Topic: To tariff or not to tariff (Read 507 times)

The guy is trying to twist other's countries arms, but I think his view of international relations and commerce is far too simplistics - I think his view of nearly everything is far to simplistic. Trade is not only trade, it is soft power and cultural dominance. There are many things you cannot measure just in the balance sheet and those are sometimes the ones that matter.

It's a way to put one of the largest taxes ever for ignorant Americans, without them understanding that they are paying for it.
It might help domestic producers if done correctly, but as trump doesn't understand math or tariffs, it's probably going to be a disaster.

Now he is saying that EU should buy oil from US or else it's "Tariffs all the way", not understanding that paying those tariffs would be way cheaper then buying their oil. But yeah, it's always going to be about concept of understanding for him.

There are too many factors to easily determine if tariffs will be good or bad for the States. History shows that when they were used, they made a more prosperous, stronger nation. The US has a large land mass, lots of raw materials, and the ingenuity to make all its own products... or invent something new.

The UK isn't like that. Think of having to move London a hundred miles away because the richest iron ore deposits were found under her.

Tariffs might help one nation while destroying another.

I think that Trump will try to improve international trade deals by slapping tariffs or threatening to. However it is very unlikely that he is going to achieve any result out of it other than yet another self-cheering operation.

International deals are fine-tuned and usual the result of many years of technical negotiations. Comming into the party pretending to know more than anyone else is bound to cause a dissaster - but a disassarter to all. Trump knows the report that has been presented above, he just thinks he does not need to work with numbers or data.

The thing you are forgetting is supply and demand, without regs. Regs can exist for the big guys and be reduced for the little guys. America making its own products to sell to itself, is simply taking other countries of the world out of the equation. America is easily big enough to supply all of its own needs without the other countries of the world. What this does is MAGA, without having the other countries to be a weight around the neck of America.

What would a BRICS of trade between other countries of the world do? Let them do it if they want. America doesn't need them. MAGA, without the added weight of other countries. But the best thing that will come out of this is that Americans will recognize that each State is a country within the US. There will be no lack of trade between these American 'countries'. MAGA.

---

Trump is serious about tariffs, lol. Be scared you other countries. Tariffs are coming. Kneel or die, lol. Study the info at the site, and see that tariffs bring in tons of money. Trump will be able to easily cancel the IRS tax.Everybody will benefit from tariffs.


Should We Take Trump Seriously or Literally on Huge Tariff Hikes?

---

https://mishtalk.com/economics/should-we-take-trump-seriously-or-literally-on-huge-tariff-hikes/
Trump Not Budging on Tariffs

The Wall Street Journal reports CEOs Want Trump to Change Course on Tariffs. He Isn't Budging.

Donald Trump's tariff threats have triggered a behind-the-scenes lobbying campaign to soften or alter the president-elect's plans. But the effort faces a potentially insurmountable roadblock: Trump isn't budging.

So far, executives are facing setbacks as they canvass Trump's aides for advice on how to influence the president-elect's next steps. Trump is largely acting on his own, leaving his incoming team of advisers with few opportunities to shape his thinking. His recent late-night social-media statements about tariffs have come with little warning even to some of his closest allies, according to people familiar with the matter.

Trump's team has told corporate consultants there is no waving the president-elect off his plans to make liberal use of tariffs once he gets into office, the people said.

Late last month, Trump said in a Truth Social post that he would place a 25% tariff on imports from Canada and Mexico if the countries didn't do more to stem the flow of migrants and drugs across the border. He raised the prospect of imposing an additional 10% levy on goods coming from China because, he said, Beijing hadn't done enough to prevent fentanyl from coming into the U.S. Days later, Trump warned that he could place 100% tariffs on Brics countries, which include Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa, if they try to replace the U.S. dollar as the main global currency. That is on top of his pledge during the presidential campaign to impose across-the-board tariffs of as much as 20% on all U.S. imports.
...

---

And meanwhile you live in a parallel planet, with parallel rules of physics and parallel economic laws, the crude reality is that the currencies of nations are always competing. In the end, Trump may simply not be able to carry out the initial plan - which is already well wattered down - not even his usual "plan B" which is a minimal ultra-reduced version of it.

Good for US consumers if he can't, you cannot cheat your way into making your country a leader in manufacturing.

Again, US does not "need" China, but it certainly need to supply the immense number of underpaid and poor people in the country with goods - and they cannot pay "american made". Those who can pay it are de-facto paying a hidden tax to the US plutocrats.

A very simple example: Elon Tesla car cannot compete with the costs and quality of Chinesse made cars. He finances Trump, Trump slaps a tarrif. End result, you now have to either buy his expensive Tesla or pay the same for the Chinese. Guess who is going to pay the bill of "US made"? Hint: Not Elon.

We'll see, it's too early to judge...

Actually, it's this simple. It doesn't have to do with a contest between nations. All it has to do with is what a nation is willing to do for itself.

It won't hurt the US to cut off trade with China. It will only hurt China. America can MAGA anything for itself that it wants. It's China that will fail without America buying their junk.

Price relationships between nations are fake, built by the greedy jokers who want the China slaves to make products cheaply. Tariffs will help both nations to grow. Ask yourself why Musk and Ramaswamy are being placed into DOGE. They are there to reduce government size and waste so that government can be supported off tariffs until tariffs aren't needed any longer.

You seem to think that the US doesn't have the ability to live without other nations. If this were the case, little, dinky Britain would never have never become a world power.

The US doesn't need China as much as China and the world need the US. You are totally missing it. And it shows, easily, in the fact that you seem to have to call me names... because you don't have anything else in your favor. It's the only thing you can do. You don't have anything else. You are kinda pathetic. Most of Britain isn't like that.

The companies that are looking for cheaper manufacturers and laborers will continue to find it as long as it is going to save them a lot of money. Because money that has been saved for them is money earned for the company for which they can use for business expansion and other research and development purposes or any other reason that they're going to benefit in the longer term. So, those companies that are being hit by huge tariffs are going to find a better place for as long as they can be. The important matter for them is to find a country where cost-effective benefits are there, raw materials are cheaper but they're not going to sacrifice the quality that they do.

It is very simple, but quite the opposite. How is having tariffs going to make your manufacturing stronger? It is exactly the opposite, you really, urgently need to read more about protectionism. The only beneficiaries are the large companies of the US, nobody else.

It is so simple that it is scary you do not understand it. US consumers will have no choice and will be held hostage by the local companies and will not be able to shop for better prices elsewhere. What it is exactly that you do not understand?

You will not "need other nations", but all the other nations will be producing better and cheaper because there is competence in prices.

The money you get from tariffs is paid by the US consumer!! The other nations will be selling their products pre-tariff at the same price, it will be the US citizens only paying the extra - a hidden tax.

There's only one benefit to protectionism, it is creating jobs - that the US does not need at the moment - all the rest goes to the monopolits of the US dumBAss. Who do you think has paid for Trumps campaign stupid!

I think tariffs should be looked at from two angles. On one hand, they can encourage companies to move back to the US and create jobs. But on the other hand, it can make goods more expensive for us, the consumers.

Did you know that the US has a trade deficit of over $600 billion? That means we import way more goods than we export. So, if tariffs make imported goods more expensive, it could actually help reduce our trade deficit.

But here's the thing: tariffs can also hurt American businesses that rely on imported goods. For example, if a US company imports parts from China to make a product, tariffs on those parts can increase their costs and make their products more expensive for us.

So, it's not just a simple question of whether tariffs will make goods cheaper or more expensive. It's a complex issue that affects different people and businesses in different ways.

Tariffs is even simpler than you say.

- Tariffs incentivize average citizens to make their own products so we don't need to rely on other nations.
- Tariffs supply money to government so we don't need income taxes.
- Tariffs give us money and manufacturing strength.
- Tariffs equal MAGA.

It's so simple it's scary.

I think you are quite confused about the result of tariffs. Tariffs will not make goods cheaper.

It is very simple, you are buying product XZY from China at 100. The reason is that if you manufacture it in the US it costs 200. Now, you slap a tariff on the Chinese version and make it at least 200. You now will buy US made, but ... at 200.

There will be obviously some job creation in the US and very likely... inflation with it. It will not make the US industry more competitive, it will make it lazy and based on the hidden handover of the consumers who will have no option but the local product.

Is that puting the US first? Yes, but only that bit of the US that is going to benefit from not having competition - not the middle class, certainly not all that working class that has merely voted for Trump.

The point is to Make America Great Again by putting America First.  Who cares about foreign trading partners.  It's time we stopped selling out our currency in order to have cheap goods.  Canada can pay their fair share along with the rest of the world.  One thing is for sure though, if I was in Canada I would be looking to get the hell out as fast as I can.  The next year is going to be rough.  I imagine once Trudeau loses the next election by a landslide then things may start returning to normal, but Canadians better be tightening their belts and making themselves irreplaceable at their jobs...

China's minimum - When the tariffs are high enough, it doesn't matter. The US will need to manufacture its own stuff. The balance will be between tariff amount, people wanting to work and develop, government reducing regs for the little guy so he can develop, and the black market.

What does compete with Asia mean? No competition necessary. Tariffs will supply govt funds.

Don't buy offshore. Manufacture. As tariffs grow, they will gradually offset the need for income taxes. People using their income tax money for the right things will bring back manufacturing.

DOGE is reducing size of government already. Small government means no need for IRS taxes.

Advertising isn't needed and really doesn't have anything to do with it.

when chinas highest minimum wage is equivelent of $3.70 and america's minimum wage is $15
it shows that china can manufacture things with cheap labour of minimum wage 4x less than america

again you need to realise america will not be able to compete with asia even if they had 200-400% tariff

the only thing america can try to do is advocate why people should pay a premium for patriotism
american made goods will ALWAYS be higher price

the only thing american advertisers can do is pretend quality of imports is worse and being patriotic = high quality to sound worthy of premium

^^^ And it's becoming more and more like that all the time. We need to implement those tariffs as fast as we can, so that we can manufacture strength for ourselves, before we fall into becoming less than a third world country.

tariffs dont work to sway consumers to buy domestically..
this is why there is so much money wasted on patriotic advertising trying to sway people to avoid imports
(if domestic made produce was competitive, the patriotic advertising wouldnt be needed, because price competition would sell itself)

for instance i have a projector which a replacement bulb from a made in the UK official vendor of the brand would cost £100
yet i can go to aliexpress and get the same bulb from a chinese vendor for $20
the only way to tempt me to pay for the UK made version is if the tariff was 500% of goods price

an electric bike battery is £320 in the uk, but i can aliexpress a battery for £80
the only way to tempt me to pay for the UK made version is if the tariff was 400% of goods price

if you look at the difference between materials cost and labour cost of china vs US.. a tariff would need to be more then 100% on imports to make US manufactured goods competitive

tariffs will never make "made in america" same/cheaper than imports even if tariffs were +100% of goods

..
as for your other waffle, you have not even spent 30 seconds looking into freeports to know how they work/their purpose.. so your silliness is still silly on the subject. and yes there are many loopholes manufacturers can negate the need to have their recipients pay premium tariffs

EG shipping bagged wine is not tariffed like bottled wine is. and then sending it through a freeport makes it 'bottled domestically' thus not treated as an import

Biden over Trump... worldwide deaths up at least several millions, direct operations. Besides, the US economy isn't booming under Biden... just the opposite. You dense or something?

BRICS would be great if the Fed remained. Way more honest than the current Western banking systems.

MAGA won't happen over night. The sooner we get started the better.

What are you even talking about? there is no Funding from the United States coming to this country whatsoever... this country have pretty bad political relationships with the United States, they do not send a penny here to fund anything... comments like that only prove your lack of understanding on the relation your country has with other republics within the same hemisphere.
Also, it is pretty much not true the United States in independent from other countries and other countries need the USA for them to continue to function normally, otherwise the USA would not import as much raw materials and products from Africa and Asia, for example. Also, the USA if the biggest producer of oil on the planet and yet they need to import gas and oil from abroad... that is not enegy independence at all, and I doubt it will change with Trump in the white house, the UsA will still need to bring oil from the middle east.