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Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion - page 16838. (Read 26711653 times)

legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1000
Regarding the velocity of money, if the increase in the use of Bitcoin leads to a decrease in need for holding dollars, it would increase the dollar’s velocity of circulation and tend to increase the money supply associated with any given amount of base money

More illogical nonsense.  Government is a monopoly on force.  Do you not know what the fucking word monopoly means?  If they want you to use dollars, worst case they just shoot you if you use something else.  Everything revolves around how much resources they're required to spend to stop you.  It requires VERY FEW resources to lock down the internet, exchanges, and mining pools to stop bitcoin, while it takes several orders of magnitude more resources to run a police state in the real world and prevent people from using metals.
sr. member
Activity: 532
Merit: 251

Your claim that central banks have to "invent" a more competitive form of money than other alternatives in the market is shockingly dumb.  Government is a monopoly on force.  The banks took over the government.  They are not here to "compete", they are here to use force to scam you.  There is no "competing" required besides deploying a larger amount of force than you can.  Any random fool on this forum knows that.
You don't understand how banks work. Banks or ie the fed, makes policy that affects the quality of the money that is issued. I already cited this congressional research report that admits exactly what I claim:

https://fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R43339.pdf

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Regarding the velocity of money, if the increase in the use of Bitcoin leads to a decrease in need for holding dollars, it would increase the dollar’s velocity of circulation and tend to increase the money supply associated with any given amount of base money (currency in circulation plus bank reserves held with the Fed).

In this case, for the Fed to maintain the same degree of monetary accommodation, it would need to undertake a compensating tightening of monetary policy. At a minimum, a substantial use of Bitcoins could make the measurement of velocity more uncertain, and judging the appropriate stance of monetary policy uncertain.

This is exactly what Nash points out:



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The idea seems paradoxical, but by speaking of “inflation targeting” these responsible official are effectively CONFESSING…that it is indeed after all possible to control inflation by controlling the supply of money (as if by limiting the amount of individual “prints” that could be made of a work of art being produced as “prints).

If the usd starts to tank because bitcoin becomes relevant the fed can choose to let the dollar drop out of existence or it can create favorable policy so it's value is attractive to citizens.  You are effectively arguing the fed will let the dollars value drop to the point where no one uses it, which is asinine. The only logical option is to compete to survive.  

You simply haven't thought two steps ahead.

Everyone knows I know what I am talking about and that you don't understand the subject at hand.
legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1000
they have to tend towards more valuable currency or they lose their customers:

Your claim that central banks have to "invent" a more competitive form of money than other alternatives in the market is shockingly dumb.  Government is a monopoly on force.  The banks took over the government.  They are not here to "compete", they are here to use force to scam you.  There is no "competing" required besides deploying a larger amount of force than you can.  Any random fool on this forum knows that.
sr. member
Activity: 532
Merit: 251

The purpose of bitcoin is regulatory arbitrage and that's why even though bitcoin is completely centralized it has not failed yet.  Being decentralized is not a requirement of regulatory arbitrage.  For past examples see Liberty Reserve or Silk Road.  Being a centralized regulatory arbitrage network is an untenable position in the long run though.

I might be able to disambiguate ur use of the word centralized and find some re-solution.

Bitcoin as a settlement system provided no one nation controls it takes the control from central banks.  They still control the value but their hands are tied, they have to tend towards more valuable currency or they lose their customers:



This is Nash's argument, he is not keynesian or pro central bank.



Everyone is keynesian, only nash was thinking beyond such a state of thinking:

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There can be Keynesians Neo-Keynesians New-Keynesians Post-Keynesians. Even the Post-Keynesians are still Keynesians~Lecture, Ideal Money

legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1000

Of course it doesn't work.  It's value is supposed to be based on decentralization yet it's completely centralized.  You make this buffoonish statement that it "works" just because there are entities trying to pump and dump it.  A pump and dump does not validate something.  Does "chaincoin" work just because someone pump and dumped it from 5 cents to $6 before it crashes to nothing again? LOL.
You are denying reality and by YOUR OWN DEFINITION wasting your life on this forum.

The purpose of bitcoin is regulatory arbitrage and that's why even though bitcoin is completely centralized it has not failed yet.  Being decentralized is not a requirement of regulatory arbitrage.  For past examples see Liberty Reserve or Silk Road.  Being a centralized regulatory arbitrage network is an untenable position in the long run though, as can be seen by the fate of those other attempts at regulatory arbitrage in the past.  Mining pools and exchanges are a stupidly large attack vector so anyone can shut this centralized nonsense down whenever they want to.
sr. member
Activity: 532
Merit: 251

Of course it doesn't work.  It's value is supposed to be based on decentralization yet it's completely centralized.  You make this buffoonish statement that it "works" just because there are entities trying to pump and dump it.  A pump and dump does not validate something.  Does "chaincoin" work just because someone pump and dumped it from 5 cents to $6 before it crashes to nothing again? LOL.
You are denying reality and by YOUR OWN DEFINITION wasting your life on this forum.
full member
Activity: 137
Merit: 100
For your listening pleasure, Fuck World Trade!
I now have several BTC loaned on Poloniex at between 4 and 4.9999% daily rate.

5% being the max allowed.

Feeling a bit Jewish right now...

Sorry to be a bother.. can you just briefly explain to me how it works loaning BTC on Polio? Is it safe to do so? Is there ever a possibility you lose your coins?
legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1000
You have said bitcoin can't work and yet reality shows it does

Of course it doesn't work.  It's value is supposed to be based on decentralization yet it's completely centralized.  You make this buffoonish statement that it "works" just because there are entities trying to pump and dump it. A pump and dump does not validate something.  

Does "chaincoin" work just because someone pump and dumped it from 5 cents to $6 before it crashes to nothing again?  Everybody knows bitcoin completely failed at what it claimed to be set out to do.  Right now it's sole reason for existing is regulatory arbitrage - avoiding the legal system.  It's not actually required to be decentralized to accomplish that goal.  For example, bitcoin's centralized money laundering operation precursor:  The Liberty Reserve.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_Reserve
sr. member
Activity: 532
Merit: 251

I'm not concerned about a BCC value and in fact I was never here for BCC in the first place. I would only be concerned with BCC value if I follow my greed to get MORE.
You have to SELL the BCC to gain from them
legendary
Activity: 1464
Merit: 1136
Everywhere I read its recommended to withdraw coins from exchanges until the dust settles sometime after Aug.1st. That would create very thin pools everywhere without the option to transfer back and prices could move any direction much easier.  The skeptic in me wonders if it might be better to put my coins on an exchange and perhaps just ignore the fork drama.   BTC seems to have a tendency to go the opposite direction of the masses.  


There are 2 options.

1. The price goes down. This means that the percentage of bitcoin that you can acquire is greater!

2. The price goes up. In this scenario the percentage of bitcoin that you can acquire diminishes, but the amount of fiat you can trade it for is greater.


Assuming you care only for the coin and not fiat. The demand will still be there, and you will be out of its way with u'r dead weight corpse dragging 'fake' trade. And any of those 2 scenarios would help you profit. So?? Smiley

Dead weight corpse dragging fake trade?  Haha, didn't intend to put your knickers in a twist. I don't claim to know what will happen but being one who's gone against the crowd most of my life has worked out well for me so far.  Best of luck to you sir.
legendary
Activity: 2198
Merit: 1000
The price has been holding nicely last few days. I actually sold some yesterday on Coinbase with no issues. I don't think the BTC market will be much affected, or so it seems now.

Some may want to go chase the new alt coin BCC, just as in any other alts. Most exchanges will not be supporting it right away. Not to say as time goes on BCC wont gain ground. Hard to see it being the dominant chain.

Well its almost "fork eve"  Grin
member
Activity: 98
Merit: 10
Everywhere I read its recommended to withdraw coins from exchanges until the dust settles sometime after Aug.1st. That would create very thin pools everywhere without the option to transfer back and prices could move any direction much easier.  The skeptic in me wonders if it might be better to put my coins on an exchange and perhaps just ignore the fork drama.   BTC seems to have a tendency to go the opposite direction of the masses.  

That's actually my exact train of thought. First everyone follows the often spouted ideal to withdraw their coins, then a large % will not redeem their airdropped BCH fast enough and get beat to the punch. Additionally, with all of the liquidity gone off exchanges the markets will get slapped around like a five dollar whore with far fewer coins while people sit there with their funds locked in wallets which need to sync and get transferred to exchanges creating a time buffer for market makers to react as they see fit.
legendary
Activity: 1464
Merit: 1136
Everywhere I read its recommended to withdraw coins from exchanges until the dust settles sometime after Aug.1st. That would create very thin pools everywhere without the option to transfer back and prices could move any direction much easier.
How does this equal bcc gaining value or you gaining value from going against the crowd (or with the crowd)?
I'm not concerned about a BCC value and in fact I was never here for BCC in the first place. I would only be concerned with BCC value if I follow my greed to get MORE. Really, I'd never even heard of BCC before last week.   I'm suggesting to consider ignoring the "possible fork" or simply taking advantage of the likely volatility that would arise from thin pools where transactions are halted.
  
You seem like a smart individual but personally I can't bear to read much of what you write. Seems trollish to me, and where the hell did you come from anyway? No offence intended, just suspicious timing to enter WO with so much to argue about.
 
hero member
Activity: 1876
Merit: 612
Plant 1xTree for each Satoshi earned!
Everywhere I read its recommended to withdraw coins from exchanges until the dust settles sometime after Aug.1st. That would create very thin pools everywhere without the option to transfer back and prices could move any direction much easier.  The skeptic in me wonders if it might be better to put my coins on an exchange and perhaps just ignore the fork drama.   BTC seems to have a tendency to go the opposite direction of the masses.  


There are 2 options.

1. The price goes down. This means that the percentage of bitcoin that you can acquire is greater!

2. The price goes up. In this scenario the percentage of bitcoin that you can acquire diminishes, but the amount of fiat you can trade it for is greater.


Assuming you care only for the coin and not fiat. The demand will still be there, and you will be out of its way with u'r dead weight corpse dragging 'fake' trade. And any of those 2 scenarios would help you profit. So?? Smiley
sr. member
Activity: 502
Merit: 251
I can see sharks playing crazy tricks here with stop losses on exchanges that arent giving BCC. Watch out if you're on stamp, liquidity will be shot.
sr. member
Activity: 532
Merit: 251
Everywhere I read its recommended to withdraw coins from exchanges until the dust settles sometime after Aug.1st. That would create very thin pools everywhere without the option to transfer back and prices could move any direction much easier.
How does this equal bcc gaining value or you gaining value from going against the crowd (or with the crowd)?
legendary
Activity: 3620
Merit: 4813
I cant wait untill this BCC shit show is finally over.
legendary
Activity: 1464
Merit: 1136
Everywhere I read its recommended to withdraw coins from exchanges until the dust settles sometime after Aug.1st. That would create very thin pools everywhere without the option to transfer back and prices could move any direction much easier.  The skeptic in me wonders if it might be better to put my coins on an exchange and perhaps just ignore the fork drama.   BTC seems to have a tendency to go the opposite direction of the masses.  
sr. member
Activity: 532
Merit: 251
To sell or hold your btc crack cash, that is the question...
Szabo's article shows if you are certain then you should go with the currency that will win in the long run asap.  If you are not certain you should sell have your bitcoin equity and use it to buy the equivalent in bcc and hold equal equity in both.
legendary
Activity: 1806
Merit: 1828

the feds just audited coinbase
Did coinbase turn over the records that the IRS demanded in its subpoena?

I don't think they have yet. But the IRS has been compelled to lessen the degree of their request.

http://fortune.com/2017/07/10/bitcoin-irs-coinbase/
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