Why Localbitcoin take this action ? | Bitcointalksearch.org

EarnOnVictor

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Quote from: CCMS on November 27, 2023, 12:06:59 PM

Quote from: EarnOnVictor on November 24, 2023, 11:38:59 AM

Quote from: CCMS on November 23, 2023, 12:20:47 PM

As far as I know they had mentioned about some losses that they were going through while running the website .

Have you then ........... P2P in their model went bankrupt even before them, and a few like Paxful that are left are ...

I didn't really do a research on this but I am surprised about the loss thing since in P2P it shouldn't be the company bearing losses since the trade should be between the people. Maybe, heavy taxes could be reason behind it? LBTC had its headquarters in Finland ?

Yes, they had their headquarters in Finland, the capital of the country, Helsinki, to be precise.

This has nothing to do with the insolvency of the company and I don't think taxes are a problem either, after all, they are not the ones paying the taxes indirectly but those dealing on the platform. They've survived many years without issues even while paying their taxes, so it can't be the taxes.

All I believe is that people are finding their better serves elsewhere and the world of P2P is revolutionizing, so those who are lagging with their old ways may not meet up with the competition.

Elpeor00

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Quote from: CCMS on November 27, 2023, 12:06:59 PM

Quote from: EarnOnVictor on November 24, 2023, 11:38:59 AM

Quote from: CCMS on November 23, 2023, 12:20:47 PM

As far as I know they had mentioned about some losses that they were going through while running the website .

Have you then ........... P2P in their model went bankrupt even before them, and a few like Paxful that are left are ...

I didn't really do a research on this but I am surprised about the loss thing since in P2P it shouldn't be the company bearing losses since the trade should be between the people. Maybe, heavy taxes could be reason behind it? LBTC had its headquarters in Finland ?

They shouldn't bear loses derived from prices drop, as a p2p exchange, that's especially true if you take into account that a bear market is often accompanied by high volume of people trying to dump their coins and others trying to buy at the lowest

That's why I think they "crypto winter" refers to the costumers migration after the KYC implementation. As I noted before, that is my case

Z-tight

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Quote from: CCMS on November 27, 2023, 12:06:59 PM

I didn't really do a research on this but I am surprised about the loss thing since in P2P it shouldn't be the company bearing losses since the trade should be between the people. Maybe, heavy taxes could be reason behind it? LBTC had its headquarters in Finland ?

I have pointed this out so many times, LocalBitcoins started their operation as a p2p exchange, but they stopped being a p2p exchange the moment they made kyc mandatory and became a third party in trades. LocalBitcoins became like every other centralized exchange after they made that kyc decision, and then they had to compete with other centralized exchanges for customers, because most of their customers' abandoned them for other p2p solutions. In the end LocalBitcoins could not cope with their lack of trading volume and they had to shut down.

CCMS

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Quote from: EarnOnVictor on November 24, 2023, 11:38:59 AM

Quote from: CCMS on November 23, 2023, 12:20:47 PM

As far as I know they had mentioned about some losses that they were going through while running the website .

Have you then ........... P2P in their model went bankrupt even before them, and a few like Paxful that are left are ...

I didn't really do a research on this but I am surprised about the loss thing since in P2P it shouldn't be the company bearing losses since the trade should be between the people. Maybe, heavy taxes could be reason behind it? LBTC had its headquarters in Finland ?

Elpeor00

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Sad, yeah? Localbitconis was the first p2p exchange I ever used (as you can see in this account creation date, I have been into crypto for some time)

Back in the day before 2019 I used to trade btc for cash in person, via localbitconis, is still the exchange I have used more for crypto to fiat trades, but with the kyc/aml after that I found easier to search in social media groups for small amount p2p trades

That's why I think was the kyc/aml what caused the user base to migrate, was my case

Btw, I agree Binance p2p and the likes are not true p2p

Z-tight

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Quote from: Obari on November 24, 2023, 04:54:08 PM

but I have a question for local bitcoin is that, what is the hope of their customers who didn’t meet up to transfer or withdraw their assets after the due date ?

I believe the exchange is going to claim it, LocalBitcoins shut down in early February this year and their customers were given 12 months to withdraw their funds, which hasn't elapsed by the way. I think 12 months is such a long time, and anybody who hasn't withdrawn by the end of this deadline, probably is no longer available to withdraw their coins or all they have there is dust; as such i believe the exchange would claim anything that is left.

Obari

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Quote from: SquirrelJulietGarden on November 16, 2023, 09:53:49 AM

Quote from: SAHASAN on November 16, 2023, 09:36:25 AM

My first bitcoin buy from Local Bitcoin and it was my favorite p2p site. But I don't understand why and what is the main reason to closed buy/sell service by local bitcoin? Huh

Paxful is shutting down

I think paxful is fully back to service and they’re already doing fine and pastilles has been one of my best exchanges and I think the reason for paxfuls closure was from some sort of internal conflict which was later resolved but I think paxful also gave us a sister app to use while they were away and I think the app was more like a copy and paste of paxful and unlike other exchanges which just closed down without prior notifications I think most of this other exchanges are now putting their customers to considerations as there are prior notifications before any shutting down is down but I have a question for local bitcoin is that, what is the hope of their customers who didn’t meet up to transfer or withdraw their assets after the due date ?

EarnOnVictor

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Quote from: CCMS on November 23, 2023, 12:20:47 PM

As far as I know they had mentioned about some losses that they were going through while running the website .

Have you then taken your time to learn or suspect the reason for the losses and how they have come into play this much? This is not about Localbitcoins alone, some other businesses running P2P in their model went bankrupt even before them, and a few like Paxful that are left are showing signs of being stressed but the insolvent of Localbitcoins can still buy it time.

There must be a reason for the losses, a reason why they could not meet up with the business unlike before, and the only reason I suspect is the lack of much patronage like before. It's not a business as usual for them, their business model has killed the company. I can't imagine myself seeing Binance and would say it's Localbitcoins I want to deal with. That is impossible, and it's simply because of some factors like security and fees among others.

CCMS

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As far as I know they had mentioned about some losses that they were going through while running the website .

Z-tight

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Quote from: CRAIC on November 21, 2023, 09:58:56 AM

Quote from: SAHASAN on November 16, 2023, 09:36:25 AM

My first bitcoin buy from Local Bitcoin and it was my favorite p2p site. But I don't understand why and what is the main reason to closed buy/sell service by local bitcoin? Huh

don't worry, binance has a good p2p platform (better than localbitcoins has)

Take note that Binance is not a p2p exchange, if you are looking for options of p2p exchanges, then look here: https://kycnot.me/?type=exchange

Binance is a centralized exchange that collects kyc and is a third party in every trade you make in their platform. The 'p2p' in Binance is not true p2p because you are not connecting directly to the other peer and you don't have control of your funds when you are trading.

CRAIC

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Quote from: SAHASAN on November 16, 2023, 09:36:25 AM

My first bitcoin buy from Local Bitcoin and it was my favorite p2p site. But I don't understand why and what is the main reason to closed buy/sell service by local bitcoin? Huh

don't worry, binance has a good p2p platform (better than localbitcoins has)

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Quote from: khaled0111 on November 17, 2023, 05:59:49 PM

Binance have the strictest kyc requirements but they still have a p2p exchange platform.

There is nothing peer to peer about Binance's "P2P" platform.

Peer to peer means peer to peer. It doesn't mean peer to middle man to peer. If there is a middle man called Binance with which you have to register an account, complete KYC, deposit your coins or fiat, and who can spy on everything you do, block or reverse trades, close your account, confiscate your coins, etc., then that isn't peer to peer in the slightest. It is completely centralized in all but name.

There are plenty of exchanges out there which call themselves peer to peer or call themselves decentralized when they are no such thing. This has been the case for years:

Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on September 14, 2020, 04:26:47 AM

There is a problem with a lot of exchanges using the word "decentralized" as a marketing tool and gimmick, when in reality they are not decentralized at all. Sites like LocalBitcoins and IDEX which claim to be decentralized, and yet users have to deposit coins to their custodial wallets and complete KYC. Complete nonsense.

How could a truly peer to peer exchange even collect KYC? For an exchange to collect KYC then there must be a centralized third party to do that collection in the first place, at which point you are no longer trading peer to peer but trading with permission of this centralized third party. There are very few truly peer to peer exchanges out there, and even fewer truly decentralized ones. Bisq remains the best option for both criteria.

Z-tight

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Quote from: khaled0111 on November 17, 2023, 05:59:49 PM

Sorry, I didn't get that! Why do you think they are not a p2p exchange anymore just because they decided to enforce kyc? And what does that have to do with being centralized or not?

It is not about what i think, an exchange that makes kyc mandatory cannot be called a decentralized or p2p exchange, if you have to submit information about yourself and still deposit funds into a wallet that only the exchange controls in order to trade, then that's surely not a p2p trade, you can call it what you want, and maybe peer to exchange, and then exchange to the trading peer on the other side is suitable. Buddy, It has a lot with being centralized, because that is simply what kyc exchanges are called, and as with everything centralized, there is a single point ot failure, it could be a honeypot service and data could be fed to the LE at anytime.

Quote from: khaled0111 on November 17, 2023, 05:59:49 PM

Lbc was still a p2p exchange even after enforcing kyc and, BTW, I don't believe this is the reason, or the drop of their trading volume, is the reason why they had to shut down their services. Binance have the strictest kyc requirements but they still have a p2p exchange platform.

Binance have always been a centralized exchange, most of their customers have always been people who didn't mind submitting their data to centralized services, how do you compare it to LocalBitcoins that was a p2p exchange that didn't require kyc, and then decided to make it mandatory along the line, what do you think would happen to trading volume in Bisq or AgoraDesk if they make KYC compulsory tomorrow? Majority of their customers would look for another p2p alternative. And FWIW, p2p on Binance isn't true p2p.

EarnOnVictor

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Quote from: SAHASAN on November 16, 2023, 09:36:25 AM

My first bitcoin buy from Local Bitcoin and it was my favorite p2p site. But I don't understand why and what is the main reason to closed buy/sell service by local bitcoin? Huh

I knew Localbitcoins but never transacted there simply because it's an old way of exchange, they've had their good moments when cryptocurrency was not as exposed as this and working in the old way is primarily the reason I believe they stopped operation, they couldn't meet up with the competition. This is the second time in less than a year and I believe they are going for good this time.

Come to think of it, they are doing KYC, this is despite that their transcription fees are so high. I don't think it would be a smart idea for anyone to deal with them when they can easily deal with regular exchanges like Binance with low fees.

In other words, cheapness and ease of doing business within exchanges might be the main cause of this, people are taking their businesses elsewhere.

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Quote from: Z-tight on November 17, 2023, 04:59:58 PM

LocalBitcoins were previously a p2p exchange, but they stopped being that when they made KYC mandatory, so saying they were a p2p exchange, and that competing with centralized exchanges is one of the reasons they collapsed is not true

Sorry, I didn't get that! Why do you think they are not a p2p exchange anymore just because they decided to enforce kyc? And what does that have to do with being centralized or not?
Lbc was still a p2p exchange even after enforcing kyc and, BTW, I don't believe this is the reason, or the drop of their trading volume, is the reason why they had to shut down their services. Binance have the strictest kyc requirements but they still have a p2p exchange platform.

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Quote from: The Cryptovator on November 16, 2023, 02:42:47 PM

There would be some law enforcement issues as well. It's true that their volume has dropped due to the many competitors on the market. Especially centralised exchanges like Binance started p2p exchange. A large number of cryptocurrency users have been involved with centralised exchanges, and often we get all services in one place. Hence, individuals lose their interests in other p2p exchanges because of centralised exchanges.

LocalBitcoins were previously a p2p exchange, but they stopped being that when they made KYC mandatory, so saying they were a p2p exchange, and that competing with centralized exchanges is one of the reasons they collapsed is not true, rather what is true is that they turned into a kyc exchange and couldn't compete with other kyc exchanges, because their customers' had left them for other p2p exchanges.

LE cannot also be a reason why they shut down, LE loves kyc exchanges, they love services that can feed them with customers' data, so there was no way they were going to have problems with LE when they comply with their laws.

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Quote from: SAHASAN on November 16, 2023, 09:36:25 AM

My first bitcoin buy from Local Bitcoin and it was my favorite p2p site. But I don't understand why and what is the main reason to closed buy/sell service by local bitcoin? Huh

All is not lost. They are actually better alternatives in terms of privacy because they don't ask for KYC yet. The only disadvantage is low liquidity, but if you really care about not handing over your KYC documents to many online platforms, they are the services to use for now.

Some have already been mentioned by other members, but let me list more

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Quote from: SquirrelJulietGarden on November 16, 2023, 09:53:49 AM

It is not only LocalBitcoins, there are some P2P platforms closed their services too like Paxful, 2 months after LocalBitcoins.

Paxful is shutting down

They did it by stricter regulations. Even Kucoin required mandatory KYC a few months after that.

Before LocalBitcoins and Paxful, there is another one in October 2022, Localcryptos.
LocalCryptos is shutting down

Stricter regulations are the easiest to use as a reason, but it might not be the real one. Although I think it's indeed the reason as far as Localcryptos are concerned, it probably wasn't as to the case of LocalBitcoins. LocalBitcoins complied with regulatory demands. Therefore, they didn't have to shutdown because of regulatory challenges. It was probably more of dwindling activity or volume brought by the crypto winter and their mandatory KYC. Localcryptos remained principled until the end; they had to shutdown.

As to Paxful, although they also mentioned it, the shutdown wasn't really about stricter regulations. It was more of internal disagreement on ownership and control. It reopened later with another CEO.

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Quote from: Potato Chips on November 16, 2023, 10:19:52 AM

Quote from: SquirrelJulietGarden on November 16, 2023, 09:53:49 AM

It is not only LocalBitcoins, there are some P2P platforms closed their services too like Paxful, 2 months after LocalBitcoins.

Paxful is shutting down

You must have missed that paxful came back! try accessing the website again Cheesy

I was thinking that LocalBitcoins have came back to their service but I was wrong with that thought and yes, that's paxful that came back and lively again. But I don't think that the same welcome from its former users will still be there.

@OP, with all of the potential reasons why they have to close their service down were already said. Bear market, regulatory pressure, not enough funding and lesser volume, etc.

But I wouldn't be surprised if the former executives of it will join force with other the same service for them to render what they've applied and learned from this company they've established.

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Quote from: The Cryptovator on November 16, 2023, 02:42:47 PM

A cold crypto winter would be one of the reasons behind the shutdown of Localbitcoin, but I don't think this is the main reason. There would be some law enforcement issues as well. It's true that their volume has dropped due to the many competitors on the market. Especially centralised exchanges like Binance started p2p exchange. A large number of cryptocurrency users have been involved with centralised exchanges, and often we get all services in one place. Hence, individuals lose their interests in other p2p exchanges because of centralised exchanges.

It's definitely not the bear market and not Binance's P2P arm either. Even in a bear market, LocalBitcoins was the place the go, and Binance's P2P hasn't gain traction that time yet(assuming it was already around).

It's 99% law enforcement requiring AML/KYC that killed it.

Topic: Why Localbitcoin take this action ? (Read 414 times)