Why are transactions much faster now? - page 2.

hugeblack

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Quote from: Carlton Banks on January 26, 2018, 09:09:16 AM

Quote from: reliable on January 26, 2018, 07:37:26 AM

the network fees what block chain use to charge before and now has a drastic change.

The network isn't setting the price of fees, it's users are.

This is either the result of people using badly written fee estimator websites, or bad wallet software estimates, or even just users blindly picking a fee without knowing or caring how low fees are (people are still choosing 200 satoshis/byte and even 1000 satoshis/byte in the last week, when they could've paid from 10-50 various points throughout the week and gotten the same speed of confirmation)

https://jochen-hoenicke.de/queue is the best website to use, the other popular websites are misleading or poorly laid out.

can you explain why this site https://jochen-hoenicke.de/queue is better than https://bitcoinfees.earn.com/ "which 90% of users recommended it"? why 230 satoshis/byte isnot cheapest fee?
also, give us small tips how to us this site https://jochen-hoenicke.de/queue?(i checked it and only find Graphic forms).

General question:
-best way to calculate the fee for segwit transctions?

Samarkand

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Quote from: Carlton Banks on January 26, 2018, 09:09:16 AM

Quote from: reliable on January 26, 2018, 07:37:26 AM

the network fees what block chain use to charge before and now has a drastic change.

The network isn't setting the price of fees, it's users are.

This is either the result of people using badly written fee estimator websites, or bad wallet software estimates, or even just users blindly picking a fee without knowing or caring how low fees are (people are still choosing 200 satoshis/byte and even 1000 satoshis/byte in the last week, when they could've paid from 10-50 various points throughout the week and gotten the same speed of confirmation)

https://jochen-hoenicke.de/queue is the best website to use, the other popular websites are misleading or poorly laid out.

Another reason is that some online services/exchanges are poorly coded as well. E.g. some major
exchanges don´t even batch transactions and use the same fee irrespective of changes
in the mempool size.

It is unbelievable how some businesses that have a trading volume in the billions are getting
away with stuff like this, which perpetuates the fee problem unnecessarily.

If I were running a business like Coinbase I´d use a period of low fees to consolidate
inputs that are otherwise unspendable in an effort to increase the bottom line of my business
as well as the overall health of the Bitcoin network.

Carlton Banks

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Quote from: reliable on January 26, 2018, 07:37:26 AM

the network fees what block chain use to charge before and now has a drastic change.

The network isn't setting the price of fees, it's users are.

This is either the result of people using badly written fee estimator websites, or bad wallet software estimates, or even just users blindly picking a fee without knowing or caring how low fees are (people are still choosing 200 satoshis/byte and even 1000 satoshis/byte in the last week, when they could've paid from 10-50 various points throughout the week and gotten the same speed of confirmation)

https://jochen-hoenicke.de/queue is the best website to use, the other popular websites are misleading or poorly laid out.

reliable

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Quote from: jinksters09 on January 25, 2018, 09:00:36 PM

Lucky for you guys because I didn't experience this yesterday when I sent some of bitcoin into my other wallet to cash them out but until now the transaction has not yet been confirmed, but I set at a low priority with a low transaction fee amount it sucks maybe because of the wallet I have used.

The unconfirmed transaction has being going down which is a good sign and due to this even the network fees what block chain use to charge before and now has a drastic change. May be from next week if it continues this way even with the low fees our transaction should get confirmed in a day or 2 max which will help us to save huge fees while transferring .

DexterRock

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Quote from: Don Pedro Dinero on January 24, 2018, 12:18:32 PM

Today I set a transaction with the lowest fee and I was warned with a notice that with such a fee, the transaction could take days to be confirmed. I confirmed it because I wasn't in a hurry at all. That was about a couple of hours ago and it already has 8 confirmations.

I've checked mempool's unconfirmed transactions and there are about 72.000 whereas that figure hasn't been below 200.000 for quite a while.

Any specific reason for that? Has the price anything to do with it?

When BTC hit the news in December and hit heights of 19000USD many people jumped in trying to get a piece of the pie, created accounts on exchanges etc etc and new users = new wallets = more transactions.
BTC transaction fees went sky high as a result, high fees caused people to reconsider making small transactions , less small transactions means lower fees. BTC price dropped, interest dropped off, number of small transactions decreased = back to normal.

AGD

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Quote from: Anti-Cen on January 25, 2018, 04:40:40 PM

Quote from: Carlton Banks on January 25, 2018, 06:44:11 AM

There's still more than 100 MB of less than 10 satoshi per byte transactions queued in large mempools: https://jochen-hoenicke.de/queue (check the bottom graph)

I get paid in £-Notes and we measure data in megabytes not bytes these days so dress it up what ever way
you like but the fees are high

See https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-transactionfees.html
Says the fees are $12.56 for just storing 256 bytes of data and it's not my fault that 20,000 fulls nodes
repeat the same work because I did not ask for them all to be here and 1000 would do the trick

Sorry, but this makes me laugh. You obv. can't accept the fact that Bitcoin fees are actually pretty low these days.

TheQuin

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Quote from: pebwindkraft on January 26, 2018, 03:26:13 AM

when you follow the entries of Anti-Cen in the forum, you naturally come to the conclusion, that he is trying to throw his fud on bitcoin/Lightning.

It is worth checking out this post https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.28929402 and then reading DannyHamilton's dissection of it two posts below before taking anything Anti-Cen says at face value.

Anyway, in an update to my earlier post above it looks like the difficulty retarget hasn't stopped the mempool clearing out. Currently the 8 and 9 satoshi/byte tx are going through.

pebwindkraft

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Quote from: ranochigo on January 26, 2018, 01:53:58 AM

Quote from: Anti-Cen on January 25, 2018, 04:40:40 PM

See https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-transactionfees.html
Says the fees are $12.56 for just storing 256 bytes of data and it's not my fault that 20,000 fulls nodes
repeat the same work because I did not ask for them all to be here and 1000 would do the trick

If you interpret it that way, yeah it would be true. The problem here is that if you're not running a Bitcoin node, Bitcoin won't be trustless. You're basically relying on someone else to help you verify the transaction and blocks. You would have to run a node too and it wouldn't be fair for people to spam as much transactions as possible to occupy all your storage space.

Unless you somehow come up with a method to ensure decentralisation and redundancy with 1000 nodes, then its impossible to blame it on others running a node.

when you follow the entries of Anti-Cen in the forum, you naturally come to the conclusion, that he is trying to throw his fud on bitcoin/Lightning. He references webpages with 12$ to store 220bytes of data. And also wants to measure Satoshi/Byte in Megabytes. Well, he is free to do so (IMHO a good laugh). He is trying to through his torsioned view at the community. He can do so, it's a free world (somehow)! From the posts one can derive a limited level of comprehension of the underlying logic (well, as every low level people). In his view Lightning shall be used for large amount tx, and the number of hosts shall be reduced to 1000. Which in his logic proofs, that the system cannot work Grin

.
I haven't seen a single constructive proposal. He is probably paid by government to disturb fruitful discussions. Those who got it, understand the fud. @ruletheworld got it... the others discuss at the same level. Kind of hopeless.

ranochigo

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Quote from: Anti-Cen on January 25, 2018, 04:40:40 PM

See https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-transactionfees.html
Says the fees are $12.56 for just storing 256 bytes of data and it's not my fault that 20,000 fulls nodes
repeat the same work because I did not ask for them all to be here and 1000 would do the trick

If you interpret it that way, yeah it would be true. The problem here is that if you're not running a Bitcoin node, Bitcoin won't be trustless. You're basically relying on someone else to help you verify the transaction and blocks. You would have to run a node too and it wouldn't be fair for people to spam as much transactions as possible to occupy all your storage space.

Unless you somehow come up with a method to ensure decentralisation and redundancy with 1000 nodes, then its impossible to blame it on others running a node.

Tbh, I don't know how to interpet your question. The fees does not go to the nodes at all. Your interpretation could be somewhat logical but isn't correct.

digaran

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Quote from: ruletheworld on January 25, 2018, 05:17:44 PM

Quote from: Anti-Cen on January 25, 2018, 04:40:40 PM

Quote from: Carlton Banks on January 25, 2018, 06:44:11 AM

There's still more than 100 MB of less than 10 satoshi per byte transactions queued in large mempools: https://jochen-hoenicke.de/queue (check the bottom graph)

I get paid in £-Notes and we measure data in megabytes not bytes these days so dress it up what ever way
you like but the fees are high

See https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-transactionfees.html
Says the fees are $12.56 for just storing 256 bytes of data and it's not my fault that 20,000 fulls nodes
repeat the same work because I did not ask for them all to be here and 1000 would do the trick

You're wrong on many different levels, so let's analyze what you're saying.

First, according to https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-transactionfees.html, the average fee is already around 12.5 sat/byte, which is significantly lower than in the past. However, that's not the whole story. Take a look at the mempool stats here: https://jochen-hoenicke.de/queue. This will give you a better idea of when your transactions can confirm. If they aren't urgent, you can put them as lower fee transactions hoping the miners will include them soon but not the next block.
Your reading of the fees as "$12.56 for just storing 256 bytes" is completely wrong. See the description above to learn what it means.
I think by 'work' you mean 'proof of work'. This isn't done by the nodes. The nodes simply check for transaction validity, and the honest nodes will only forward correct transactions on to the network, and reject the incorrect ones. This also includes accepting/rejecting blocks mined by miners. The miners are the ones that extend the blockchain, not the nodes.
Changing the node count from 20,000 to 1,000 as you say will not have any effect on the fees. This suggestion also tells me you have no idea how Bitcoin works or what makes it valuable.

You need to do a little more research into how Bitcoin works.

If you had researched Bitcoin you could know what he is trying to say, is that when you add 1 MB data to the blockchain, you are adding 10,000 MB if you have 10,000 full nodes. controlling the majority is controlling the longest chain.

SamsungBitcoin

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Quote from: jinksters09 on January 25, 2018, 09:00:36 PM

Lucky for you guys because I didn't experience this yesterday when I sent some of bitcoin into my other wallet to cash them out but until now the transaction has not yet been confirmed, but I set at a low priority with a low transaction fee amount it sucks maybe because of the wallet I have used.

I guest you are using mycelium mobile wallet, because that is the same scenario in the wallet of my wife she send her fund to our local bitcoin wallet for cashing out because she have things want to buy but the confirmation was too slow i think 2 or 3 days to confirm that is sucks it was first time to experience.

correct: edit your post and put the tx id if someone see the unconfirmed transaction they can easily helps you about that, much better if that services is for free.

ruletheworld

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Quote from: jinksters09 on January 25, 2018, 09:00:36 PM

Lucky for you guys because I didn't experience this yesterday when I sent some of bitcoin into my other wallet to cash them out but until now the transaction has not yet been confirmed, but I set at a low priority with a low transaction fee amount it sucks maybe because of the wallet I have used.

What's the transaction ID? What wallet did you use to send the transaction? If you post these details, perhaps the community can help.

jinksters09

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Lucky for you guys because I didn't experience this yesterday when I sent some of bitcoin into my other wallet to cash them out but until now the transaction has not yet been confirmed, but I set at a low priority with a low transaction fee amount it sucks maybe because of the wallet I have used.

ruletheworld

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Quote from: Anti-Cen on January 25, 2018, 04:40:40 PM

Quote from: Carlton Banks on January 25, 2018, 06:44:11 AM

There's still more than 100 MB of less than 10 satoshi per byte transactions queued in large mempools: https://jochen-hoenicke.de/queue (check the bottom graph)

I get paid in £-Notes and we measure data in megabytes not bytes these days so dress it up what ever way
you like but the fees are high

See https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-transactionfees.html
Says the fees are $12.56 for just storing 256 bytes of data and it's not my fault that 20,000 fulls nodes
repeat the same work because I did not ask for them all to be here and 1000 would do the trick

You're wrong on many different levels, so let's analyze what you're saying.

First, according to https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-transactionfees.html, the average fee is already around 12.5 sat/byte, which is significantly lower than in the past. However, that's not the whole story. Take a look at the mempool stats here: https://jochen-hoenicke.de/queue. This will give you a better idea of when your transactions can confirm. If they aren't urgent, you can put them as lower fee transactions hoping the miners will include them soon but not the next block.
Your reading of the fees as "$12.56 for just storing 256 bytes" is completely wrong. See the description above to learn what it means.
I think by 'work' you mean 'proof of work'. This isn't done by the nodes. The nodes simply check for transaction validity, and the honest nodes will only forward correct transactions on to the network, and reject the incorrect ones. This also includes accepting/rejecting blocks mined by miners. The miners are the ones that extend the blockchain, not the nodes.
Changing the node count from 20,000 to 1,000 as you say will not have any effect on the fees. This suggestion also tells me you have no idea how Bitcoin works or what makes it valuable.

You need to do a little more research into how Bitcoin works.

exstasie

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Quote from: TryNinja on January 24, 2018, 12:49:04 PM

(IIRC) the hashing power increased by ~20% in the last few weeks, lower transaction volume and the mempool is empty again[1].

P.S: That's a good time to move your funds to a Segwit address. Do it!

[1] https://dedi.jochen-hoenicke.de/queue/#24h

Yes, this can't be stressed enough. It's a very good time to merge outputs in preparation for when fees rise again....and they will! The recent congestion definitely taught me to take advantage of these periods of lower network activity. I'm in the process of migrating to Segwit wallets as well.... a little extra fee savings never hurt anybody.

Quote from: Carlton Banks on January 25, 2018, 06:44:11 AM

If anyone's thinking "but low fees are confirming fast, so that's wrong", then try paying less than 10 satoshis per byte. It'll still take many hours, or even longer than that, for your transaction to confirm.

There's still more than 100 MB of less than 10 satoshi per byte transactions queued in large mempools: https://jochen-hoenicke.de/queue (check the bottom graph)

Yep, I sent out lots of low-fee transactions over the past week. All my 12-15 satoshi/byte transactions have confirmed by now, but all the 5-10 satoshi/byte transactions are still unconfirmed after several days. Oh well, no hurry here!

Anti-Cen

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High fees = low BTC price

Quote from: Carlton Banks on January 25, 2018, 06:44:11 AM

There's still more than 100 MB of less than 10 satoshi per byte transactions queued in large mempools: https://jochen-hoenicke.de/queue (check the bottom graph)

I get paid in £-Notes and we measure data in megabytes not bytes these days so dress it up what ever way
you like but the fees are high

See https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-transactionfees.html
Says the fees are $12.56 for just storing 256 bytes of data and it's not my fault that 20,000 fulls nodes
repeat the same work because I did not ask for them all to be here and 1000 would do the trick

Thirdspace

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the minimum network free dropped lower because mempool size is getting smaller
mempool size is smaller because less people make bitcoin transactions
less people create transactions because bitcoin price is dropping
why they dont sell when price drop? more users become HODLer and wait for price to back up Grin

and if you check mempool stats, 90% of unconfirmed txs set fee 20s/B or less
it seems people are fed up with high tx fee and decided to just go with low fee Tongue

and wait for eventual confirmation

Bazinga442

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I believe it's the improvement in technology and the prompt response of consumers of bitcoin

digaran

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Quote from: fhl182 on January 25, 2018, 08:08:10 AM

People just abandon bitcoin and moving to cryptocurrencies. Why do they need a store of value if they can have both store of value and a currency? So, why should one use bitcoin and not litecoin or monero? The reason?

Reason is not because of people abandoning Bitcoin, no body has moved to other coins because they all were pumped after Bitcoin, all the Bitcoin investors are also alt coin investors, selling Bitcoin to buy alt coins is not abandoning Bitcoin.

Quote from: fhl182 on January 25, 2018, 08:08:10 AM

Because public invested in bitcoin brand so much?

Because if you have a decentralized currency and have everybody accepting it, you don't need any other currency, moreover, if you have a payment processor accepting 75-100 different coins, you could use a coin with low fees and fast transactions.

Btw, I think that I was one of the first beggars to use a Segwit address for signature payment. (note, as the rule of a man has got to eat applies here, merit me for I am begging for it).

ranochigo

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Quote from: onnz423 on January 25, 2018, 09:02:25 AM

Segwit adoption is increasing, reducing the number of transactions on the legacy mempool. I have noticed when sending transactions from a legacy address that even low fee transactions are confirmed relatively quickly now, certainly the fees issue are starting to become less of a concern recently.

There's no such thing as a legacy mempool. Based on statistics, the percentage of Segwit transactions in blocks is still about 12%. It's pretty much the same as when the fees were high. The only reason why the fees are low right now is that the number of transactions paying high fees is decreasing, not related to Segwit.

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