Which wallet is safe for long term Bitcoin storage? - page 2.

Z_MBFM

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Quote from: sokani on November 07, 2023, 03:24:44 PM

Quote from: hypothetical on November 06, 2023, 02:05:44 AM

I've asked many people, big and small, which wallet bitcoins are the safest to store long-term.
Many of them said to keep Bitcoin in Binance Account, Ku Coin Account, Trust Wallet.Now my question is if I keep my bitcoins in these wallets will I be able to use them whenever I want and will it be safe.
Are there other wallets where bitcoins are most secure?
I want your opinion.

I can see that you're new to the crypto space and you might not know the dangers attached in keeping your funds on centralized exchanges. Storing your funds on CEX means you're giving them custody over it and you could lose it if the exchange gets hacked, bankrupted or confiscated by the authorities. So if truly you're here to learn and amass knowledge, then you should read through the responses from forum members and take their advice very seriously. No your keys, not your coins.

He probably doesn't know about the FTX incident New crypto users want to hold their crypto on a centralized exchange to save some fees. For example, when Bitcoin is withdrawn from an exchange, some fee is deducted, and when it is brought back to the exchange for the purpose of selling, some transaction fee is deducted. But these thoughts can put them in a lot of danger

Quote from: Coyster on November 07, 2023, 06:50:10 PM

Quote from: ZAINmalik75 on November 06, 2023, 12:39:19 PM

when you make account on Trust wallet you have to keep a recovery key safe in order to access that account again.

There is no "account" in the Bitcoin network, use wallet instead. Trust wallet is a non-custodial wallet, but it is closed source and with being closed source you have to "trust" everything that the developers tell you about the wallet, keys and seed phrase. Atomic wallet is a good example of a closed source non-custodial wallet, they were hacked a few months ago, and quite a lot of their users lost their money, but even as i type this there is still no info from Atomic wallet about what happened. Thus don't use closed source wallets, even if they are non-custodial and give you a recovery phrase.

Trust wallet is fine but it will more secure if op use another Non-custodial wallet like Electrum or if op want to investment a big capital then he should use hardware wallet those will help him to hold his bitcoin more securely without any problem

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Quote from: Rikafip on November 07, 2023, 12:30:52 PM

Quote from: Lucius on November 07, 2023, 06:50:05 AM

A properly made cold wallet or something like a Passport is still the level of storage that people should be directed to, especially those who want to securely store much larger values than a few hundred $ worth of altcoins.

Vast majority of people store altcoins beside bitcoin on their hardware wallets so many will avoid passport for that reason too, and another issue with it is that its not easily available as some other more mainstream wallets like Ledger and Trezor. Add on that a bit higher price (even though ~$200 shouldn't be too much to store thousands of dollars worth of bitcoin) and in the end not many people actually get it.

It's true, most people are looking for multicurrency wallets because there are few who only have Bitcoin, which means that hardware wallets that offer such options will continue to be more popular, and also more affordable for the average user. Passport, of course, has a higher price, which for us in Europe is above $250, but there are more than enough resellers and the device can be bought for cash in some countries in our area.

I hope that some of them will offer a discount for Black Friday, and considering the increase in the price of BTC, this could be the best opportunity to buy such a device.

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Quote from: ZAINmalik75 on November 06, 2023, 12:39:19 PM

when you make account on Trust wallet you have to keep a recovery key safe in order to access that account again.

There is no "account" in the Bitcoin network, use wallet instead. Trust wallet is a non-custodial wallet, but it is closed source and with being closed source you have to "trust" everything that the developers tell you about the wallet, keys and seed phrase. Atomic wallet is a good example of a closed source non-custodial wallet, they were hacked a few months ago, and quite a lot of their users lost their money, but even as i type this there is still no info from Atomic wallet about what happened. Thus don't use closed source wallets, even if they are non-custodial and give you a recovery phrase.

sokani

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Quote from: hypothetical on November 06, 2023, 02:05:44 AM

I've asked many people, big and small, which wallet bitcoins are the safest to store long-term.
Many of them said to keep Bitcoin in Binance Account, Ku Coin Account, Trust Wallet.Now my question is if I keep my bitcoins in these wallets will I be able to use them whenever I want and will it be safe.
Are there other wallets where bitcoins are most secure?
I want your opinion.

I can see that you're new to the crypto space and you might not know the dangers attached in keeping your funds on centralized exchanges. Storing your funds on CEX means you're giving them custody over it and you could lose it if the exchange gets hacked, bankrupted or confiscated by the authorities. So if truly you're here to learn and amass knowledge, then you should read through the responses from forum members and take their advice very seriously. No your keys, not your coins.

blckhawk

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Quote from: hypothetical on November 06, 2023, 02:05:44 AM

I've asked many people, big and small, which wallet bitcoins are the safest to store long-term.
Many of them said to keep Bitcoin in Binance Account, Ku Coin Account, Trust Wallet.Now my question is if I keep my bitcoins in these wallets will I be able to use them whenever I want and will it be safe.
Are there other wallets where bitcoins are most secure?
I want your opinion.

These stuff that you've listed isn't the best of them all, these are temporary wallets for when you don't have a lot of bitcoin, check out the story of Mt. Gox so you can understand why people in this forum are afraid of storing their bitcoins in non-custodial wallet. As many others have said time and time again, "Not your keys, not your coins." Regarding the best kind of wallet for storing bitcoin, you can never go with cold wallets or any wallets that you can store in an offline storage.

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Quote from: Lucius on November 07, 2023, 06:50:05 AM

That is one of the options, but the secure element is not something to rely too much on - because Ledger HW also has it, and in the end it turns out that the most sensitive data can still be extracted and shared with third parties.

Afaik, Trezor firmware is open source so hopefully community will figure it out if Trezor does anytyhing dodgy in that regard.

Quote from: Lucius on November 07, 2023, 06:50:05 AM

A properly made cold wallet or something like a Passport is still the level of storage that people should be directed to, especially those who want to securely store much larger values than a few hundred $ worth of altcoins.

Vast majority of people store altcoins beside bitcoin on their hardware wallets so many will avoid passport for that reason too, and another issue with it is that its not easily available as some other more mainstream wallets like Ledger and Trezor. Add on that a bit higher price (even though ~$200 shouldn't be too much to store thousands of dollars worth of bitcoin) and in the end not many people actually get it.

Lucius

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Quote from: Rikafip on November 06, 2023, 10:12:27 AM

Quote from: Lucius on November 06, 2023, 06:39:05 AM

I could recommend Trezor to someone with a note to additionally protect their account with a passphrase considering the irreparable vulnerability that allows anyone who has physical access to the device to extract the seed very easily

Or even better, get that new Trezor Safe 3 that has secure element.

That is one of the options, but the secure element is not something to rely too much on - because Ledger HW also has it, and in the end it turns out that the most sensitive data can still be extracted and shared with third parties. A properly made cold wallet or something like a Passport is still the level of storage that people should be directed to, especially those who want to securely store much larger values than a few hundred $ worth of altcoins.

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That platform you have given is the exchange and based on the name their purpose only and not as a wallet, people get too much confident with their money to that platform because they can now easily make a trade with their coins but at the end of the day, it's not your money because you do not have the full authorization with that funds if you want to, again, for now, its convenience to you but if anything can happen in the future that you don't have the control with that platform youll now get in trouble how to get your assets. The most ideal even if you do not have the budget for your cold wallet like a hardware wallet, still there's an available hot wallet like the Electrum, dont exchange a small convenience for your security just a tip.

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There are potential risks awaiting hardware wallet users too, most newbies believe that once you get a hardware wallet the risk is over, there is a possibility of hardware going from centralized to decentralized or even from.decentralized to centralized, there is also risks with the hardware wallet software updates.

When all you have to worry about is your private keys and recovery seeds, with hardware wallet there is more, I don't know if anyone read about the recent fake ledger app on a store where people lost a lot of Bitcoin in a matter of days, I think it's either last month or before, the thing is even hardware wallet users are not completely safe.

The only good practical way of storing Bitcoin that I will always support and prefer is paper wallet, by generating the wallet offline and write down your recovery seed, there is no need to want to update your software or anything, this get rid of such things.

Winterfrost

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Quote from: hypothetical on November 06, 2023, 02:05:44 AM

I've asked many people, big and small, which wallet bitcoins are the safest to store long-term.
Many of them said to keep Bitcoin in Binance Account, Ku Coin Account, Trust Wallet.Now my question is if I keep my bitcoins in these wallets will I be able to use them whenever I want and will it be safe.
Are there other wallets where bitcoins are most secure?
I want your opinion.

Perhaps those person that advised you to store you Bitcoin are day to day traders that is why they have their Bitcoin in a centralized exchange. This is because it is quite expensive to cover the gas fee when they want to send form a trusted non-custodial wallet every time they want to trade. But it is not a good advisable for a person who is an investor and would want to store his investment. Good you ask for opinion here because they only told based on their experiences and that is why the forum is here for clearer understanding of Bitcoin.

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Quote from: hypothetical on November 06, 2023, 02:05:44 AM

Many of them said to keep Bitcoin in Binance Account, Ku Coin Account, Trust Wallet.
<...>

Whoever said that to you either doesn't know what they're talking about or just doesn't want the best for you. You really gotta think this through logically. how can your coins actually be safe long-term if you aint fully in control of the wallet itself? Binance and KuCoin are exchanges, they ain't wallets. So what happens to all your coins if one day they just up and stop working? I mean, didn't you hear about what went down with one of the biggest exchanges last year? It was nuts.

Anyway bottom line is, if you care about keeping your coins truly secure for the long haul, you gotta control the private keys to your wallet. Exchanges can go belly up anytime. Don't take unnecessary risks here. Do your research and get yourself a proper crypto wallet that you control. As for Trust Wallet, I don't personally use it so I can't recommend it. It's probably good enough for smaller amounts. But if you plan to keep your coins long term, I wouldn't use a hot wallet for that.

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Quote from: hypothetical on November 06, 2023, 02:05:44 AM

I've asked many people, big and small, which wallet bitcoins are the safest to store long-term.
Many of them said to keep Bitcoin in Binance Account, Ku Coin Account, Trust Wallet.Now my question is if I keep my bitcoins in these wallets will I be able to use them whenever I want and will it be safe.
Are there other wallets where bitcoins are most secure?
I want your opinion.

Who are those many that have said to you that keeping on exchanges account are a safe method for storing your Bitcoins there for a long time?

It is not safe, their description means that they are an exchange so that's where the activity of exchange happens. It's not a place to store our Bitcoin.

Hardware wallet is a safe for long term but choose what you think is the right one for you and if you have no budget, just stay with Electrum.

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Quote from: hypothetical on November 06, 2023, 02:05:44 AM

Are there other wallets where bitcoins are most secure?
I want your opinion.

The most secure wallet for bitcoin stash is a multisig wallet with at least two co-signers represented by HW from independent makers. In my view, the best available HW you can find are Passport 2 and ColdCard MK4 (or coming ColdCard Q1). I would advocate reading this tutorial which sheds the light on creation of Passport 2 - Sparrow - multisig wallet. It can be easily adopted to any arrangement of cosigners.

BlackHatCoiner

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It is hard for newbies to tell the difference between storing bitcoin in a centralized exchange and storing fiat in a bank account. There is chaotic difference, where do I begin.

- If a centralized exchange gets hacked, they go bankrupt, no funds for you. If a bank is hacked, transactions can be reversed.
- Even in a scenario where the bank goes bankrupt, there is legislation which grants you access to your money through deposit insurances; in the worst, the government intervenes.
- When deposing coins to a centralized exchange, you're agreeing this is practically not yours and that the company can use it however they like; many are caught implementing fractional reserve. (I know, the largest banks can do that too, but there is clearly lack of regulation here)
- Centralized exchanges are more frequently shut down, as they are targeted by hackers etc.
- There is no alternative to banking when it comes to electronic fiat. There is apparent alternative to using a centralized exchange; in fact, the very purpose of bitcoin is that alternative in the first place.

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Quote from: hypothetical on November 06, 2023, 02:05:44 AM

Are there other wallets where bitcoins are most secure?

Worst thing you can do is to store Bitcoinon Binance and other centralized exchanges, this is not actually your bitcoin because you don't own the keys.

I wouldn't even suggest any closed source hot wallet, especially when we already have good open source wallets.
Best choice for most people are hardware wallets, something like Passport is good airgapped option if you use only Bitcoin, and new Trezor 3 Safe is very good overall option.
Open source hot wallets can also be used but only for storing smaller amount of coins.

ZAINmalik75

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Quote from: hypothetical on November 06, 2023, 02:05:44 AM

I've asked many people, big and small, which wallet bitcoins are the safest to store long-term.
Many of them said to keep Bitcoin in Binance Account, Ku Coin Account, Trust Wallet.Now my question is if I keep my bitcoins in these wallets will I be able to use them whenever I want and will it be safe.
Are there other wallets where bitcoins are most secure?
I want your opinion.

There are many types of wallets, once you get to know about them then it will be more easy for you to decide to which wallet to use. One is custodial and non custodial. In custodial you don't have the key or seed phrase to your wallet like when you keep funds in some centralized exchange like Binance, or the Kucoin, you don't have any keep to the wallet where you keep your funds and in Non-custodial you will be asked to backed up your wallet with some seed phrase like when you make account on Trust wallet you have to keep a recovery key safe in order to access that account again.

I would say go for non custodial wallets only, because if you have the key you are the real owner and if you don't then you are not the real owner even if you own the money. Because that money is now under CEX's control.

Then there comes hold and cold wallet, like hot wallets are like Electrum or TW and Cold wallets are know as hardware wallets like a small USB type, which have some way to give input and to show output too, some are touch or buttoned either way you can make direct Transactions from them and they are best way to store money for longer time.

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Quote from: hypothetical on November 06, 2023, 02:05:44 AM

I've asked many people, big and small, which wallet bitcoins are the safest to store long-term.
Many of them said to keep Bitcoin in Binance Account, Ku Coin Account, Trust Wallet.Now my question is if I keep my bitcoins in these wallets will I be able to use them whenever I want and will it be safe.
Are there other wallets where bitcoins are most secure?
I want your opinion.

Lol, All that you mention is either custodial wallet or close source wallet which is not good in long term since there’s a chance that your Bitcoin will be lost once the company behind it went rouge.

Use Electrum and any open source code hardware wallet if you plan to hold your Bitcoin long term without any problem. You can access your Bitcoin whenever you want as long as you have your seed phrase safe. Invest on hardware wallet if you want a worry free holding in long term. It will be a painful lesson if you already hold for many years until your wallet got compromised since you use custodial wallet.

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Quote from: Rikafip on November 06, 2023, 10:12:27 AM

Quote from: hypothetical on November 06, 2023, 02:05:44 AM

I've asked many people, big and small, which wallet bitcoins are the safest to store long-term.
Many of them said to keep Bitcoin in Binance Account, Ku Coin Account, Trust Wallet.

Lol, who are these people? Based on the answer they gave you, I would suggest you not to listen to them or ask them about any crypto related issue as they are obviously ignorant.

Bitcoin enthusiasts who took an interest during the last bull run. They don't know anything about it, except that you can trade and make a profit without knowing the difference between wallet and exchange.

Rikafip

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Quote from: hypothetical on November 06, 2023, 02:05:44 AM

I've asked many people, big and small, which wallet bitcoins are the safest to store long-term.
Many of them said to keep Bitcoin in Binance Account, Ku Coin Account, Trust Wallet.

Lol, who are these people? Based on the answer they gave you, I would suggest you not to listen to them or ask them about any crypto related issue as they are obviously ignorant.

Quote from: Lucius on November 06, 2023, 06:39:05 AM

I could recommend Trezor to someone with a note to additionally protect their account with a passphrase considering the irreparable vulnerability that allows anyone who has physical access to the device to extract the seed very easily

Or even better, get that new Trezor Safe 3 that has secure element.

Lucius

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Quote from: Odohu on November 06, 2023, 02:18:12 AM

For long term hold, hardware wallets are surely the best especially when you will not need to be accessing the wallet every now and then. However, you must put extra care to protect the physical wallet just like you will protect your gold wrist watch or expensive jewelry. Trezor Model T and Ledger Nano X are good cold storage wallets.
~snip~

I could recommend Trezor to someone with a note to additionally protect their account with a passphrase considering the irreparable vulnerability that allows anyone who has physical access to the device to extract the seed very easily, but Ledger has become completely undesirable after its recovery service, unless you think that it is wise to share your backup with third parties and pay $9.99 every month? Of course it's only an option - but the fact that the seed can be extracted from your HW is more than enough warning in itself.

@hypothetical, centralized crypto exchanges are not a place for safe storage, but only a place where you buy/sell Bitcoin, and if you want the best possible protection, I recommend that you consider this HW -> Foundation Passport Official Thread

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