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Topic: Track the movements of big players and mutual funds. (Read 221 times)

ivankoh
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Track the movements of big players and mutual funds.
January 23, 2021, 08:44:00 AM
#16
Quote from: Husires on January 12, 2021, 04:17:01 AM
Unlike what happened in the year 2017, we know that there are many big players who have joined the cryptocurrency market, how can we know the numbers they bought or at least keep track of OTC markets.
what are the investment funds and institutions that have bought and how can the quantities that they have made can be tracked? Grayscale, Paypal, Microstrategy, Square,bakkt ...etc
What would happen to the price if they create alliances?

The movement of the market right now, it is certain that many institutions have entered this market. Maybe Strategy at 2018 has spawned a wave of crypto entry. Until recently, they alone continued to raise more than 70k BTC.
I remember, the CEO of Skybridge said what would happen if financial institutions around the world accelerated the flow into bitcoin. It could be 100k $, 500k $ or 500k $. What if this coalition of organizations acted together? difficult to know.
bitgolden
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Re: Track the movements of big players and mutual funds.
January 23, 2021, 02:44:13 AM
#15
Quote from: Mauser on January 20, 2021, 03:31:59 AM
If they would all work together and buy more bitcoins the price will rise even further. They bring in a lot of one new capital into the crypto world, which is a good thing in my opinion. If they would all one day to decide to sell and leave the bitcoin market. It would be hard to find buyers for these amounts in a short period of time. So even if they work together their alliance could only be for upward prices, not downward as they would be competiting against each other.
Alliance is correct but for the "how much" part we have to check the news, there are places that track it as well because it is on the news so whenever it is on the news some people collect that information, but there is really no need to know precisely how much they own, we can just say a lot, for example grayscale alone has over half a million bitcoins by some reports, if that is true and that is both risky but also great that they are involved so much. Long story short we have to realize that these people do work together anyway so there is no worry for us at all.

Be calm about it, they are buying bitcoin collectively and anyone who can afford 15+ billion dollars worth of bitcoin purchase can offer 10-20 million dollars to senators and congress people to let bitcoin get more and more popular and less and less regulated so that it could make them richer.
Mauser
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Re: Track the movements of big players and mutual funds.
January 20, 2021, 03:31:59 AM
#14
Quote from: Husires on January 12, 2021, 04:17:01 AM
Unlike what happened in the year 2017, we know that there are many big players who have joined the cryptocurrency market, how can we know the numbers they bought or at least keep track of OTC markets.
what are the investment funds and institutions that have bought and how can the quantities that they have made can be tracked? Grayscale, Paypal, Microstrategy, Square,bakkt ...etc
What would happen to the price if they create alliances?


If they would all work together and buy more bitcoins the price will rise even further. They bring in a lot of one new capital into the crypto world, which is a good thing in my opinion. If they would all one day to decide to sell and leave the bitcoin market. It would be hard to find buyers for these amounts in a short period of time. So even if they work together their alliance could only be for upward prices, not downward as they would be competiting against each other.
zanezane
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Re: Track the movements of big players and mutual funds.
January 20, 2021, 03:26:32 AM
#13
Quote from: jacafbiz on January 12, 2021, 07:03:27 AM
Who tells you they do not work together, I believe all these Bitcoin whales work together to pump the price and they have the price target they have in mind. There is no way no whale can put all the money up to pump Bitcoin from $10k to $40k. I am also scared of these institutional investors if there is anything the stock market has taught me, they are never your friend
It is in their best interest to work together so I have to side with you when it comes to this speculation. Don't be scared with this whales though, yes they are not your friend but you should know that there will always be an exploit that can be abused, always find positive in negative situations right? Why should we track their movements? Even if we do track their movements, what can we do about it anyway? If they create an alliance then we will call it a monopoly and the prices will be stabilized although the pumps and dumps will be unfavorable for individual investors.
Husires
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Re: Track the movements of big players and mutual funds.
January 20, 2021, 02:59:05 AM
#12
Quote from: exstasie on January 12, 2021, 05:04:21 AM
fillippone is tracking all that info here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1fmYF8ND3lGHeZCzNww8chtiz7ZvbhSAzXOHKPkKDVF8

If he's missing anything, it might be listed here: https://bitcointreasuries.org/
Thanks to the sources. I was looking for OTC markets or any data linking purchases that appear in block explorers>
Do not all companies announce Bitcoin that they have purchased? Even if that data is not recent.
Or where do we look? I do not think that monitoring top exchange markets will give real data.
Is there an app that gives me notifications or a way to get notifications when I find this news?
sana54210
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Re: Track the movements of big players and mutual funds.
January 13, 2021, 11:05:03 AM
#11
Quote from: Darker45 on January 12, 2021, 09:50:02 PM
Quote from: Bttzed03 on January 12, 2021, 10:59:32 AM
Quote from: jacafbiz on January 12, 2021, 07:03:27 AM
Who tells you they do not work together, I believe all these Bitcoin whales work together to pump the price and they have the price target they have in mind.
Lol. How would they even do that? Do you think there's a secret group chat for institutions and OG whales? Illuminati? There are always two sides that trade against each other. It just so happens that the bullish guys are "winning".

However, I think a lot of these so-called Bitcoin whales have very open communication lines with each other. I am not saying they are talking of pump and dump plots, though.  
I am not sure about the old timer bitcoin whales would be working together, like the people who got in 3-5 years ago, there were plenty of whales in bitcoin before any corporation decided to go in. However I believe 100% that big huge companies that got in, like grayscale and microstrategy and all others basically got involved with bitcoin all together, it is nearly impossible to assume that they would actually end up investing all at the same time without any of them knowing about each other, that is not coincidence that is just talking together and buying together so they could increase the price.

They are not after manipulation if you ask me, they just wanted to get together and buy and hold and if they ended up buying 20 billion dollars all corporations together, that should increase the price and made all of them a lot richer, which happened in 2020 I believe.
teosanru
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Re: Track the movements of big players and mutual funds.
January 13, 2021, 09:24:38 AM
#10
I read an article today on cointelegraph: https://www.google.com/amp/s/cointelegraph.com/news/pension-funds-are-getting-in-on-bitcoin-according-to-grayscale/amp
A few other investors have also said that Pension funds are the reason why there is such an hype in cryptospace but I think there is pretty limited Bitcoins available considering the amount of wealth that these funds have. Apart from increasing the price isn't this centralising the bitcoin even more? Concentration of huge funds in hands of few doesn't really adds up to the true definition of bitcoin.
Quote from: exstasie on January 12, 2021, 05:04:21 AM
Quote from: Husires on January 12, 2021, 04:17:01 AM
Unlike what happened in the year 2017, we know that there are many big players who have joined the cryptocurrency market, how can we know the numbers they bought or at least keep track of OTC markets.
what are the investment funds and institutions that have bought and how can the quantities that they have made can be tracked? Grayscale, Paypal, Microstrategy, Square,bakkt ...etc

fillippone is tracking all that info here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1fmYF8ND3lGHeZCzNww8chtiz7ZvbhSAzXOHKPkKDVF8

If he's missing anything, it might be listed here: https://bitcointreasuries.org/

Keep in mind, public companies (like Microstrategy or Square) often won't disclose their purchases right away, as opposed to funds like GBTC who report changes daily.

Paypal processes transactions through itBit, whose volume was virtually nonexistent before. So you can watch itBit's volume to gauge retail interest in Bitcoin, which is apparently going through the roof:


I think the funds have to disclose their investments mandatorily especially when the investment exceeds a certain percentage of their total AUM. Isn't it? What is the criteria?
Bttzed03
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Re: Track the movements of big players and mutual funds.
January 13, 2021, 08:50:25 AM
#9
Quote from: Darker45 on January 12, 2021, 09:50:02 PM
~
However, I think a lot of these so-called Bitcoin whales have very open communication lines with each other. I am not saying they are talking of pump and dump plots, though.
I guess so. A lot of early guys are flexing on twitter and became somewhat friends but I also doubt they "work together". When it comes to the real money game, it's every man for himself. I bet they counter-trade without them knowing. Heck, I even remember a funny story of someone trading against himself. He forgot about the bot he set up on the other side of the trade and thought it was someone else.

I don't know if the same can be said with institutional investors though.

Quote from: Darker45 on January 12, 2021, 09:50:02 PM
~
This is a lot easier said than done. The oceans are full of whales but it is impossible to ride on and with them. In a way, we, retail investors, are at their mercy. We're just crossing our fingers our entry and exit points somehow coincide with theirs. Or why not stick to hodling instead of trading? The long term gains are probably sweeter than the short term ones.
It's difficult because we aren't pros (yet). They find it easier to follow the current/trend.
Darker45
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Re: Track the movements of big players and mutual funds.
January 12, 2021, 09:50:02 PM
#8
Quote from: Bttzed03 on January 12, 2021, 10:59:32 AM
Quote from: jacafbiz on January 12, 2021, 07:03:27 AM
Who tells you they do not work together, I believe all these Bitcoin whales work together to pump the price and they have the price target they have in mind.
Lol. How would they even do that? Do you think there's a secret group chat for institutions and OG whales? Illuminati? There are always two sides that trade against each other. It just so happens that the bullish guys are "winning".

However, I think a lot of these so-called Bitcoin whales have very open communication lines with each other. I am not saying they are talking of pump and dump plots, though.  

Quote from: jacafbiz on January 12, 2021, 07:03:27 AM
There is no way no whale can put all the money up to pump Bitcoin from $10k to $40k.
That's where FOMO from retail investors comes in. Read this thread by fillippone - This last rally Leg has been also bought by retail? (pretty good analysis).

It was indeed possible the FOMO among retail investors caught up with the rally which was almost certainly brought about by institutional investors.

Quote from: jacafbiz on January 12, 2021, 07:03:27 AM
I am also scared of these institutional investors if there is anything the stock market has taught me, they are never your friend
Be like water as pro traders say. One day they'll pump the price and then dump on the next.

This is a lot easier said than done. The oceans are full of whales but it is impossible to ride on and with them. In a way, we, retail investors, are at their mercy. We're just crossing our fingers our entry and exit points somehow coincide with theirs. Or why not stick to hodling instead of trading? The long term gains are probably sweeter than the short term ones.
yhiaali3
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Re: Track the movements of big players and mutual funds.
January 12, 2021, 09:49:29 PM
#7
Here you can find some interesting information about the institutions that own Bitcoin and the huge numbers that own them:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaeldelcastillo/2020/08/06/valuable-sec-data-on-20-institutional-bitcoin-investors-could-soon-disappear/?sh=1ffe6a6b1de2

Regarding the last question, "What would happen to the price if they create alliances?" It can be said that the entry of these large institutions into the Bitcoin world had a great impact on the mass adoption of Bitcoin, but at the same time the union of these institutions could have a serious impact on Bitcoin's transformation into centralization through the control of these institutions over the largest share of Bitcoin in the market. They will also have the power to control and manipulate Bitcoin's price.
exstasie
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Re: Track the movements of big players and mutual funds.
January 12, 2021, 08:58:56 PM
#6
Quote from: Tstar on January 12, 2021, 02:57:02 PM
Quote from: exstasie on January 12, 2021, 05:04:21 AM
fillippone is tracking all that info here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1fmYF8ND3lGHeZCzNww8chtiz7ZvbhSAzXOHKPkKDVF8

If he's missing anything, it might be listed here: https://bitcointreasuries.org/

Interesting, just $3bn in today's value and creating so much FOMO and price movement. It makes me think don't we overvalue the impact of the big investors?

It's not "just $3 billion." It's billions of dollars injected into a very illiquid market. Relatively small amounts of money can absorb all available supply at a given price range, causing price to get marked up quickly and exponentially.

When OTC supply dries up, OTC demand spills onto exchanges. There is no doubt in my mind that institutional accumulation played a big role in the huge reduction in exchange supply that took place during 2020:



It's simple supply and demand: supply down, price up. And once price rises enough, positive price feedback loops develop. Key technical levels get broken, price moves higher. Sellers and shorters panic buy back in, price moves higher. Traders jump onto a powerful bull trend, price moves higher. Retail sees BTC breaking its ATH and piles in, price moves higher.....

This is how bubbles are born.
Tstar
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Re: Track the movements of big players and mutual funds.
January 12, 2021, 02:57:02 PM
#5
Quote from: exstasie on January 12, 2021, 05:04:21 AM
Quote from: Husires on January 12, 2021, 04:17:01 AM
Unlike what happened in the year 2017, we know that there are many big players who have joined the cryptocurrency market, how can we know the numbers they bought or at least keep track of OTC markets.
what are the investment funds and institutions that have bought and how can the quantities that they have made can be tracked? Grayscale, Paypal, Microstrategy, Square,bakkt ...etc

fillippone is tracking all that info here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1fmYF8ND3lGHeZCzNww8chtiz7ZvbhSAzXOHKPkKDVF8

If he's missing anything, it might be listed here: https://bitcointreasuries.org/

...

Interesting, just $3bn in today's value and creating so much FOMO and price movement. It makes me think don't we overvalue the impact of the big investors?
Bttzed03
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Re: Track the movements of big players and mutual funds.
January 12, 2021, 10:59:32 AM
#4
Quote from: jacafbiz on January 12, 2021, 07:03:27 AM
Who tells you they do not work together, I believe all these Bitcoin whales work together to pump the price and they have the price target they have in mind.
Lol. How would they even do that? Do you think there's a secret group chat for institutions and OG whales? Illuminati? There are always two sides that trade against each other. It just so happens that the bullish guys are "winning".

Quote from: jacafbiz on January 12, 2021, 07:03:27 AM
There is no way no whale can put all the money up to pump Bitcoin from $10k to $40k.
That's where FOMO from retail investors comes in. Read this thread by fillippone - This last rally Leg has been also bought by retail? (pretty good analysis).

Quote from: jacafbiz on January 12, 2021, 07:03:27 AM
I am also scared of these institutional investors if there is anything the stock market has taught me, they are never your friend
Be like water as pro traders say. One day they'll pump the price and then dump on the next.
jacafbiz
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Re: Track the movements of big players and mutual funds.
January 12, 2021, 07:03:27 AM
#3
Who tells you they do not work together, I believe all these Bitcoin whales work together to pump the price and they have the price target they have in mind. There is no way no whale can put all the money up to pump Bitcoin from $10k to $40k. I am also scared of these institutional investors if there is anything the stock market has taught me, they are never your friend
exstasie
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Re: Track the movements of big players and mutual funds.
January 12, 2021, 05:04:21 AM
#2
Quote from: Husires on January 12, 2021, 04:17:01 AM
Unlike what happened in the year 2017, we know that there are many big players who have joined the cryptocurrency market, how can we know the numbers they bought or at least keep track of OTC markets.
what are the investment funds and institutions that have bought and how can the quantities that they have made can be tracked? Grayscale, Paypal, Microstrategy, Square,bakkt ...etc

fillippone is tracking all that info here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1fmYF8ND3lGHeZCzNww8chtiz7ZvbhSAzXOHKPkKDVF8

If he's missing anything, it might be listed here: https://bitcointreasuries.org/

Keep in mind, public companies (like Microstrategy or Square) often won't disclose their purchases right away, as opposed to funds like GBTC who report changes daily.

Paypal processes transactions through itBit, whose volume was virtually nonexistent before. So you can watch itBit's volume to gauge retail interest in Bitcoin, which is apparently going through the roof:

Husires
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Re: Track the movements of big players and mutual funds.
January 12, 2021, 04:17:01 AM
#1
Unlike what happened in the year 2017, we know that there are many big players who have joined the cryptocurrency market, how can we know the numbers they bought or at least keep track of OTC markets.
what are the investment funds and institutions that have bought and how can the quantities that they have made can be tracked? Grayscale, Paypal, Microstrategy, Square,bakkt ...etc
What would happen to the price if they create alliances?
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