Geez, this reminds me of 2011.
Dammit!
Topic: Why did bitcoin go down? - page 2. (Read 9054 times)
it was market manipulation, plain and simple. see the thread in the newbie section.
link?
can you link to that paper/article?
eprint.iacr.org/2012/584.pdf
it was market manipulation, plain and simple. see the thread in the newbie section.
can you link to that paper/article? I never heard of it. I don't think its bearish because of the existence of dark pools, but because a huge down swing like that will scare people into thinking twice about getting into btc at this price.
just an update though, gox says that they were not ddosed today, but that genuine volume of traders overloaded servers. https://www.facebook.com/MtGox
just an update though, gox says that they were not ddosed today, but that genuine volume of traders overloaded servers. https://www.facebook.com/MtGox
now who knows whats gonna happen, but i think this is a very bearish sign.
Not necessarily.
The existence of the "dark pool" was well known. Anybody who read Ron/Shamir paper and choose not to ignore it (or actually had attention span to read it and ability to understand it) knew that is very probable.
It doesn't even take that much analysis: everybody who has been following BTC closely knew that there are 'entities' out here with a huge stash of coins, min 500,000 that they got for pennies.
Ron/Shamir also documented some curious patterns. For example a pattern where a single address would sell hundred of thousands of BTCs to multiple destinations, and, through Mt.Gox, they would all return back to the same address.
I called that market-making in one post. You can say it was testing and preparation for today.
That is really nothing unusual for stocks and is often very easily visible on pumped-dumped poorly liquid penny stocks.
ill put in my 2 cents here. I was watching the depth chart very carefully from the time bitcoin hit 200 all through the drop to 100. I believe there was a massive dark pool sell order, combined with the ddos, made it impossible for people to withdraw their buy orders, and for other sellers to get in and sell. meaning whoever it was chewed through all the buy orders from 250 down to 105. i don't know how many coins that was, but it was a lot.
the reason i think this was a dark pool sell was that there was a huge spread once bitcoin hit below 200. sellers were selling still around 180-190, while all buy orders were being sold down to 120 or so. Buyers would creep back up, but anytime they did they would just get eaten up by an invisible sell. This kept going on until around buys were at 105, while all non dark sell orders were at about 140. I presume whoever was selling did not want the price to completely tank, as they stopped before it broke below 100, which would of probably caused a panic.
now who knows whats gonna happen, but i think this is a very bearish sign.
the reason i think this was a dark pool sell was that there was a huge spread once bitcoin hit below 200. sellers were selling still around 180-190, while all buy orders were being sold down to 120 or so. Buyers would creep back up, but anytime they did they would just get eaten up by an invisible sell. This kept going on until around buys were at 105, while all non dark sell orders were at about 140. I presume whoever was selling did not want the price to completely tank, as they stopped before it broke below 100, which would of probably caused a panic.
now who knows whats gonna happen, but i think this is a very bearish sign.
It didn't crash to what it was before the rise started, it is inevitable it would start to plateau following Cyprus cashouts, we're seeing who was just using Bitcoin to transfer their money to another fiat currency, or who decided it was better to stay as the value kept increasing, and there are more and more merchants starting to accept BTC following the new media hype and speculation.
No worries, crap like this will save us:
http://news.yahoo.com/bitcoin-hacker-currency-bursts-mainstream-222018978--finance.html
http://news.yahoo.com/bitcoin-hacker-currency-bursts-mainstream-222018978--finance.html
Oh definitie DoS attack for sure!!! That is sooooo obvious!!!
DoS and negative spin causing panic selling of weak hands!!!
Certainly nothing to do with speculative bubble profit taking, panic selling, and certainly nothing to do with market manipulation.
The fundamentals of Bitcoin are too strong. The world is changing. Bitcoin is going tomake me very very rich free the world from the shackles of central banks and the governments they control. Why would the existing financial establishment want to lose money making Bitcoin crash, when they could make money investing in it. Bitcoin is the solution that those central bankers trying their best to fix the economy have been looking for. If you disagree with me, then you are an idiot!
Nothing to see here people, business as usual, kindly move along to the Mt Gox exchange and keep buying in at any price!
DoS and negative spin causing panic selling of weak hands!!!
Certainly nothing to do with speculative bubble profit taking, panic selling, and certainly nothing to do with market manipulation.
The fundamentals of Bitcoin are too strong. The world is changing. Bitcoin is going to
Nothing to see here people, business as usual, kindly move along to the Mt Gox exchange and keep buying in at any price!
+1 lol.
LOL, reminds me of good ole' 2000 and Yahoo penny stocks bulletin boards.
Oh definitie DoS attack for sure!!! That is sooooo obvious!!!
DoS and negative spin causing panic selling of weak hands!!!
Certainly nothing to do with speculative bubble profit taking, panic selling, and certainly nothing to do with market manipulation.
The fundamentals of Bitcoin are too strong. The world is changing. Bitcoin is going tomake me very very rich free the world from the shackles of central banks and the governments they control. Why would the existing financial establishment want to lose money making Bitcoin crash, when they could make money investing in it. Bitcoin is the solution that those central bankers trying their best to fix the economy have been looking for. If you disagree with me, then you are an idiot!
Nothing to see here people, business as usual, kindly move along to the Mt Gox exchange and keep buying in at any price!
DoS and negative spin causing panic selling of weak hands!!!
Certainly nothing to do with speculative bubble profit taking, panic selling, and certainly nothing to do with market manipulation.
The fundamentals of Bitcoin are too strong. The world is changing. Bitcoin is going to
Nothing to see here people, business as usual, kindly move along to the Mt Gox exchange and keep buying in at any price!
+1 lol.
It is the "other", obviously. BTC is in media and big guys want in with cheaper price. Whoever holds on, the real rise will come after this. I watch a journalist (read paid sockpuppet), who writes bad stuff about stocks which synchronously dips without reason, and then corrects in few days. He wrote about bitcoin in same tone about a day two back.
Ddos causes lag and failure of bitcoin exchanges, and initial sell off of the traders anticipating the drop. This drop scares the weakest hands who scramble to log in and sell, increasing lag and so on in a feedback loop.
Well, to be sure we will have to see MtGox trade log. Since there are 7 million dormant coins out there, according to paper by Ron & Shamir, some entity's big profit taking is entirely a possibility. Hell, I would do it if I could. If I had a million, not to sell at least 200,000 at these prices? A Ferrari today is better than Ferrari in a year, maybe.
The rest is then just a noise from small, scared hands.
Bubble burst
I don't buy it.
Massive DDOS doesn't cause a lot (or just a few) of people to decide to sell a huge volume.
We had DDOSes before and it merely made it slower to either purchase or sell the coin.
We had big volume dumps before big DDOSes, it was just lower price and lower volatility.
Massive DDOS doesn't cause a lot (or just a few) of people to decide to sell a huge volume.
We had DDOSes before and it merely made it slower to either purchase or sell the coin.
We had big volume dumps before big DDOSes, it was just lower price and lower volatility.
Ddos causes lag and failure of bitcoin exchanges, and initial sell off of the traders anticipating the drop. This drop scares the weakest hands who scramble to log in and sell, increasing lag and so on in a feedback loop.
Mere speculation here but BTC is still a thin niche market and there could be a hand full of Big time BTC holders/traders colluding to drive the price up and sell off...
not saying its true just pointing out a possible scenerio.
not saying its true just pointing out a possible scenerio.
I don't buy it.
Massive DDOS doesn't cause a lot (or just a few) of people to decide to sell a huge volume.
We had DDOSes before and it merely made it slower to either purchase or sell the coin.
We had big volume dumps before big DDOSes, it was just lower price and lower volatility.
Massive DDOS doesn't cause a lot (or just a few) of people to decide to sell a huge volume.
We had DDOSes before and it merely made it slower to either purchase or sell the coin.
We had big volume dumps before big DDOSes, it was just lower price and lower volatility.
aren't 1 and 3 the same?
I thought about it for a while before separating those concepts. A bubble and a correction are different in my book. I think in my opinion when a bubble burst the. Price should go back to the beginning of the bubble. This was not the case. A correction is whe. There's a spike that is not justified and the. A profit taking takes place and the price is adjusted to real values. This is just my opinion and conceptually I could be wrong though. To me, what happened today was a huge DoS not only against mtgox, but also other exchanges and even bitcointalk! Every site related to bitcoins was somewhat slow.
I think DoS is the bug cause. We need to start isolating the exchanges and the use of brokers could be an alternative.
aren't 1 and 3 the same?
No, one implies a mere hiccup towards deathcode's projected profit margins, the other implies that the game is up and now is time to maximise the reduced but still obscene profit margins.
aren't 1 and 3 the same?
No, one implies a mere hiccup towards deathcode's projected profit margins, the other implies that the game is up and now is time to maximise the reduced but still obscene profit margins.
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