Topic: Why COVID diagnostics are crashing. - page 2. (Read 374 times)

Slightly disturbing :/

problem with your thinking is.
countries that closed the borders efficiently. and the tracked and traced people at the borders.. kept it out of their borders to allow people within to be more freer

so if you want to blame anyone for masks and infections and deaths.
blame trump for keeping the flights open and purposefully doing repatriation flights from hotzones. and then not monitoring/quarantining them people once in america

you should try to use common sense and facts

The problem with this thinking is that, statistics show that people who didn't lock down or wear masks, were far freer from cases and sickness and death than those who did.

because in february and march2020.. there was no lockdown.
so the spread was high. the viral load was high
emphasis the spread and load.
it was getting over 1% a week spread. thus many infected.. thus many passing to each other.
many passing it upclose to each other. thus high load. thus many getting severe sick
so the exponential rate was at over 3 and with high load per infection

mid march lockdowns occured. and the spread curbed the peak. from over 3 to way below 0.8
in summer they tried to find a balance of restriction but not too much.. to keep it at 1 (flatline)
they relaxed it a bit in autumn.
but people were still social distancing and wearing masks which if you understood viral load. means less virus inhaled =less severity

do you get it yet
the january2021 infection peak was higher but lower death peak is due to people getting infected. but with lower viral load because they were being more careful than those in february/march 2020

do yo get it

So, what? I've told you before I don't deny COVID exists.


You can call it collapse being overwhelmed or whatever. How do you explain that there is a peak of 100% excess mortality just in April 2020 for a disease that has a so low death rate? That 100% excess was only in April. There is no other month with 100% excess mortality.

pokerplayer is insinuating that car crash victims were left to die on the streets because hospitals only treat covid and refused ambulances for anything else.
he doesnt realise that ICU wards and 'elective surgery' wards were converted to treat covid patients and other wards like the ER and emergency surgical wards still treated other things like car crash injuries(as usual).
yes less breast implants and skin grafts occured.. but no rise in deaths because of elective surgery cancellations occured.

he also doesnt realise that the cancer monitoring appointments stopped from March-june(uk) did not result in premature cancer deaths in march/april. if someone was to die of cancer in 2 months.. hospitals wouldnt have been able to help anyway as they are already terminal.
and i dont need to say it but think i should for pokers benefit. someone having a screening in say JUNE would not have been a excess death in april (time doesnt flow backwards)

but it 'could' cause its own excess mortality rate year(s) later if hospitals dont catch up with screening appointments
emphasis on future impact. emphasis on IF not catch up with screening

But from your link (my bold):


I don't understand the point you're making with this bit, sorry. Please could you explain? Hospital systems don't in general collapse spontaneously. But they can become overwhelmed, leading to lower quality care and more deaths, if they are hit by something like — for example — a huge influx of patients due to a pandemic.

what your not realising is the EXCESS DEATHS. is not the 'asymptomatic people'
asymptomatic people dont die.. .. common sense. no symptom=no death

what you dont understand is in march-april they were not even testing random people unaffected. they were testing only sick people to find out what their cause of their sickness was.
yep the ones in march-april wont be common flu death. because of tests/scans/diagnoses

..
also if there was no lockdowns.
the excess rate in May would have been higher than april
the excess rate in June would have been higher than May
the excess rate in July would have been higher than June
and so on (ill draw you a ascii image at bottom if you cant understand the point here)
learn about exponential growth.
that lockdown cut that growth.
at the april period not even 1% of people had covid. imagine the excess death count if lockdown didnt happen

yes the deaths dipped in May nearer to normal levels. but this is not the virus still going wild at same levels and just being less deadly. it was stopping the deadly virus from reaching people. it dropped the levels

if there is no vaccine and no lockdowns the excess deaths would be magnitudes higher

as for your dilution of yearly data vs the data at the peaks. shows you dont understand.
learn how it was the lockdowns that diluted the excess death potential.. not the virus magically inerting itself
yep you adding in the 'null' months where lockdown cut infections. is just diluting the months where the virus was going wild


lockdown(tighten/relax 3 times)               no lockdown
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MAMJJASOND                                         MAMJJASOND

As I commented in another post, lies, bigger lies and statistics.

First, I don't know if you have not understood that I do not deny that COVID exists. Some people do, I don't. The occurrence of the large peak in April may be due to many causes, including collapse of the hospital system. That there is a 100% excess mortality peak in April tells me nothing if the overall excess mortality is around 5%. As I say, it may be due to different factors, among other things that at that time COVID was something new. If you add another disease to the mortality rate we already had, even if statistically it has a low mortality, the overall mortality rate will normally increase. This is fully compatible with COVID cases being inflated, as has been done, by counting completely asymptomatic people as COVID or also counting common flu cases as COVID.

I think the reason for the drop is we have developed herd immunity.
Seems like virus was not as serious as the initial response our media and government gave.
The reported death also included death with any other disease as every people with low immunity easily contracted and tested positive for the virus.
And that population is already down and the remaining people could easily resist the virus or have antibodies already developed.

Vaccination surely helps but most of the countries presented a decrease in cases and death even before the first dose.

Look at the data and see if there are any clear patterns. Anecdotal evidence and speculation give us nothing... nothing beyond an initial hypothesis, which then needs to be tested against the data.
We've had a year of this pandemic, all around the globe. There are vast quantities of data from a vast number of independent sources. Let's not rely on speculation too much.

Pick a country that has reduced cases but no real vaccination programme. Look at the data, and see what's happening. Has a lockdown reduced community transmission? Compulsory mask-wearing? Is there a decline in testing, and therefore a decline in confirmed cases? Is the government claiming that Covid deaths are actually deaths from other causes - in which case the pattern would become clear from an excess mortality analysis. What do the data tell us?

the chart with the gold and blue sections..
firstly lockdown caused the decline in both sections(jan 19th (couple weeks after the rule))
however the gold decline is more noticable angle, different to the blue angle
this difference in the slope of the gold vs blue is the difference of the vaccine

basically if the 80+ were not vaccinated their lockdown decline of cases would be at the same angle/percent per week as the under 80
\ \ =no vaccine    \\ = vaccine

But still there are many countries who are yet to receive their ordered vaccines which means how they able to reduce the number of cases in the same time? Maybe it has an effect but it is clear that media lost their interest so we are not seeing much aggressive news about covid and it also seems that number of affected persons are also decreasing.

Watch the first 20 minutes of this - https://www.bitchute.com/video/fGrVfRKlrYtN/ - to see that the statistics don't make any sense. Covid was crashing long before the vaccine was available, and crashing further without lockdowns and masks than with them.

Vaccinations are having a clear statistical effect, yes. Take a look at the charts below for the UK.

Firstly, vaccination progress. Over 32% of the UK population have now had at least one dose. You will note that vaccination rate increased sharply from around mid-January. Vaccinations have been administered to people in 5-year age bands, starting from the most elderly (and vulnerable). The 80+ age group was completed some time ago, and we have now progressed down through the bandings into the 60yos.



Secondly, death rate for confirmed Covid cases has fallen sharply for the (vaccinated) 80+ age group over the last few weeks... and - crucially, as a metric of vaccine effectiveness - is falling far more quickly than it is for younger (and mostly unvaccinated) age groups. Note that obviously death is a lagging indicator when we are considering Covid cases, so the current stats are representative of the earlier stages of vaccine distribution... which means that we can expect the downward trend in death rate to continue amongst the vaccinated.


https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/965771/2021-03-01_COVID-19_Press_Conference_Slides.pdf

Possibly herd immunity? Or people started to consider covid 19 as a normal flu so they just need to take rest and quarantine themselves to cure from it and mainly people started to recognize that covid 19 is not a deadly virus. Vaccinations too? I don't think that government have given enough vaccines to reduce the covid 19 yet so its something happening naturally not due to any actions taken by governments.

Yes doctor, any basis? research, article or research journal is accepted.

I don't have prior knowledge with these about "Tiny Particles" withholding a virus from being detected and such.

This is the same argument from a few days ago. My response is the same: if you don't trust reason for death, then just look at total deaths from any reason...





Your response (below) didn't address the question. I'm saying, okay, if you don't think that people are dying of Covid, if you think the mortality is no different to flu, then what is the reason for so many more people dying than normal, and why do the excess deaths coincide with waves of Covid infections? Look at the data.

^^^ There are loads of tiny particles in the body. Nobody properly sorted out any Covid virus from the rest of the stuff, so that they could say with certainty that they know that there is a virus.

It turns out that we have an epidemic that has been called a pandemic to scare more, in which cases have been inflated counting as infected people who do not show any symptoms at any stage and counting as dead by COVID people as cancer patients who exceed life expectancy, although they did not show any symptoms, if they were tested for COVID and were positive.

Lately COVID cases are dropping significantly. Is this due to vaccines? Not at all:

Is This Why "New COVID Cases" Are Crashing?

"The scary red numbers are all going down. Check any newspaper or covid tracking website you want. Cases. Deaths. Hospitalisations. They’re all going down, sharply, and have been for weeks, especially in the US and UK."..."The assumption most people would make, and would be encouraged to make by the talking heads and media experts, is that the various “vaccines” have taken effect and stopped the spread of the “virus”.

Is this the case? No, no it’s not.

The decline started in mid-January, far too early for any vaccination program to have any effect."..."Another suspect is the lockdown, with blaring propaganda stating that all the various government-imposed house arrests and “distancing” measures have finally had an impact.

That’s not it either.

Sweden, famously, never locked down at all. Yet their “cases” and “Covid related deaths” have been dropping exactly in parallel with the UK."..."on January 13th the WHO published a memo regarding the problem of asymptomatic cases being discovered by PCR tests, and suggesting any asymptomatic positive tests be repeated.

This followed up their previous memo, instructing labs around the world to use lower cycle thresholds (CT values) for PCR tests, as values over 35 could produce false positives.

Essentially, in two memos the WHO ensured future testing would be less likely to produce false positives and made it much harder to be labelled an “asymptomatic case”.

In short, logic would suggest we’re not in fact seeing a “decline in Covid cases” or a “decrease in Covid deaths” at all.

What we’re seeing is a decline in perfectly healthy people being labelled “covid cases” based on a false positive from an unreliable testing process."