Topic: This why wall street are rich and you are poor (Read 949 times)

The probelm here is that the wall streeet guys has the insider information as when the bitcoin will pump and how long the bull run will last. We, as a retailers, does not have any such information and hence we cannot time the market perfectly. What if we took loans to buy crypto and the market does not enter into the bullish phase.

Secondly, money makes you money. Rich people have all the facilties to borrow money while its hard for any common man to borrow huge amounf of money without any collectral.

True. You cannot just easily take a loan without any collateral to present that can also cover up the worth on the amount you wish to borrow. This is what most of the traditional lenders too.

However, lending money is not at all times productive. Because there are cases that your business had boom in its first months, but later on started to crash or collapse. Its like crypto too, there are no guarantees that you will always gain profits, as the market has its own flaws too. So if you wish to borrow money, make sure that you also have other stable sources of income that will pay your loan when crypto fails to do so.

Wall Street are never poor to begin with, the rules of borrowing money is having something to tender as collateral just in case, lenders don't just lend out money to anyone, you have to worth something yourself.

Borrowing money to invest in crypto is indeed a good idea but on the other hand the risk is also big,
we know that investing in crypto is not always profitable,
but what is clear is that it all depends on each person if that person can manage his finances well maybe it won't be a big problem

That is, loans should not be made for personal interest and gains. But if you borrow money to invest in crypto, i would say, yes its a better idea but not really significant. Because there is no assurance that you will make profits consistently, and no assurance that you can pay your debt in time. As long as volatility matters, crypto will always be unstable. But it does give us a huge income, but not in a frequent basis.

That is why you borrow money and then invest into something that is a bit more guaranteed, a bit less risky. Like for example mortgages are great for that, you borrow money and then you get a loan for 10 or even 20 years if you can, and after 20 years, you have a house that worths A LOT more than what you paid for since inflation will make sure the price would go up, and by the time you are finishing, on your last years the debt will be tiny because of inflation as well.

Assuming you make 1000$ per month, and you pay $500 for the house, by the end of 10th year you will be making 2000 or even 3000 and still paying 500 and that is the great part about it.

It is mate. It is bad to borrow money and then use that money in the actual gambling. The OP also talks about gambling but its a different one. Investing in crypto is another form of gambling but it is less riskier especially if done on good set of coins. I say less riskier because cryptos are volatile.

You might be losing today but you never know maybe by the time you woke the next morning your already in profits. This is the good thing in crypto. Gambling is more of a personal hobby or personal interest and its not really that beneficial if we borrow money to feed our personal interest because there is no better returns that we can expect.

having debt for some people is indeed quite wise but only for some people who are really good at circulating their money but sometimes many people do the same thing but what happens is the opposite and even only gets worse so they can't get out of debt they.
As for investing using money that can be said to be quite hot because the results from borrowing are actually too risky, not only for beginners but also for those who are advanced, the risk will still be very large.
they need to think of various ways here because the market won't always be supportive in this case because they won't always be green.
I think we also have to be wise in self-control to be in debt in this case

It's no bad decision if borrowing cash both in fiat, in the cryptocurrency sphere and also for gambling,I see nothing bad with such, like I could attest to the fact that I borrowed some amount of money to gamble, strictly football gambling and I wasn't able to pay back in the first two months.
It might work for you, but not for all, at last I got to pay after too many loss.
What I think is demanded is a good mindset, a change of your old mindset, not everyone will want to take this risk, not even the poor nor rich.
A good plan, strategies and taking calculated risks matters.

Well, I quite agree with this. borrow money, to make more money. however, in the crypto world, we never know which coins will be pumped, and which ones will be dumped. although there is quite a lot of speculation that we have, prices always move based on information that has happened. well, so it's very risky to borrow money then try to invest in crypto. however, if you believe in the risks you can take, well, then give it a try.
it's just that, based on this, I came to understand that people who move and take risks to take big profits are faced with two things, namely losses, and very large profits. What makes most people rich is that they take those risks.

Having debts is always a wise idea if you have smart plans for it, but its never really that important especially if you can start a business even with a minimum capital. And i think investing in crypto will never really need a huge capital, that you have to go on financing companies and lets you pay the additional interest. You can expand your investment and create bigger profits if you are already making good returns from your initial investment. Because not all debtors are capable to generate profits.

Knowledge has no boundaries and not only limited to rich people. Poor people have low amount of money but he can use this to experience what is investing like, if he fails he will try to learn from his failure if he want to improve and if he is successful with it, that is how his money can slowly increase till he can afford big investments and experience greater returns.

Rich people can start with investing in bigger amounts but not all of them can become successful. If you read the news or watch some videos online, you will came across a story similar to what I am saying here. Being knowledgeable is not enough but the way you control you self is important too.

It is important for a person to have some savings to start investing it is a good idea for rich people to take out loans for investment because they can afford more but borrowing from the poor will make them poorer. Lacking their knowledge and experience they cannot invest in the right work but for the rich the only source of credit for a large business is debt. These come in handy in small enterprises wealthy people conquer everything with their intellect.

What makes the rich richer and the poor poorer is how easy it is for them to get a loan from the bank and use it properly for investment purposes, be it in the short or long term. They are not afraid to take risks in borrowing large amounts of money, because they have plans to settle their debts if they can't pay them.

I believe that the rich in the context of OP is;
Someone that has ample access to information;
Someone that good access to credit facilities;
Perhaps, someone with good investment acumen.
It's always nice investing with a borrowed capital, it makes one appear smart and ease investment stress.
Then, you cannot risk your investment funds with shitcoins. Bitcoin is the only genuine way. In bitcoin, when your investment goes wrong, there is a high likely that it will bounce back, unlike shit coins.

We can learn that, it's not a trick by the way. It's being smart and we can always use it in a situation where we think the market is bearish so we can buy cheap assets. It's always nice to accumulate when people panic, and borrowing money from the bank should not be a burden especially if we are playing like 20% a year because it's not only 100% increase we will see, we could see more especially during the bull run.

the fact is that not everyone is able to successfully manage their debt to be productive and profit doubled

until now I'm still learning this trick, because as you said when the crypto market is bearish then borrowing money from a bank or other to buy crypto is the best moment

May we all be able to manage debt productively

Sure there might be some sense of futility, and it is quite likely that your rate of savings have to grow faster than the price of housing... which does vary from region to region.

What is your plan?

I would suggest DCA'ing into bitcoin as part of your plan (and maybe even a substantial portion of your plan.. depending on various options that you might have available to yourself.. while you are saying that you do not have very many options currently available).. and if you are persistently investing into bitcoin maybe in 4-10 years, you will be in a better position than you are in now.

Let's say, for example, you have saved around $5k over the past few years, so in that regard, your target house is currently priced around $100k in value.

You can either lump sum buy BTC with the hypothetical $5k that you have saved, or you can DCA with the $5k that you already have and to spread such DCA'ing of your already established value into BTC over the next 6 months to year depending on how you want to go about it. 

Personally, I would suggest some considerations of front loading your investment of the $5k into BTC and then start some kind of an attempted aggressive ongoing BTC strategy into BTC.. whether you are able to do $100 per week which would get you about an additional $5,200 invested each year into BTC, or if you cannot afford $100 per week to invest into BTC then you do what you can.. maybe $50 per week or whatever is reasonably manageable for you....

Of course, no matter what you do, you are responsible for your own decisions and the weighing of what kinds of strategies that you might employ when it comes to something like BTC investing and how over time you build your BTC holdings and there are no guarantees that BTC will outperform the dollar or other investment possibilities, but seems to be a very good investment with decently great asymmetric possibilities to build wealth.. especially if you are investing over the next 4-10 years and maybe you will get lucky to get upward performance before those 4-10 years into the future... People do not tend to get rich quick, even though sometimes if you are prudent you might be able to put yourself into positions that improve your situation and your odds for opportunities.

Another matter with any investment into BTC or any other investment, is that you should maintain some kind of reasonable emergency fund that covers you for 3-6 months minimum in case some of your sources of cashflow dry up.. so it would be risky to NOT maintain some kind of a cash savings outside of bitcoin and other investments that you have.   

In other words, I would suggest NOT being too greedy in terms of attempting to build the wealth of your own situation and to be working on putting yourself into a better position, in the event that you are wanting to get a loan for real estate (such as your own home) or otherwise building up your own capital to likely cause yourself to have more savings in order that you likely will NOT feel rushed into accepting any kinds of loan terms because the more that you are able to bring to the table in terms of your own wealth and built up value, the more likely that you are going to be able to negotiate better loan terms in the event that you do end up entering into some kind of a loan product.. and sure it could take 4-10 years to put yourself into a decently good or great or better position, depending upon where you are now and if you are able to exercise ongoing prudence in your own management of your building of wealth and preserving of your principle too.. hopefully.

Robert Kiyosaki approach of life is not something you can do today if you are "poor". If you are middle class or have a bit of savings then you can do it, but when you are "poor" you can't do it. So, let's assume they create debt that is used for buying assets, I am not a very poor person but I certainly do not have anywhere near enough to buy a house, like maybe 5% of a house saved aside, how am I suppose to get a loan for 95% of the house? I can't right?

This is why poor people can't make wealth not because they do not know how to, yeah sure there are some people who you can give a million dollars and in 10 years they will be working for someone else, but in reality if you could purchase real estate, you would and you should but most people do not have that kind of money and that is why they can't do it and not because they do not know how to.

Even if we might end up saying similar things, but just emphasizing different aspects, I doubt that differences between players is just a matter of magnitude.  At any given time, we may or may not have access to some of the same tools, and for sure there are folks who have access from their birth.  Some of the advantages/disadvantages come from geographical location, and some come from level of starting financial / social resources.  In some places you are able to build yourself into some of the circles of advantage, and other places you are going to have a very tough time of it, such as if you coming from having hardly any resources or even opportunities to teach yourself because you are pretty much forced to work, and maybe even "learning" is frowned upon.

You might not even be able to identify ways that you might possibly be able to get ahead because you actually believe some of the information in your upbrining, including that even if you could qualify for being able to use debt, you have no ideas regarding how to employ it in order that it makes more money than the service fees attached to it.

I am neither suggesting that these varying situations are futile for those in disadvantaged places or that mere access to money is going to allow some poor uneducated sod to figure out how to employ capital in advantages ways.  At the same time skills can likely be learned for those ready, willing and able to learn, and so surely sometimes the ditch digger is going to have to bust his ass to be able to spend 10 hours per week studying the matter.. and have quite a few difficulties relating.. for sure in the beginning, and maybe there are ways to practice without losing his shirt, too.  Normies do frequently need to learn the advantages of moderation, incrementalism and preservation of capital, and not even blaming normies for tending to make major mistakes with their capital when they do end up getting access to capital that could facilitate their getting out of disadvantaged circumstances. 

I do believe that bitcoin is a very strong tool that could help to get normies out of disadvantaged circumstances so long as they learn some of the techniques that will contribute to their building principle and capital rather than putting too much of their capital at risk in any moves that they make.

People who come from somewhat advantaged circumstances could potentially improve their situation vastly in 4-10 years, adn people in less advantages circumstances might take 10-30 years or longer.. and surely some of the difficulties that normies have is to attempt to unrealistically accelerate their situation, and loans/debt are not necessarily going to disadvantage them so long as they have some realistic knowledge regarding how to employ such capital, and sometimes, they just might not yet be in a position to employ debt/loans wisely, but with some practice, they potentially could end up figuring out ways to use loans/debt in ways that contribute to their getting to positions that they may well would have not been able to get to without the use of such debt/loans.