Trump’s call for a bitcoin strategic reserve is a very bad idea

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Quote from: CryptoBuds on October 07, 2024, 10:38:44 AM

The US approval of bitcoin ETFs means that they support and encourage their citizens to invest in bitcoin through ETFs. But as you said, the US will never support anything that is not controlled by them, especially bitcoin because it is decentralized.

Your first sentence directly contradicts your first. I mean, how desparate can you get?

The US hosts the majority of Bitcoin hashrate, the overwhelming majority of Bitcoin is held by US citizens, and there are thousands of products--all perfectly legal--in the US that support Bitcoin is thousands of ways.

In 2024, Bitcoin interests were the largest since donor to the US elections, bigger than Big Oil, Big Pharma, big Health Care and so on.

I cannot possibly imagine something being more accepted and mainstream in a country, and yet people continue to repeat this absurdity that the "US government is out to get Bitcoin". It's absolute nonsense.

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Quote from: CryptoBuds on October 07, 2024, 10:38:44 AM

Quote from: EarnOnVictor on October 07, 2024, 03:39:57 AM

I wonder why some of you do not think before you write. Is Bitcoin ETF beyond the control of the US? No. In case you don't know, Bitcoin ETF is a centralised arrangement, all the actors are known and are made accountable for all their operations. You should know through government approval that the ETF companies must have been duly registered and are regulated. What the government regulates, they control. Besides, you deviated from the main discussion, it was about the US accepting Bitcoin as a reserve. The country will prefer its own blockchain/CBDC (centralised system) for digital reserve to Bitcoin because Bitcoin is decentralised. The US government will never accept that for a "direct" government dealing arrangement.

The US approval of bitcoin ETFs means that they support and encourage their citizens to invest in bitcoin through ETFs. But as you said, the US will never support anything that is not controlled by them, especially bitcoin because it is decentralized.

Yes, you are making some sense, the way I see it, ETF is better regulated, people often see regulation as a way of opposition, but it is not. Even this Biden administration has never been anti-crypto, if they are, how many cryptocurrencies have they stopped their citizens from purchasing? But as a forefront nation, it has to lead by example and safeguard the homeland, which leads to regulation, it's normal. It is about the decentralisation of most cryptos, if care is not taken, it will lead to more illegality. As for the ETF, it is centralised, they have fewer worries.

Quote

Is it correct to say that their acceptance of bitcoin ETFs has nothing to do with bitcoin and they do not support it?

Lol, thanks for that, it's still about Bitcoin, so why did they accept the ETF that is dealing with Bitcoin if they reject Bitcoin entirely?

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Quote from: EarnOnVictor on October 07, 2024, 03:39:57 AM

I wonder why some of you do not think before you write. Is Bitcoin ETF beyond the control of the US? No. In case you don't know, Bitcoin ETF is a centralised arrangement, all the actors are known and are made accountable for all their operations. You should know through government approval that the ETF companies must have been duly registered and are regulated. What the government regulates, they control. Besides, you deviated from the main discussion, it was about the US accepting Bitcoin as a reserve. The country will prefer its own blockchain/CBDC (centralised system) for digital reserve to Bitcoin because Bitcoin is decentralised. The US government will never accept that for a "direct" government dealing arrangement.

The US approval of bitcoin ETFs means that they support and encourage their citizens to invest in bitcoin through ETFs. But as you said, the US will never support anything that is not controlled by them, especially bitcoin because it is decentralized. Is it correct to say that their acceptance of bitcoin ETFs has nothing to do with bitcoin and they do not support it? They allow their citizens to invest in bitcoin through bitcoin ETFs or any form that shows they support bitcoin.

Do you ever think they will approve bitcoin ETFs? and I remember many people didn't believe it either because it has been rejected for years. But it finally happened to many people's surprise, so why is making bitcoin a reserve strategy not feasible or it will never happen? Anything can happen because it's bitcoin.

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Quote from: Marvell1 on October 03, 2024, 09:16:45 AM

Quote from: EarnOnVictor on October 03, 2024, 07:39:03 AM

Thank you for this fact, I can see another sane person here talking in a truly economical way and not in the way of a bigot who has been blinded by extremism.

First, Trump is a deceiver, that man is so fake, anything coming from his mouth is mostly not true, he just wanted people to hear what they like to hear to gain more love. I am sure he knows that the US will never support what is out of their control, Bitcoin is a decentralised system. Using a very volatile asset like Bitcoin that can devalue by 4 times its value in 1 or 2 years as a reserve is very sick advice.

Trump is now a comedian to me, I watch him laugh.

If the US never supports anything that is beyond their control, then why did they accept bitcoin ETF and never even ban it like other countries did?

I wonder why some of you do not think before you write. Is Bitcoin ETF beyond the control of the US? No. In case you don't know, Bitcoin ETF is a centralised arrangement, all the actors are known and are made accountable for all their operations. You should know through government approval that the ETF companies must have been duly registered and are regulated. What the government regulates, they control. Besides, you deviated from the main discussion, it was about the US accepting Bitcoin as a reserve. The country will prefer its own blockchain/CBDC (centralised system) for digital reserve to Bitcoin because Bitcoin is decentralised. The US government will never accept that for a "direct" government dealing arrangement.

legiteum

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Quote from: avp2306 on October 04, 2024, 06:06:11 PM

What I don't like if Harris will win is the continuation of possible crypto lockdown since they are known for that, so hopefully things will go better and this politician will see how useful bitcoin and they adapt it.

What "crypto lockdown" are you talking about?

Are you talking about the last four years under Biden, when:

1. The US became the #1 county for Bitcoin hash rate?

2. Bitcoin went up 500% in value?

3. Bitcoin ETFs were approved?

If that is a "crypto lockdown", I think any rational person in this business would sure like a lot more of this "lockdown".

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Quote from: fruktik on October 04, 2024, 08:49:22 AM

Quote from: Smartprofit on October 03, 2024, 07:07:53 AM

Donald Trump's idea of creating a strategic reserve of bitcoins is, in my opinion, a very good idea.

Bitcoin is an ideal reserve asset. If you consider bitcoin as a reserve asset, and not as a means of payment, then even its technological disadvantages turn into an advantage. Let's assume that bitcoin becomes an integral part of the gold and foreign exchange reserves of central banks of all countries. Then the transparency of the blockchain, instead of a disadvantage, will become an advantage - because this means that an asset like Bitcoin is very easy to audit.

Bitcoin also has a technological limitation of 300,000 daily transactions. This makes it a very bad means of payment for 8 billion people on the planet.

However, if Bitcoin becomes a reserve asset, it will no longer need a large number of daily transactions.

If Bitcoin becomes an integral part of the gold and foreign exchange reserves of central banks, then even the enormous energy consumption of the bitcoin network (for which it is criticized by environmental organizations) will not be a big problem. Because Bitcoin will become the basis of the global financial system.

Trump talks a lot of pretty words, but never gets down to business. Yes, the idea is very attractive with its new approach. It seems to me that there is something in it that should be urgently implemented in practice. Well, at least for the sake of learning about the possibility of such a method of reserving money. It is enough to control well and you can always find out about the operations if something goes wrong. So what? Will we believe Donnie? Does he really have such plans?

He publicly say those words and many people look forward on his promise and beside he is the candidate showing interest regarding on bitcoin adaption. For that if fait will allow we could give him a chance to see if he's really true to his words. maybe we will know all of this once he win, but until he is just campaigning and using bitcoin the only thing we could able to do is to speculate further effect of what will happen to bitcoin in US.

What I don't like if Harris will win is the continuation of possible Edit: (@legiteum ~~crypto lockdown~~ it supposed to be crack down sorry wrong word used) since they are known for that, so hopefully things will go better and this politician will see how useful bitcoin and they adapt it.

Election is nearly coming and we can see who among these two candidate will win the seat and we could also see if they would follow or implement everything they promise while they are campaigning.

But its really interesting to see bitcoin will be used as strategic reserve of US since imagine the hype will build up for bitcoin if they make this thing happen.

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Quote from: Smartprofit on October 03, 2024, 07:07:53 AM

Donald Trump's idea of creating a strategic reserve of bitcoins is, in my opinion, a very good idea.

Bitcoin is an ideal reserve asset. If you consider bitcoin as a reserve asset, and not as a means of payment, then even its technological disadvantages turn into an advantage. Let's assume that bitcoin becomes an integral part of the gold and foreign exchange reserves of central banks of all countries. Then the transparency of the blockchain, instead of a disadvantage, will become an advantage - because this means that an asset like Bitcoin is very easy to audit.

Bitcoin also has a technological limitation of 300,000 daily transactions. This makes it a very bad means of payment for 8 billion people on the planet.

However, if Bitcoin becomes a reserve asset, it will no longer need a large number of daily transactions.

If Bitcoin becomes an integral part of the gold and foreign exchange reserves of central banks, then even the enormous energy consumption of the bitcoin network (for which it is criticized by environmental organizations) will not be a big problem. Because Bitcoin will become the basis of the global financial system.

Trump talks a lot of pretty words, but never gets down to business. Yes, the idea is very attractive with its new approach. It seems to me that there is something in it that should be urgently implemented in practice. Well, at least for the sake of learning about the possibility of such a method of reserving money. It is enough to control well and you can always find out about the operations if something goes wrong. So what? Will we believe Donnie? Does he really have such plans?

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Quote from: pooya87 on September 17, 2024, 03:32:12 AM

Adoption phase is just beginning, you said it yourself people are still just hearing about bitcoin. And most of them are hearing negative things about it (such as it is going to dump, it is a Ponzi scheme, there is no use for it, etc.). When they learn the truth, they usually adopt bitcoin.

The majority of people want to earn more $$ with the help of Bitcoin, they do not want to adopt it to replace $$. The reason of Bitcoin's popularity is not it's revolutionary ecosystem, the reason is that Bitcoin went from 0 to 70K USD. That's why people talk about it. I'm 100% sure that average Joe doesn't care about privacy and peer-2-peer. I became confident about that a few years ago when Blockchain.info had an airdrop. Almost everyone around me submitted their KYC documents to get 25 dollars.

Quote from: OgNasty on October 02, 2024, 10:15:37 PM

It is funny that Trump keeps mentioning Bitcoin as a way to pay off the national debt. He is really totally fine with the United States pumping Bitcoin to the moon and then dumping it all on some creditor somehow to pay off the national debt. Seems like a far fetched plan to me but if sends Bitcoin to $10,000,000 each and I manage to hang onto some, I’ll be happy.

That's the plan to my mind, to pump Bitcoin, then sell and pay the debt by making millions of people poorer because otherwise, it doesn't make sense. The sad part is that this process will finally destroy Bitcoin, that's how the debt will be paid but to my mind, it's far from reality. I can't imagine something similar to happen, that will be very shocking from the USA.

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Quote from: AmoreJaz on October 02, 2024, 07:58:56 PM

Quote from: pooya87 on September 17, 2024, 03:32:12 AM

Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 17, 2024, 01:15:55 AM

but who exactly is adopting bitcoin. i know it's not everyday people here in the usa. bitcoin doesn't offer anything to them. they might keep hearing about it but they don't have any use for it just like they don't have any use for TSLA stock. they hear about it but they don't care...

at some point we have to admit that the adoption phase is over and see what the deal is that is making price go up. if it is going up at all...

Adoption phase is just beginning, you said it yourself people are still just hearing about bitcoin. And most of them are hearing negative things about it (such as it is going to dump, it is a Ponzi scheme, there is no use for it, etc.). When they learn the truth, they usually adopt bitcoin.

In time, these people who are hearing negative things will change their mind once they have the first-hand experience in this market especially after they execute their first crypto transaction. They will understand the benefits of having this currency in terms of transparency, speed and fees involved.

That is sad that many people who are not involved in crypto and when they hear such negative news for bitcoin, whether by presidental candidate Trump or anyone else. They simply will decide to stay away from this crypto thing and they will realize someday that they made a wrong decision.

It is really sad to see how the negative news impact people's thinking about cryptocurrencies and they miss out on the potential opportunities that they may have gained over the time if they had invested in cryptos.

It’s a complex thing and when there are risks in crypto but there are also possibilities too that they could secure their future. I am hopeful that as people will know more about Bitcoin, adoption increases and they feel more comfortable exploring it.

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Quote from: Marvell1 on October 03, 2024, 09:16:45 AM

If the US never supports anything that is beyond their control, then why did they accept bitcoin ETF and never even ban it like other countries did?

From what you say, most of you are just spending time criticizing and cursing him instead of discussing this idea. So I can say that: you don't like it and think it's a stupid idea because you're a Democrat, you hate Trump. I bet if this idea came from Harris and the Democrats, you would applaud and say this is a great idea. What makes some people think this is a bad idea is that it doesn't come from the candidate they support Cheesy

.

I don't think it a bad idea, I just think that when the USAians seem to be going crazy like the Germans did before WW2, threatening to put an insane "charismatic dictator" into power, that candidate is a horrible vehicle for any idea however good; better to skip the good idea until after the mass insanity has somehow fizzled out or something, remember the German (actually not but thats who put him in power) guy didn't have nukes.

-MarkM-

EDIT: And the USAians back then were real heroes who went above and beyond to get him OUT of power...

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Quote from: EarnOnVictor on October 03, 2024, 07:39:03 AM

Thank you for this fact, I can see another sane person here talking in a truly economical way and not in the way of a bigot who has been blinded by extremism.

First, Trump is a deceiver, that man is so fake, anything coming from his mouth is mostly not true, he just wanted people to hear what they like to hear to gain more love. I am sure he knows that the US will never support what is out of their control, Bitcoin is a decentralised system. Using a very volatile asset like Bitcoin that can devalue by 4 times its value in 1 or 2 years as a reserve is very sick advice.

Trump is now a comedian to me, I watch him laugh.

If the US never supports anything that is beyond their control, then why did they accept bitcoin ETF and never even ban it like other countries did?

From what you say, most of you are just spending time criticizing and cursing him instead of discussing this idea. So I can say that: you don't like it and think it's a stupid idea because you're a Democrat, you hate Trump. I bet if this idea came from Harris and the Democrats, you would applaud and say this is a great idea. What makes some people think this is a bad idea is that it doesn't come from the candidate they support Cheesy

.

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Quote from: Smartprofit on October 03, 2024, 07:07:53 AM

Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 08, 2024, 08:15:03 AM

Trump’s call for a bitcoin strategic reserve is a very bad idea https://www.ft.com/content/e0e5e286-1885-4d72-8b65-3333069815c1

"Bitcoin is not going to make America great. What will help this country continue to be great is getting our debt and deficits under our control."

This was a very interesting article explaining why bitcoin can't replace the dollar! Required reading. To anyone that thinks bitcoin get the government out of debt just NO. They need to be able to print more money.

Donald Trump's idea of creating a strategic reserve of bitcoins is, in my opinion, a very good idea.

Bitcoin is an ideal reserve asset. If you consider bitcoin as a reserve asset, and not as a means of payment, then even its technological disadvantages turn into an advantage. Let's assume that bitcoin becomes an integral part of the gold and foreign exchange reserves of central banks of all countries. Then the transparency of the blockchain, instead of a disadvantage, will become an advantage - because this means that an asset like Bitcoin is very easy to audit.

Bitcoin also has a technological limitation of 300,000 daily transactions. This makes it a very bad means of payment for 8 billion people on the planet.

However, if Bitcoin becomes a reserve asset, it will no longer need a large number of daily transactions.

If Bitcoin becomes an integral part of the gold and foreign exchange reserves of central banks, then even the enormous energy consumption of the bitcoin network (for which it is criticized by environmental organizations) will not be a big problem. Because Bitcoin will become the basis of the global financial system.

People think about negative way without overlooking the possible good effect it may bring to the ecosystem especially that America is huge and their decision to make a strategic reserve would provably bring bitcoin to its next level.

Many people think negative about it since maybe they don't figure out yet on how they could able take advantage on the technology. They always get worried about the volatility, but they didn't consider many good benefits they can acquire if they allow bitcoin to became their global reserve. Bitcoin deserve to be declared as good asset the same with gold and other foreign exchange reserves. Its just there are skeptical old man lazy to learn more information about bitcoin.

Provably this will happen since for sure that so called environmentalist will not bother to stop this operation. Since they provably would able to see that bitcoin is doing well and been protected when this plan to make it as their reserve would happen.

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 08, 2024, 08:15:03 AM

Trump’s call for a bitcoin strategic reserve is a very bad idea https://www.ft.com/content/e0e5e286-1885-4d72-8b65-3333069815c1

"Bitcoin is not going to make America great. What will help this country continue to be great is getting our debt and deficits under our control."

This was a very interesting article explaining why bitcoin can't replace the dollar! Required reading. To anyone that thinks bitcoin get the government out of debt just NO. They need to be able to print more money.

Thank you for this fact, I can see another sane person here talking in a truly economical way and not in the way of a bigot who has been blinded by extremism.

First, Trump is a deceiver, that man is so fake, anything coming from his mouth is mostly not true, he just wanted people to hear what they like to hear to gain more love. I am sure he knows that the US will never support what is out of their control, Bitcoin is a decentralised system. Using a very volatile asset like Bitcoin that can devalue by 4 times its value in 1 or 2 years as a reserve is very sick advice.

Trump is now a comedian to me, I watch him laugh.

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 08, 2024, 08:15:03 AM

Trump’s call for a bitcoin strategic reserve is a very bad idea https://www.ft.com/content/e0e5e286-1885-4d72-8b65-3333069815c1

"Bitcoin is not going to make America great. What will help this country continue to be great is getting our debt and deficits under our control."

This was a very interesting article explaining why bitcoin can't replace the dollar! Required reading. To anyone that thinks bitcoin get the government out of debt just NO. They need to be able to print more money.

Donald Trump's idea of creating a strategic reserve of bitcoins is, in my opinion, a very good idea.

Bitcoin is an ideal reserve asset. If you consider bitcoin as a reserve asset, and not as a means of payment, then even its technological disadvantages turn into an advantage. Let's assume that bitcoin becomes an integral part of the gold and foreign exchange reserves of central banks of all countries. Then the transparency of the blockchain, instead of a disadvantage, will become an advantage - because this means that an asset like Bitcoin is very easy to audit.

Bitcoin also has a technological limitation of 300,000 daily transactions. This makes it a very bad means of payment for 8 billion people on the planet.

However, if Bitcoin becomes a reserve asset, it will no longer need a large number of daily transactions.

If Bitcoin becomes an integral part of the gold and foreign exchange reserves of central banks, then even the enormous energy consumption of the bitcoin network (for which it is criticized by environmental organizations) will not be a big problem. Because Bitcoin will become the basis of the global financial system.

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Quote from: markm on October 02, 2024, 07:52:00 PM

His trying to make bitcoin a major reserve could end up badly for sure.

Suppose he "by fiat" decided bitcoin is to be worth no less than, say even just $100000 dollars, and printed enough dollars to put buy walls everywhere at that price.

It is of course natural to hope that someone somewhere will retain a "snapshot" of a previous block so that...

Once everyone willing to "dump" onto his buy wall has done so, the rest of us can...

Fork! Hahahaha damn it is scary seeing a nation as large as the U.S. seemingly trying to follow in the footsteps of some crazed Germans and put some insane "charismatic dictator" into power, don't you think?

-MarkM-

We don't know how they can handle its volatility and if they make it as their reserve then provably that they might be shaken out especially that bearish trend exist and somehow we experience this situation now.

But I don't think he's will make those thing to happen since for me he just say those words just to hype the bitcoin community since if he catch all the interest of people on his promises made then possibly that he can get all the votes of bitcoin users.

In reality its hard to make everything to happen since for sure that there are many law makers will object to this plan since there are still many politician in US think about bitcoin is scam or high risk asset to invest.

Also don't like to make this plan to happen since its scary the possible manipulation attempt they possibly do, especially if they own a lot of bitcoins.

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 08, 2024, 08:15:03 AM

Trump’s call for a bitcoin strategic reserve is a very bad idea https://www.ft.com/content/e0e5e286-1885-4d72-8b65-3333069815c1

This was a very interesting article explaining why bitcoin can't replace the dollar! Required reading. To anyone that thinks bitcoin get the government out of debt just NO. They need to be able to print more money.

With the fact that Bitcoin has a tremendous growth and impacts to the crypto community and society as a whole it can't be substituted in the place of dollars, yes looking at the fluctuations rate of the dollar you may be thinking in no time it's value would be out of space and Bitcoin adoption would cover up the lapses leading to massive change. But then having the thoughts that Bitcoin can replace dollars cannot be emphasized so the Trump's call for Bitcoin strategic reserve it's not a bad idea but a medium to let the government and individuals fully know the need to adopt and have it in use could possibly help out in the long run.

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Quote from: pooya87 on October 03, 2024, 01:41:59 AM

Well, adoption is a naturally slow process and even though correct information about Bitcoin is mandatory but another problem that slows it down, which may be even more important than informing people, is the volatility. Until mass adoption, the price will remain volatile which will slow down the process of adoption because people always hesitate to adopt something that can go up 50% one day and drop 30% the other.

However, it is hard to argue with this. Of course, Bitcoin is far from ideal with its volatility, but still... There is no need to at least tell people that it is a scam or a hype project that is not worthy of attention. People should learn to study the information in more detail, and not just skim the origins, having spent only a few minutes reading the information, you still don't really understand anything.

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Quote from: fruktik on October 03, 2024, 01:20:56 AM

Quote from: pooya87 on September 17, 2024, 03:32:12 AM

Adoption phase is just beginning, you said it yourself people are still just hearing about bitcoin. And most of them are hearing negative things about it (such as it is going to dump, it is a Ponzi scheme, there is no use for it, etc.). When they learn the truth, they usually adopt bitcoin.

And how long will it take for people to change their attitude towards Bitcoin? It has been many years since its creation, and most people think it is just some kind of scam. No, information is needed in the world media about the positive aspects that cryptocurrency provides. Constant coverage in the news about the benefits of its use. This is the only way to change the opinion of most people on the planet.

Well, adoption is a naturally slow process and even though correct information about Bitcoin is mandatory but another problem that slows it down, which may be even more important than informing people, is the volatility. Until mass adoption, the price will remain volatile which will slow down the process of adoption because people always hesitate to adopt something that can go up 50% one day and drop 30% the other.

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Quote from: pooya87 on September 17, 2024, 03:32:12 AM

Adoption phase is just beginning, you said it yourself people are still just hearing about bitcoin. And most of them are hearing negative things about it (such as it is going to dump, it is a Ponzi scheme, there is no use for it, etc.). When they learn the truth, they usually adopt bitcoin.

And how long will it take for people to change their attitude towards Bitcoin? It has been many years since its creation, and most people think it is just some kind of scam. No, information is needed in the world media about the positive aspects that cryptocurrency provides. Constant coverage in the news about the benefits of its use. This is the only way to change the opinion of most people on the planet.

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 08, 2024, 08:15:03 AM

This was a very interesting article explaining why bitcoin can't replace the dollar! Required reading. To anyone that thinks bitcoin get the government out of debt just NO. They need to be able to print more money.

No one can control Bitcoin because bitcoin can't replace what the dollar did. Besides that, there many factors like all financial in the world is used dollar for trading anything. For example when I want to trade goods to my friend in India, I have to exchange first my fiat Rupiah into the US Dollar then exchange it again USD to Rupee. so not directly my local currency to India currency. Because of that the dollar is powerful, it used to many financial around the world.

I don't know what happen next after Petro Dollar over 9 June 2024 ago. Because that agreement also made the dollar is more powerful since 1974 in the middle east especially on Saudi Arabia. USA seem like worry Saudi do not extend it and maybe USA think to change the strategy by made pressure in the middle east like today.

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