Which clients still allow zero-fee transactions?

empoweoqwj

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Quote from: empoweoqwj on December 26, 2013, 12:13:03 PM

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Quote from: Jcw188 on December 26, 2013, 12:30:35 AM

Is there any way to decrease the fees in qt? Some seem excessive. I have no problem with fees but as btc price climbs it makes it tough to justify the default fees.

I can decrease the fee by clicking "Settings" then "Options". But I'm running 0.8.5. Don't know if this still works under the latest version?

Another reason why fees are important is it keeps people from flooding the network with trivial transaction amounts. I read somewhere that a DOS attack could be attempted by sending huge numbers of tiny transactions. Transaction fees would make this very expensive to try.

Where did you read that?

Don't remember where I originally read about this, but a quick Google search turned up a reddit thread on exactly this topic:

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1jvd7k/just_curious_would_it_be_possible_to_screw/

OK, makes sense. Stops people spamming the blockchain as well.

But really, the whole system needs fees to function, otherwise who is going to pay for the infrastructure that keeps it going.

empoweoqwj

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Quote from: Jcw188 on December 26, 2013, 12:30:35 AM

Is there any way to decrease the fees in qt? Some seem excessive. I have no problem with fees but as btc price climbs it makes it tough to justify the default fees.

I can decrease the fee by clicking "Settings" then "Options". But I'm running 0.8.5. Don't know if this still works under the latest version?

Another reason why fees are important is it keeps people from flooding the network with trivial transaction amounts. I read somewhere that a DOS attack could be attempted by sending huge numbers of tiny transactions. Transaction fees would make this very expensive to try.

Where did you read that?

Jcw188

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Sometimes it's .0005 it all depends on size of the transmission. But I believe .0005 is excessive.

empoweoqwj

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Quote from: Jcw188 on December 26, 2013, 12:30:35 AM

Is there any way to decrease the fees in qt? Some seem excessive. I have no problem with fees but as btc price climbs it makes it tough to justify the default fees.

What is the default fee it qt at the moment?

Jcw188

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Is there any way to decrease the fees in qt? Some seem excessive. I have no problem with fees but as btc price climbs it makes it tough to justify the default fees.

QuestionAuthority

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The original client currently refuses to relay transactions it considers "unacceptable". However, there may be miners that are willing to put these in a block. This group is for people who want to send such transactions, and those who want to put them in blocks. Simply have your node maintain a connection to Lightfoot Hosting's node, which relays indiscriminately. This means that you can broadcast your transaction to it, and it will relay it to any miner who also has a connection to it. If your transaction meets the policies of at least one miner connected, it should eventually get into a block.

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Free_transaction_relay_policy

Transaction priority is calculated as a value-weighted sum of input age, divided by transaction size in bytes: priority = sum(input_value_in_base_units * input_age)/size_in_bytes

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Transaction_fees

t1000

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Quote from: empoweoqwj on December 25, 2013, 09:47:10 PM

Quote from: jonanon on December 25, 2013, 09:39:51 PM

Why do you want to send without fees?

Fees are so tiny and it allows before a better community!!!

At christmas time its called being a scrooge!

There is a spectrum of people with different levels of generosity. I believe good things happen to those who are generous so I tend to spend, tip, etc etc.
My mum works in a bank and she told me there are people who cash in cheques with cents on them.
For some people, a cent is a cent, for others it is noise.

Some of these cent is a cent is a cent people end up being quite wealthy but they don't tend to enjoy they wealth (they enjoy counting it though).

Voodah

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Quote from: Pente on December 25, 2013, 09:49:37 PM

The default behavior on blockchain.info is to not send a fee. This can take up to 3 days to complete. I now always use the custom send feature and add a .0001 BTC tip with almost always immediate confirmation. One time I made a transaction that used over a dozen small inputs with my standard .0001 BTC fee. This took about 3 hours to complete.

My memory may be faulty, but I thought blockchain.info was adding a small fee when I first began to use it. If they revert to adding a fee, you could always use the custom feature to not add a fee. I just hate transactions waiting in limbo for several days. Besides, why be so stingy to not add a few cents for a tip? It will be the expected behavior in 2140. And yes, even though I am almost an old man now, I still expect to be around at that time. http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/12/131219130738.htm

You can go to your account settings in blockchain.info and change the behaviour for fees.

Frugal - A Miners fee will not be included unless absolutely essential. Transactions will be significantly slower to confirm.
Normal - Follow the fee policy suggested by the mainline bitcoin client. Recommended.
Generous - Fees will be set to ensure transactions are high priority (0.001 BTC Base Fee).

I think Normal is 0.0005.

Pente

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The default behavior on blockchain.info is to not send a fee. This can take up to 3 days to complete. I now always use the custom send feature and add a .0001 BTC tip with almost always immediate confirmation. One time I made a transaction that used over a dozen small inputs with my standard .0001 BTC fee. This took about 3 hours to complete.

My memory may be faulty, but I thought blockchain.info was adding a small fee when I first began to use it. If they revert to adding a fee, you could always use the custom feature to not add a fee. I just hate transactions waiting in limbo for several days. Besides, why be so stingy to not add a few cents for a tip? It will be the expected behavior in 2140. And yes, even though I am almost an old man now, I still expect to be around at that time. http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/12/131219130738.htm

empoweoqwj

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Quote from: jonanon on December 25, 2013, 09:39:51 PM

Why do you want to send without fees?

Fees are so tiny and it allows before a better community!!!

At christmas time its called being a scrooge!

jonanon

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Why do you want to send without fees?

Fees are so tiny and it allows before a better community!!!

empoweoqwj

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Quote from: t1000 on December 25, 2013, 12:35:40 PM

A month ago at the height of the boom, when the network was very busy, I did a small experiment on fees to gauge the linearity of its effect on confirmation time.

BTC0 fee: took 2 days to confirm.
BTC0.00000100 (100 satoshi) fee: no difference, took 2 days.
BTC0.0001 fee: confirmed on next block
BTC0.0005 fee: confirmed on next block

My conclusion is that BTC0.0001 fee currently is enough to let your transaction be included in the new block or two. More than BTC0.0001 would almost guarantee it's place in the next block.
Fee amounts less than BTC0.0001 might as well be 0.

Great experiment. Its good that 0 (or effectively 0) fee took two days. I can be longer than that as well sometimes. Goood

t1000

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A month ago at the height of the boom, when the network was very busy, I did a small experiment on fees to gauge the linearity of its effect on confirmation time.

BTC0 fee: took 2 days to confirm.
BTC0.00000100 (100 satoshi) fee: no difference, took 2 days.
BTC0.0001 fee: confirmed on next block
BTC0.0005 fee: confirmed on next block

My conclusion is that BTC0.0001 fee currently is enough to let your transaction be included in the new block or two. More than BTC0.0001 would almost guarantee it's place in the next block.
Fee amounts less than BTC0.0001 might as well be 0.

acegilz

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1ACEGiLZnZoG7KUNkMwAT8tBuJ6jsrwj5Q

i sent 0.00001 and the transactions are confirmed quite fast. with armory

DeepCryptoanalist3

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Quote from: HeliKopterBen on December 25, 2013, 08:18:04 AM

Miners shouldn't accept transactions without at least the standard nominal fee.

Aha )) It is a standard already? Miners are free to require any fee for their block generation work. It is a market. The fee will be somehow related to the power cost of mining.

HeliKopterBen

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Miners shouldn't accept transactions without at least the standard nominal fee.

camolist

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get enough coins in one lump and never pay transaction fees again Cool

tom.hashemi

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Quote from: bennybong on December 25, 2013, 06:54:07 AM

Just use fees for christ sake! Don't be a tight-ass, it's part of the whole ethos man...

+1

LiteCoinGuy

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Quote from: bennybong on December 25, 2013, 06:54:07 AM

Just use fees for christ sake! Don't be a tight-ass, it's part of the whole ethos man...

thats the reason why it has to be built in the programm, because of that kind of people.

hopefully your transaction will be in the nowhere forever Roll Eyes

F-bernanke

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Quote from: bennybong on December 25, 2013, 06:54:07 AM

Just use fees for christ sake! Don't be a tight-ass, it's part of the whole ethos man...

+1

Topic: Which clients still allow zero-fee transactions? (Read 2219 times)