UK rules will hit loot boxes games hard - as they’re turning kids into gamblers.

serjent05

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Quote from: Kakmakr on July 01, 2020, 07:33:57 AM

The difference for me comes in when the players have some control over the outcome of the game or when there are some kind of skill that would help them to get the reward. (So if you have good eye-hand coordination and you can use that to grab a Teddy bear, then I will not call it gambling)

I agree, but in loot boxes, players have no control or whatsoever on the result of the roll. I remember one youtuber getting nothing special out of $1000 he spent on Ragnarok M eternal love and his expression is like wtf, and it looks like he wanted to bang his head on the monitor LOL. Imagine kids having this kind of frustration and yet he keeps on coming back for another try because he wanted to get something that is near to impossible to get. That is some kind of preparing them to be compulsive gambling someday.

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A lot of Arcade games can also encourage gambling, but that is also open for debate. https://www.casino.org/blog/do-arcades-and-claw-machines-turn-kids-into-gamblers/

The problem with the "Loot boxes" has been an issue for years now, see this article in 2018 - https://theconversation.com/gambling-loot-boxes-in-video-games-could-be-conditioning-children-107667

The difference for me comes in when the players have some control over the outcome of the game or when there are some kind of skill that would help them to get the reward. (So if you have good eye-hand coordination and you can use that to grab a Teddy bear, then I will not call it gambling)

The Arcade center near our brick-n-mortar casino has a lot of "Coin pusher" type games.. so I think they want kids to get used to those kind of rewards to groom them for gambling later in their lives. Roll Eyes

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Quote from: pilosopotasyo on June 28, 2020, 12:26:04 AM

Quote from: Debonaire217 on June 27, 2020, 11:25:04 PM

I think this should not reach the jurisdiction to tell that kids are gambling through loot boxes because in the first place, discipline starts inside of their respective homes where their parents should be the one supervising their child whether to give them credits to use in games, it is not wrong to ask your kid which item he/she would buy and if you think it isn't fair, or quite exposing them to the side of gambling, then simply don't allowing them will solve the problem and explain it further if they insist.

Good thinking, kids should have parental guidance when purchasing anything on the internet, it's not their money any way it's their parent's money, the site just needs to post a disclaimer about the things that customers or players are purchasing, no need to disrupt the industry with that kind of ruling, they should do a survey first among parents of gamers before coming up with that kind of decision.

I think kids probably shouldn't be exposed to lots of betting games at very tender ages, just as you don't expose them to many kinds of alcoholic beverages(probably the sweet ones). They could easily play/drink too much and even get addicted due to weak self-control.
You still encourage them when they are of age to avoid gambling. They may "bet but don't Gamble"

verita1

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Based on this expertise, kids must be protected. I agree that the industry is regulated because they are certainly learning to become a compulsive gambling player in the future. Therefore, creators must develop games that contribute to children's intellectual growth.

TimeTeller

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Quote from: alani123 on June 30, 2020, 05:17:32 PM

I think this regulation is fair game. Game developers continue to have complete free reign over what they put in their games, but to try and lure children to spend money over "randomized" content such as in game items is just ridiculous. Some games with no age rating are featuring such mechanics and it was begging for regulation. It's amazing how companies were getting millions this way, paying no taxes, and still pretending it wasn't gambling. Big companies have gotten away with it for so long without even paying tax or being regulated, while even receiving subsidies (looking at you Activision Blizzard), and also paying their CEOs millions in bonuses even when under-performing. Corporations that are big in producing games can be very scummy. And they call casino owners shady...

That's their main purpose, to earn big profits without worrying about the tax that they need to pay.
And they are hiding it from creating this kind of loot boxes games.
Of course, kids do not bother about this taxes and all. They just care about what they will get.
So maybe the government is not after for these kids that may turn up to gamblers but rather they are after for these big companies.

carlfebz2

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Quote from: serjent05 on June 30, 2020, 12:47:33 PM

Quote from: Debonaire217 on June 27, 2020, 11:25:04 PM

I think this should not reach the jurisdiction to tell that kids are gambling through loot boxes because in the first place, discipline starts inside of their respective homes where their parents should be the one supervising their child whether to give them credits to use in games, it is not wrong to ask your kid which item he/she would buy and if you think it isn't fair, or quite exposing them to the side of gambling, then simply don't allowing them will solve the problem and explain it further if they insist.

I hope it is easy as that. We all know children have this thing curiosity and sometimes being mischievous. At least having the government to rule that loot box in a game is like gambling, parents have a strong footing to warn their children about it. Aside from that, tagging this kind of money-making scheme of the game developers as gambling activities will more likely resulting in them(game developer/owner) giving the player the true value of the money they are spending in the game. I am agreeing that this loot boxes in the game should be tagged as a gambling activity.

Gambling activity or not, this will vary or depend on how a child do recognize this kind of activity and since this had been allowed then it all matters with kids parents on how they do

handle out or explain clearly to their child on what they are dealing with in case they do know that their son/daughter is engage up with this thing or not but in most cases, parents

arent aware that much on activities specially if they are just too busy into something. This one can either be a gambling nor just simply buying out just because you do

love to get some unexpected rewards.

alani123

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I think this regulation is fair game. Game developers continue to have complete free reign over what they put in their games, but to try and lure children to spend money over "randomized" content such as in game items is just ridiculous. Some games with no age rating are featuring such mechanics and it was begging for regulation. It's amazing how companies were getting millions this way, paying no taxes, and still pretending it wasn't gambling. Big companies have gotten away with it for so long without even paying tax or being regulated, while even receiving subsidies (looking at you Activision Blizzard), and also paying their CEOs millions in bonuses even when under-performing. Corporations that are big in producing games can be very scummy. And they call casino owners shady...

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Quote from: bitbunnny on June 30, 2020, 12:15:42 PM

Quote from: yazher on June 30, 2020, 12:02:46 PM

I don't think this is a good one, as a kid, you really need to avoid such kind of action to pursue your dreams or else you ended up losing all of your allowance for mere entertainment. They need to re-think this new rule because this is not an easy thing to eliminate once it has been approved for many years now. The kids will not be recovered from addiction in a day. they want to gather as much money as they can but the risk is higher than to earn. Kids shouldn't be thinking where he needs to get money to play more instead he needs to have some free mind and to have some problem-free life.

I really can't understand how can they expose kids to such risk. They can't think clearly and rationaly and will not be able to resist temptation. That is big potential social problem but obviously authorities didn't think that way. That can only push forward completely wrong at these children who will play such games. When problems ocur I guess it will be too late.

In our society now, it's really hard to control the developers in developing different kind of games as they will try to provide an exciting games to attract gamers and that is regardless of their hidden intentions. If we care for our children, I think we should be the one monitoring our children's activity online to avoid all online temptations.

Actually not only games but there's a lot of things, if they can get any information how to gamble, they can also try it as children are always curious on things they will discover online, the discipline should start from us, if we don't tolerate our children, government does not have to take this kind of actions that would hinder the success of the games developers.

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on June 27, 2020, 11:25:04 PM

I think this should not reach the jurisdiction to tell that kids are gambling through loot boxes because in the first place, discipline starts inside of their respective homes where their parents should be the one supervising their child whether to give them credits to use in games, it is not wrong to ask your kid which item he/she would buy and if you think it isn't fair, or quite exposing them to the side of gambling, then simply don't allowing them will solve the problem and explain it further if they insist.

I hope it is easy as that. We all know children have this thing curiosity and sometimes being mischievous. At least having the government to rule that loot box in a game is like gambling, parents have a strong footing to warn their children about it. Aside from that, tagging this kind of money-making scheme of the game developers as gambling activities will more likely resulting in them(game developer/owner) giving the player the true value of the money they are spending in the game. I am agreeing that this loot boxes in the game should be tagged as a gambling activity.

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Quote from: Mauser on June 30, 2020, 11:06:13 AM

Quote from: Becky666 on June 30, 2020, 10:42:56 AM

games you win without cashing out isn't a gambling platform and should be hit with more rules, they deserve this. Those games were my liken from childhood because I used to play with these games on phones. Buying virtual coins to game with real fiats money looks bad, this can also lead many kids to early gambling addiction. The car race was my favourite among these categories of games, some of my gambling zeas (minor addiction) today came from here, and am still strongly with them.

Games with cashing out or not should be definitely regulated more if they are for kids. Just because they don't require actual money and work with virtual currencies, or skins/mounts for games, doesn't mean they can't be addictive for kids.
The thing with casinos is the games are somehow standardized, everyone knows the chance to win. But with these loot boxes, no one knows their chances of winning something big. It could be all a big scam in the end. For youngsters under 18 there definitely needs to be more regulation.

It's the downside of letting kids be addicted to gadgets at a young age. It may not involve monetary rewards like in real gambling, kids can still be addicted to games that they can bring once they grow up.

But one thing is that, even if the game is not intended for minors, once it gets popular, minors will still play it since it's accessible. So it's already outside of the hand of the developer nor the government. The regulation should be implemented by their parents. Also, kids won't be able to spend money on loot boxes if their parents didn't allow them in the first place. Kids still find it hard to control their emotions so once they start spending money on certain entertainment, it will be hard for them to resist doing it again.

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Quote from: yazher on June 30, 2020, 12:02:46 PM

I don't think this is a good one, as a kid, you really need to avoid such kind of action to pursue your dreams or else you ended up losing all of your allowance for mere entertainment. They need to re-think this new rule because this is not an easy thing to eliminate once it has been approved for many years now. The kids will not be recovered from addiction in a day. they want to gather as much money as they can but the risk is higher than to earn. Kids shouldn't be thinking where he needs to get money to play more instead he needs to have some free mind and to have some problem-free life.

I really can't understand how can they expose kids to such risk. They can't think clearly and rationaly and will not be able to resist temptation. That is big potential social problem but obviously authorities didn't think that way. That can only push forward completely wrong at these children who will play such games. When problems ocur I guess it will be too late.

yazher

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I don't think this is a good one, as a kid, you really need to avoid such kind of action to pursue your dreams or else you ended up losing all of your allowance for mere entertainment. They need to re-think this new rule because this is not an easy thing to eliminate once it has been approved for many years now. The kids will not be recovered from addiction in a day. they want to gather as much money as they can but the risk is higher than to earn. Kids shouldn't be thinking where he needs to get money to play more instead he needs to have some free mind and to have some problem-free life.

Mauser

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Quote from: Becky666 on June 30, 2020, 10:42:56 AM

games you win without cashing out isn't a gambling platform and should be hit with more rules, they deserve this. Those games were my liken from childhood because I used to play with these games on phones. Buying virtual coins to game with real fiats money looks bad, this can also lead many kids to early gambling addiction. The car race was my favourite among these categories of games, some of my gambling zeas (minor addiction) today came from here, and am still strongly with them.

Games with cashing out or not should be definitely regulated more if they are for kids. Just because they don't require actual money and work with virtual currencies, or skins/mounts for games, doesn't mean they can't be addictive for kids.
The thing with casinos is the games are somehow standardized, everyone knows the chance to win. But with these loot boxes, no one knows their chances of winning something big. It could be all a big scam in the end. For youngsters under 18 there definitely needs to be more regulation.

Becky666

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games you win without cashing out isn't a gambling platform and should be hit with more rules, they deserve this. Those games were my liken from childhood because I used to play with these games on phones. Buying virtual coins to game with real fiats money looks bad, this can also lead many kids to early gambling addiction. The car race was my favourite among these categories of games, some of my gambling zeas (minor addiction) today came from here, and am still strongly with them.

AlbertoLB

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When gambling you bound to lose your money, loot boxes and since we are talking about crypto give you an actual value no matter how many boxes you buy which isn't gambling, and yes you can get a bit hooked to that, just as you can get hooked to any sound, color or action.
When you say spent 10000$ you definetly not mean crypto-gaming, as some crypto games are basicaly rather giving away money.

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Quote from: traderethereum on June 30, 2020, 03:40:01 AM

Quote from: pilosopotasyo on June 28, 2020, 12:26:04 AM

Quote from: Debonaire217 on June 27, 2020, 11:25:04 PM

I think this should not reach the jurisdiction to tell that kids are gambling through loot boxes because in the first place, discipline starts inside of their respective homes where their parents should be the one supervising their child whether to give them credits to use in games, it is not wrong to ask your kid which item he/she would buy and if you think it isn't fair, or quite exposing them to the side of gambling, then simply don't allowing them will solve the problem and explain it further if they insist.

Good thinking, kids should have parental guidance when purchasing anything on the internet, it's not their money any way it's their parent's money, the site just needs to post a disclaimer about the things that customers or players are purchasing, no need to disrupt the industry with that kind of ruling, they should do a survey first among parents of gamers before coming up with that kind of decision.

Nah, many kids know how to use their parents' credit cards to buy something on the internet.
Kids now are smart and they can learn without we teach them.
It is a job for every parent to watch out their kids while they connect to the internet because they can attract to play games, which can lead them to gamble with their parent's money.
Before it's happening, we need to make some rules for them when they can use the internet to learn something or read or watch something.
I am sure they will not do something negative with the internet, and they will know that gambling is a dangerous thing that they should stay away.

I think the method you are saying is correct.It is the one we can all use by using our Internet Security Software to define which websites can the kids access as a first point of defense.Nowadays all kids have tablets or start to use parents phones and these are the second line of defense where we can install apps which makes the usage of these devices timed like 1 hour a day only.

These tips plus constant good education and speaking directly with the children will ensure they grow up healthy and free from gambling and addiction.

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Quote from: pilosopotasyo on June 28, 2020, 12:26:04 AM

Quote from: Debonaire217 on June 27, 2020, 11:25:04 PM

I think this should not reach the jurisdiction to tell that kids are gambling through loot boxes because in the first place, discipline starts inside of their respective homes where their parents should be the one supervising their child whether to give them credits to use in games, it is not wrong to ask your kid which item he/she would buy and if you think it isn't fair, or quite exposing them to the side of gambling, then simply don't allowing them will solve the problem and explain it further if they insist.

Good thinking, kids should have parental guidance when purchasing anything on the internet, it's not their money any way it's their parent's money, the site just needs to post a disclaimer about the things that customers or players are purchasing, no need to disrupt the industry with that kind of ruling, they should do a survey first among parents of gamers before coming up with that kind of decision.

Nah, many kids know how to use their parents' credit cards to buy something on the internet.
Kids now are smart and they can learn without we teach them.
It is a job for every parent to watch out their kids while they connect to the internet because they can attract to play games, which can lead them to gamble with their parent's money.
Before it's happening, we need to make some rules for them when they can use the internet to learn something or read or watch something.
I am sure they will not do something negative with the internet, and they will know that gambling is a dangerous thing that they should stay away.

pilosopotasyo

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on June 27, 2020, 11:25:04 PM

I think this should not reach the jurisdiction to tell that kids are gambling through loot boxes because in the first place, discipline starts inside of their respective homes where their parents should be the one supervising their child whether to give them credits to use in games, it is not wrong to ask your kid which item he/she would buy and if you think it isn't fair, or quite exposing them to the side of gambling, then simply don't allowing them will solve the problem and explain it further if they insist.

Good thinking, kids should have parental guidance when purchasing anything on the internet, it's not their money any way it's their parent's money, the site just needs to post a disclaimer about the things that customers or players are purchasing, no need to disrupt the industry with that kind of ruling, they should do a survey first among parents of gamers before coming up with that kind of decision.

Debonaire217

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I think this should not reach the jurisdiction to tell that kids are gambling through loot boxes because in the first place, discipline starts inside of their respective homes where their parents should be the one supervising their child whether to give them credits to use in games, it is not wrong to ask your kid which item he/she would buy and if you think it isn't fair, or quite exposing them to the side of gambling, then simply don't allowing them will solve the problem and explain it further if they insist.

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Quote from: FlightyPouch on June 27, 2020, 07:58:38 PM

Quote from: Darker45 on June 27, 2020, 09:09:46 AM

It is their decision that will be followed. To me personally, however, it does not sound gambling at all.

Those elements of surprise and chance are not enough a reason so that those loot boxes games should be considered gambling. Buying a mystery box is not gambling.

At first, I saw it as a harmless way for players to spend their money and for that gaming platform to earn some but in the long run, players are kind of addicted to buying them. They are after rare items and the chance of getting them is low compared to normal ones. They will not stop until they get themselves a rare in-game item and that might take a while and take some money that is why I consider it as gambling.

Well, in a broad sense, it could possibly be gambling. In the same manner that life is a gamble.

Online games always have ways to make sure the gamer won't stop playing. There are items to look for, levels to pursue, skills to unlock, heroes to be accessed, ranks to achieve, golds to earn, stars to acquire, and so on and so forth. All this is for the players to get hooked on to it.

And then they are providing premium access, load cards, and other ways for the players who wish to spend and receive a certain exclusive offering in return. This is taking money from them.

However, all this is not betting or placing a wager.

Topic: UK rules will hit loot boxes games hard - as they’re turning kids into gamblers. (Read 982 times)