being online on the internet?

Why do I not like them? Because, in addition with a txt file that you can encrypt with many ways and save it in many places, if your hardware stops working, you're a dead man. And you're going to fix it somewhere? Not that recommended. If you're a paranoid of course.

Prove me wrong, by not telling me the cons of software wallet. Prove me wrong, by telling me the pros of hardware wallet.

That’s what they say, but every type of wallet you decide to use has their cons and pros. There are so many wallets that people say are not safe, but I’ve used these wallets and not have any problem with them for one day. Sometimes I wonder if it’s the same way I use these wallets that others are using, because I don’t seem to have any problem with them. It’s just like mobile wallets, I have seen people say a lot, but I make use of them.

You just have to understand what you’re using completely and know the cons and how you can avoid them and you’re good to go. And apart from that there are basic rules you have to follow to ensure that you’re safe in all these.

witcher_sense

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Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on July 06, 2020, 08:24:27 AM

You can use most hardware wallets with a completely airgapped computer if you want. For example, pair a Ledger device with Electrum on an airgapped computer, and use a watch only Electrum wallet on a live computer to monitor addresses and generate transactions.

I didn't get this part. As far as I know, with watch-only wallets one can only track balances and recieve funds. If I sign a transaction on a completely offline PC with my airgapped hardware, can I broadcast a signed transaction using watch-only wallets? What do you mean under "generating"? It is safe to broadcast an already signed transaction on a compromised online computer?

pooya87

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I don't think some wallets are more secure than others. There is always a risk.

there are always risks involved in everything but some things are riskier than others.
for example a hardware wallet is a lot more secure than a desktop wallet on an online PC and that is a lot more secure than a web wallet and so on. then we have types that are more or less at the same security level: hardware wallet, cold storage (offline-online setup by user), paper wallets. and the only difference in that case is the difficulty of setup and usage while spending from these.

charlesmichel1

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Cold storage is supposed to be the safest methods for holding bitcoin. These wallets are not accessible via the Internet, so they can't be hacked. But there are still some risks about them, if users misplace or forget their private keys, they will lose access to their funds. But it isn't the problem created by a hardware wallet itself.

o_e_l_e_o

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Quote from: witcher_sense on July 06, 2020, 02:57:40 AM

I was thinking about a hardware wallet that is completely air-gapped, never connects via USB

You can use most hardware wallets with a completely airgapped computer if you want. For example, pair a Ledger device with Electrum on an airgapped computer, and use a watch only Electrum wallet on a live computer to monitor addresses and generate transactions.

Quote from: 20kevin20 on July 06, 2020, 06:57:44 AM

You can literally hand it out to a thief and nothing should happen to it. The thief has 3 attempts to unlock your wallet before the Ledger resets. The only thing you have to take care of is the seed.

To the best of our knowledge this is true for Ledger devices, but there could easily exist a yet undiscovered security flaw. I don't think saying you don't need to take care of your device is the best advice. We also know this isn't true at all for Trezor and KeepKey devices. If an attacker has physical access to these wallets, then they can extract your private keys.

Shasha80

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For me hardware wallets are still the safest way to store Bitcoin. Maybe you consider it unsafe because it doesn't save private keys
in a safe place, do not store private keys in an easily encrypted txt file. And most importantly if you have hardware wallets, don't
forget make recovery seed. So if the hardware stops working, lost, stolen and damaged. As long as we have recovery seeds, you
don't need to worry, because the Bitcoin that we have will be safe.

20kevin20

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Quote from: Mulann2 on July 05, 2020, 10:12:24 AM

I see hardware wallet as flash drive that you store any valuable and important information,

Except information from flash drives cannot be fully restored using a string of words.

Quote from: Mulann2 on July 05, 2020, 10:12:24 AM

I see hardware wallet as flash drive that you store any valuable and important information, hardware wallet is much more safer than any online or offline wallet in storing your funds, all you need do is store your hardware wallet in a safe and secure place where you will remember, as long as you didn't misplace your hardware wallet you have nothing to fear.

You can literally hand it out to a thief and nothing should happen to it. The thief has 3 attempts to unlock your wallet before the Ledger resets. The only thing you have to take care of is the seed.

witcher_sense

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Quote from: bakasabo on July 06, 2020, 05:33:40 AM

"Even if you lose your wallet, your entire money will be perfectly safe" - you mean saving privatkey or seed phrase on separate paper? But this will just weaken your security. You can lose or something might find and use it.

What do you mean "back up will weaken security"? If you to lose your hardware wallet and you didn't have backup, then you have no chance to prove the ownership of your coins. That is not back up itself makes security weaken. It basically depends on where you store your back up, how you store it, whether it is encrypted or not, in which form it is, etc. Either way, hardware wallets are used only for signing transactions with private keys derived from your seed phrase, i.e. seed phrase is more important than device storing it.

bakasabo

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Quote from: Benefactor on July 04, 2020, 12:04:39 PM

The protection of hardware wallets is much better. It is in a much better position than software wallets. Hardware wallets keep your money safe at all times. Even if you lose your wallet, your entire money will be perfectly safe.

Take a look here. The guy got a hardware, that was already opened. Who knows what was done with it. Even if you buy it from authorized representative, you dont know what or could the worker has done with the device.

"Even if you lose your wallet, your entire money will be perfectly safe" - you mean saving privatkey or seed phrase on separate paper? But this will just weaken your security. You can lose or something might find and use it.

darmanzds

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Hardware wallets are not bad. I like its security system. I enjoy using the hardware wallet for my daily work. I think it's safest in my language. Others may disagree. Hardware wallet best in my case...

witcher_sense

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Quote from: pooya87 on July 06, 2020, 02:19:23 AM

if you check all the exploits that were fixed in hardware wallets over the years you can see that they really aren't as safe as people think. in other words there are always a lot of ways to steal your coins even if they are in a hardware wallet and you connect it to a compromised computer.

Hardware wallets still require software for constructing and broadcasting transactions, I think thats not possible to do things completely offline since bitcoin doesn't work without Internet ptotocols. I was thinking about a hardware wallet that is completely air-gapped, never connects via USB, Coldcard is arguably the best choice, however it still needs to receive partially signed transactions somehow. SD-cards for transfering information may also be compromised and if it is possible to hack hardware that way we also in trouble. In other words, as long as we can't use bitcoin blockchain completely offline, we have to rely on software, no matter how cold our wallets are, there is no truly safe way to broadcast transactions.

pooya87

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Quote from: Sadlife on July 05, 2020, 07:43:37 PM

You can always plug it in a different computer then your good to go, even if you use your previous computer that was compromised by a malware to steal data they wouldn't manage to steal your Crypto because an hardware wallet has a series of encryption known as private key, child key and grandchildren keys. It would be extremely difficult to guess password/bruteforce unless they have a super computer.

if you check all the exploits that were fixed in hardware wallets over the years you can see that they really aren't as safe as people think. in other words there are always a lot of ways to steal your coins even if they are in a hardware wallet and you connect it to a compromised computer.

Lorence.xD

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Quote from: Sadlife on July 05, 2020, 07:43:37 PM

You can always plug it in a different computer then your good to go, even if you use your previous computer that was compromised by a malware to steal data they wouldn't manage to steal your Crypto because an hardware wallet has a series of encryption known as private key, child key and grandchildren keys. It would be extremely difficult to guess password/bruteforce unless they have a super computer.

That is one of the advantages of hardware wallet, the problem is not the wallet itself, it is the person responsible for it, you might have the safest wallet ever but you are carefree and disregard security of your wallet then it will ultimately defeat the purpose.

Sadlife

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You can always plug it in a different computer then your good to go, even if you use your previous computer that was compromised by a malware to steal data they wouldn't manage to steal your Crypto because an hardware wallet has a series of encryption known as private key, child key and grandchildren keys. It would be extremely difficult to guess password/bruteforce unless they have a super computer.

htsy585

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Quote from: BlackHatCoiner on July 04, 2020, 08:50:00 AM

Why do they say that? Correct me if I'm wrong. Isn't, hardware wallet, a hardware like usb, that generates private keys without being online on the internet?

Why do I not like them? Because, in addition with a txt file that you can encrypt with many ways and save it in many places, if your hardware stops working, you're a dead man. And you're going to fix it somewhere? Not that recommended. If you're a paranoid of course.

Prove me wrong, by not telling me the cons of software wallet. Prove me wrong, by telling me the pros of hardware wallet.

Nope, that's not how hardware wallet really work and indeed it is the best and the most secure set of wallet available in the market. Taking about losing or when the wallet get damaged, there's a way to recover you damage wallet on a new one because each hardware wallet has a recovery seed. Yoy should learn more about how hardware wallet operates

carlisle1

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Quote from: BlackHatCoiner on July 04, 2020, 08:50:00 AM

Why do they say that? Correct me if I'm wrong. Isn't, hardware wallet, a hardware like usb, that generates private keys without being online on the internet?

Why do I not like them? Because, in addition with a txt file that you can encrypt with many ways and save it in many places, if your hardware stops working, you're a dead man. And you're going to fix it somewhere? Not that recommended. If you're a paranoid of course.

Prove me wrong, by not telling me the cons of software wallet. Prove me wrong, by telling me the pros of hardware wallet.

This is one example of the risk hardware wallet can experienced things that just happen now,for how long that there are users of this wallet

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/my-hardware-wallet-was-seized-by-us-customs-5260116

Though we still not sure what happens yet if the allegation is true?now US citizen might consider keeping safe their Hardware wallet orders and delivers.

sunsilk

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Quote from: sayulita on July 05, 2020, 10:02:22 AM

Quote from: sunsilk on July 04, 2020, 01:10:09 PM

You can do that as long as you have the recovery phrase from your hardware wallet, you can use that with Electrum.

Now this means that I always have to save the copy of my private key somewhere safe at all times because the bitcoins from the hardware wallet are also not recoverable.

Exactly.

Actually this practice isn't just for hardware wallets but for every non-custodial wallets. Those are the wallets that give you the private keys, seed, or the recovery phrases. So you should practice that of keeping a copy of it whenever you use it to store your balance for a long time. Always create a back-up and it's safer if you won't use the cloud as a backup or any email but handwritten.

Quote from: sayulita on July 05, 2020, 10:02:22 AM

But this also jeopardize the safety of the hardware wallet as already there is a copy of the private key out there outside the wallet so higher chances of the funds being stolen. I guess the problem of storing the private key more securely also arises now since we know that the hardware wallet can also stop working at any time or any mishap can happen.

The manufacturers like Ledger don't know our private keys. Read this discussion for clarification.

https://www.reddit.com/r/ledgerwallet/comments/4xgi2t/does_ledger_know_your_private_keys/

Topic: They say hardware wallets are the safest - page 3. (Read 1101 times)