Use of cryptocurrencies, a concern – IMF

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Quote from: Silberman on March 06, 2021, 12:21:13 AM

Quote from: Dave1 on March 04, 2021, 08:46:44 AM

Quote from: Silberman on March 02, 2021, 10:29:09 PM

The problem for governments is that such a goal is impossible to accomplish, I think we all understand that one of the first and probably the most important duty of a government is to guarantee the security of their citizens, but with that excuse they are taking so many measures that go against our freedoms that sooner or later people would have reacted against it and once that happens any attempt to try to control their citizens will fail completely and bitcoin is a perfect example of this.

So it's a double sword standard that we are currently live it. Initially we thought that Internet is censorship resistant and it was developed to really connect us in a way without any interference from government. However, it has drastically change when it become centralized because of the monopoly of companies such as Google. Bitcoin will like to change all of that, or at least crypto for that matter. But for me the pattern continues, they want total regulations, they want everything under their control.

Right now we are experimenting an invisible battle which many people do no appreciate but that it is there, and it is the battle of centralization vs decentralization, governments want to centralize everything, it is on their very nature and unfortunately technological advancements have allowed them to reach a level of power that was impossible to imagine just 30 years ago, but there is hope, technologies like bitcoin and cryptography allow us to bypass some of that centralization and I think for the first time in a long time people are reacting negatively to all the power governments and private companies like Google and Facebook have over them.

Facebook and Google don't have any power that people don't give to them. You opt into that by using google services or opening a facebook account and posting information about yourself. If you don't like what facebook or google do or the power they have over you, stop using their services. It's an entirely solvable problem.

barbara44

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Quote from: Twinkledoe on March 14, 2021, 06:09:20 AM

Quote from: Sithara007 on March 13, 2021, 10:20:08 PM

The biggest scam ongoing in the world right now is fiat currency. Governments are printing banknotes as if there is no tomorrow and the global debt is now estimated at around $300 trillion, which is close to the global GDP. Now IMF is the agency which has been one of the main players in this scam. Ordinary citizens are the victims of this scam, and every year they lose out in the form of increased debt burden and falling purchasing power of their bank deposits.

They forgot to look at themselves first, before overthinking the impact of cryptocurrencies. Tongue

I believe they are concern of the rising popularity of crypto, because this currency, they don't have the control so they don't know where money are going to or coming from. They are not comfortable that people will find a way how to control their own funds without the knowledge of the government. Anyway, they should place their concern over other pressing matters that involved fiat.

That is exactly the reason why they do not like crypto, because they know that they are not going to be able to stop it and that is why they hate it, that is the main reason why they are doing all of what they can to make it look like bitcoin is something shady and illegal but the reality is that bitcoin is the most legit currency there ever was in history of mankind.

If bitcoin becomes so popular that it breaks over gold market cap and that will be one step that we are starting to eat fiat and slowly destroy it, people will slowly stop investing with fiat and will start using crypto instead, that should be our number one focus right now. But, one another important fact is that we need to find a way to transfer bitcoin around very very cheaply and super fast so that we could actually spend it everywhere, that would be second goal that would help us a lot.

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Quote from: Ucy on March 15, 2021, 11:09:19 AM

Quote from: Xavofat on February 19, 2021, 06:10:33 AM

Quote from: Ucy on February 18, 2021, 10:36:55 AM

Bitcoin is built to be anonymous.

No, it's built to be pseudonymous, but it's very difficult to keep transactions pseudonymous because many people have revealed some kind of identifying information about themselves in connection with their address on the Internet. Especially with exchanges that have KYC in place, governments and others can draw connections between known Bitcoin users and the people that they are sending Bitcoin to.

Satoshi did not claim that Bitcoin is an anonymous system, rather that the possibility to be anonymous or pseudonymous relies on you not revealing any identifying information about yourself in connection to the Bitcoin address you use.

I just checked the dictionary definition of pseudonymous just to be sure, and as far as I can tell, users who run full nodes don't use false name for their addresses or wallets. Their addresses are typically anonymous with no false/fake names tied to them unless they want their identities to be known.

Ofcourse, no anonymous system/network is really fully anonymous. There will always be ways to know or guess the identity behind them.

But some are really fully anonymous! Monero is one of them! I didn't hear that someone claimed that $ 500k bounty on cracking Monero chain, issued by some US agency... maybe I am wrong?!

Bitcoin is transparent, you can connect yourself with your address (or not), but the transaction is visible to all of us! With Monero (and some other privacy coins) you can't keep track of transactions!

Quote from: Charles-Tim on February 18, 2021, 07:48:22 AM

...
Central banks that ban bitcoin only encouraging p2p.

The future is in p2p... people are sick of banks, governments, and all their shit!

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Quote from: Xavofat on February 19, 2021, 06:10:33 AM

Quote from: Ucy on February 18, 2021, 10:36:55 AM

Bitcoin is built to be anonymous.

No, it's built to be pseudonymous, but it's very difficult to keep transactions pseudonymous because many people have revealed some kind of identifying information about themselves in connection with their address on the Internet. Especially with exchanges that have KYC in place, governments and others can draw connections between known Bitcoin users and the people that they are sending Bitcoin to.

Satoshi did not claim that Bitcoin is an anonymous system, rather that the possibility to be anonymous or pseudonymous relies on you not revealing any identifying information about yourself in connection to the Bitcoin address you use.

I just checked the dictionary definition of pseudonymous just to be sure, and as far as I can tell, users who run full nodes don't use false name for their addresses or wallets. Their addresses are typically anonymous with no false/fake names tied to them unless they want their identities to be known.

Ofcourse, no anonymous system/network is really fully anonymous. There will always be ways to know or guess the identity behind them.

worle1bm

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Actually most of the government and their cabinet are unable to understand the usage of Cryptocurrencies like Bitcoin or simply they don't want to understand it because they fear of losing control over monetary transaction.But they need to look it at other way because the transactions are not anonymous as blockchain holds the record of each and every transaction made on Bitcoin network and most customer have KYC done on the exchange revealing their Indentity so we can't say it is completely anonymous and used for dark web crimes.The control is in owners hand and the government cannot rob them of their funds unlike fiat which Is completely under their functioning.So they are giving such lame excuses to avoid usage and demotivate people by spreading FOMO but it will be of no usage.So let them try their tricks which will result in their economical loss.

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Quote from: Twinkledoe on March 14, 2021, 06:09:20 AM

They forgot to look at themselves first, before overthinking the impact of cryptocurrencies. Tongue

I believe they are concern of the rising popularity of crypto, because this currency, they don't have the control so they don't know where money are going to or coming from. They are not comfortable that people will find a way how to control their own funds without the knowledge of the government. Anyway, they should place their concern over other pressing matters that involved fiat.

They believe that cryptocurrencies pose a direct challenge for them. Why should people use shitty fiat currencies to store their wealth, when they have a much better alternative? The stock market and bullion were the only options available to the users earlier. But the government has manipulated these markets as well and they have a close interlink with fiat economy. But that is not the case with cryptocurrencies, and that explains their panic.

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Quote from: Charles-Tim on February 18, 2021, 07:48:22 AM

That is why I like countries like USA that do not ban cryptocurrencies but regulating it. As fiat is, it is most used in all these

Most things come in stages and time. It is clear to the world the cryptocurrency and bitcoin is a world phenomenon and with time, countries that are not positive will turn around. If not a total adoption but will use it as an option. Countries that have pronounced ban on it have not been totally successful on the ban. India and Nigeria have their citizens buying on P2P basis and things are going on. Time is a factor that will bring the reversal because the government is losing.

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Quote from: Sithara007 on March 13, 2021, 10:20:08 PM

The biggest scam ongoing in the world right now is fiat currency. Governments are printing banknotes as if there is no tomorrow and the global debt is now estimated at around $300 trillion, which is close to the global GDP. Now IMF is the agency which has been one of the main players in this scam. Ordinary citizens are the victims of this scam, and every year they lose out in the form of increased debt burden and falling purchasing power of their bank deposits.

They forgot to look at themselves first, before overthinking the impact of cryptocurrencies. Tongue

I believe they are concern of the rising popularity of crypto, because this currency, they don't have the control so they don't know where money are going to or coming from. They are not comfortable that people will find a way how to control their own funds without the knowledge of the government. Anyway, they should place their concern over other pressing matters that involved fiat.

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Quote from: sana54210 on February 20, 2021, 02:04:54 PM

So, that means is you could find someone who uses an exchange, find the exchange address they were given, see the address they sent money from to their exchange and follow them up from there all from blockchain.

Centralized exchanges hold your data/info as well as your private keys in your web wallet, but it doesn't mean they'll give that information to just anyone, your post above isn't only specific to Exchange addresses, you can somewhat trace any address on the blockchain network, but the only information you'll be able to get is just the addresses it received from/sent to, but the personnel behind all the transactions remains unseen.

Having said that, the difference is now that, with other wallets that you hold your private keys, if you've not converted crypto via an exchange, there's no way a transaction can be traced to the point of knowing who you are, but if you've used a centralized exchange, on a serious order from the government your identity could be revealed to them, but that order wouldn't just come from anyone, but the government. There are other risks with exchanges and that's data hack/leak, and that's one way your data can find its way into the hands of scammers in the black market.

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The biggest scam ongoing in the world right now is fiat currency. Governments are printing banknotes as if there is no tomorrow and the global debt is now estimated at around $300 trillion, which is close to the global GDP. Now IMF is the agency which has been one of the main players in this scam. Ordinary citizens are the victims of this scam, and every year they lose out in the form of increased debt burden and falling purchasing power of their bank deposits.

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Quote from: sana54210 on February 20, 2021, 02:04:54 PM

that means is you could find someone who uses an exchange, find the exchange address they were given, see the address they sent money from to their exchange and follow them up from there all from blockchain.

It's near impossible to find the address an exchange allocates the user unless the user is just naive and gives it away for no reason to anyone. It's similar to sharing your bank account number, nothing much can be changed but a lot of things can be extracted if known.

Also what happens if you deposit money to that address by withdrawing from another exchange, for example, I withdraw from Binance to another exchange. It's impossible to track it.

Quote from: sana54210 on February 20, 2021, 02:04:54 PM

Like you said it is a lot more clear and available, whereas in banking world, can you and I follow up what Elon does with his money? Of course not.

If he shares his account numbers publicly then for sure someone can get that information.

Quote from: sana54210 on February 20, 2021, 02:04:54 PM

Long story short this is not about anon or not, this is about banks versus crypto, this is about rich vs poor, this is about fair versus unfair and if the world goes more crypto they know that people will have a too much power.

It's also about transparency and giving control to the people rather than banks.

I understand there are some possible ways of finding others' addresses and track their transactions but if they are educated enough they can remain anonymous for as long as they want.

We know Michael Saylor bought tons of BTC, do we actually know which address he uses to hold them? Obviously, NO. because he knows how to buy, let everyone know yet remain hidden.

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Quote from: Dave1 on March 04, 2021, 08:46:44 AM

Quote from: Silberman on March 02, 2021, 10:29:09 PM

The problem for governments is that such a goal is impossible to accomplish, I think we all understand that one of the first and probably the most important duty of a government is to guarantee the security of their citizens, but with that excuse they are taking so many measures that go against our freedoms that sooner or later people would have reacted against it and once that happens any attempt to try to control their citizens will fail completely and bitcoin is a perfect example of this.

So it's a double sword standard that we are currently live it. Initially we thought that Internet is censorship resistant and it was developed to really connect us in a way without any interference from government. However, it has drastically change when it become centralized because of the monopoly of companies such as Google. Bitcoin will like to change all of that, or at least crypto for that matter. But for me the pattern continues, they want total regulations, they want everything under their control.

Right now we are experimenting an invisible battle which many people do no appreciate but that it is there, and it is the battle of centralization vs decentralization, governments want to centralize everything, it is on their very nature and unfortunately technological advancements have allowed them to reach a level of power that was impossible to imagine just 30 years ago, but there is hope, technologies like bitcoin and cryptography allow us to bypass some of that centralization and I think for the first time in a long time people are reacting negatively to all the power governments and private companies like Google and Facebook have over them.

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Quote from: Coinsfera on March 03, 2021, 02:27:55 AM

Probably they fear that if people hold the mass amount of crypto and wanted to convert it to cash then it will be a problem those banks have low cash holdings. Considering the significant price increase in Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies it will be hard to pay them back if they want to take their cash out. This can be considered a major problem.

That is exactly what they fear! In crypto if you own crypto you can buy more or sell and it is always there, there is no "money lost" there, you buy a certain amount of bitcoins and you sell certain amount of bitcoins, there could never be more or less amount in the world.

So, why can't banks handle that? Simple reason, because they do not have the money they claim they do, that has been known for years and world didn't just crashed the whole banking industry, I do not know why and I can't say how but the reality is that we put money into banks, and they spend that and if every single person that has money in that bank wants to withdraw it, that would result with them collapsing and not being able to pay, that is basically means banks are a ponzi scheme surviving with the new money coming in. Crypto doesn't allow that and financial industry hates it for that.

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Quote from: magneto on February 18, 2021, 04:07:32 PM

By this logic, gift cards should be banned because of the high levels of fraud associated with them (and I think Hydrogen posted a nice article a while back regarding this). Heck, bank transfers should be banned altogether because it facilitates certain transactions with tax evasion, money laundering... etc. etc.

It is only that they want to restrict access to decentralised assets that they are making these meaningless statements. No other reason.

In order to control the pace of the main economy, they are very aggressive in a dirty way. They restrict us from having the financial freedom Satoshi hoped 10 years ago. they make regulations that really want to suppress our finances which are easy to control and they can also stop at any time. this needs to be fought.

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Having no control at all means they are vulnerable to such accusations. The government aren't convince at all because some crypto currencies aren't regulated. These institutions are much more prone to money laundering and this is why KYC are much important.

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Quote from: Silberman on March 02, 2021, 10:29:09 PM

Quote from: Smartprofit on February 27, 2021, 02:55:43 AM

Governments seek total control. However, the Internet and the virtual space are not the territory of separate states.

The virtual world was created not by kings, emperors and presidents, but by developers and ordinary people. Therefore, the Internet and the virtual space is a special space that should not be regulated by the laws of individual states. Satoshi Nakamoto created Bitcoin. Bitcoin is the money of the virtual space.

Yes, the Bitcoin blockchain is transparent. This is done to confirm the reality of transactions, and not for regulatory purposes.

The problem for governments is that such a goal is impossible to accomplish, I think we all understand that one of the first and probably the most important duty of a government is to guarantee the security of their citizens, but with that excuse they are taking so many measures that go against our freedoms that sooner or later people would have reacted against it and once that happens any attempt to try to control their citizens will fail completely and bitcoin is a perfect example of this.

So it's a double sword standard that we are currently live it. Initially we thought that Internet is censorship resistant and it was developed to really connect us in a way without any interference from government. However, it has drastically change when it become centralized because of the monopoly of companies such as Google. Bitcoin will like to change all of that, or at least crypto for that matter. But for me the pattern continues, they want total regulations, they want everything under their control.

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Quote from: Charles-Tim on February 18, 2021, 07:48:22 AM

I am so curious that many people do not know or research properly about bitcoin and many other crypto assets, they only know little about them and dipicting them bad to people. Normally, there are two types of cryptocurrencies in term of psuedonymity and anonymity, they are:
1. The ones with public ledger which transactions can be seen by everyone on blockchain. Example is bitcoin
2. The ones that are are completely anonymous in which transactions are not designed to be tracked

Quote from: https://punchng.com/use-of-cryptocurrencies-a-concern-imf/

The International Monetary Fund has called for caution in the use of cryptocurrencies, describing it as a concern. It disclosed this during a virtual briefing on the recently published 2020 Article IV IMF Staff Report for Nigeria. The Resident Representative of IMF for Nigeria, Ari Aisen, said the concern on the use of cryptocurrencies was why many central banks were cautious about the development.
“That is why some central banks, not only in Nigeria, have these concerns about what kind of activities these cryptocurrencies are put and how best to monitor those activities.” Aisen noted that some of the activities might be illegal or related to money laundering and drug peddling.

Is the above quote meaningful? I do not see it meaningful at all. Some people are not concerned about privacy and make use of exchange for crypto purchase, while many providing kyc all because exchanges are making it mandatory to do. Many people do not like exchanges because they are making people not to have privacy. Is it not proper for the government to have laws that will make exchanges be able to track crypto transactions rather than banning it. That is why I like countries like USA that do not ban cryptocurrencies but regulating it. As fiat is, it is most used in all these (terrorism financing, money laundering and drug peddling).
Central banks that ban bitcoin only encouraging p2p.

Probably they fear that if people hold the mass amount of crypto and wanted to convert it to cash then it will be a problem those banks have low cash holdings. Considering the significant price increase in Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies it will be hard to pay them back if they want to take their cash out. This can be considered a major problem.

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Quote from: Smartprofit on February 27, 2021, 02:55:43 AM

The virtual world was created not by kings, emperors and presidents, but by developers and ordinary people. Therefore, the Internet and the virtual space is a special space that should not be regulated by the laws of individual states.

Actually, the internet is way too centralized and becomes more and more censored as we speak. It's in the worst state it has ever probably been, and that really sucks.

Silberman

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Quote from: Smartprofit on February 27, 2021, 02:55:43 AM

Governments seek total control. However, the Internet and the virtual space are not the territory of separate states.

The virtual world was created not by kings, emperors and presidents, but by developers and ordinary people. Therefore, the Internet and the virtual space is a special space that should not be regulated by the laws of individual states. Satoshi Nakamoto created Bitcoin. Bitcoin is the money of the virtual space.

Yes, the Bitcoin blockchain is transparent. This is done to confirm the reality of transactions, and not for regulatory purposes.

The problem for governments is that such a goal is impossible to accomplish, I think we all understand that one of the first and probably the most important duty of a government is to guarantee the security of their citizens, but with that excuse they are taking so many measures that go against our freedoms that sooner or later people would have reacted against it and once that happens any attempt to try to control their citizens will fail completely and bitcoin is a perfect example of this.

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On the strength of new technologies, each individual has different purposes for using bitcoin as well as for cryptocurrencies. As you can see, the majority use bitcoin in order to gain a huge profit from the increase in the price whereas it is believed to be a strong hedge again the monetary. Others like bitcoin because of its anonymity and thus, they avoid use any exchange which forces them to become exposed to the authorities. Only a few manipulate bitcoin for bad influences such as terrorism, money laundering, etc

Banning Bitcoin is a way in which Nigeria chooses to solve the problem without having any appropriate regulation on using, owning, and trading cryptocurrency. They avoid the facts that people in their country are innovators who easily understand and adapt to advanced practical applications.

To me, bitcoin is a wonderful asset generating money passively for me without doing anything except stacking it.

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