I am seriously thinking of starting an online business accepting bitcoins. Never would have bothered if I had to accept credit cards. Why? There's a lot of overhead to accepting credit cards beyond just their 3% cut, there is the PCI compliance, hacking to worry about, all kinds of stuff. If I were to setup a business accepting bitcoins, the only one of these concerns that it still valid is hacking, and I'd probably just put most of the funds in cold storage to minimize that threat.
Right now, bitcoin is probably still too complex for most people: it's the equivalent of where the internet was in 1991 or so. But more services are coming up all the time, this will change in time. This to me, selling things online, is the killer app for bitcoins. I think I could single handedly manage an online business that's based on bitcoins. There's probably no way I could do that if I had to accept credit cards.
Topic: We need to find out some real use of bitcoin (Read 2268 times)
Real use?
- Remittance
- Gambling
- Services in the grey area (for instance a seedbox)
- Freelancing (imagine if Elance, Odesk or Freelancer.com jumped on the wagon)
Good point, I think freelancing is a potential area worth looking
Fiat money get widely adopted because people get paid in form of fiat. 160 million labor, each averagely earn 3000 USD per month, means that 480 billion USD were handed out monthly as salary, this huge amount of income ensure it get widely adopted, and they are typically coming from government spending and large bank loans from corporations
But if the economy structure changes and there are more and more small businesses, their product/service in principle can accept any form of payment, bitcoin might become very practical if the purchase power is stable or constantly rising
Sure, merchants will get more profit by accepting bitcoin, but currently the amount of people who are able to pay bitcoin is still very small, merchants still get more sale with CC
Amazon's operating margin is 1.7%* if they can increase this by even .01% by using BTC they will jump all over it.
Allot of industries operate on very thin margins and will do everything they can for even the slightest of improvements.**
After looking at the data, most industries these days operate at under 10% margin. If we can give them a super easy way of accepting BTC then our market cap will go from 1.4 Billion to 10's or even 100's of billions per year, and each bitcoin may be worth 10's or even 100's of thousands of dollars each. (this is why I am betting on this btw)
* http://www.wikinvest.com/stock/Amazon.com_%28AMZN%29/Data/Operating_Margin
** http://pages.stern.nyu.edu/~adamodar/New_Home_Page/datafile/margin.html
Real use?
- Remittance
- Gambling
- Services in the grey area (for instance a seedbox)
- Freelancing (imagine if Elance, Odesk or Freelancer.com jumped on the wagon)
I run the site www.Coingig.com which is a bitcoin marketplace to buy real everyday products, these are one of the great uses i've done with bitcoin and it's growing fast.
Real use?
- Remittance
- Gambling
- Services in the grey area (for instance a seedbox)
- Freelancing (imagine if Elance, Odesk or Freelancer.com jumped on the wagon)
it's not about finding uses, it's about creating uses.
in history, pubs, shops were not found, they were created
in history, pubs, shops were not found, they were created
This reason alone has absurd potential: It can be sent anywhere, instantly, at near-zero cost
I'm constantly getting raped by bank fees and having to put up with delays of 3-6 days for transfers.
For this alone..BTC has enormous potential. For a global economy there is way too much friction in banking.
You don't need to "find" real uses for Bitcoin. Millions of dollars worth are being transacted every day. Apparently someone is using them. You could argue that speculation isn't the best use of it, but keep in mind that it is still incredibly young, and still very obscure (despite being trumpeted on major news media in this last year). Patience is a dying virtue. We need to breathe some life back into it. Don't worry about Bitcoin losing ways to be used. If that's your concern, then ask yourself what are you doing to strengthen this new economy? Are you hoarding coins in defense of inflation or are you using them as a medium for exchanging value (i.e. purchasing goods and services with them). Be the change you want to see.
Ture, I'm accepting bitcoin payment for my sales. If there are enough people providing products/service around the world, then in principle you can live with bitcoin anywhere
But people must first have the motivation to get the coin, and they must be able to get coin easily, it is this step stop bitcoin from mass adopted
So far, that motivation is mostly coming from speculation. I've found only one practical use: Investors who want to diversify their portfolio and take bitcoin as a risk digital asset. Considering that more and more people are becoming financial and investment aware, there is demand from that direction, this is for sure
But since bitcoin has very strange fundamentals (What you can do with a bitcoin is not as clear as a house/gold/diamond), an investor might totally get shocked by its price development, still lots of uncertainty
People have been participated in central banks game for centuries, what is the motivation for them to switch to another game? That game must have much favorable terms for them in order for them to switch
For miners, the benefit is very clear, they have an extra income source and it is fun, but for rest of the people, why use bitcoin instead of USD is typically a political debate which is out of grasp of majority
...
I have not found a good reason that everyone want to have bitcoin (of course a fast price appreciation is an universal reason that everyone want it, but when price do not appreciate that fast, many of them will leave)
I have not found a good reason that everyone want to have bitcoin (of course a fast price appreciation is an universal reason that everyone want it, but when price do not appreciate that fast, many of them will leave)
Borrowing words better said than I could by Erik Vorhees at the Bitcoin conference:
It is easy to divide and recombine
It cannot be counterfeited
It is highly durable, so long as certain precautions are taken
It can be sent anywhere, instantly, at near-zero cost
If you were going to make a super hero currency, this is one of the traits you would give it
Can’t do that with gold due to physical constraints, or dollars due to legal constraints
It is scarce, with a known supply and a known inflation schedule
And it cannot be manipulated, restricted, or seized by any central party (shares this property with gold). Nobody has special privileges. In this way, it is very democratic, and very egalitarian.
This reason alone has absurd potential: It can be sent anywhere, instantly, at near-zero cost
You don't need to "find" real uses for Bitcoin. Millions of dollars worth are being transacted every day. Apparently someone is using them. You could argue that speculation isn't the best use of it, but keep in mind that it is still incredibly young, and still very obscure (despite being trumpeted on major news media in this last year). Patience is a dying virtue. We need to breathe some life back into it. Don't worry about Bitcoin losing ways to be used. If that's your concern, then ask yourself what are you doing to strengthen this new economy? Are you hoarding coins in defense of inflation or are you using them as a medium for exchanging value (i.e. purchasing goods and services with them). Be the change you want to see.
I mean something that can really push it to spread much more widely. Currently it is only limited to a small fraction of people, it does not help normal people to reach one specific goal that they can not achieve by other means
The most important character for a currency is universal equivalence, and this character typically established on a fact that everyone want it. I have not found a good reason that everyone want to have bitcoin (of course a fast price appreciation is an universal reason that everyone want it, but when price do not appreciate that fast, many of them will leave)
The most important character for a currency is universal equivalence, and this character typically established on a fact that everyone want it. I have not found a good reason that everyone want to have bitcoin (of course a fast price appreciation is an universal reason that everyone want it, but when price do not appreciate that fast, many of them will leave)
Personally, once I took more than an hour to learn about BTC, I realized that it simply couldn't be ignored - and it would appear that I'm far from being alone in that thinking.
True words
After all the hype, if bitcoin can't really provide something more practical and useful, it might just get ignored and stay as a geek's hobby, just like a computer game, played and forgotten
Any other thoughts?
Specific to this point, I don't think the consciousness of Bitcoin decreases, and the analysis of this particular website's statistics contribute to that theory:
If we hadn't seen the second spike, I might be inclined to believe the possibility of Bitcoin being ignored - but those kinds of numbers and mostly growing numbers of Max Online suggest that the sphere of interest is bigger than "a geek's hobby" especially when they are tied together with some of the VC being introduced into the market.
Personally, once I took more than an hour to learn about BTC, I realized that it simply couldn't be ignored - and it would appear that I'm far from being alone in that thinking.
what do you guys think about this post: http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1feujr/for_the_bitcoin_economy_to_grow_anonymity_needs/
The site in my Sig cannot be done with government currency unless people willingly provide access to their bank account information. And even then it would be clunky.
My point is, they will see the benefit if we wait patiently, governments are already setting up their own destruction with hyperinflation, I for instance didn't see much point in studying economics and history until I experienced a financial recession for myself, now I know how to defend against it, it will be the same for a lot of people when it comes to Bitcoin, chances are if we have another Cyprus or Greece people are going to immediately start looking for alternatives.
That's true, if the current monetary system run into a disaster, then bitcoin is ready to rescue, but there is also a possibility that nothing happened (Banks gain 1 billion while give you one million, as long as you are satisfied with one million, you might not care about their gain)
Some real use?
What about freedom and monetary independence? How about having the opportunity to get rid of the bankers and financial mafia?
That's a pretty big, revolutionary and REAL use in my book. I would say its the definitive use.
Then, if you want a fast micropayment solution, well... Use Paypal, Dwolla or the likes.
What about freedom and monetary independence? How about having the opportunity to get rid of the bankers and financial mafia?
That's a pretty big, revolutionary and REAL use in my book. I would say its the definitive use.
Then, if you want a fast micropayment solution, well... Use Paypal, Dwolla or the likes.
Taking away the power and control over our money from banks and governments, and bringing it back to us, the users, who own the damn money in the first place, seems pretty useful to me.
My point is, they will see the benefit if we wait patiently, governments are already setting up their own destruction with hyperinflation, I for instance didn't see much point in studying economics and history until I experienced a financial recession for myself, now I know how to defend against it, it will be the same for a lot of people when it comes to Bitcoin, chances are if we have another Cyprus or Greece people are going to immediately start looking for alternatives.
All you need are people with the balls to accept Bitcoin and people will find uses for it on their own, it will happen eventually, as someone who is setting up selling stuff for Bitcoin entirely I've done the maths and believe me the benefits of Bitcoin far outweigh the bad stuff ( if you can call anonymity and deflation and the like bad ) I would rather get 100 sales in Bitcoin than in paper. The amazing thing is because of how Bitcoin is still maintaining it's value if I make even less than 100 sales I will still be able to expand faster than I ever could in paper and that's because Bitcoin has more purchasing power.
Let's look at current pricing, if I managed to sell say, a game for 0.1 BTC and got 100 sales that would make 10 Bitcoins, selling the Bitcoins on the market even at lows would net me a lot more than paper and if I chose to trade with Bitcoin I have the added advantage of it keeping value after I trade it, at current prices I'd get about £848 going by MTGOX of course. If I sold the same at current paper money prices along with all the crap you have to deal with when it comes to paypal and the like I would only get around £700 and of course there's the problem of tons of regulation regarding the currency as well as the fact that paper money is all being hyper-inflated to nothing so by the time I get any of the money back it would have dropped in value massively. There's of course all the restrictions that are lifted in Bitcoin too, no one tells you what you can do with your money and so on, the only restrictions I can really see out in the open are the fact you need an internet connection and a computer of some sort but that's a small price to pay for having what is pretty much total freedom over your own finances, you can trade with anyone as well regardless of the country they're from.
Trust me, people are interested in Bitcoin, neo-keynesians and the government loyalists out there love to spread bullshit about Bitcoin and I've seen them do it even on these forums, we just have to be patient and wait for people to come to us and be helpful when they need it.
Let's look at current pricing, if I managed to sell say, a game for 0.1 BTC and got 100 sales that would make 10 Bitcoins, selling the Bitcoins on the market even at lows would net me a lot more than paper and if I chose to trade with Bitcoin I have the added advantage of it keeping value after I trade it, at current prices I'd get about £848 going by MTGOX of course. If I sold the same at current paper money prices along with all the crap you have to deal with when it comes to paypal and the like I would only get around £700 and of course there's the problem of tons of regulation regarding the currency as well as the fact that paper money is all being hyper-inflated to nothing so by the time I get any of the money back it would have dropped in value massively. There's of course all the restrictions that are lifted in Bitcoin too, no one tells you what you can do with your money and so on, the only restrictions I can really see out in the open are the fact you need an internet connection and a computer of some sort but that's a small price to pay for having what is pretty much total freedom over your own finances, you can trade with anyone as well regardless of the country they're from.
Trust me, people are interested in Bitcoin, neo-keynesians and the government loyalists out there love to spread bullshit about Bitcoin and I've seen them do it even on these forums, we just have to be patient and wait for people to come to us and be helpful when they need it.
We all know that from a higher level bitcoin excels, but for most people who don't have so much knowledge in economics and computers, they can't see that benefit. And currently some of the country still have deflation, their fiat money even gained in purchase power, only China have high inflation rate now
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