Topic: What is it calculating/workng on?! - page 2. (Read 10805 times)
In another thread, it was suggested to have a 10% CPU donation built into the client. How would this 10% actually work to strengthen/secure the Bitcoin network, once generation of all the bitcoins has happened?
And how does that finding zeroes gets used to certify that no double spendings or forged coins are put in circulation?
It makes it hard to create blocks, which prevents someone from rewriting past blocks, "changing history".
See:
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Block
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Block_chain
And how does that finding zeroes gets used to certify that no double spendings or forged coins are put in circulation?
Another way of thinking of it is that it's spending its time buying and checking thousands of lottery tickets per second. The cost of these tickets is the price of the electricity used to process them. If you happen to get a winning ticket, bam you get 50 Bitcoins. But the typical CPU can only check so many at a time compared to these $600 GPUs (which can process millions and/or billions of tickets per second) that statistically, you're unlikely to ever get a winning ticket even if you ran the computer 24/7 for a year.
As others have explained, in terms of "usefulness," all you're really doing is strengthening the Bitcoin network. That's it. No actual problems are being solved, no complex proteins are being mapped, and you're not donating CPU time to find aliens. You're just trying to hit the jackpot.
Using your screensaver connected to a mining pool, you may make a few cents a day, which is better than nothing at least. Slush's pool works by sending you the same sort of work you'd be doing on your own, but it's MUCH MUCH easier to find a solution. Your client doesn't know the difference and thinks it hit the jackpot and sends that info to the pool. Each time your client finds a valid "block" this counts as credit for you in the pool. When someone does happen to find a block that the Bitcoin network accepts (a TRUE "winning ticket"), the 50 Bitcoin prize is split up amongst all who contributed. The splitting up is a bit more complex in that it involves the time you send in your shares versus the time of the winning block, but that's a minor detail.
As others have explained, in terms of "usefulness," all you're really doing is strengthening the Bitcoin network. That's it. No actual problems are being solved, no complex proteins are being mapped, and you're not donating CPU time to find aliens. You're just trying to hit the jackpot.
Using your screensaver connected to a mining pool, you may make a few cents a day, which is better than nothing at least. Slush's pool works by sending you the same sort of work you'd be doing on your own, but it's MUCH MUCH easier to find a solution. Your client doesn't know the difference and thinks it hit the jackpot and sends that info to the pool. Each time your client finds a valid "block" this counts as credit for you in the pool. When someone does happen to find a block that the Bitcoin network accepts (a TRUE "winning ticket"), the 50 Bitcoin prize is split up amongst all who contributed. The splitting up is a bit more complex in that it involves the time you send in your shares versus the time of the winning block, but that's a minor detail.
Quote
I'm not getting an answer to my question! What kind of "...calculational problem..." is being worked on your computer?
Is it crunching numbers in the Hydrostatic Equation to help weather forecasters give better, earlier warnings of severe weather?
Or is it crunching numbers in the Hydrostatic Equation to help The Black Ops perfect Weather Modification as Weapon?
Is it crunching numbers for biologists to find the true cures for cancer and diabetes?
Or is it crunching numbers for Black Ops biologists to perfect the Ultimate Bio Weapon?
Is it crunching data to determine the most efficient and cost effective way to transport food so as to avoid shortages?
Or is it crunching data for Wall Street speculators in The Commodities Market to give them the most efficient ways to regulate and even spike food prices?
Do I have to continue or do you get my drift?
Is it crunching numbers in the Hydrostatic Equation to help weather forecasters give better, earlier warnings of severe weather?
Or is it crunching numbers in the Hydrostatic Equation to help The Black Ops perfect Weather Modification as Weapon?
Is it crunching numbers for biologists to find the true cures for cancer and diabetes?
Or is it crunching numbers for Black Ops biologists to perfect the Ultimate Bio Weapon?
Is it crunching data to determine the most efficient and cost effective way to transport food so as to avoid shortages?
Or is it crunching data for Wall Street speculators in The Commodities Market to give them the most efficient ways to regulate and even spike food prices?
Do I have to continue or do you get my drift?
These are the kinds of things my friend is asking. I keep trying to explain it is working on Bitcoin stuff, not stuff for companies or governments. But, hey, if she doesn't Trust the information being given, if she doesn't believe the explanations, she doesn't Have to download and install the bitcoin app at all! She can still use bitcoins by getting an online account with My Bitcoin. There, paranoia problem solved.
It is not crunching anything externally useful. It is crunching the SHA256 hash algorithm, repeatedly trying strings of bytes until it finds a hash that starts with lots of zeroes, simply to prove that it was busy. It is doing this merely to produce a "proof" that it was busy - which helps the network establish who is the "majority" for the purpose of validating transactions. The system is built relying on the assumption that the majority of users are honest. Knowing the "majority" helps the system reject bogus or fraudulent transactions from modified Bitcoin software. It is not doing anything useful in any external way, like finding aliens or curing cancer.
Thanks. 
I cross posted and linked to this thread. I don't know if that will convince her of exactly what the bitcoin app is supposedly working on when it is set to Generate Bitcoins. I don't have mine set to do that. It totally chews up the system resources, the stupid Windows XP OS does not like it, or something. CPU usage shoots up to 100% and stays there, memory fills up, the hard drive goes crazy from trying to handle swapping, and every single thing crawls to a near halt! Plus, it is apparently far too slow at doing any work for me to Ever actually solve and create a block, and earn bitcoins.
So, I'm running a screensaver and joined a Mining Pool. The screen saver, I've noticed after looking at the logs, usually only makes the CPU shoot up to about 90%, the hard drive doesn't go nuts, and the computer doesn't practically crash, plus it's only working on tiny pieces of the overall problem.
I used to run SETI@Home, I really liked that screensaver, it looked neat, but, then they changed how it works, or something, and I just gave up on it.
I cross posted and linked to this thread. I don't know if that will convince her of exactly what the bitcoin app is supposedly working on when it is set to Generate Bitcoins. I don't have mine set to do that. It totally chews up the system resources, the stupid Windows XP OS does not like it, or something. CPU usage shoots up to 100% and stays there, memory fills up, the hard drive goes crazy from trying to handle swapping, and every single thing crawls to a near halt! Plus, it is apparently far too slow at doing any work for me to Ever actually solve and create a block, and earn bitcoins.So, I'm running a screensaver and joined a Mining Pool. The screen saver, I've noticed after looking at the logs, usually only makes the CPU shoot up to about 90%, the hard drive doesn't go nuts, and the computer doesn't practically crash, plus it's only working on tiny pieces of the overall problem.
I used to run SETI@Home, I really liked that screensaver, it looked neat, but, then they changed how it works, or something, and I just gave up on it.
Don't bother using CPU mining. I am sure you will hear that repeatedly. Once upon a time, CPU mining was actually worthwhile. Then somebody figured out, that for specific technical reasons, that the mining program can be run hundreds of times faster on your GPU (video card), in a way a CPU can't even come remotely close.
Best not even bother using the built-in "generate coins" option. It will, with overwhelming probability, produce nothing. If you have a decent video card from ATI or Nvidia, consider downloading one of the special mining programs built for your card.
By that do you mean the screensaver I downloaded? It displays a bunch of pretty bitcoins all over my screen, and reports what it is doing. It has yet to solve any blocks.
Quote
I'm not getting an answer to my question! What kind of "...calculational problem..." is being worked on your computer?
Is it crunching numbers in the Hydrostatic Equation to help weather forecasters give better, earlier warnings of severe weather?
Or is it crunching numbers in the Hydrostatic Equation to help The Black Ops perfect Weather Modification as Weapon?
Is it crunching numbers for biologists to find the true cures for cancer and diabetes?
Or is it crunching numbers for Black Ops biologists to perfect the Ultimate Bio Weapon?
Is it crunching data to determine the most efficient and cost effective way to transport food so as to avoid shortages?
Or is it crunching data for Wall Street speculators in The Commodities Market to give them the most efficient ways to regulate and even spike food prices?
Do I have to continue or do you get my drift?
Is it crunching numbers in the Hydrostatic Equation to help weather forecasters give better, earlier warnings of severe weather?
Or is it crunching numbers in the Hydrostatic Equation to help The Black Ops perfect Weather Modification as Weapon?
Is it crunching numbers for biologists to find the true cures for cancer and diabetes?
Or is it crunching numbers for Black Ops biologists to perfect the Ultimate Bio Weapon?
Is it crunching data to determine the most efficient and cost effective way to transport food so as to avoid shortages?
Or is it crunching data for Wall Street speculators in The Commodities Market to give them the most efficient ways to regulate and even spike food prices?
Do I have to continue or do you get my drift?
These are the kinds of things my friend is asking. I keep trying to explain it is working on Bitcoin stuff, not stuff for companies or governments. But, hey, if she doesn't Trust the information being given, if she doesn't believe the explanations, she doesn't Have to download and install the bitcoin app at all! She can still use bitcoins by getting an online account with My Bitcoin. There, paranoia problem solved.
Thanks. I cross posted and linked to this thread. I don't know if that will convince her of exactly what the bitcoin app is supposedly working on when it is set to Generate Bitcoins. I don't have mine set to do that. It totally chews up the system resources, the stupid Windows XP OS does not like it, or something. CPU usage shoots up to 100% and stays there, memory fills up, the hard drive goes crazy from trying to handle swapping, and every single thing crawls to a near halt! Plus, it is apparently far too slow at doing any work for me to Ever actually solve and create a block, and earn bitcoins.
So, I'm running a screensaver and joined a Mining Pool. The screen saver, I've noticed after looking at the logs, usually only makes the CPU shoot up to about 90%, the hard drive doesn't go nuts, and the computer doesn't practically crash, plus it's only working on tiny pieces of the overall problem.
I used to run SETI@Home, I really liked that screensaver, it looked neat, but, then they changed how it works, or something, and I just gave up on it.
I cross posted and linked to this thread. I don't know if that will convince her of exactly what the bitcoin app is supposedly working on when it is set to Generate Bitcoins. I don't have mine set to do that. It totally chews up the system resources, the stupid Windows XP OS does not like it, or something. CPU usage shoots up to 100% and stays there, memory fills up, the hard drive goes crazy from trying to handle swapping, and every single thing crawls to a near halt! Plus, it is apparently far too slow at doing any work for me to Ever actually solve and create a block, and earn bitcoins.So, I'm running a screensaver and joined a Mining Pool. The screen saver, I've noticed after looking at the logs, usually only makes the CPU shoot up to about 90%, the hard drive doesn't go nuts, and the computer doesn't practically crash, plus it's only working on tiny pieces of the overall problem.
I used to run SETI@Home, I really liked that screensaver, it looked neat, but, then they changed how it works, or something, and I just gave up on it.
Don't bother using CPU mining. I am sure you will hear that repeatedly. Once upon a time, CPU mining was actually worthwhile. Then somebody figured out, that for specific technical reasons, that the mining program can be run hundreds of times faster on your GPU (video card), in a way a CPU can't even come remotely close.
Best not even bother using the built-in "generate coins" option. It will, with overwhelming probability, produce nothing. If you have a decent video card from ATI or Nvidia, consider downloading one of the special mining programs built for your card.
Thanks. I cross posted and linked to this thread. I don't know if that will convince her of exactly what the bitcoin app is supposedly working on when it is set to Generate Bitcoins. I don't have mine set to do that. It totally chews up the system resources, the stupid Windows XP OS does not like it, or something. CPU usage shoots up to 100% and stays there, memory fills up, the hard drive goes crazy from trying to handle swapping, and every single thing crawls to a near halt! Plus, it is apparently far too slow at doing any work for me to Ever actually solve and create a block, and earn bitcoins.
So, I'm running a screensaver and joined a Mining Pool. The screen saver, I've noticed after looking at the logs, usually only makes the CPU shoot up to about 90%, the hard drive doesn't go nuts, and the computer doesn't practically crash, plus it's only working on tiny pieces of the overall problem.
I used to run SETI@Home, I really liked that screensaver, it looked neat, but, then they changed how it works, or something, and I just gave up on it.
I cross posted and linked to this thread. I don't know if that will convince her of exactly what the bitcoin app is supposedly working on when it is set to Generate Bitcoins. I don't have mine set to do that. It totally chews up the system resources, the stupid Windows XP OS does not like it, or something. CPU usage shoots up to 100% and stays there, memory fills up, the hard drive goes crazy from trying to handle swapping, and every single thing crawls to a near halt! Plus, it is apparently far too slow at doing any work for me to Ever actually solve and create a block, and earn bitcoins.So, I'm running a screensaver and joined a Mining Pool. The screen saver, I've noticed after looking at the logs, usually only makes the CPU shoot up to about 90%, the hard drive doesn't go nuts, and the computer doesn't practically crash, plus it's only working on tiny pieces of the overall problem.
I used to run SETI@Home, I really liked that screensaver, it looked neat, but, then they changed how it works, or something, and I just gave up on it.
It's taking a block of data that contains a transaction that pays you new coins and possibly other recent transactions and hashing that plus an incrementing number repeatedly until the output is below a certain target value.
It sounds pointless and wasteful to some people at first, but this is what allows us to share one unambiguous record of which addresses contain coins without having to trust or rely on a central party. It's pretty much genius.
It sounds pointless and wasteful to some people at first, but this is what allows us to share one unambiguous record of which addresses contain coins without having to trust or rely on a central party. It's pretty much genius.
I've tried and tried to answer a friend of mine, I guess I'm just not grasping this well enough myself to really explain it well enough. Could someone please give a really precise answer as to exactly what the Bitcoin app is calculating or working on? Is there any reason to think blocks of data are being worked on for companies or governments, like SETI@Home?
The forum where I'm discussing Bitcoins is Imaginative Worlds. Here is the thread, so you can see my flailing attempts to explain.
http://imaginativeworlds.com/forum/showthread.php?20007-The-Truth-About-Money-Silver-and-Gold&p=362904&highlight=bitcoin#post362904
If you can come up with a really great answer, please post both here and on IW. If you only post here, I guess I'll cross post and link to the thread.
Thanks.
The forum where I'm discussing Bitcoins is Imaginative Worlds. Here is the thread, so you can see my flailing attempts to explain.
http://imaginativeworlds.com/forum/showthread.php?20007-The-Truth-About-Money-Silver-and-Gold&p=362904&highlight=bitcoin#post362904
If you can come up with a really great answer, please post both here and on IW. If you only post here, I guess I'll cross post and link to the thread.
Thanks.
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