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Topic: Too much scamming in Bitcoin (Read 4469 times)

legendary
Activity: 3752
Merit: 1217
April 22, 2014, 03:44:07 AM
#89
Everybody gave mt gox free advertising. It seemed to be the biggest exchange here even before the big trouble.

Actually everyone here made a comparison between the BTC-E and Mt Gox. On the outside, Mt Gox looked more reliable. The owners were well known, and Karpeles had made a few statements supporting Bitcoin. On the other hand, the two owners of BTC-E (Alexei and Alexander), chose to remain anonymous and even shifted their office without any warning from Kiev to Bulgaria.
sr. member
Activity: 252
Merit: 250
Sentinel
April 22, 2014, 03:13:55 AM
#88
Although they are all bigger or smaller scams, they all survive because their customers are either mentally incapable of spotting the scam, gullible, naive - or suffer from gambling addiction. They all manipulate, that's their very nature and sole source of revenue.

Do you have any proof for this? My friend plays on Prime-dice every week or so. So far, he hasn't incurred any loses at all. I have studied the results from hundreds of games played by him. I found nothing suspicious.

If it's provably fair then how can they manipulate?

All smoke & mirrors, nothing more. And if someone takes an edge on a game and lets you do the math - he still has an edge and is tilting the table (falsely interpreted as honesty by gambling addicts).
*hint* showing long lists of games does not mean this list is complete, there are many ways to present you with something you can calculate and be apparently correct, for as long as the house can add unlimited virtual/invisible sessions unknown to you - they can create any matching checksums for any lists they like...

Plus, noone can "break the bank", the most legit services hold back their manipulation algos for the most profitable targets and to protect the bank (those will gladly break any luck streak if a winning streak endangers the operator).

Common sense or knowledge is often absent in gamblers minds, together with the number of addicted it makes for very profitable targets. It suits the BTC world well I must say so I don't have a hughe issue with their existence.
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 500
April 19, 2014, 11:38:19 AM
#87
We've done all we can, I didn't even know about Neo & Bee but I personally stayed away from MTGOX because of it repeatedly having problems and I remember users warning about doing business with them, if people choose to ignore warnings backed up with legitimate evidence then them whining about scammers is just stupid.

I think the mainstream media is also partly to blame because they constantly gave MTGOX free advertising without checking into their history in the slightest.

Everybody gave mt gox free advertising. It seemed to be the biggest exchange here even before the big trouble.
legendary
Activity: 1540
Merit: 1000
April 19, 2014, 11:23:37 AM
#86
We've done all we can, I didn't even know about Neo & Bee but I personally stayed away from MTGOX because of it repeatedly having problems and I remember users warning about doing business with them, if people choose to ignore warnings backed up with legitimate evidence then them whining about scammers is just stupid.

I think the mainstream media is also partly to blame because they constantly gave MTGOX free advertising without checking into their history in the slightest.
member
Activity: 93
Merit: 10
April 19, 2014, 11:20:56 AM
#85
As you said none wants to get ripped off. What can we do to prevent this?
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 500
April 19, 2014, 11:12:47 AM
#84
Although they are all bigger or smaller scams, they all survive because their customers are either mentally incapable of spotting the scam, gullible, naive - or suffer from gambling addiction. They all manipulate, that's their very nature and sole source of revenue.

Do you have any proof for this? My friend plays on Prime-dice every week or so. So far, he hasn't incurred any loses at all. I have studied the results from hundreds of games played by him. I found nothing suspicious.

If it's provably fair then how can they manipulate?

problem with btc is always btc is not regulated.

Why is that a problem? I think it's regulated by the people.

LOL,
children's mindset

How so?
sr. member
Activity: 406
Merit: 250
April 19, 2014, 11:10:42 AM
#83
problem with btc is always btc is not regulated.

Why is that a problem? I think it's regulated by the people.

LOL,
children's mindset
legendary
Activity: 3752
Merit: 1217
April 19, 2014, 11:10:19 AM
#82
Although they are all bigger or smaller scams, they all survive because their customers are either mentally incapable of spotting the scam, gullible, naive - or suffer from gambling addiction. They all manipulate, that's their very nature and sole source of revenue.

Do you have any proof for this? My friend plays on Prime-dice every week or so. So far, he hasn't incurred any loses at all. I have studied the results from hundreds of games played by him. I found nothing suspicious.
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 500
April 19, 2014, 10:55:48 AM
#81
problem with btc is always btc is not regulated.

Why is that a problem? I think it's regulated by the people.
sr. member
Activity: 252
Merit: 250
Sentinel
April 19, 2014, 10:54:11 AM
#80
gambling and scamming can be the same if the odds are tweaked.

Not many gambling sites can survive of they manipulate the odds. People will find out within hours and the news will be spread like wild fire. Just search here in Bitcointalk about such incidents.

Although they are all bigger or smaller scams, they all survive because their customers are either mentally incapable of spotting the scam, gullible, naive - or suffer from gambling addiction.
They all manipulate, that's their very nature and sole source of revenue.
member
Activity: 71
Merit: 10
April 19, 2014, 10:53:34 AM
#79
Bitcoin itself is rock solid, but anytime you deal with a third party you are introducing counterparty risk. Eventually everyone will just move to decentralized solutions anyway.
newbie
Activity: 10
Merit: 0
April 19, 2014, 10:26:03 AM
#78
problem with btc is always btc is not regulated.
legendary
Activity: 1302
Merit: 1008
Core dev leaves me neg feedback #abuse #political
April 19, 2014, 10:20:37 AM
#77
Welcome to capitalism - this whole shit is a scam, son.

Those with real power - real wealth, they pay very dangerous men to wield guns at you on their behalf. There is no capitalism without violence. There is no capitalism without deception and exploitation.

You should really watch "American Hustle".



Real capitalism does not exist in today's world.
So blaming "capitalism" is not accurate.

I guess we should probably call it corporatism and nepotism then if we are going to be technical


Corporatism is accurate enough; Most people don't know what "capitalism" is since the current school system (and media) often blames the "free-market" when in reality individual freedom wasn't anywhere to be seen.

Agree.  True capitalism = laissez faire ("let do"), which is consistent with upholding individual rights (the only valid laws are those prohibiting fraud and initiary force). 
legendary
Activity: 3752
Merit: 1217
April 19, 2014, 01:42:17 AM
#76
gambling and scamming can be the same if the odds are tweaked.

Not many gambling sites can survive of they manipulate the odds. People will find out within hours and the news will be spread like wild fire. Just search here in Bitcointalk about such incidents.
legendary
Activity: 2114
Merit: 1040
A Great Time to Start Something!
April 18, 2014, 11:36:39 PM
#75
Welcome to capitalism - this whole shit is a scam, son.

Those with real power - real wealth, they pay very dangerous men to wield guns at you on their behalf. There is no capitalism without violence. There is no capitalism without deception and exploitation.

You should really watch "American Hustle".



Real capitalism does not exist in today's world.
So blaming "capitalism" is not accurate.

I guess we should probably call it corporatism and nepotism then if we are going to be technical


Corporatism is accurate enough; Most people don't know what "capitalism" is since the current school system (and media) often blames the "free-market" when in reality individual freedom wasn't anywhere to be seen.
full member
Activity: 154
Merit: 100
April 18, 2014, 11:30:21 PM
#74
You mean if I get robbed, I can recover my lost money?

There is at least more likely to be consequences for the perpetrator if the authorities ever catch them. Whereas currently with Bitcoin police are not interested in investigating any fraud.

It's easy to understand why scams and fraud are rampant in the Bitcoin community:

  • Irreversible pseudonymous transfers
  • Highly technical method of security
  • Lack of interest from conventional law enforcement
  • Crossing nation state boundaries is the norm, not the exception
  • Financial infrastructure being operated by people with no training and experience in operating traditional financial infrastructure ("I can operate a blog in PHP about my cat! Time to set up a crypto exchange and transact 6 figures a month!")
  • Crypocurrency financial infrastructure being operated without any of the regulation and safeguards that fiat financial infrastructure is forced to abide by
  • Financial dealing being undertaken by people who would normally never engage in financial dealing (lack of subject knowledge required to spot/avoid scammy proposals)
  • Recent history of incredible price rises instilling massive levels of greed into some participants

Whilst acknowledging these problems, I do not think they are crippling problems. I think their solution and the need for them to be solved will go hand in hand with mainstream adoption. The technology offers the possibilities and these are still early days.

All those crying about this have either been scammed because they are out of their depth, or are calling for an alt-coin where "freezing" of scammed funds is possible in the protocol, without actually doing any of the work to make that a reality.
newbie
Activity: 5
Merit: 0
April 18, 2014, 11:09:41 PM
#73
gambling and scamming can be the same if the odds are tweaked.
legendary
Activity: 3752
Merit: 1217
April 18, 2014, 10:58:20 PM
#72
My two pence... The world is a cruel place... Same applies to the net. So if your nieve as a few times I have been then your precious Bitcoins will belong to someone else being either a ponzi or a dice site  Grin

Keep gambling sites out of this. Wasting money in gambling cannot be considered as scamming. And I know a lot of people who have won huge jackpots in Dice sites as well.
legendary
Activity: 966
Merit: 1000
In holiday we trust
April 18, 2014, 10:32:55 PM
#71
My two pence... The world is a cruel place... Same applies to the net. So if your nieve as a few times I have been then your precious Bitcoins will belong to someone else being either a ponzi or a dice site  Grin
member
Activity: 100
Merit: 10
April 18, 2014, 09:01:42 PM
#70
Where's the money, there is also fraud.
Don't have to be money.
There could be fraud at any form of trade.
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