Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion - page 18968.

bargainbin

full member

Activity: 126

Merit: 100

Quote from: JayJuanGee on April 06, 2016, 01:38:00 PM

Quote from: bargainbin on April 06, 2016, 12:49:42 PM

...

"This, indeed, is despair." --Soren Kierkegaard

O.k. "usurious middlemen." I'm not sure how you arrived at that conclusion.

Every Bitcoin loan ever: Bitcoin Forum > Economy > Marketplace > Lending. Shameless, greedy fucks exploiting their fellow ~~degenerate gamblers~~ bitcoin enthusiasts.
The sort of shit that brought about usury laws in the ~~civilized~~ legacy finance world Sad

Quote

It seems to me that Western Union can be a bit usurious,

Western Union doesn't lend money.

Quote

but even some of these mainstream institutions have been offering some more competitive rates based on some of the low to no fees of bitcoin remittances, surely bitcoin has barely made a dent in the payment remittance market.

Your insanity is making you type annoying nonsense again.
Either that, or you don't understand the difference between lending money and sending money. WTF is wrong with you?

Quote

Furthermore, sometimes, the first innovations may be more usurious than others until more and more competition evolves. If people have bitcoin options, they can compare those to their other options and decide whether or not to use the service. If it is the best rate that they can get, then it could potentially be usurious, no? Is that what you are saying?

I'm saying "Bitcoin, the "be your own bank" currency, created to eliminated the usurious middlemen and escape the spiral of debt slavery ...creates a new bankster class, who go on to rope in new users by offering them credit. But not free credit, like legacy CC, oh no... loans with [no doubt usurious] interest."
Which part do you not get?

P.S. Almost forgot:

JayJuanGee

legendary

Activity: 3920

Merit: 11299

Self-Custody is a right. Say no to"Non-custodial"

Quote from: bargainbin on April 06, 2016, 12:49:42 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on April 06, 2016, 12:19:09 PM

...
Thanks for your smartass contribution, Bargainbin.

Would we label this post as a forum of desperate trolling, when you attempt to describe the beneficial (and likely even the bullish) offerings of one small company as a kind of negative?

I would categorize this proposed BitPagos service as innovative, and we will witness the extent to which some companies are going to make money off of these kinds of services and potentially reaching segments of the currently underserved populations who may not be able to easily get small loans from traditional institutions.

Interesting times ahead. Cool

Well, let's see... Bitcoin, the "be your own bank" currency, created to eliminated the usurious middlemen and escape the spiral of debt slavery ...creates a new bankster class, who go on to rope in new users by offering them credit. But not free credit, like legacy CC, oh no... loans with [no doubt usurious] interest.

[http://s30.postimg.org/3jxn42mj5/laughting_at_you.gif[/img]

"This, indeed, is despair." --Soren Kierkegaard

O.k. "usurious middlemen." I'm not sure how you arrived at that conclusion. It seems to me that Western Union can be a bit usurious, but even some of these mainstream institutions have been offering some more competitive rates based on some of the low to no fees of bitcoin remittances, surely bitcoin has barely made a dent in the payment remittance market. Furthermore, sometimes, the first innovations may be more usurious than others until more and more competition evolves. If people have bitcoin options, they can compare those to their other options and decide whether or not to use the service. If it is the best rate that they can get, then it could potentially be usurious, no? Is that what you are saying?

JayJuanGee

legendary

Activity: 3920

Merit: 11299

Self-Custody is a right. Say no to"Non-custodial"

Quote from: aztecminer on April 06, 2016, 12:35:46 PM

Quote from: adamstgBit on April 06, 2016, 12:29:16 PM

Quote from: aztecminer on April 06, 2016, 12:27:29 PM

i disagree, i believe that is a serious problem. i own a bunch bitcoins, however, i am not going to lie to myself and try to convince myself or anyone else that there is nothing wrong with bitcoin. clearly, to anyone with intelligence, there is a problem with bitcoin taking 75 minutes to clear. online business might find bitcoin useful, however, starbucks will find it annoying.

it takes 10mins to clear if you have the appropriate 5cent fee...

starbucks will still find a 5min wait annoying.. i wouldn't pay .05 more a transaction for my coffee just for hell of it tax... that fee is not set in stone. it is going to continue to increase if the bloatchain continues to grow bandwidth. which is part of the argument of the "cripple coiners" who want to cripple the bloatchain to increase the fees. ... how much is .05 in bitcoin anyways.

If you were able to support your own lame conclusions, you should be able to make simple calculations in order to show that you know what the fuck you are talking about.

It's similar to your failure and refusal to provide sufficient information regarding your coinbase limit problem.. you fail and refuse to engage in basic research and/or knowledge and selectively pick your facts.

By the way, at this time, $.05 is about a tiny bit above .0001 BTC... look at bitcoin's exchange rate.. it is about $421, and therefore, .1BTC would be $42.10, and .01 BTC would be $4.21, and .001 BTC would be $.421 and .0001 BTC would be $.0421 etc etc etc

JayJuanGee

legendary

Activity: 3920

Merit: 11299

Self-Custody is a right. Say no to"Non-custodial"

Quote from: aztecminer on April 06, 2016, 12:27:29 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on April 05, 2016, 04:13:54 PM

Quote from: aztecminer on April 05, 2016, 03:32:52 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on April 05, 2016, 01:58:37 PM

Quote from: aztecminer on April 05, 2016, 10:08:17 AM

Quote from: Ayle56 on April 04, 2016, 05:29:59 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on April 04, 2016, 02:58:14 PM

Quote from: Fatman3001 on April 04, 2016, 02:36:21 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on April 04, 2016, 01:51:07 PM

[blablablablablabla]
Some of the data on that site make little sense to me, however. I don't really understand how they are calculating average blocksize as compared with median blocksize, and why there would be a difference between those two concepts (except through their definition of such).
[blablablablablabla]

https://www.vocabulary.com/articles/chooseyourwords/mean-median-average/

Hahahahahaha

I will admit that I had a brain fart, and for a moment, I was considering mean and median as the same.

So, O.k. I will agree that reviewing information about the median could be helpful to various analysis regarding whether there are block full problems and transaction time problems that are resulting from block fullness, and blockchain.info charts are providing the mean for blocksize, but so far, seem to not be providing the median. At least, I have not found it, so far.

There's lies, damn lies, and then there's statistics. Any statistician will tell you the average is an awful stone age measure, then start talking about mean, median, and standard deviation to decide whether the blocks are truly full or not. However if you can't get your transaction into a block for hours even with a good fee that's all you need to know.

if juans transaction took four days to complete he would still argue with you that everything is fine in #bizarroworld of bitcoin. ...

Yes, that is a big "IF".

My transactions are not taking four days but tend to show up immediately and usually take less than an hour. In early March, while the blocks were supposedly full, I sent out three transactions with varying fees, and the one with the highest fees (I recall it was $.04) took about 75 minutes to complete, and the two with the low to no fees ($.01 and $.001 respectively) took close to 10 hours to complete.

In other words, you are in a fantasy world, Mr. Aztec, and transactions do not appear to be taking anywhere near 4 days to complete, even when blocks are at their fullest... and including some small token fees seems to help speed up transaction confirmations.

yeah waiting over an hour for a payment to go through rocks.

Nothing wrong with that. Bitcoin is in an interim stage of development, and we should not be expecting a 6 billion dollar market cap system to compete on the same level as various centralized credit card and other centralized payment systems (in terms of speed).. in these early and expansive days of bitcoin and its various systems.

And, even so, these days, it seems that bitcoin is allowing a lot of value transfer, control and storage of value in ways that would be extremely expensive and even slow for final confirmation in many instances with traditional payment systems.

A couple of weeks ago, I sent 80 bitcoins (price at the time $416 - therefore $33,280), and it took about 7 minutes to be confirmed, and I was able to use the money in less than 30 minutes. I did not do anything special on that occasion, and the standard fee was .000187 BTC (almost $.08). Personally, I find that transaction to be quite amazing in comparison to any other payment system (and largely decentralized in this circumstance).

My earlier March tests of three transactions (while the blocks were supposedly full) that took 75 minutes, and nearly 10 hours for the other two, were fairly small level transactions (a little more than $1), and those transaction times and fees were acceptable, as well, yet would depend on use case, whether faster confirmation would be preferred or lower fees would be expected...

Bitcoin is not anywhere near broken, and a lot of further innovations are in the soon-to-be implemented pipeline... this year, and maybe more next year. So, you FUCD spreaders seem to becoming less and less persuasive with your lame assertions of "emergency" and or to make supposed "brokenness of bitcoin" cries.

i disagree, i believe that is a serious problem. i own a bunch bitcoins, however, i am not going to lie to myself and try to convince myself or anyone else that there is nothing wrong with bitcoin. clearly, to anyone with intelligence, there is a problem with bitcoin taking 75 minutes to clear. online business might find bitcoin useful, however, starbucks will find it annoying.

Yeah... You seem to be ignoring most, if not all facts in order to repeat your assertion that in your view bitcoin sucks.

As I already asserted, and should be sufficiently clear, bitcoin is not yet at the starbucks stage... it is just not close to being mass or merchant adopted or even sufficiently user friendly for such level of micro transactions at the current time.

Surely, in the next couple of years, it seems very likely that bitcoin is going to have the potential to become incorporated into a lot of the fast transaction confirmation market... we just aren't there, yet, and therefore, describing expectations that are not there seems to be in the fantasyland self-serving territory to talk bitcoin down and to focus on deficiencies without acknowledging a large number of development attributes that are either in the wings or likely to be developed in the coming years.

bargainbin

full member

Activity: 126

Merit: 100

Quote from: JayJuanGee on April 06, 2016, 12:19:09 PM

...
Thanks for your smartass contribution, Bargainbin.

Would we label this post as a forum of desperate trolling, when you attempt to describe the beneficial (and likely even the bullish) offerings of one small company as a kind of negative?

I would categorize this proposed BitPagos service as innovative, and we will witness the extent to which some companies are going to make money off of these kinds of services and potentially reaching segments of the currently underserved populations who may not be able to easily get small loans from traditional institutions.

Interesting times ahead. Cool

Well, let's see... Bitcoin, the "be your own bank" currency, created to eliminated the usurious middlemen and escape the spiral of debt slavery ...creates a new bankster class, who go on to rope in new users by offering them credit. But not free credit, like legacy CC, oh no... loans with [no doubt usurious] interest.

"This, indeed, is despair." --Soren Kierkegaard

dumbfbrankings

full member

Activity: 238

Merit: 100

U guise, this Barclays/Lightning Hub pump is getting a little out of control... donchathink?

I mean, let's pace ourselves, no need to buy all at once. Occasionally, optimism can take the forum of irrational exuberance.

aztecminer

legendary

Activity: 1092

Merit: 1000

Quote from: JayJuanGee on April 06, 2016, 12:19:09 PM

Quote from: bargainbin on April 06, 2016, 09:02:15 AM

Welcome to debt slavery!

Thanks for your smartass contribution, Bargainbin.

Would we label this post as a forum of desperate trolling, when you attempt to describe the beneficial (and likely even the bullish) offerings of one small company as a kind of negative?

I would categorize this proposed BitPagos service as innovative, and we will witness the extent to which some companies are going to make money off of these kinds of services and potentially reaching segments of the currently underserved populations who may not be able to easily get small loans from traditional institutions.

Interesting times ahead. Cool

there is nothing innovating about 'interest to infinity' debt slavery systems.. we already have one that is failing miserably.. this plays into the hands of bitcoin being nothing more than a glorified fiat currency .

aztecminer

legendary

Activity: 1092

Merit: 1000

Quote from: adamstgBit on April 06, 2016, 12:29:16 PM

Quote from: aztecminer on April 06, 2016, 12:27:29 PM

i disagree, i believe that is a serious problem. i own a bunch bitcoins, however, i am not going to lie to myself and try to convince myself or anyone else that there is nothing wrong with bitcoin. clearly, to anyone with intelligence, there is a problem with bitcoin taking 75 minutes to clear. online business might find bitcoin useful, however, starbucks will find it annoying.

it takes 10mins to clear if you have the appropriate 5cent fee...

starbucks will still find a 5min wait annoying.. i wouldn't pay .05 more a transaction for my coffee just for hell of it tax... that fee is not set in stone. it is going to continue to increase if the bloatchain continues to grow bandwidth. which is part of the argument of the "cripple coiners" who want to cripple the bloatchain to increase the fees. ... how much is .05 in bitcoin anyways.

aztecminer

legendary

Activity: 1092

Merit: 1000

Quote from: brg444 on April 05, 2016, 07:38:19 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on April 05, 2016, 04:51:32 PM

Quote from: DeathAngel on April 05, 2016, 12:56:18 PM

$421 boring action man. Somebody wake me up from hibernation if/when we hit $700 or something.

Even in the best-case scenarios, $700 is going to be a while... Maybe 4 months or longer....?

I would think that if we get into the $480s (and possibly into the $470s would be sufficient), then it is very likely that we would be able to experience the $600s within that same price run... and the $700s seem to be quite a longer shot, especially without some correction (profit-taking) period, first.. which could cause several months of delay... but really, I would like to be wrong, and it does seem difficult to deny that bitcoin is due for some kind of upwards price explosion... I just fear that getting into the $800s would likely require movement to a new ATH (and we may not be quite ready for that, yet?).

680 is next stop

its not going to 680.. that is why they are dragging out the scaling issue. we pretend scaling issue went away because it should have... but it still didn't.

adamstgBit

legendary

Activity: 1904

Merit: 1037

Trusted Bitcoiner

Quote from: aztecminer on April 06, 2016, 12:27:29 PM

i disagree, i believe that is a serious problem. i own a bunch bitcoins, however, i am not going to lie to myself and try to convince myself or anyone else that there is nothing wrong with bitcoin. clearly, to anyone with intelligence, there is a problem with bitcoin taking 75 minutes to clear. online business might find bitcoin useful, however, starbucks will find it annoying.

it takes 10mins to clear if you have the appropriate 5cent fee...

aztecminer

legendary

Activity: 1092

Merit: 1000

Quote from: JayJuanGee on April 05, 2016, 04:13:54 PM

Quote from: aztecminer on April 05, 2016, 03:32:52 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on April 05, 2016, 01:58:37 PM

Quote from: aztecminer on April 05, 2016, 10:08:17 AM

Quote from: Ayle56 on April 04, 2016, 05:29:59 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on April 04, 2016, 02:58:14 PM

Quote from: Fatman3001 on April 04, 2016, 02:36:21 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on April 04, 2016, 01:51:07 PM

[blablablablablabla]
Some of the data on that site make little sense to me, however. I don't really understand how they are calculating average blocksize as compared with median blocksize, and why there would be a difference between those two concepts (except through their definition of such).
[blablablablablabla]

https://www.vocabulary.com/articles/chooseyourwords/mean-median-average/

Hahahahahaha

I will admit that I had a brain fart, and for a moment, I was considering mean and median as the same.

So, O.k. I will agree that reviewing information about the median could be helpful to various analysis regarding whether there are block full problems and transaction time problems that are resulting from block fullness, and blockchain.info charts are providing the mean for blocksize, but so far, seem to not be providing the median. At least, I have not found it, so far.

There's lies, damn lies, and then there's statistics. Any statistician will tell you the average is an awful stone age measure, then start talking about mean, median, and standard deviation to decide whether the blocks are truly full or not. However if you can't get your transaction into a block for hours even with a good fee that's all you need to know.

if juans transaction took four days to complete he would still argue with you that everything is fine in #bizarroworld of bitcoin. ...

Yes, that is a big "IF".

My transactions are not taking four days but tend to show up immediately and usually take less than an hour. In early March, while the blocks were supposedly full, I sent out three transactions with varying fees, and the one with the highest fees (I recall it was $.04) took about 75 minutes to complete, and the two with the low to no fees ($.01 and $.001 respectively) took close to 10 hours to complete.

In other words, you are in a fantasy world, Mr. Aztec, and transactions do not appear to be taking anywhere near 4 days to complete, even when blocks are at their fullest... and including some small token fees seems to help speed up transaction confirmations.

yeah waiting over an hour for a payment to go through rocks.

Nothing wrong with that. Bitcoin is in an interim stage of development, and we should not be expecting a 6 billion dollar market cap system to compete on the same level as various centralized credit card and other centralized payment systems (in terms of speed).. in these early and expansive days of bitcoin and its various systems.

And, even so, these days, it seems that bitcoin is allowing a lot of value transfer, control and storage of value in ways that would be extremely expensive and even slow for final confirmation in many instances with traditional payment systems.

A couple of weeks ago, I sent 80 bitcoins (price at the time $416 - therefore $33,280), and it took about 7 minutes to be confirmed, and I was able to use the money in less than 30 minutes. I did not do anything special on that occasion, and the standard fee was .000187 BTC (almost $.08). Personally, I find that transaction to be quite amazing in comparison to any other payment system (and largely decentralized in this circumstance).

My earlier March tests of three transactions (while the blocks were supposedly full) that took 75 minutes, and nearly 10 hours for the other two, were fairly small level transactions (a little more than $1), and those transaction times and fees were acceptable, as well, yet would depend on use case, whether faster confirmation would be preferred or lower fees would be expected...

Bitcoin is not anywhere near broken, and a lot of further innovations are in the soon-to-be implemented pipeline... this year, and maybe more next year. So, you FUCD spreaders seem to becoming less and less persuasive with your lame assertions of "emergency" and or to make supposed "brokenness of bitcoin" cries.

i disagree, i believe that is a serious problem. i own a bunch bitcoins, however, i am not going to lie to myself and try to convince myself or anyone else that there is nothing wrong with bitcoin. clearly, to anyone with intelligence, there is a problem with bitcoin taking 75 minutes to clear. online business might find bitcoin useful, however, starbucks will find it annoying.

JayJuanGee

legendary

Activity: 3920

Merit: 11299

Self-Custody is a right. Say no to"Non-custodial"

Quote from: bargainbin on April 06, 2016, 09:02:15 AM

Welcome to debt slavery!

Thanks for your smartass contribution, Bargainbin.

Would we label this post as a forum of desperate trolling, when you attempt to describe the beneficial (and likely even the bullish) offerings of one small company as a kind of negative?

I would categorize this proposed BitPagos service as innovative, and we will witness the extent to which some companies are going to make money off of these kinds of services and potentially reaching segments of the currently underserved populations who may not be able to easily get small loans from traditional institutions.

Interesting times ahead. Cool

bargainbin

full member

Activity: 126

Merit: 100

Welcome to debt slavery!

Gyrsur

legendary

Activity: 2856

Merit: 1520

Bitcoin Legal Tender Countries: 2 of 206

Quote from: Hunyadi on April 06, 2016, 06:24:45 AM

http://coinjournal.net/lightning-network-should-be-ready-this-summer/

bargainbin

full member

Activity: 126

Merit: 100

Quote from: Denker on April 06, 2016, 08:07:30 AM

Quote from: marcus_of_augustus on April 06, 2016, 01:54:16 AM

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/4dk8j1/financial_times_barclays_partners_with_bitcoin/

not quite Wall St. but close enough ... City is first to show up (officially) for the bitcoin party.

London seems to be way more open to cryptos and Bitcoin.
While NY state stifles ~~progress and innovation~~ infestation [...]

^BitLicense^

LMGTFY

hero member

Activity: 644

Merit: 503

Quote from: Denker on April 06, 2016, 08:07:30 AM

Quote from: marcus_of_augustus on April 06, 2016, 01:54:16 AM

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/4dk8j1/financial_times_barclays_partners_with_bitcoin/

not quite Wall St. but close enough ... City is first to show up (officially) for the bitcoin party.

London seems to be way more open to cryptos and Bitcoin.
While NY state stifles progress and innovation via a stupid license, London is rubbing hands and says: "Come to us!"
That BitLicense seems be self-defeating.

Sort of. So long as it benefits them. Banks in the UK don't appear BTC-friendly at a consumer-level - if you want to stick GBP on an exchange you're looking at a non-UK exchange and SEPA transfers. Even buying BTC on Localbitcoin you'll probably be asked by the seller to use something like "Ebay purchase" as the reference in case the seller's bank takes offence and closes their account for having the audacity to use that magic internet money.

I do think this is good news, however, despite the hypocrisy of UK banks.

Denker

legendary

Activity: 1442

Merit: 1016

Quote from: marcus_of_augustus on April 06, 2016, 01:54:16 AM

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/4dk8j1/financial_times_barclays_partners_with_bitcoin/

not quite Wall St. but close enough ... City is first to show up (officially) for the bitcoin party.

London seems to be way more open to cryptos and Bitcoin.
While NY state stifles progress and innovation via a stupid license, London is rubbing hands and says: "Come to us!"
That BitLicense seems be self-defeating.

Fatman3001

legendary

Activity: 1554

Merit: 1014

Make Bitcoin glow with ENIAC

New candidate for the Bitcoin Anthem: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urglg3WimHA

bargainbin

full member

Activity: 126

Merit: 100

^^
Fiat Child: Where's Daddy? What's he doing?

Fiat Fairy: He is guarding our home, son.

Fiat Fairy: There has been a war, and this land is lost.

Fiat Child: Why can't we fight and win, Mommy?

Fiat Fairy: Because they have weapons and technology [also Assburgers --ed.]. We just have love.

Hunyadi

legendary

Activity: 1281

Merit: 1000

☑ ♟ ☐ ♚

http://coinjournal.net/lightning-network-should-be-ready-this-summer/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uebInqG1pJI

Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion - page 18968. (Read 26609181 times)