Were Banks and Governments behind this Dump?

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Quote from: marcous on August 27, 2023, 06:06:51 AM

Quote from: posi on August 27, 2023, 04:05:50 AM

Quote from: DeathAngel on August 25, 2023, 08:33:50 AM

I don’t think so to be honest. We always look for justification & a reason why the price goes down but most of the time it’s just organic price movements in a free market. Unless it’s major FUD or a black swan event i don’t think we need to pin a dump on any particular reason. We will go up again soon, no need to panic or over analyse short term price volatility.

I also searched for news that caused a sudden drop in bitcoin price but there was no reasonable answer and I stopped searching after that. You're right, just think simply it's the movement of bitcoin and that has happened a million times over the last 14 years. Why do we always make unrealistic theories about bitcoin's drop? And if we find the cause, what do we do next? In my opinion, instead let's think about what we do when the market goes down, and what we do when the market goes up, don't spend too much time thinking of conspiracy theories.

It's true that there is a lot of speculation out there and we shouldn't be shaken, many think that putting SpaceX under Elon Musk was the reason for the sudden crash in the price of BTC. A reduction in the amount of BTC holdings by SpeceX resulted in this dump happening, but slowly the price is rising again. It's true that not spending a lot of time thinking about various speculations is better, for sure there is still a chance for the BTC price to rise again.

I am told there is much evidence that Elon is not the cause of that drop and no reason has been found. It is simply a market movement or manipulation by whales. But whatever the reason, I think they have created an opportunity for us to collect cheap bitcoins, those who still have money and are looking to buy more bitcoins really this is an opportunity not to be missed.
The price hasn't recovered yet and I don't think it will rise again any time soon but that's not a big deal either. Since it will surely rise again in the future, it cannot go down forever without increasing.

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Quote from: DeathAngel on August 25, 2023, 08:33:50 AM

I don’t think so to be honest. We always look for justification & a reason why the price goes down but most of the time it’s just organic price movements in a free market. Unless it’s major FUD or a black swan event i don’t think we need to pin a dump on any particular reason. We will go up again soon, no need to panic or over analyse short term price volatility.

Risky but favorable if the timing is right, and I agree most of the time traders are looking for a reason and from there they will
place their insight and position their investment.

Looking for the reason and for possible to blame is something that's normal in terms of analysing,
it's been used to anticipate what might be the possible turn around and how it will benefit your
investment once you already decide where to place your targets.

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Quote from: Faisal2202 on August 22, 2023, 12:26:25 PM

Quote from: Sayeds56 on August 22, 2023, 05:56:14 AM

Your skillful articulation of an insightful analysis, focused on distinguishing the legitimacy of the recent cryptocurrencies dip, is truly commendable. Whether this decline is real or deliberately manipulated by international players, I perceive this downturn as a promising opportunity to acquire Bitcoin and Ethereum at more favorable rates.

Thanks for your kind words dear, really appreciate it but to be honest I am still learning and trying to be good enough to analyze the market using TA and FA and I hope you remembered your advice of one YT channel to me I am also trying to learn from that but by sharing my ideas here on the forum many other people have shared there valuable insights which already correcting me and some are agreed with me. Well, thanks again.

I do agree that getting better overtime is the key, we should only focus on getting better overtime and that will make it better for everyone. I think it is important to notice the differences and if you could do that then you are going to be fine.

Both analyses (technical and fundamental) are not something people master at a single day, but not a lot of people keep on working on it daily neither so you are doing something good, as long as you keep on working on it and try to get better everyday that is all we can hope for. There is no perfection in this market, there is only constant growth and in order to grow that means you need to spend time on it everyday, and since it looks like you are doing that it means that you are going to be doing a lot better.

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Quote from: posi on August 27, 2023, 04:05:50 AM

Quote from: DeathAngel on August 25, 2023, 08:33:50 AM

I don’t think so to be honest. We always look for justification & a reason why the price goes down but most of the time it’s just organic price movements in a free market. Unless it’s major FUD or a black swan event i don’t think we need to pin a dump on any particular reason. We will go up again soon, no need to panic or over analyse short term price volatility.

I also searched for news that caused a sudden drop in bitcoin price but there was no reasonable answer and I stopped searching after that. You're right, just think simply it's the movement of bitcoin and that has happened a million times over the last 14 years. Why do we always make unrealistic theories about bitcoin's drop? And if we find the cause, what do we do next? In my opinion, instead let's think about what we do when the market goes down, and what we do when the market goes up, don't spend too much time thinking of conspiracy theories.

It's true that there is a lot of speculation out there and we shouldn't be shaken, many think that putting SpaceX under Elon Musk was the reason for the sudden crash in the price of BTC. A reduction in the amount of BTC holdings by SpeceX resulted in this dump happening, but slowly the price is rising again. It's true that not spending a lot of time thinking about various speculations is better, for sure there is still a chance for the BTC price to rise again.

posi

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Quote from: DeathAngel on August 25, 2023, 08:33:50 AM

I don’t think so to be honest. We always look for justification & a reason why the price goes down but most of the time it’s just organic price movements in a free market. Unless it’s major FUD or a black swan event i don’t think we need to pin a dump on any particular reason. We will go up again soon, no need to panic or over analyse short term price volatility.

I also searched for news that caused a sudden drop in bitcoin price but there was no reasonable answer and I stopped searching after that. You're right, just think simply it's the movement of bitcoin and that has happened a million times over the last 14 years. Why do we always make unrealistic theories about bitcoin's drop? And if we find the cause, what do we do next? In my opinion, instead let's think about what we do when the market goes down, and what we do when the market goes up, don't spend too much time thinking of conspiracy theories.

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Quote from: Faisal2202 on August 25, 2023, 01:41:40 AM

I am a small investor but I am not greedy but just like I said Elon is after money like anyone else in the world because its the necessity. And I am not criticizing at least that was not my intention that's why I also included in the first sentence that market is open for anyone so either they sell or buy or hold they have no restriction on making it public.

Because everyone has the freedom to access the market and enter the market in their own way, be it to buy, sell or hold after buying. So there's nothing to look at or argue about with that because everyone is capable and has a way to earn money in any market, it must be considered as a proper thing and doesn't violate anything and Elon Musk himself often uses his own strategy in finding money is also not worth saying bad because he did all of it based on the ability he has at this time. So what you're saying, I think, is clear enough.

Quote

Not every money maker is greedy and not every greedy person is money maker too. And Elon made moves which to some people are greedy and to some are not. Because greedy is a characteristic that based and labelled by different minds with different ideas. Means its distinct property not everyone must have the same thoughts about greedy.

The understanding of greed according to the thoughts of each person is not a reference that must be seen because some people only judge other people as greedy when they are unable to do so in the market or in any economic sector. So it won't be specific enough because it's only born by the minds of weak people, so I agree with the alignment you said that greed shouldn't be seen from the amount of money someone like Elon Musk has earned or through the amount of property someone like Elon Musk. Because what Elon Musk has now is thanks to the pure efforts he made in the past so that he was able to achieve extraordinary developments in his life.

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Quote from: DeathAngel on August 25, 2023, 08:33:50 AM

I don’t think so to be honest. We always look for justification & a reason why the price goes down but most of the time it’s just organic price movements in a free market. Unless it’s major FUD or a black swan event i don’t think we need to pin a dump on any particular reason. We will go up again soon, no need to panic or over analyse short term price volatility.

I was just laughing when I read the OP, everyone is just justifying what comes to their head, what happened is far from all of what was written except one. All others have been happening from days immemorial, how come they suddenly plummeted the market so much? There have been enough controversies around this and I know more theorists will come to display their conspiracy theories. What I know that really happened was the selling of $373 million worth of BTC by Elon Musk's Space X, others are merely secondary.

The amount might be small for people to doubt it in relation to such an impact, but what people don't know is that it's not about the amount of the money but the company/person behind the money. Elon Musk and anything linked to him has an influence on the crypto space, so I am not surprised about the fall after the removal of such an amount.

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Quote from: DeathAngel on August 25, 2023, 08:33:50 AM

I don’t think so to be honest. We always look for justification & a reason why the price goes down but most of the time it’s just organic price movements in a free market. Unless it’s major FUD or a black swan event i don’t think we need to pin a dump on any particular reason. We will go up again soon, no need to panic or over analyse short term price volatility.

Some pin point something or someones issue if there's a dump happening but the real case there on why such thing happened is due to how people react when they hear some bad or good news on crypto space. If many will just relax about certain manipulation happened maybe we cannot see bitcoin price dump so bad, but rather it remain stable and can easily recover once bitcoin negative news will fade on people's mind.

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I don’t think so to be honest. We always look for justification & a reason why the price goes down but most of the time it’s just organic price movements in a free market. Unless it’s major FUD or a black swan event i don’t think we need to pin a dump on any particular reason. We will go up again soon, no need to panic or over analyse short term price volatility.

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Quote from: Faisal2202 on August 25, 2023, 01:41:40 AM

Quote from: Texac on August 22, 2023, 10:21:20 AM

I'm digressing a bit with what you're saying, but I want to ask you 1 thing. are you greedy for money, and are you after money? are you entering this market not for profit but to support the bitcoin revolution without any profit? if you are also money hungry then don't call any investor greedy. don't just blame or criticize Elon or anyone because once they enter the market, they are investors just like us. Whether they sell or buy bitcoin is no different than us so don't try to criticize anyone when the market goes down.

I am a small investor but I am not greedy but just like I said Elon is after money like anyone else in the world because its the necessity. And I am not criticizing at least that was not my intention that's why I also included in the first sentence that market is open for anyone so either they sell or buy or hold they have no restriction on making it public.

Not every money maker is greedy and not every greedy person is money maker too. And Elon made moves which to some people are greedy and to some are not. Because greedy is a characteristic that based and labelled by different minds with different ideas. Means its distinct property not everyone must have the same thoughts about greedy.

I also disagree when you say that you are not greedy. We all need money and are greedy, even the fact that we take risks to invest in bitcoin shows that we are greedy. Greed is not bad as long as you just want to make money and benefit yourself and not harm anyone. There's nothing wrong with making money with your wits and thoughts, not by stealing from others. I am also a greedy person, because I also want to have a lot of money to have a happy life like rich people, and I do not want to lie about this.

The market is a battleground, I also don't want to blame anyone for dumping because that's the law of finance and we need to accept that. If we lose, it means that we are too weak and the person to blame is ourselves. What guarantees that if we were Elon, we wouldn't do the same thing as him?

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Quote from: Texac on August 22, 2023, 10:21:20 AM

I'm digressing a bit with what you're saying, but I want to ask you 1 thing. are you greedy for money, and are you after money? are you entering this market not for profit but to support the bitcoin revolution without any profit? if you are also money hungry then don't call any investor greedy. don't just blame or criticize Elon or anyone because once they enter the market, they are investors just like us. Whether they sell or buy bitcoin is no different than us so don't try to criticize anyone when the market goes down.

I am a small investor but I am not greedy but just like I said Elon is after money like anyone else in the world because its the necessity. And I am not criticizing at least that was not my intention that's why I also included in the first sentence that market is open for anyone so either they sell or buy or hold they have no restriction on making it public.

Not every money maker is greedy and not every greedy person is money maker too. And Elon made moves which to some people are greedy and to some are not. Because greedy is a characteristic that based and labelled by different minds with different ideas. Means its distinct property not everyone must have the same thoughts about greedy.

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Quote from: Faisal2202 on August 24, 2023, 03:01:36 PM

Quote from: slapper on August 22, 2023, 06:33:15 AM

My tale? The market reacts to several things. Be cautious when assigning blame or making assumptions. Please step back and discover more reliable sources

Thanks for the heads up but I already confessed in my topic that I am not providing any sources but if anyone has some to back my thoughts or conspiracies then I am more than ok with them. And TBH, after reading these 5 causes I did not stooped my myself for making this topic even though there are not some stats and figure other than news. But if we dig more then we will definitely find some. But, I also agreed that these might not be the only factors included in this downtrend instead in my few previous replies i confessed that the market volume dropped more than the price extracted by SpaceX only (they withdrawal around $350+ Mil dollars but the market cap loses more. Means it might be a domino effect to triggers things out or market was flat too.

Well assuming the government could be involved might be something but possibly not in the sense of them having to make any actual or direct involvement in its price dump by making withdrawals or pumping more coins into the market to over run supply! By that I mean, seized coins and all. Of course the US government is always those to look out for on this but, I think where the government can step in on this would be in the FUD they would promote and even little reactions towards the negative is a win for them.

What I do believe is the Elon syndrome that tends to follow his fans and weak hands. People tend to listen to these people and never get to do there own research because, his ways got him where he is right now, at the top of Forbes list but, that doesn’t mean you take in on all his decisions as some could have ulterior motives which you aren’t in on.

That SpaceX had to floored the market with $350m+ worth of bitcoin doesn’t mean that’s the same amount you expect to get out. People, weak hands are going to go with this energy. Still, those who have a better understanding would hodl and buy through all this period.

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Quote from: slapper on August 22, 2023, 06:33:15 AM

My tale? The market reacts to several things. Be cautious when assigning blame or making assumptions. Please step back and discover more reliable sources

Thanks for the heads up but I already confessed in my topic that I am not providing any sources but if anyone has some to back my thoughts or conspiracies then I am more than ok with them. And TBH, after reading these 5 causes I did not stooped my myself for making this topic even though there are not some stats and figure other than news. But if we dig more then we will definitely find some. But, I also agreed that these might not be the only factors included in this downtrend instead in my few previous replies i confessed that the market volume dropped more than the price extracted by SpaceX only (they withdrawal around $350+ Mil dollars but the market cap loses more. Means it might be a domino effect to triggers things out or market was flat too.

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Quote from: Cookdata on August 24, 2023, 09:32:04 AM

In the current state of the bitcoin market, we have more market makers and traders than holders which is why, anytime there is FUD, the price use to falls because they will certainly reduce their long position to mitigate an uncertain loss especially when they are not sure about what is causing the FUD. The government can manipulate bitcoin price though, where there is power, expect the worst from such because they can do and undo. Who knows if they decide to pressure institutional institutions to sell their bitcoin.

Yes, this is the point, current market situation is totally different from the past. Fud about btc force big traders to stop buying more and also sell some btc before panic sell start. Wheather SpaceX sell btc or not but bad news create lot of fund and their is possibility that they made this news by himself to liquidate big investors opened long position.

Market position is somehow now control by big whales and they are not allowing btc prices to go higher like we seen in previous. whenever people become confidence, they suddenly dump the market by selling news to create fud.

besides SpaceX US government also have Seized Silk Road Bitcoin and they announced that they will sell all in four benches four years. This fud will also not allow traders to trade freely. You can check full detail how btc dumped 9% after this news and yes i am also smelling that they are creating panic amongst institution to sell btc and they are somehow succeeded in their mission.

https://www.coindesk.com/business/2023/03/31/us-government-sold-216m-of-seized-silk-road-bitcoin-this-month/

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I am quite late to respond to this query, but in my opinion, they are behind everything, whether it is a small dump or a big one. They always tried to manipulate almost everything. The financial sector is in their pockets, and how to transfer money and use it for their own purposes is what they have been doing from the start. The factors you have mentioned here are not enough, but they still make sense, and I am starting to think that these 5 factors are enough to start the domino effect you talked about.

And we should really not blame Elon and his associates for all the dips, as I have personally seen many people blaming him for the dips because they need someone to blame. I think this provides relief to the hearts of the people. I do not know the reason, but it must have to do something to provide relief.

Overall, I partially think banks and governments are behind this dump, as all the factors you mentioned are far from each other and also not so closely related to each other; they are so independent of each other, and I do not think it's an easy task to make such FUDs by manipulating things, but still, you have got a point.

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Quote from: justdimin on August 24, 2023, 04:32:15 AM

The other type is making it so complicated because they think it is not going to be simple to make money from it. To make it simple, if you buy 10 thousand dollars worth of bitcoin right now, when bitcoin becomes 1 million dollars, that would be 400 thousand dollars. When would it be 1 million dollars? Maybe in 2 years, maybe in 5, maybe in 10, but it will get there and there is nothing else that can turn your 10k into 400k at the same time as bitcoin can.

I hope newbies can understand that this scenario you showed here doesn't also happen overnight with bitcoin. They could have that notion in their mind and begin to get fussed about it when it doesn't just fly to give 100% profit. Every business needs patience to mature before it will be time to enjoy the investment benefit. For bitcoin, an investor really has to be patient to wait at least for a circle of halving to have such ROI depending on your value of investment.

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Quote from: Adbitco on August 21, 2023, 04:36:55 PM

I think the one that is mostly affecting the market could be that of SpaceX, the rate at which the dump come really shake the market and it was so sudden and shocking, which is now reacting negatively to the mind of investors and traders (fear). This may possibly last for the entire month of August and if time not taken we may also witness same effects in the month of September, most of the investors are being too skeptical about the market because of uncertainty at this point they are playing a smart game by securing their investment either trying to sell or setting a stop lose for them to secure their asset from going down more imo.

You have got a legit point here mate. But I wish this downfall will not continue till next month but I do agree that many investors are still thinking that there is more time to buy as they think market will lose more value by market I mean BTC. As I have a friend who is new in crypto still think that market will come down.

I can not think of any other factor other than the one you mentioned. That people are making assumption on the same sentiments that market and manipulators wants them to make. But I hope market will regain its value again and soon.

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Quote from: yhiaali3 on August 21, 2023, 05:00:44 AM

First, I don't expect SpaceX to have sold its Bitcoin holdings, or perhaps they did, but earlier, because it doesn't make sense to sell at a loss.

Secondly, I do not rule out the theory that governments, especially the United States government, are behind everything that happened. Governments have a long history of manipulation in secret, out of sight and without leaving behind any clear evidence.

Governments have manipulation but they do not have results, in the sense that they plan something and get something different, for example every time they manipulate the market to break Bitcoin, but Bitcoin comes out stronger every time and investor confidence increases, you can look at what is happening now as everyone considers this decline a new opportunity to buy.

Space X has been proactive in selling their BTC before the Media, the last one they did, they sold before making the announcement in their first quarter of 2023 and the announcement did a lot of damage, so people don't want to sit and let that happen again, everything surrounding them is now more of speculation, nobody knows and Elon has not made any positive words or green light if they still hold or not just like the way they did back then before acquiring Twitter(X) for liquidity.

In the current state of the bitcoin market, we have more market makers and traders than holders which is why, anytime there is FUD, the price use to falls because they will certainly reduce their long position to mitigate an uncertain loss especially when they are not sure about what is causing the FUD. The government can manipulate bitcoin price though, where there is power, expect the worst from such because they can do and undo. Who knows if they decide to pressure institutional institutions to sell their bitcoin.

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Quote from: Wend on August 21, 2023, 05:02:32 AM

Quote from: Afnan_faizah on August 20, 2023, 07:39:46 PM

I don't want to believe in any conspiracy, I think the volatility is still okay. based on my experience, bitcoin is always like this, very unpredictable and at the end it will amaze us. I think we don't need to worry about bitcoin whether it price will fall again or not. I prefer like to believe that btc will gain more and more adoption, so the price will tend to rise.

Your thinking is simple but it is true, but people always want to complicate things to prove that they are brilliant. We all know bitcoin is volatile and unpredictable, so why do we always find excuses to blame when bitcoin is volatile? And what problem will that solve for us? Instead, we should take advantage of the opportunity to buy because we all want profits and profits only come when buying low and selling high. I also think that this is just a market movement.

There are two types of people in the crypto world, one type thinks that making money is easy simple as seeing a "tip" from some twitter influencer and buying it and getting rich, which we all know that it is not possible and it would be a miracle if you could ever do that.

The other type is making it so complicated because they think it is not going to be simple to make money from it. To make it simple, if you buy 10 thousand dollars worth of bitcoin right now, when bitcoin becomes 1 million dollars, that would be 400 thousand dollars. When would it be 1 million dollars? Maybe in 2 years, maybe in 5, maybe in 10, but it will get there and there is nothing else that can turn your 10k into 400k at the same time as bitcoin can.

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Quote from: Sayeds56 on August 22, 2023, 05:56:14 AM

Your skillful articulation of an insightful analysis, focused on distinguishing the legitimacy of the recent cryptocurrencies dip, is truly commendable. Whether this decline is real or deliberately manipulated by international players, I perceive this downturn as a promising opportunity to acquire Bitcoin and Ethereum at more favorable rates.

Thanks for your kind words dear, really appreciate it but to be honest I am still learning and trying to be good enough to analyze the market using TA and FA and I hope you remembered your advice of one YT channel to me I am also trying to learn from that but by sharing my ideas here on the forum many other people have shared there valuable insights which already correcting me and some are agreed with me. Well, thanks again.

Topic: Were Banks and Governments behind this Dump? (Read 570 times)