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Topic: What is best way to maintain your privacy sending payment with Electrum wallet? (Read 362 times)

legendary
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Electrum is a SPV wallet and you have to connect to Electrum server to broadcast your transaction.
Even if you set up your own node it will still connect to Electrum server?

To be detailed, Electrum can't connect directly to Bitcoin node. You need to also run Electrum server (which obtain it's data from your node) and configure Electrum (the wallet) to only connect to your Electrum server.

I think OP's concern is related to  anonymity rather than privacy.  
The distinction?

In short,
1. Privacy is about hiding your action
2. Anonymity is about hiding your identity.
legendary
Activity: 1008
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If you plan on setting up a node and connecting it over TOR network all by yourself OP, I highly advise you to read this[1] guide. You can stop in whatever step you like but I think that it is very well written and it actually guides any user in creating a safe environment regarding their node. By the end of it you will have a great setup and a great feeling of being able to built it all by yourself.

[1]https://kyc3.life/dojo-x86-bitcoin-node-guide/
hero member
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I think OP's concern is related to  anonymity rather than privacy.  
The distinction?


There is a lot of written stuff explaining distinction , just google.

However, in short and as applied  to transactions. Transactions anonymity means everyone can see them but at the same time lacks the ability to identify their senders. On the contrary, privacy would signify that no one could see (and as a result) to trace transactions against the will of their  senders.
legendary
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Electrum's 'Receive' tab automatically manages your addresses in a way that an address issued by an unexpired invoice wont be issued in another invoice.
Something I noticed on threads elsewhere is the fixation on receiving but less so on sending when it comes to privacy/anonymity by members in general.
That's because your UTXO (coins) are the ones being tracked, not addresses in general.
It's not actually "from to address" but a UTXO spent to create another UTXO(s) that's why you can't see any mention of "do not reuse address to send from".

You cannot prevent a previously used address to receive to be shown as an input of a send transaction.
Because the UTXO that the receiving transaction is the one that you're spending, the address is just a wallet-representation of the script of that UTXO.

For the "fixation", receiving to different address is a precaution so each UTXO that you've received aren't automatically linked to a single identity (you).
Preserving privacy when sending is more complicated which requires manual coin control (e.g.: freezing dust attack coins, only using multiple coins that are okay to link, etc.)
When sending, as I mentioned, you do not want to link your UTXO together in one transaction by using only one per separate transaction.
Electrum's default behavior is to maximize privacy when selecting UTXO, but it's not perfect since it's automatic.
sr. member
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Electrum is a SPV wallet and you have to connect to Electrum server to broadcast your transaction.
Even if you set up your own node it will still connect to Electrum server?

In order to connect Electrum to your own node you will also need to run your own Electrum server. You can follow some online guides to show you how to install a server and connect to your node. If you follow the tutorials correctly then Electrum will only receive and send information through your node instead of using random public servers.
member
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Electrum is a SPV wallet and you have to connect to Electrum server to broadcast your transaction.
Even if you set up your own node it will still connect to Electrum server?

You do not necessary need to use Tails while using Electrum. If you enable the proxy, Electrum will not synchronize if you are using Internet service provider network because it will only work with Tor even on mobile Electrum.
Once tor option is enabled on Electrum it will go thru tor directly without any other 3rd party tool? The green circle turned blue and it said  'synchronizing' and finally showing my balance again at the end of it all.

  • Electrum's 'Receive' tab automatically manages your addresses in a way that an address issued by an unexpired invoice wont be issued in another invoice.
Something I noticed on threads elsewhere is the fixation on receiving but less so on sending when it comes to privacy/anonymity by members in general. [/list]

I think OP's concern is related to  anonymity rather than privacy.  
The distinction?
legendary
Activity: 2380
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I looked under Electrum's preferences tab but didn't see proxy option, which tab to enable proxy?
If you are on the desktop version, click on the circle located at bottom right corner of the window. In the new window, go to "Proxy" tab.
If you are on the mobile version, tap on the circle located at top right corner of the screen. Go to "Network" and after that tap on "Proxy settings".
hero member
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Aside from all the mentioned above about privacy, its also worth mentioning that running your own bitcoin node also be able to help the bitcoin network become more secured and more decentralized. You can also make profit of it when you set it as Lightning node and charges routing fees as payments that go will through your channels.

But take note it needs resources (finance) to create one.
member
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If you enable the proxy, Electrum will not synchronize if you are using Internet service provider network because it will only work with Tor even on mobile Electrum.
I looked under Electrum's preferences tab but didn't see proxy option, which tab to enable proxy?
hero member
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The best way is by connecting to your own node, no doubt. The second best, is by using Tails. It comes with Electrum pre-installed and does not allow you to sync without going through the Tor network. However, note that by doing that, all of your addresses can be linked from the Electrum server that you use to request information.
Using your own node is the only way that I know. But if you can not use your own node is when you can look for anonymity with those light client wallets.

You do not necessary need to use Tails while using Electrum. If you enable the proxy, Electrum will not synchronize if you are using Internet service provider network because it will only work with Tor even on mobile Electrum.
legendary
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The best way is by connecting to your own node, no doubt. The second best, is by using Tails. It comes with Electrum pre-installed and does not allow you to sync without going through the Tor network. However, note that by doing that, all of your addresses can be linked from the Electrum server that you use to request information.

You must not connect to a third party server when using electrum, and you must not use a full node wallet for better privacy, you can use your Electrum wallet and connect to your own Electrum server, without exposing your ip addresses and BTC addresses to any third party server.
The only way to not expose IP and Bitcoin addresses to a third party is by running a full node, so I presume you've mistyped.
hero member
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I think OP's concern is related to  anonymity rather than privacy.  It would be privacy relevant if OP could have the ability to choose who can really  see his payment but  due to bitcoin design it is practically impossible  task.

As to improving anonymity (i.e. decreasing the traceability   of payment) there are plenty of ways (including those already  described in this thread) to do this, but some times, at appropriate and adequate obstinacy of investigators, all of them may fail.

Good reading on this matter - "How a 27-year-old busted the myth of Bitcoin’s anonymity".
legendary
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The article is talking about the possible "upload" bandwidth because a full node may also send its blockchain to its peers that are in IBD.
Which also means more data are required, especially if your node is active 😳

Although, I was referring to what I quoted. It was a typo from me. I meant 20 gigabyte monthly of download, and not 200 gigabyte.

Quote
Download usage is around 20 gigabytes a month, plus around an additional 340 gigabytes the first time you start your node.
legendary
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When the full blockchain download was still around 340 gigabytes, the monthly download usage specified in the article was 200 gigabyte or more monthly.
The article is talking about the possible "upload" bandwidth because a full node may also send its blockchain to its peers that are in IBD.

What is best way to maintain your privacy sending btc payment with Electrum wallet?
As suggested by the majority, using your own server and connecting to Tor is the best solution.
That requires a full node so if you ever consider using the full node's wallet as is, just use Bitcoin Core for simplicity of the setup.

If setting-up a server or full node isn't an option, you could select a server that "claimed" that they do not keep logs (like Blockstream's server)
But since it's only their words, it involves trust, trust that they wouldn't map your IP to your Bitcoin addresses.

Additionally, it's a matter of handling your addresses and UTXOs.
As I suggested in the other thread, use your addresses only once to receive and do not link your UTXOs by using more than one in a single transactions.
Electrum already has a quite good features aimed for privacy (only in terms of address/coins usage):
  • Electrum's coin-selection algorithm already does the above as long as the amount to send requires only one UTXO.
    So when receiving, if possible, prioritize higher amounts than multiple small amounts so that your transactions wont be needing two or more to send large amounts.
    If it requires manual coin-control, it also has an option to freeze or select coin: coin-control instructions (requires good knowledge about privacy).
  • Electrum's 'Receive' tab automatically manages your addresses in a way that an address issued by an unexpired invoice wont be issued in another invoice.
    So, if unsure, use your receive tab to get new unused address and use only one invoice per transaction. Do not set an expiration if you're not sure when the payer will send or the address will be reissued once the invoice has expired.
legendary
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It should be "every month" rather than "everyday".
I am not a node runner, but I think it was weekly that I saw when I went through an article 2 years ago about it. Likely 5 gigabyte or more every week was what that I saw.

I went through this article just now: https://bitcoin.org/en/full-node#minimum-requirements

When the full blockchain download was still around 340 gigabytes, the monthly download usage specified in the article was 200 gigabyte or more monthly.

Quote
Download usage is around 20 gigabytes a month, plus around an additional 340 gigabytes the first time you start your node.

I see. I initially thought you talk about bare-minimum requirement to download all new blocks. Number you mentioned is correct if OP or other reader intent to use Bitcoin Core as full node rather than only as wallet.
legendary
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It should be "every month" rather than "everyday".
I am not a node runner, but I think it was weekly that I saw when I went through an article 2 years ago about it. Likely 5 gigabyte or more every week was what that I saw.

I went through this article just now: https://bitcoin.org/en/full-node#minimum-requirements

When the full blockchain download was still around 340 gigabytes, the monthly download usage specified in the article was 200 gigabyte or more monthly.

Quote
Download usage is around 20 gigabytes a month, plus around an additional 340 gigabytes the first time you start your node.
legendary
Activity: 2856
Merit: 7410
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I don't know why some member mention mixer when OP mainly ask about wallet. But OP and reader should take note that not all mixers are equally good and usually mixed coin can't be deposited into centralized exchange.

Mind you running a bitcoin node plus this personal electrum server requires you to have enough storage space.
It is worth knowing that downloading the full blockchain requires over 500 gigabyte of blockchain download. Also that you will need like 5 to 10 gigabyte (if it is not more now) of data to keep downloading the lastest blocks everyday.

It should be "every month" rather than "everyday".
hero member
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You must run your own node for better privacy, just using Tor alone is not enough if you are going to connect to a third
I agree with you that having your own node can provide much better privacy then just using Tor but the ones who really don't care much if others can see their addresses then those users can benefit by using tor. The ones who really want high levels of privacy should run their own node if they have a separate system and also use tor.
hero member
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Use Tor for the privacy as that's going to be easy and helpful at the same time. It would be difficult for you to run your own personal node but that's also a good option.
You must run your own node for better privacy, just using Tor alone is not enough if you are going to connect to a third party server that can see your BTC addresses.
Electrum is a SPV wallet and you have to connect to Electrum server to broadcast your transaction. You can increase your privacy a little bit by using Tor with Electrum wallet but it is not a best solution.
You must not connect to a third party server when using electrum, and you must not use a full node wallet for better privacy, you can use your Electrum wallet and connect to your own Electrum server, without exposing your ip addresses and BTC addresses to any third party server.
hero member
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What is best way to maintain your privacy sending btc payment with Electrum wallet?
Is there another wallet that will offer more privacy sending btc?
I didn't use myself. but I heard that Wassabi and Samurai Wallets are best for privacy purposes.
Another Option is using Bitcoin Mixers, they work pretty well. but you must choose a reputable mixer for that. I can't name any mixer here because this forum does not allow posting any links of mixers but you can find good mixers list at AltcoinsTalks Forum: https://altcoinstalks.com/
All the Best.

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