Why Bitcoins are so expensive on Ebay? - page 2.

EcuaMobi

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Quote from: freeyourmind on March 23, 2015, 11:41:12 AM

So if there was a product that was shipped with a tracking number as part of a bitcoin purchase on ebay, then it fulfills Paypal's criteria and a chargebacks are no longer possible?

I've read cases that the buyer says he never bought that item (because of account being compromised or whatever) so he sends the received item back (while keeping the bitcoins of course). On some cases PayPal refunds the payment after confirming the package was sent back.
Seriously there's no way to make a charge back impossible. There could be some measures to reduce the risk but there's no bullet proof method.

freeyourmind

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Quote from: funtotry on March 21, 2015, 10:47:13 AM

Quote from: Gyfts on March 21, 2015, 05:41:47 AM

It's often easy to make money selling Bitcoin on Ebay. What sellers do to fight chargebacks is ship a US Penny with a tracking number to the buyer. This will often discourage chargebacks and allow sellers to sell at twice or even three times the rate. People who buy Bitcoin on Ebay are really looking to purchase it with PayPal. Since Ebay and PayPal go together, it's basically the first place buyers will look. Any new buyer will think Ebay is convenient and easy PayPal conversion, so sellers are able to take advantage of this fact.

So baiscally we sell a bitcoin and then ship a penny with a tracking number to prove to paypal we actually shipped something? Paypal doesn't give a rats ass about txids, so this seems like a good solution

So if there was a product that was shipped with a tracking number as part of a bitcoin purchase on ebay, then it fulfills Paypal's criteria and a chargebacks are no longer possible?

MF Doom

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becasue of sacmmers, end of story. and once you get scammed, you wont want to deal with btc anymore. I think its a major problem that everyone is ignoring

funtotry

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Quote from: Gyfts on March 21, 2015, 05:41:47 AM

It's often easy to make money selling Bitcoin on Ebay. What sellers do to fight chargebacks is ship a US Penny with a tracking number to the buyer. This will often discourage chargebacks and allow sellers to sell at twice or even three times the rate. People who buy Bitcoin on Ebay are really looking to purchase it with PayPal. Since Ebay and PayPal go together, it's basically the first place buyers will look. Any new buyer will think Ebay is convenient and easy PayPal conversion, so sellers are able to take advantage of this fact.

So baiscally we sell a bitcoin and then ship a penny with a tracking number to prove to paypal we actually shipped something? Paypal doesn't give a rats ass about txids, so this seems like a good solution

Gyfts

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It's often easy to make money selling Bitcoin on Ebay. What sellers do to fight chargebacks is ship a US Penny with a tracking number to the buyer. This will often discourage chargebacks and allow sellers to sell at twice or even three times the rate. People who buy Bitcoin on Ebay are really looking to purchase it with PayPal. Since Ebay and PayPal go together, it's basically the first place buyers will look. Any new buyer will think Ebay is convenient and easy PayPal conversion, so sellers are able to take advantage of this fact.

funtotry

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Quote from: freeyourmind on March 20, 2015, 08:32:59 PM

Quote from: EcuaMobi on March 20, 2015, 07:00:37 PM

There is in theory but PayPal almost always sides with the buyer no matter how much evidence there is.
It would be quite easy to see the messages where the buyer posts his BTC address and check the blockchain and confirm the coins were sent there. It's just that PayPal doesn't want to do that.

Interesting, so it's just understood as a known glitch by Paypal and they've decided to take a passive stance on it?

Not a "glitch", its just paypal being lazy and paypal favors the buyer much more than the seller. Same thing happens with eBay, its not just cryptocurrencies they are cracking down on, its just sellers.

freeyourmind

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Quote from: EcuaMobi on March 20, 2015, 07:00:37 PM

There is in theory but PayPal almost always sides with the buyer no matter how much evidence there is.
It would be quite easy to see the messages where the buyer posts his BTC address and check the blockchain and confirm the coins were sent there. It's just that PayPal doesn't want to do that.

Interesting, so it's just understood as a known glitch by Paypal and they've decided to take a passive stance on it?

EcuaMobi

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Quote from: freeyourmind on March 20, 2015, 06:49:52 PM

Is there no appeal process or consequence to the buyer for doing this?

There is in theory but PayPal almost always sides with the buyer no matter how much evidence there is.
It would be quite easy to see the messages where the buyer posts his BTC address and check the blockchain and confirm the coins were sent there. It's just that PayPal doesn't want to do that.

freeyourmind

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Quote from: EcuaMobi on March 20, 2015, 03:22:44 PM

Quote from: freeyourmind on March 20, 2015, 02:31:10 PM

Quote from: EcuaMobi on March 09, 2015, 12:46:14 PM

Quote from: thedreamer on March 09, 2015, 11:53:38 AM

I hope I'm putting this in the right area, sorry if not.

I see tons of people selling bitcoins (partials) at 2x-3x normal going rates. Why is that?
Or better yet, why would anyone buy those??

Thanks.

Mainly because PayPal is reversible.

This causes 2 effects:

1) Sellers have to take a risk effects. For example if 25% of buyers scam the sellers then they have to increase the price more than 25%.
So if they sell $1,000 worth of bitcoin for $1,300 and they lose $250 on scams then they still profit.

2) Because of this very few people risk and sell for PayPal. This reduces supply and the price is increased out of speculation.
People who want to buy have fewer options and have to pay more for it.

On your first point, can you elaborate on what scams would cause a seller to pay out bitcoin and not receive payment?

I was also very curious about the bitcoin price on ebay, and similar to the gold/silver price, I think another factor is that the purchase can be made on credit. That usually can't be done in normal channels. For me, local silver/gold dealers do not accept credit.

PayPal can be charged back. So the person who buys BTC can send the PP payment, receive the bitcoin and charge back the PayPal so he can keep both.

Is there no appeal process or consequence to the buyer for doing this?

EcuaMobi

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Quote from: freeyourmind on March 20, 2015, 02:31:10 PM

Quote from: EcuaMobi on March 09, 2015, 12:46:14 PM

Quote from: thedreamer on March 09, 2015, 11:53:38 AM

I hope I'm putting this in the right area, sorry if not.

I see tons of people selling bitcoins (partials) at 2x-3x normal going rates. Why is that?
Or better yet, why would anyone buy those??

Thanks.

Mainly because PayPal is reversible.

This causes 2 effects:

1) Sellers have to take a risk effects. For example if 25% of buyers scam the sellers then they have to increase the price more than 25%.
So if they sell $1,000 worth of bitcoin for $1,300 and they lose $250 on scams then they still profit.

2) Because of this very few people risk and sell for PayPal. This reduces supply and the price is increased out of speculation.
People who want to buy have fewer options and have to pay more for it.

On your first point, can you elaborate on what scams would cause a seller to pay out bitcoin and not receive payment?

I was also very curious about the bitcoin price on ebay, and similar to the gold/silver price, I think another factor is that the purchase can be made on credit. That usually can't be done in normal channels. For me, local silver/gold dealers do not accept credit.

PayPal can be charged back. So the person who buys BTC can send the PP payment, receive the bitcoin and charge back the PayPal so he can keep both.

freeyourmind

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Quote from: EcuaMobi on March 09, 2015, 12:46:14 PM

Quote from: thedreamer on March 09, 2015, 11:53:38 AM

I hope I'm putting this in the right area, sorry if not.

I see tons of people selling bitcoins (partials) at 2x-3x normal going rates. Why is that?
Or better yet, why would anyone buy those??

Thanks.

Mainly because PayPal is reversible.

This causes 2 effects:

1) Sellers have to take a risk effects. For example if 25% of buyers scam the sellers then they have to increase the price more than 25%.
So if they sell $1,000 worth of bitcoin for $1,300 and they lose $250 on scams then they still profit.

2) Because of this very few people risk and sell for PayPal. This reduces supply and the price is increased out of speculation.
People who want to buy have fewer options and have to pay more for it.

On your first point, can you elaborate on what scams would cause a seller to pay out bitcoin and not receive payment?

I was also very curious about the bitcoin price on ebay, and similar to the gold/silver price, I think another factor is that the purchase can be made on credit. That usually can't be done in normal channels. For me, local silver/gold dealers do not accept credit.

randy8777

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Quote from: hugs1BTC on March 19, 2015, 05:21:38 PM

Quote from: thedreamer on March 09, 2015, 11:53:38 AM

I hope I'm putting this in the right area, sorry if not.

I see tons of people selling bitcoins (partials) at 2x-3x normal going rates. Why is that?
Or better yet, why would anyone buy those??

Thanks.

Just some crook waiting for a noobs, that's it. Would never buy Bitcoins on eBay.

sad thing is that as long as there is demand by newbies and others the ebay sellers will continue.
they make good profits selling way overpriced bitcoins to newbies. that's not going to stop.

hugs1BTC

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Quote from: thedreamer on March 09, 2015, 11:53:38 AM

I hope I'm putting this in the right area, sorry if not.

I see tons of people selling bitcoins (partials) at 2x-3x normal going rates. Why is that?
Or better yet, why would anyone buy those??

Thanks.

Just some crook waiting for a noobs, that's it. Would never buy Bitcoins on eBay.

gentlemand

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Quote from: erikalui on March 18, 2015, 03:09:37 PM

I would never pay more than the market price and people who are really doing so are just so foolish (sorry if it offends anyone). I mean that if you can buy something for the same price, why pay higher? PayPal allows one to withdraw money via bank so buying a product for 20% more makes no sense. May be they trust Ebay and its products.

Yup. It's perceived trust and lacking the initiative to look deeper. The more time I spend on this planet, the more bizarre it seems how few people spend their time actually thinking things through.

erikalui

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Quote from: gentlemand on March 18, 2015, 03:02:35 PM

I guess it attracts mindless dabblers who can't be arsed to do any proper research. Once you get into KYC/AML stuff with the usual channels they'd probably switch off.

Ebay is an endless source of mystery. I've sold used items for 20% more than you'd pay for brand new after 10 seconds of googling. Foreign currency often goes for 20% more than you'd pay in the shittiest airport booth.

Some folks just don't expend the extra calories to investigate further.

I would never pay more than the market price and people who are really doing so are just so foolish (sorry if it offends anyone). I mean that if you can buy something for the same price, why pay higher? PayPal allows one to withdraw money via bank so buying a product for 20% more makes no sense. May be they trust Ebay and its products.

funtotry

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Quote from: erikalui on March 18, 2015, 02:52:57 PM

Quote from: EcuaMobi on March 12, 2015, 04:03:03 PM

Quote from: erikalui on March 12, 2015, 04:01:51 PM

It may be because of the Ebay fees as mostly everything on Ebay is quoted above the market price. Gift cards and other products as well because of the high fee of Ebay. They charge about 10% depending on the product you are selling.

That's definitely a factor, but not the main one. Bitcoins are usually sold there at about 60% to 100% more than market price.

60% more? Why would people buy it at such a high rate when bitcoins have no definite value? I thought that it may just be a 10-20% increase due to the fee. Better to use an exchange website which charges max 25% more.

Is it really that much? I guess people who look on Ebay see people selling a bitcoin, remembering how it was at 1k (people only read the news about it, know nothing more about btc), and then they say "wow its a great deal its 400$" when its really worth 263$.

gentlemand

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Quote from: erikalui on March 18, 2015, 02:52:57 PM

60% more? Why would people buy it at such a high rate when bitcoins have no definite value? I thought that it may just be a 10-20% increase due to the fee. Better to use an exchange website which charges max 25% more.

I guess it attracts mindless dabblers who can't be arsed to do any proper research. Once you get into KYC/AML stuff with the usual channels they'd probably switch off.

Ebay is an endless source of mystery. I've sold used items for 20% more than you'd pay for brand new after 10 seconds of googling. Foreign currency often goes for 20% more than you'd pay in the shittiest airport booth.

Some folks just don't expend the extra calories to investigate further.

erikalui

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Quote from: EcuaMobi on March 12, 2015, 04:03:03 PM

Quote from: erikalui on March 12, 2015, 04:01:51 PM

It may be because of the Ebay fees as mostly everything on Ebay is quoted above the market price. Gift cards and other products as well because of the high fee of Ebay. They charge about 10% depending on the product you are selling.

That's definitely a factor, but not the main one. Bitcoins are usually sold there at about 60% to 100% more than market price.

60% more? Why would people buy it at such a high rate when bitcoins have no definite value? I thought that it may just be a 10-20% increase due to the fee. Better to use an exchange website which charges max 25% more.

funtotry

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Quote from: winchancer on March 12, 2015, 10:02:02 PM

Quote from: funtotry on March 12, 2015, 05:54:49 PM

eBay forces paypal which is reversable, they usually favor the buyer in disputes (I have been victim by paypal 3 times), and usually people buying btcs on paypal might not be smart enough to ACTUALLY check the price so they can score lots of profit off of attempting this.

a lot of scams on ebay, never buy more than 0.1 btc

I used to sell a bunch of stuff on ebay, I just never do it anymore. Being a seller is awful, seller protection is trash and the buyer protection is way too good. Just doesn't make sense to be a seller.

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Topic: Why Bitcoins are so expensive on Ebay? - page 2. (Read 5864 times)