Topic: Viabtc Cloud Mining, read before you buy. (Read 448 times)

I am of the opinion that every cloud mining should be labelled as a scam. No exception

Unfortunately, just like in casinos where MOST people end up losing money given the statistical advantages the house has over the players, you can't label them as scammers, the same thing is true for cloud mining that is offered by "legit" companies like Bitmain, in other words, you could sue all those fake cloud mining companies who simply take your money and run, but I doubt you can do the same with Bitmain, Viabtc, any other company that doesn't just run away with your money.

They simply are counting on people's ignorance and greed, they know the math very well, and they know how to make a profit at the expense of those who don't, do I advice everyone against it? yes, can I say without a doubt that Binance, Viabtc, and all those folks are scammers? would be hard to prove in a court to be honest.

I just know after you guys tell me, and yes it actually profitable but razor-thin margin and we need 3 months to get return of investment for now it is not worth it too, it is better to buy with DCA technique and maybe the return will more than this.

* Hashrate Fee 0.02 + Electricity Fee 0.0531 = 0.0731/USD/T/Day (the historical output 0.0776/USD/T/Day - Fee 0.0731/USD/T/Day = 0.0045/USD/T/Day

I wonder where the 23% comes from



So right now it's 0.0777 in profit with 0.0200+0.0531, a bit better than yours but still, you get
0.0731 in expenses and 0.0777 in revenue, which is 0.0041 in profit, so a 5% margin, nowhere near a 23% stated there.
Taking into account the current mempool spam that drove the fees up and you get a 5% bonus from this which might not be there tomorrow the profit is paper thin, one tiny dif increase and you're losing coins.

I am of the opinion that every cloud mining should be labelled as a scam. No exception

TL:DR, Cloud mining assuming it isn't a straightforward scam, is most likely going to make you lose money, it's extremely rare for the events that make it profitable to actually happen, and even if and ones they happen, you are very likely to not benefit from them.

When an investment is presented to an individual, it mainly aims to increase the return on investment, and then it is assumed that the probability of profit and loss is 50%, or at least clarify that this is a high-risk investment, while leaving the choice to the user.

What happens here is that they give the user part of the truth or the part in which he is supposed to make profits without explaining the whole idea, the type of risk and the possibility of profit, and then the user deposits the money and cannot know that he is losing it until after a while.

If Binance explained its model exactly as mikeywith did, would it invest in it?

It has been three years for this topic, thought it would be a good idea to refresh it now that Binance is attempting the same indirect "scam" of cloud mining. I will quote myself here for all the realistic and possible scenarios that you will likely face if you buy cloud mining packages from Binance.

The only case where Cloud Mining companies are scam is when they offer unexpected returns and run away after some months. These companies are scam but companies that offer you certain conditions with responsibility, aren't scammers. These cloud mining contracts look like when banks offer you deposit interest but inflation is going to be far greater than deposit interest.

There is a huge difference between a straight-out scam service and legit services that you are unlikely to profit from in most cases, 99% of these cloud mining services are actually scammers, so I am not surprised that you are biased, in fact, I am perhaps more biased than you are.

With that being said, there are indeed a few legitimate cloud mining contracts, for an example bitdeer aka Bitmain "partners" are legit, even this very service we are discussing is actually legit, but whether you make money from it or not is a whole different story..

Cost per th for 180 = 13.1580$
Estimated profit with both difficulty and price staying flat: 12.6$

Scenario 1: both stay flat > you lose
Scenario 2: difficulty gues up while price goes down  > You lose more
Scenario 3: difficulty stays flat while price goes up > You win (only if prices increases more than 4.25% for the average of the 180 days)

Scenario 4: difficulty goes down while price goes up > you win more

so in 2/4 you could win, although the conditions needed to win are less likely to happen, especially the difficulty part, it just doesn't go down, so it's more like 30% chances of winning at best.

All the above is in respect to fiat, let's run the same thing in respect to BTC.

---

Cost per th for 180 = 0.0004464BTC
Estimated profit with both difficulty and price staying flat: 0.0004274 BTC

Scenario 1: both stay flat > You lose
Scenario 2: difficulty goes up while price goes down  > You lose more
Scenario 3: difficulty stays flat while price goes up > You lose
Scenario 4: difficulty goes down while price goes up > you win (only if difficulty drops more than 4.25% for the average of the 180 days)

1/4 you could win, but only if difficulty drops more than 4.25%, is that impossible? nop, is it very unlikely? indeed?

So you are going to need to be very , very lucky to end up winning anything out of this.

I think Binance could be setting up a trap for the naive folks with its 180 days packages, anyone who buys the package =<180 to the halving will certainly end up losing despite any condition.


Oh ya, not to mention that in the rare event of difficulty dropping and packages start actually yielding profits, Bitmain could just end the deal as that isn't against the agreement you have to sign.

Well, you haven't shown up in the difficulty thread for a while, I hope being wrong most of that isn't the reason  ,

but I believe we all agree that in 3 years difficulty will most certainly go above 43%, the only people who would bet against this are Viabtc mining contracts buyers.

I was going to say something along the lines but then I remembered one of my predictions...so better shut up  
Btw, I am more than 100% off on that difficulty rise prediction, closing on 2.5  

the only way for you to win is if bitcoin difficulty doesn't go up beyond 43% until the expiration date, while that isn't impossible I am willing to bet the horse against it.

Well I do not think all of them are scams, however, that most of them became scams because the contract issuers cannot pay out the terms. The risk is always on the contract buyer. That is where my bias comes from.  

Sufficient Hashrate - There'll be no running short of hashrate since it doesn't count on the facilities

There is a huge difference between a straight-out scam service and legit services that you are unlikely to profit from in most cases, 99% of these cloud mining services are actually scammers, so I am not surprised that you are biased, in fact, I am perhaps more biased than you are.

With that being said, there are indeed a few legitimate cloud mining contracts, for an example bitdeer aka Bitmain "partners" are legit, even this very service we are discussing is actually legit, but whether you make money from it or not is a whole different story.


I own mining gears, I never actually bought a cloud mining contract, although theoretically cloud mining can work well for both buyers and sellers if the terms and prices are right, but just like gambling the casino has the odds on its side and you are more likely to lose than to win at any given time, the way these legit cloud services play the game is by making you bet against the things that have the highest probability of happening like difficulty going up while gear prices go down.

Also, if the miners behind Viabtc were profitable, they certainly would not sell contracts. If this was not a scam, they want the contract holders to be the holders of risk hehehe.

@mikeywith. Were there mining contracts that made some small holders some profit? I am sorry for my bias against the service, however, I have only seen many complaints from users and the contract issuers stop the service.

What are your personal experiences on mining contracts and what were the profitable contracts?

So they collect bitcoin that they trade or invest in money making vehicles then they just give a fraction of the profit to their gullible customers?

Also, if the miners behind Viabtc were profitable, they certainly would not sell contracts. If this was not a scam

they want the contract holders to be the holders of risk hehehe.