Topic: Two things are certain: Bitcoin and Taxes - page 6. (Read 7445 times)

well, you have made some interesting points and maybe this would even work. but i am not going to find out. once for lack of bitcoins in this quantity, but also as i see the potential to fuck up at one point, so i rather do not take the risk. if you think i am stupid because of that, then this is fine with me. but i know i would live with the constant fear of making a mistake and i guess i would need to move a lot (or is there a different system for a house/flat?).
there are clever ways to minimize the taxes you pay, but your solution is one step to far for me. maybe if i would have bitcoins by the thousands i would be more appealing to me. 

In my minds, at first, bitcoin is made to avoid the system is giving by government because the government is very giving limitations for their civilians. like sending a large of an amount of another people, maybe you will always get examination before.

Yep. That's highly possible that you can easily skip taxes and it's very hard to trace.
If you use TOR then your IP is almost completely hidden and is very hard to trace (unless there are instrumental methods avaliable to test it).
Things are also encrypted by VPNs and Tor and are much harder to get to the root sender. Also, i they come into it too late then it's there fault. We cannot work on a voluntary status as the largest company is always going to be the one that can avoid tax. When the largest comapanies, in fiat, cannot be tracked in their ta avasion (such as google) then there's no hope for the government tracking Bitcoin.

Like you said transaction fees, that means who ever wish to send bitcoin will need to pay transaction fee, no matter is it for gambling or trading, or buying pizza. From beginning I was thinking about this connection between governments and blockchain/bitcoin. I always thought how interesting will be when they decide to get into blockchain/bitcoins, and how they are just investigate what is this all about. Now I think they don't know what to do with btc, cause in beginning they thought bitcoin don't have future, and all of a sudden btc worth a lot, and more and more people are joining. They didn't expect this, and now entering and taxing bitcoin will be hard for them. There is TOR`s, VPN`s and other services, anyone can skip government tax system.

Yeah, it was pretty disappointing. But I believe for sure that in the future the Government will find a way to it when users bitcoin in each country has a very large amount/portion of their citizens using bitcoin for each transaction, because if the Government did not immediately find a solution then Government revenues will be reduced. because digital currency is acknowledged the Government did not get the input

Well since the government in our didnt accept bitcoin yet as a way e-currency then their is no such way that they will able to get taxes from us. Well i think that is also the reason why government does not accept it because it may be hard for them to monitor

Hello and thank you.  I accept that complement.
1.  How to buy a car?  Go to Beepi.com   They accept bitcoin, give you a free squishy toy car, phone mount, pen, and 2 thermal cups with every car purchase as advertisement swag.  They also do all of the paperwork for you, registration, license plate, and will get you car insurance.  It is like a 5 star service with a concierge.  They will deliver your car to you with a big blue bow on the hood.  Also I notice they detail the living crap out of the car so it is spotless when you recieve it.  The car warranty from them is about 6 months, but you get a manufacturers warranty as well, because they don't sell any cars over 60k miles.  So it is safe to assume all cars on Beepi are decent, and new enough to have the origional warranty in MOST cases.
2.  Real name?  Obviously. lol
3.  Fake name?  Or Anonymous?  (I will count those as the same thing, same question).  Yes of course.
Get yourself an LLC, register it yourself for $50 state fee from New Mexico.  NOT California because they are $600+ per year!  NM is $50 one time, $0 yearly, and zero yearly tax, zero yearly reporting requirement.  Legalzoom.com will sell you a registered agent service.  Every LLC must have a street address (not PO box) for legal papers to be served incase of a law suit.  (the main purpose of an LLC is to protect against a law suit).  For $150 per year (you only need to pay once, and may abandon the service.) you will have legal zoom provide one of their Corporations to act as your "registered agent" representative of your LLC to answer the door, receive mail and forward any mail for your LLC to you.
You will only care about that and only need that once, or a few times so 1 year is more than enough time for you to receive the NM LLC certificate, and your car insurance, registration and title paperwork in the mail sent to that address.
They will then forward the mail to you or your PO box, or your hotel, or your cousin's friend's uncle's baby mama's house.

Then you have a car purchased with bitcoin, registered to an LLC, under a registered agent's address who isnt you, who forwards your mail anywhere you tell them.

4.  If the government asks you where the car is from.  Who are you?  You are the person driving the car.  Tell them it is a company car.  A Limited Liability Corporation vehicle.  It belongs to the LLC, not you.  So that is not for you to know.  They can ask the LLC.  The LLC of course will not reply without a lawyer or at all.  Because the LLC doesn't give a fuck about taxes, back taxes or anything else.   If the IRC wants to tax the state of New Mexico which may or may not have received yearly or quarterly tax information and payments... they can take that up with NM who does not have a yearly reporting requirement.  If the IRS manages to get NM to do anything and NM sends a mean letter to your registered agent, and if you bother to receive mail at that point, and someone wants taxes... it will be 5 years before any legal action is taken against the LLC.  By then expect to lose by default because you will not care.  And you will have simply transferred the car to another person or LLC years ago because if you do all of this, it is because you have enough money to go buy a NEW car and have no interest in driving a 5 year old car.  Or if you keep it, you changed it to yet another LLC within 5 years.  The IRS issue wins, and the LLC has no assets to be seized or sold.  The old LLC is abandon or dissolved.  Pro tip, you may add a dissolve date to the LLC at the time you create the LLC.


LLCs are what EVERY business uses to register a vehicle.
As an American it is your duty NOT to pay taxes that fund issues you do not support.
But you must lie to the stupid poor people that incorrectly think it is the law to pay taxes.  Otherwise they will annoy you.

that is a strong argument. you have more bitcoins then me, so you must be smarter then me.
so it should be easy for you to explain me one simple thing.
at some point you will want to use your bitcoin, because if you do not, then what is the point in having them.
let us say you want to buy a car. how do you do that?
with your real name? a fake one? or maybe even anonymous?
how do you explain to the government where this car is from and how you paid for it?
because if you can not explain it, they will have to assume you are involved in some kind of crime.

AGREED!
The op is stupid.
Nobody will use any other crypto currency as widely accepted as Bitcoin because the services, vendors, relators, beepi.com overprice.com godaddy.com purse.io (thus amazon.com), and point of sale services do not exist for other crypto currency!   So Others will not grow or be used.

If others are taxed or controlled by government, then that is MORE reason people will stay with bitcoin and NOT adopt the others.  No matter what the government says, they cannot stop bitcoin anymore than they can pass laws to stop the sale of Alcohol or drugs.  Those still sell and sold when illegal.  Right or wrong, they sell.

All these people are stupid if they think there can be a tax on bitcoin, or if they think the NSA can track everyones bitcoin down to the exact owner or how much they had.

Simply because anyone can open a bitcoin wallet at any moment, anonymously, keeps bitcoin anonymous if someone puts any half ass effort into it.

I have over 102 bitcoin right this moment, so unless these idiots have more than me, maybe they should shut up with all their idiot talk.

i do not think this would work, since the users will simply go to an exchange that does not cooperate with the government. also exchanges only trade with existing bitcoins. the government would have to look also at the miniers and every private trade of the exchanges. 

I am pretty sure the government will eventually attract a tax of bitcoin through the exchanger without having to spend a lot of energy, the government will press exchangers concerning transparency of transaction for calculate how much tax they get. so goverment will not care how many new gambling site or how many online shop has accept bitcoin, they just need lock 1, that is exchange.

if you earning them buy selling you stuff they can make a connection quit easy. if you trade or something like this it is harder and probably not worth the effort for them.
it is possible, but not likely since it is a question of how they spent their resources. they will prefer a big fish over a small, but it is still illegal and if they get you, you will have to pay and also take the consequences.
but as stated above. most people with money want to spent it somehow and this is where they most likely get you.   

As long as I'm earning bitcoins and I don't exchange it for Fiat, how will the Income tax authorities become aware of me earning Bitcoins? Also, if I don't provide or relate any Bitcoin related income with my personal details/kyc then still is it possible for them to track the source of income and then I'd have to pay taxes for it?

great now you have 2 million bitcoin worth even more and can do nothing with it. why would you want that? let us say you buy a nice house or car. well i do not know where you life, but in most places around the world the government will want to know where you have the money from for this nice house/car, since you did not pay any taxes. and then either you pay them or they will just take your stuff away. it is that simple.

Bitcoin cannot be taxed. When you reach a really high amount of bitcoins you send them to your hardware wallet and you are not stupid enough to do the exchange in your state if they have strong rules regarding taxes like US or UK for example. You are smart you buy a ticket for Panama, Belize, Virgin Islands and all these countries where exists more business than persons alive. You open an account there in a bank there, exchange coins, and keep the money there. The banks there don't usually give a damn from where this money come from, so enjoy your liberty with bitcoins.

But, government can force any legal/registered merchants to add taxes in bitcoin transaction and convert it to their fiat currency.
So, unless you're criminal or use illegal service, government still can take taxes from you.

While I don't agree with everything OP says there are some things I do agree with him on, and this is not one of those things.

Voluntary taxation would have to immediately go to forced taxation if it was to ever get that far, mostly due to the fact that no-one would voluntarily be taxed on their Bitcoin and most people would just ignore it. A "Fed-coin" that could spring up would also likely be ignored by a majority of people because everyone already has other forms of digital banking, and this means that unless a "Fed-coin" was pushed and required as the only form of payment (which would be viewed as a detriment and probably in a poor manner to anyone who was already a part of the previous financial system), there is no reason for a Fed-coin to exist, because no-one would use it.

Bitcoin cant be applied taxes. You can Convert your fiat into bitcoins adn distribute bitcoin in many different wallets. No one can caught you that how much worth bitcoins you have and therefore no taxes can be applied on bitcoins.

basically you have to pay taxes on every transaction/trade you make. there are exceptions and also nobody will care if you sell some candy to your sibling without taxes, but by law you should pay taxes for that.
as it is not practical and there is no way for a state to enforce this rules 100% you make usually once a year a statement about your income and based on that you pay taxes. further more you a bound by law to make a true statement or you could get fined or jail time. most of the statements are just check if they are formally ok. some are look upon closer and suspicious ones investigated. so with or without bitcoin there is plenty of room to not pay taxes, but this is illegal. since many people think bitcoin is anonymous (it is not) the think they do not have to pay taxes with bitcoin. which is simply not true and a crime. and if you rather choose to belief a meme on some internet forum then a layer, well suit yourself. you have been warned and i will not be sorry for you. maybe nothing will ever happen to you, but i do not want to take my chances.