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Topic: Who is more arrogant? BitcoinEXpress or CoinHunter? - page 2. (Read 5335 times)

sr. member
Activity: 252
Merit: 250
Most of the pledged pool will be from exactly that, from a pool operator with an axe to grind with Vinced, that has pledged to help.
You jest, vinced hardly ever talks to anyone and waits weeks before sending responses. It'd take years to build up enough of a conversation to get a decent grudge going.
Don't have any knowledge of why, but they approached me to help out.

"Nearly 1Th/s" you said this pool's capacity was? Only ArsBitcoin fits that description at currently 700 Gh/s. All other pools are either smaller or much larger. Unless it is a private pool...
A public pool that large is mining bitcoins.  If they switch to mining poison namecoins users will rise up and abandon the pool ( no BTC income).  So it is a private pool OR NO SUCH POOL EXISTS.
mrb
legendary
Activity: 1512
Merit: 1028
Most of the pledged pool will be from exactly that, from a pool operator with an axe to grind with Vinced, that has pledged to help.
You jest, vinced hardly ever talks to anyone and waits weeks before sending responses. It'd take years to build up enough of a conversation to get a decent grudge going.
Don't have any knowledge of why, but they approached me to help out.

"Nearly 1Th/s" you said this pool's capacity was? Only ArsBitcoin fits that description at currently 700 Gh/s. All other pools are either smaller or much larger. Unless it is a private pool... Or a larger pool who will commit only a fraction of its capacity... (Cue the "I told you so we shouldn't let the big pools control x% of the network").
hero member
Activity: 980
Merit: 506
BitcoinEXpress' actions are like using actual humans in a crash test of a particular model vehicle as opposed to using crash dummies.

"In the name of science I will destroy that which has value and has a solution on the way (merged mining) in order for the results to benefit bitcoin."
mrb
legendary
Activity: 1512
Merit: 1028
Now the even worse news. NMC has a lame network speed of less than 35 GH/s and the 51% mark is only is 17.51 GH/s.

No. You need to add 35 Gh/s to be at 50% of the total.
legendary
Activity: 1078
Merit: 1005
Most of the pledged pool will be from exactly that, from a pool operator with an axe to grind with Vinced, that has pledged to help.
You jest, vinced hardly ever talks to anyone and waits weeks before sending responses. It'd take years to build up enough of a conversation to get a decent grudge going.
hero member
Activity: 980
Merit: 506
Keep in mind if he has 1 terre hash commited, then thats 1 terre hash less that will be mining bitcoins, so enjoy the lower difficulty for regular bitcoins!
Nope, once he hits block 19,200 he can merge mine. This allows him to earn bitcoins and attack namecoin at the same time.

We don't need nearly that much firepower and in reality, it is pledged. Now the even worse news. NMC has a lame network speed of less than 35 GH/s and the 51% mark is only is 17.51 GH/s.

Most of the pledged pool will be from exactly that, from a pool operator with an axe to grind with Vinced, that has pledged to help.

Even if the pool operator doesn't come through, by myself I could take NMC on and know for a fact I have another 50-60 GH/s of reliable partners. As ArtForz will tell you, this attack is doable at 25%, slow but doable. 51% gives us total control.

Again I am sure ArtForz will verify if I wanted to be a dick, even by myself with 68 GH/s I could have done this silently in real time.

Finally, we are going to run it way past 19200...

~BCX~

Wow the plot thickens. So this is also a plot against vinced as well? This is starting to sound like a kindergarten "my daddy will kick your daddy's ass" fight.
hero member
Activity: 980
Merit: 506
CosbyCoin makes some valid points against BitCoinExpress' motivations, and the more I think about it, it seems that BitCoinExpress is using his personal 68 GHash/S and pledged ~1 THash/S to masturbate with Namecoin in some weird Bond-Villain sex fantasy.

+1,000,000
member
Activity: 106
Merit: 10
CosbyCoin makes some valid points against BitCoinExpress' motivations, and the more I think about it, it seems that BitCoinExpress is using his personal 68 GHash/S and pledged ~1 THash/S to masturbate with Namecoin in some weird Bond-Villain sex fantasy.
legendary
Activity: 1078
Merit: 1005
Keep in mind if he has 1 terre hash commited, then thats 1 terre hash less that will be mining bitcoins, so enjoy the lower difficulty for regular bitcoins!
Nope, once he hits block 19,200 he can merge mine. This allows him to earn bitcoins and attack namecoin at the same time.
legendary
Activity: 2114
Merit: 1031
Gotcha, so I guess I gotta read up on merged mining to see what the heck that is and why it helps. 

But ya, I'm sold (I even voted for BEX in the pole).  This is a horrible time to mess with it.  the only thing that could "save" it is an equal effort of hash power to get to that block faster than whatn BEX plans to attack it, yes? 

So as long as namecoin has some followers, they can succeed, yes? 

Namecoin miners, please unite and fight this bad man!  If you don't start a "save namecoin" forum, then that's on you.  He posted today that you have 10 days, so I'm sure it's possible to get some support, just ask...
hero member
Activity: 980
Merit: 506
My point is that we can't depend on good morals supporting the system, we need to rely on the system.  If it has weaknesses, we need to figure out solutions rather than just complaining about the weaknesses.  

If that takes someone "attacking" to build the next cryptocurrency that protects against it, then unfortunately that's natural selection...

Another way to look at it is that all of the alternate cryptocurrencies are test grounds.  Bitcoin's the only "true" cryptocurrency, for now... until someone builds a better one (that can withstand attacks).  If the attacks protect bitcoin, then I guess bitcoin figured out something that keeps it safe (being first and bigger).

As long as this is the only weakness of a newer cooler cryptocurrency, then we could all "agree" by switching to the better/cooler cryptocurrency.  Otherwise bitcoin will continue to "win."

Once again there is a solution in the immediate future of namecoin. As I asked, how is this attack justified given the merged mining concept is complete but not currently in action because of the block number chosen by the namecoin community?

Funny how he conveniently chooses to attack namecoin right before the solution that has been implemented is to take place huh. Sounds like he isn't here to save us from an outsider who will attack the network but is in it for the control/power/profit part of it plain and simple.


Yep (see previous response).  I agree now that he's a douche, cuz I'm sure he's aware of this merged mining thing.  

By the way, how's that gonna save namecoin?  And if it was gonna save namecoin, why did they pick a block in the future?  Did it need to coinicide with some difficulty change or something from a programing perspective?

1. it needed to be tested on solo miners and a pool.
2. All namecoin miners needed to be aware of the update giving them ample time to get the udpate prior to the release of merged mining.
3. Rushing things allows for mistakes as has been seen on the solidcoin network which Coinhunter has provided quick updates to. We all seen what happened to the quick development and not enough testing prior to launch/update.

These three reasons are ample enough to debunk the claim that developers of namecoin are taking too long and are a "prime network for such an attack".
legendary
Activity: 2114
Merit: 1031
My point is that we can't depend on good morals supporting the system, we need to rely on the system.  If it has weaknesses, we need to figure out solutions rather than just complaining about the weaknesses.  

If that takes someone "attacking" to build the next cryptocurrency that protects against it, then unfortunately that's natural selection...

Another way to look at it is that all of the alternate cryptocurrencies are test grounds.  Bitcoin's the only "true" cryptocurrency, for now... until someone builds a better one (that can withstand attacks).  If the attacks protect bitcoin, then I guess bitcoin figured out something that keeps it safe (being first and bigger).

As long as this is the only weakness of a newer cooler cryptocurrency, then we could all "agree" by switching to the better/cooler cryptocurrency.  Otherwise bitcoin will continue to "win."

Once again there is a solution in the immediate future of namecoin. As I asked, how is this attack justified given the merged mining concept is complete but not currently in action because of the block number chosen by the namecoin community?

Funny how he conveniently chooses to attack namecoin right before the solution that has been implemented is to take place huh. Sounds like he isn't here to save us from an outsider who will attack the network but is in it for the control/power/profit part of it plain and simple.


Yep (see previous response).  I agree now that he's a douche, cuz I'm sure he's aware of this merged mining thing.  

By the way, how's that gonna save namecoin?  And if it was gonna save namecoin, why did they pick a block in the future?  Did it need to coinicide with some difficulty change or something from a programing perspective?
hero member
Activity: 980
Merit: 506


Very sorry, I'm not up on the facts either.  I haven't read up on merged mining yet.  At least nothing that completely explained it to me yet.

Agreed, timing could be crucial to this end and one more exception to my statement.

So do you expect merged mining to bring back namecoins?
[/quote]

It will solve the security problem in terms of the amount of terahashes pointed at it.
hero member
Activity: 980
Merit: 506
My point is that we can't depend on good morals supporting the system, we need to rely on the system.  If it has weaknesses, we need to figure out solutions rather than just complaining about the weaknesses.  

If that takes someone "attacking" to build the next cryptocurrency that protects against it, then unfortunately that's natural selection...

Another way to look at it is that all of the alternate cryptocurrencies are test grounds.  Bitcoin's the only "true" cryptocurrency, for now... until someone builds a better one (that can withstand attacks).  If the attacks protect bitcoin, then I guess bitcoin figured out something that keeps it safe (being first and bigger).

As long as this is the only weakness of a newer cooler cryptocurrency, then we could all "agree" by switching to the better/cooler cryptocurrency.  Otherwise bitcoin will continue to "win."

Once again there is a solution in the immediate future of namecoin. As I asked, how is this attack justified given the merged mining concept is complete but not currently in action because of the block number chosen by the namecoin community?

Funny how he conveniently chooses to attack namecoin right before the solution that has been implemented is to take place huh. Sounds like he isn't here to save us from an outsider who will attack the network but is in it for the control/power/profit part of it plain and simple.
legendary
Activity: 2114
Merit: 1031
To be fair, if it can be done, it should be done, so that we can figure out a way to fix/ protect against it.  Even if he's out there for profit, there should be a way to protect against this....

If not, then I guess we lose... time to go back to playing progressquest instead of bitcoin quest...

Better to have one of our own attack us (and tell us about it), rather than some random and have us all very confused.

The funny thing about his attack is he gets to pick the terms under the attack are being done, which puts him outside of the community effort of this or any other project related to bitcoin. If this was a community based effort in testing the network he would have allowed input from the entire community (mainly namecoin supporter) and then go from there.

EDIT: Just because something can be done doesn't immediately make it right for anyone to do it. Example: His wife is giving birth to their first child. Someone in the hospital staff could say well we want to test a new elixir on the newly born child because it could be the cure for cancer for all of humanity and "it can be done so it should be done". Even if the hospital's motives are for profit there should be a way to protect against this...

Guess it the concept is flawed altogether now huh.

Alright, I agree that just because something can be done, it doesn't necessarily have to be done.  That's why we have laws and such.  But this is an unregulated decentralized process.  And it needs to be tested if it's gonna survive the long run.  Otherwise, some bigger fish is gonna come along and do the same thing, but be even more evil about it.

Therefore, I will revise my statement that in an unregulated world, anything that can be done will be done.  So it's better for us to experience it sooner rather than later so that we can fix it sooner rather than later.... 

Hopefully, that's better?  It's not great, but I believe my intentions are for the greater good (irrespective of whether his are), heh.

The funny thing is that in about 250 block namecoin will be using merged mining. Now if there was no solution to the difficulty or security of the network then yes your comment above is correct. So how do you justify his timing of wanting to attack the network? The guy initially thought that merged mining would occur at block 25,000. So much for his competence on being up and up on the current status of the namecoin network huh.



Very sorry, I'm not up on the facts either.  I haven't read up on merged mining yet.  At least nothing that completely explained it to me yet.

Agreed, timing could be crucial to this end and one more exception to my statement.

So do you expect merged mining to bring back namecoins?
hero member
Activity: 980
Merit: 506
To be fair, if it can be done, it should be done, so that we can figure out a way to fix/ protect against it.  Even if he's out there for profit, there should be a way to protect against this....

If not, then I guess we lose... time to go back to playing progressquest instead of bitcoin quest...

Better to have one of our own attack us (and tell us about it), rather than some random and have us all very confused.

The funny thing about his attack is he gets to pick the terms under the attack are being done, which puts him outside of the community effort of this or any other project related to bitcoin. If this was a community based effort in testing the network he would have allowed input from the entire community (mainly namecoin supporter) and then go from there.

EDIT: Just because something can be done doesn't immediately make it right for anyone to do it. Example: His wife is giving birth to their first child. Someone in the hospital staff could say well we want to test a new elixir on the newly born child because it could be the cure for cancer for all of humanity and "it can be done so it should be done". Even if the hospital's motives are for profit there should be a way to protect against this...

Guess it the concept is flawed altogether now huh.

Alright, I agree that just because something can be done, it doesn't necessarily have to be done.  That's why we have laws and such.  But this is an unregulated decentralized process.  And it needs to be tested if it's gonna survive the long run.  Otherwise, some bigger fish is gonna come along and do the same thing, but be even more evil about it.

Therefore, I will revise my statement that in an unregulated world, anything that can be done will be done.  So it's better for us to experience it sooner rather than later so that we can fix it sooner rather than later.... 

Hopefully, that's better?  It's not great, but I believe my intentions are for the greater good (irrespective of whether his are), heh.

The funny thing is that in about 250 block namecoin will be using merged mining. Now if there was no solution to the difficulty or security of the network then yes your comment above is correct. So how do you justify his timing of wanting to attack the network? The guy initially thought that merged mining would occur at block 25,000. So much for his competence on being up and up on the current status of the namecoin network huh.

legendary
Activity: 2114
Merit: 1031
My point is that we can't depend on good morals supporting the system, we need to rely on the system.  If it has weaknesses, we need to figure out solutions rather than just complaining about the weaknesses.  

If that takes someone "attacking" to build the next cryptocurrency that protects against it, then unfortunately that's natural selection...

Another way to look at it is that all of the alternate cryptocurrencies are test grounds.  Bitcoin's the only "true" cryptocurrency, for now... until someone builds a better one (that can withstand attacks).  If the attacks protect bitcoin, then I guess bitcoin figured out something that keeps it safe (being first and bigger).

As long as this is the only weakness of a newer cooler cryptocurrency, then we could all "agree" by switching to the better/cooler cryptocurrency.  Otherwise bitcoin will continue to "win."
legendary
Activity: 1666
Merit: 1057
Marketing manager - GO MP
I see this as sort of a popularity contest or a test for the statement "In a democracy if 51% decide to kill the other 49% it will happen".

..... the interesting thing is there might even be a reason for people to hate namecoin, being to get rid of it before the merged mining start.... a view of the hardcore fanatics or self-appointed defenders of the status quo.

very interesting dynamics to say it in the words of a SA member:

gold, comedy gold.  Cool
sr. member
Activity: 406
Merit: 257
To be fair, if it can be done, it should be done, so that we can figure out a way to fix/ protect against it.  Even if he's out there for profit, there should be a way to protect against this....

If not, then I guess we lose... time to go back to playing progressquest instead of bitcoin quest...

Better to have one of our own attack us (and tell us about it), rather than some random and have us all very confused.

It's been known about since the start of Bitcoin, there are also test networks for such things. There is only one purpose for attacking "live" chains, and anyone defending them is pretty stupid in my opinion.
"51% Attacker can lower difficulty without driving up nTime due to flaw in retargeting algorithm" has been known since the start of Bitcoin? Got any proof of that?
legendary
Activity: 2114
Merit: 1031
To be fair, if it can be done, it should be done, so that we can figure out a way to fix/ protect against it.  Even if he's out there for profit, there should be a way to protect against this....

If not, then I guess we lose... time to go back to playing progressquest instead of bitcoin quest...

Better to have one of our own attack us (and tell us about it), rather than some random and have us all very confused.

The funny thing about his attack is he gets to pick the terms under the attack are being done, which puts him outside of the community effort of this or any other project related to bitcoin. If this was a community based effort in testing the network he would have allowed input from the entire community (mainly namecoin supporter) and then go from there.

EDIT: Just because something can be done doesn't immediately make it right for anyone to do it. Example: His wife is giving birth to their first child. Someone in the hospital staff could say well we want to test a new elixir on the newly born child because it could be the cure for cancer for all of humanity and "it can be done so it should be done". Even if the hospital's motives are for profit there should be a way to protect against this...

Guess it the concept is flawed altogether now huh.

Alright, I agree that just because something can be done, it doesn't necessarily have to be done.  That's why we have laws and such.  But this is an unregulated decentralized process.  And it needs to be tested if it's gonna survive the long run.  Otherwise, some bigger fish is gonna come along and do the same thing, but be even more evil about it.

Therefore, I will revise my statement that in an unregulated world, anything that can be done will be done.  So it's better for us to experience it sooner rather than later so that we can fix it sooner rather than later.... 

Hopefully, that's better?  It's not great, but I believe my intentions are for the greater good (irrespective of whether his are), heh.
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