Why the disagreement between the Government, Bank and Bitcoin? - page 2.

serjent05

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Quote from: Accardo on May 28, 2023, 05:08:08 PM

Among the last three terms on my topic, each has representatives, and they've been having disagreements; the Government and banks against Bitcoin. With no tangible reason why it's so? I mean, Electricity came, the government and the bank accepted it and placed an electricity bill, the internet came they both accepted it and the Government works with ISPs to take bills from data subscriptions. Bitcoin came they took advantage of centralized exchanges, yet they're not satisfied. I've read multiple bad reasons placed on bitcoin volatility, fraud, etc, and don't see it tangible because every innovation has its risks and importance.

Bitcoin truly is not tangible because it is intangible. A digital or virtual currency has no physical form that can be touched or felt. Government cannot consider Bitcoin as money because of the issue of being a store of value since the government believes that Bitcoin is too volatile to be considered one.

Quote from: Accardo on May 28, 2023, 05:08:08 PM

On the contrary, why do Bitcoiners quarrel with them? knowing that they, Government and Bank, got no strong evidence to tarnish the image of Bitcoin completely. I think the quarrel will make Bitcoin very famous to the extent that both opponents will have no other option than to submit to Bitcoin.

Bitcoiners do not quarrel with the government and banks. They are just citing the obvious on how these two institutions exploit people and how the government wants to control the cash flow of its constituents. if Bitcoiners quarrel with the two institutions, you could have seen Bitcoiners making an aggressive rally and assaulting these two institutions, but we never see that happen, do we?

hatshepsut93

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It's a bit of misconception that banks are anti-Bitcoin. Many of them do business with exchanges and profit from all the transactions fees that come when people deposit or withdraw from exchange. Some banks prohibit crypto-related transactions, but not necessarily because they are afraid of crypto, they likely afraid of responsibility that might come if some of those transactions are linked to crime and black markets.

As for governments, in general they don't want Bitcoin to be used instead of fiat, it's harder to trace, harder to tax. But only a few governments in the world actually banned mining or trading.

Agbe

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The last paragraph of your thread made me laugh. Let me start from the beginning of the thread. Government is working for the interest of the Bank because the bank is own by a Capitalist who is a businessman and the government must act according the request of the bank. Now the Bank sees bitcoin as a treat to it existence, because if the government adopt bitcoin without the notice of the bank, it will affect the interest of the bank and the bank is using the government as a super hero to do and undo. And the bank is thinking that the people will use bitcoin more than the back. Remember it is now that bitcoin has not been accepted globally making the exchange to be popular once government adopt bitcoin as a legal tender in any country the the exchange platforms will not be known like that again because everyone will be using p2p and banks are afraid of that. And that is why they banks are lobbying the government not to adopt bitcoin in their regions. It is a very simple ideology. Banks are the main opponent of bitcoin and not even the government. Banks are using the government to cover up.

umbara ardian

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The fastest way for people to get to know someone or something is to be a part of a drama. This is also how bitcoin gets all the attention when it comes to its conflict with governments and banks. When there is disagreement and it is difficult to control, the pressure on bitcoin will be greater. Since then, people will gradually notice this conflict, and eventually someone will become interested and learn more about their benefits. However, no matter how the government tries to suppress it, bitcoin will continue to grow strongly and will make other objects dependent on and accept the use of bitcoin.

BIT-BENDER

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Like you said electricity can and the government found a way the electricity can work for them by placing a bill on it, and also the internet came and same thing the government found a way to control it, this should tell you that the government aren't against development either technology or other wise what they are really against is what they can not control.

Crypto-currency is some thing the government has tried to control by all means but it seem not to be working and even though they have some grip on the centralized system of Crypto-currency such as some exchange regardless this can not give them complete control.

hannahB4

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With the Electricity and the Internet, you mentioned I don't think the government or bank has something to lose rather than benefit from its existence. On the other hand, the bank knows with more people investing in bitcoin their sales and profit from investment will drop, people who buy shares, bonds, and stock who withdraw their funds and invest in bitcoin will have an effect negatively on them. In my country, the excuse government gave concerning Bitcoin then was that it was a scam and fraudulent means for youth.

Flexystar

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The quarrel is due to the fact Bitcoin came out of cryptography method that had existed way before bitcoin was actually launched on the blockchain and government or financial institutes were incapable to invent it all by themselves. Now bitcoin stands as one of the greatest investment in entire world. I mean it quickly picked up attention of developers around the world, gave rise to enormous marketplace that was just dream before 2009. I am pretty sure government is surprised to see newborn tech like this disrupting their own money land. There it is, that is the point when government and financial institute came together to fight against bitcoin but with failure.

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Quote from: Accardo on May 28, 2023, 05:08:08 PM

Among the last three terms on my topic, each has representatives, and they've been having disagreements; the Government and banks against Bitcoin. With no tangible reason why it's so? I mean, Electricity came, the government and the bank accepted it and placed an electricity bill, the internet came they both accepted it and the Government works with ISPs to take bills from data subscriptions. Bitcoin came they took advantage of centralized exchanges, yet they're not satisfied. I've read multiple bad reasons placed on bitcoin volatility, fraud, etc, and don't see it tangible because every innovation has its risks and importance.

On the contrary, why do Bitcoiners quarrel with them? knowing that they, Government and Bank, got no strong evidence to tarnish the image of Bitcoin completely. I think the quarrel will make Bitcoin very famous to the extent that both opponents will have no other option than to submit to Bitcoin.

The government and banks are like a coin with two sides.

Now let's think without blaming each other to get an answer.
In this sophisticated life, no one in this world can do activities without a bank account. Bank accounts seem to be the most important part for people in living a normal life.

People who want to be part of a bank, such as opening an account to deposit money, need to agree to rules without any coercion. Everything is regulated under the agreement that our money is managed by them.
The presence of Bitcoin in the midst of the economic turmoil that hit the world seized all of it. Bitcoin gives freedom to everyone to live life according to their own tastes above their own money.

Reference here -> (Bitcoin: The Social Phenomenon) by nullius. That topic is a perfect answer to the three terms you meant.

gunhell16

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Quote from: Accardo on May 28, 2023, 05:08:08 PM

Among the last three terms on my topic, each has representatives, and they've been having disagreements; the Government and banks against Bitcoin. With no tangible reason why it's so? I mean, Electricity came, the government and the bank accepted it and placed an electricity bill, the internet came they both accepted it and the Government works with ISPs to take bills from data subscriptions. Bitcoin came they took advantage of centralized exchanges, yet they're not satisfied. I've read multiple bad reasons placed on bitcoin volatility, fraud, etc, and don't see it tangible because every innovation has its risks and importance.

On the contrary, why do Bitcoiners quarrel with them? knowing that they, Government and Bank, got no strong evidence to tarnish the image of Bitcoin completely. I think the quarrel will make Bitcoin very famous to the extent that both opponents will have no other option than to submit to Bitcoin.

Actually, we Bitcoiners are not in our habit of being angry with the government or the banks, can't we just see what it can do and help us so we trust Bitcoin more than the rules that the government wants?

We can see that a few years have passed that most governments that fought against the concept of Bitcoin did not work in their destruction of it and proved that they could not control it, so instead of criticizing it they just rode the trend here in Bitcoin because otherwise they will be left behind for sure.

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Quote from: Accardo on May 28, 2023, 05:08:08 PM

On the contrary, why do Bitcoiners quarrel with them? knowing that they, Government and Bank, got no strong evidence to tarnish the image of Bitcoin completely. I think the quarrel will make Bitcoin very famous to the extent that both opponents will have no other option than to submit to Bitcoin.

Maybe the less reason with thag is they cannot have full control on bitcoin and so hard for them to implement taxes to each bitcoin users that's why they choose to give negative impression about it. But there are countries open about possibilities of adoption but its just the volatility and negative impressions brought up by several cases of scamming stopping its adoption since government look at that situation as big risk on adopting bitcoin on their circulation. But who knows maybe in future we can see some changes of every decision they made and they decide to adopt bitcoin since they find it very useful.

Solosanz

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Electricity is fully controlled by the government, it's almost impossible you can find the free electricity by yourself.

Internet connection is almost fully controlled by the government, but some good VPN or Tor they still not able to control it.

While Bitcoin, they're not able to control it, they can control Bitcoin through centralized exchange, but there are many ways other people can get rid off from the government. Not all centralized exchanges are cooperated with all government too.

Z390

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The disagreements between bitcoin and government should be obvious to everybody, we all know that the government always like getting something out of everything that is making money and I believe the government is mad for the fact that bitcoin is bringing money for many investors and they can't be able to make money for themselves because they can't control Bitcoin that is one reason why they are pissed about Bitcoin.

The only way the government can make money out of Bitcoin is them turning into one of the investors themselves and I bet the most like that or maybe I should say it won't be satisfying for them, they will prefer to be in control.

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Quote from: ilovealtcoins on May 28, 2023, 10:58:55 PM

Quote from: Fundamentals Of on May 28, 2023, 09:11:06 PM

It's not just because of volatility, fraud, etc. that some governments and banks are against Bitcoin. There are more fundamental reasons to it. Decentralization, for instance, is something the governments and banks don't like. So even if Bitcoin isn't as volatile as it is today, we should expect the same unfriendly treatment.

The truth of the matter is that they can't control Bitcoin so they're mad at the technology. This is the truth. Whatever they say is just their own way of attacking Bitcoin subtly, in a way that won't give them a bad name.

Volatility and scams will be resolved quickly if they get bitcoin under control, so that's not really a problem. And you are right, decentralized, non-control is something they will never accept or support bitcoins. But given the strong and unstoppable growth of bitcoin, they will soon accept to some extent is a certainty. I believe all governments will soon accept bitcoin, but accordingly, there will be a series of regulations to oversee it.

You mean under the government's control? No, there's no telling what would likely happen if that will indeed happen but since bitcoin is decentralized, which is a good thing, that makes them powerless in taking over cryptocurrency under their control because it is designed that nobody can own it, even the creator Satoshi himself cannot own as a whole. But being decentralized doesn't stop the government from having benefits over it, if only there are like other countries who are friendly towards it, like El Salvador now.

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Quote from: Accardo on May 28, 2023, 05:08:08 PM

Among the last three terms on my topic, each has representatives, and they've been having disagreements; the Government and banks against Bitcoin. With no tangible reason why it's so? I mean, Electricity came, the government and the bank accepted it and placed an electricity bill, the internet came they both accepted it and the Government works with ISPs to take bills from data subscriptions. Bitcoin came they took advantage of centralized exchanges, yet they're not satisfied. I've read multiple bad reasons placed on bitcoin volatility, fraud, etc, and don't see it tangible because every innovation has its risks and importance.

Bitcoin doesn't need governments or banks to exist, it doesn't need to agree or disagree with the current system either: it just offers you a system with a solid set of rules that you are absolutely free to ignore. It is a decentralized system of voluntary participants, it is an antipode of a fiat system of governments and banks, which is gravely centralized and coercive. Governments don't produce anything, no economic goods they can sell for money, but they need to provide services and defend themselves from citizens: they utilize the fiat system to finance their needs, it is their sole source of income besides taxation and confiscation. With Bitcoin, it is a lot harder for them to tax citizens and confiscate their belongings, it is impossible to finance needs by printing more Bitcoin. Why accept a system that makes you less powerful?

Kryptowerk

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Quote from: Accardo on May 28, 2023, 05:08:08 PM

Among the last three terms on my topic, each has representatives, and they've been having disagreements; the Government and banks against Bitcoin. With no tangible reason why it's so? I mean, Electricity came, the government and the bank accepted it and placed an electricity bill, the internet came they both accepted it and the Government works with ISPs to take bills from data subscriptions. Bitcoin came they took advantage of centralized exchanges, yet they're not satisfied. I've read multiple bad reasons placed on bitcoin volatility, fraud, etc, and don't see it tangible because every innovation has its risks and importance.

On the contrary, why do Bitcoiners quarrel with them? knowing that they, Government and Bank, got no strong evidence to tarnish the image of Bitcoin completely. I think the quarrel will make Bitcoin very famous to the extent that both opponents will have no other option than to submit to Bitcoin.

There were already good answers in this thread, including taxation and control etc.

I would like to add to this: One of the main reasons for major disagreements among all three players is the fact they have completely different underlying reasons for their actions.
- Banks are profit oriented organisations, tangled between legislation and their aim to pull max profit from potential customers.
- Goverments should ideally serve their citizens, however the reality is, most of them try to keep and increase control over them instead.
- Bitcoin is a liberation from both, exaggerated govermental control as well as greedy banksters and associated big corps. It is decentralized (!= banks), it is borderless (!=governments), it is open-source (!= banks & governments), uncensorable and most importantly out of any direct control from both banks and governments.

Just looking at these massive differences or even opposing internal motivations makes it clear why there is disagreement among all three of them.

348Judah

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There will always be a disagreement between them, because the banks and government works in hand while bitcoin remain on it own, the two of ther cannot made or influence any changes on bitcoin such that will work in their favour just as they have been doing with fiat currency because bitcoin is a digital currency and its a p2p network that is decentralized, anyone can decide on how, when and what the market value is with bitcoin before selling or buying it, government will always want people to be under their regulations with the use of fiat because they can control the banks since they are centralized while the p2p network cannot be regulated by any government or financial institutions.

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Quote from: Accardo on May 28, 2023, 05:08:08 PM

Among the last three terms on my topic, each has representatives, and they've been having disagreements; the Government and banks against Bitcoin. With no tangible reason why it's so? I mean, Electricity came, the government and the bank accepted it and placed an electricity bill, the internet came they both accepted it and the Government works with ISPs to take bills from data subscriptions.

Government will never submit to bitcoin because it is a currency that is not from them and both the government and banks sees bitcoin as a threat to fiat currency. The fact is that bitcoin volatile nature and decentralization has given the government less power for easy manipulation and taxation because transactions are done anonymously. In one sentence it shows that they don't benefit from bitcoin and the government feels that every currency should be controlled by them so that they can also have their quarter from your transaction. Internet and electricity can be monitored by the government and they receive taxes from those business. Let us allow them to say or come up with whatever talk on bitcoin, bitcoin awareness will keep on spreading till it gets to all the ends of the earth.

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Quote from: Accardo on May 28, 2023, 05:08:08 PM

Among the last three terms on my topic, each has representatives, and they've been having disagreements; the Government and banks against Bitcoin. With no tangible reason why it's so? I mean, Electricity came, the government and the bank accepted it and placed an electricity bill, the internet came they both accepted it and the Government works with ISPs to take bills from data subscriptions. Bitcoin came they took advantage of centralized exchanges, yet they're not satisfied. I've read multiple bad reasons placed on bitcoin volatility, fraud, etc, and don't see it tangible because every innovation has its risks and importance.

The most basic one is because the government cannot control the Bitcoin system like they control the banks.
Bitcoin is a future technology that offers a unique concept with a fairly good level of privacy that cannot be controlled by any other authority besides the user compared to other electricity and internet technologies that you mentioned that can provide income through the products they produce.
Imagine how many large companies carry out their activities or operate using electricity and the internet.

If governments accept Bitcoin, they assume fiat currency activity will kill itself. From a rough perspective, we can see that printing the amount of fiat currency each year has also benefited them.

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Simply, there is always a struggle between the old and the new. Any new invention in history took decades for society to fully accept it and eventually replace the old system.

This is the logic of historical development, so it is very natural for the old system (banks led by the government) to fight the new system (Bitcoin) but in the end Bitcoin will win because this is the natural logic that evolution works with.

So I am personally optimistic about the future of Bitcoin and that it will eventually get global adoption.

Crypt0Gore

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I've never seen where the government became friendly with something they can't control, why is Russia in war with Ukraine right now? If they can't control something they either take it by force or ruin it and if they can't ruin it they will hate it till the end of time.

If the government loves something, they are getting big benefits from the thing, in the case of Bitcoin, nothing will settle the hatred between the government and Bitcoin, nothing, the only way they can benefit is keep hating and slowing down its adoption, yet causing panic still makes them get some Bitcoin and later dump on the investors.

No one can tell me that the governments are not buying Bitcoin, they like the advantages that comes with having money e.g. making more money but they are mad for not being able to track down Satoshi Nakamoto and take control.

Topic: Why the disagreement between the Government, Bank and Bitcoin? - page 2. (Read 442 times)