Topic: Why today's cryptocurrencies are doomed - page 2. (Read 2991 times)

everything you said just now is insane and makes no sense - but you seem like a nice guy.

moving forward ...

what's the "global ID" all about ?

sound like a winner.

I wouldn't trust a hardware wallet since the hardware can fail. And without backup the money would be gone. And with backup we are back into paper wallets, offline hard drives or MtGox again.

If ordinary banks, PayPal and Visa etc would accept cryptocurrencies, then that would work for ordinary people. There is a great risk however that this will not happen.

An alternative is that new cryptocurrency companies can become trustworthy enough to replace ordinary financial services like banks, PayPal and Visa. But then there is the messy problem of legal regulations.

Grandma has a Hardware wallet - with multi sigs

but she won't call it that, she will call it my.

"Money widget thing" and she will know that if she presses this or that button she can spend money.

- as for long term storage, "Banks" revert back to the original "Coin storage" facilities they were in ancient times, literally they could be just protecting a crypto "Paper bond"  with he ability to "make liquid" that bond and add to your "Money widget thing"

so in summary:

Hardware wallets,  multi-signatures, and storage facilities.

want to hear something terrifying?

just as the "Internet" equalized  information flow , Crypto will "equalized" capital flows, if you haven't figured out what that means, i can say it like this:

its very likely that there will be a "re-balance of wealth".

I'll let you figure out the rest.

For people who are computer savvy and interested in cryptocurrencies, the problems may not be a big deal. That's however only a tiny percentage of all potential users. For the average person the problems with today's cryptocurrencies are obstacles enough to prevent a mainstream adoption.

You would probably trust having your money stored in a bank account. Would you trust having your cryptocurrencies stored in a MtGox?

The EU for example could issue a regulated cryptocurrency:

* Low incentive for hoarding (high currency flow)
* Low volatility (stable value short-term)
* Stable in terms of inflation and deflation
* Decentralized
* Peer-to-peer
* Block chain with encrypted user IDs/wallet addresses (so that the coins don't have to be cold stored)
* Zero transaction fees (low friction)
* Miners that are run by the EU member states as a public service
* Fast and reliable transaction times
* VC Protocol regulated by EU authority
* User ID system regulated by EU authority

As a use case, how will grandma store her QarkCoins? Does she have to print private keys on paper, on a computer disconnected from the Internet, and with several separate copies that later must be put together? That's worse than even money under the mattress! Or does she need a hardware wallet, that needs to be backed up in case of hardware failure? In which case, we are back to square one again with private keys on paper or stored on a hard drive disconnected from the Internet. Extremely cumbersome management.

There is some wallet that uses a 12 word pass phrase or something like that, and then generates private keys with a deterministic algorithm. But would grandma try to remember the whole pass phrase or write it down on paper?

You (of course ) are a :

1. A Sock puppet

2. Talking about a "Global ID"

So your "credibility rating" is currently T*


* Turd.

If you don't want a discussion fuck off back to your WOW game?

This is a great thread. Well, it *was* much better before digitalindustry inserted his senseless propaganda into it..... 


Anywho, I tend to agree with those that see a form of GlobalID coming into existence; something that automatically identifies your place on the blockchain, no matter where you are. However, such a concept is extremely frightening, as it would have serious, serious implications if abused or utilized by nefarious actors, especially actors of the corporate and governmental persuasions.

Too many coins chasing too few dollars. For one coin to succeed, other coins must die.

Nice where did you come from? anyhow we like some argument here:

lets go though your list, i intend to show you why innovation can matter and "Gen 2.0" crypto already exists.


- Quark has an effective 30 second block time, and its in its "EQ period" (see down the list) - both of these things provide some robustness and security. ( also dynamic checkpoints which can be taken off any time)


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- certainly a potential problem but not a deal breaker when you see how Quark has solved the other "issues" Like many other decentralized system Cryptocurrency is similar to say for example "Torrents" - if users are running full nodes they are serving the network, should/could there be some incentive to do this in the future , sure why not. that's the "if we do nothing to the core" scenario, there are of course many other options.



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i'm going to be honest i've not idea what you are talking about? but you could be referring to a theory I proposed which i've called the "use/collapse" paradox , where because mining monopoly in Bitcoin creates price manipulation if the manipulators "use" the entity (Bitcoin) this will cause the market to "price collapse" (Bitcoin) so this causes it to be in effect "kept under the mattress "

lets explain:

Quark is fully distributed except for the EQ reward, this gives benefits (many) and causes some perceived problems  the benefits far outweigh the issues as Quark is priced by the market and moving forward will be used and utilized by the market.



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this ones my favorite but really i don't judge you for being ignorant of it - because when monopoly takes over any system, ignorance and humor grow usually.

The Quark EQ reward  -

EQ)uilibrium R)eward   is just a simple trickle amount of "inflation" 0.4% declining - that allows fees to be replaced, so its is the reward for mining not the generated fees.

To all intents and purposes Quark is fee free, (except for the protections on the "spam transactions"
It can be Fee free because of the this small amount of "inflation" ( which also effectively protects the network from monopoly)

Summary :
The EQ reward is a revolution in Crypto currency.
Quark is "fee free"



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True , generally, not sold on this one totally yet. it gets more complex.
(Quark is not PoS it has the EQ reward.)



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what's a "Government" oh you mean the guys that work directly for the people that issue the currency in to Debt?
the people that issue the currency into Debt are by default the leaders (in most cases) of the government.

next question:

Why would entities that issue debt money ever support ANY debt free system that means they lose all control over the "ongoing mechanics of debt issuance" ?

the answer is they won't and you are living in fantasy land if you think they will (just because.)

if they look like they are supporting it, its because they are either 1. actively destroying it. or 2. working towards that.



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nope that's a Meme and a Myth as well - Quark solved it  ( we believe )

have a look at the charts here:

http://kolinevans.wordpress.com/2014/07/14/an-interesting-thing-happened-on-the-way-to-proving-that-decentralized-free-market-distribution-can-find-price-stability/


full distribution + free market pricing.

volatility is caused because all (most) crypto are price manipulated - once Real economists (Shiller etc)  understand "mining difficulty" they are going to 1. Slap themselves 2. laugh at you guys (just so you know)

Hmm... Interesting idea. There is a project called bitID or something like that. I haven't checked it out yet.

But this possibility seems pretty scary to me.  I'm supposed to put my global idenity into some sort of decentralized information network.  I worry about things like: what if this network is overthrown, who is organizing it?  More importantly, what if the information in this network is used against me?  Ie, people with X, Y, or Z characteristics are deemed unworth to A, B or C.

I'm not saying such a thing won't come to  pass, I just don't see it in our lifetimes.  Who knows, maybe in some future generations though.

Totally agree that current generation cryptos are all doomed, but the problems can be fixed if we see some real innovation in alts. There is the possibility of making our own decentralised global identity system.

One potential danger is that a global ID system (or even local ID systems) will lead to Orwellian control over people. Scary. In the long run we will have artificial intelligence taking care of all of that, but that's technological singularity stuff and hopefully without a Skynet, lol.

I think I finally understand where you are coming from on this.  However, I thing that the kind of "trustlessness" that you're talking about isn't really trustless, it's just trusting in a community.  Indeed, I think this is a powerful idea.  And you might be right about some eventual implementation, I'm not convinced though.  Anyway, I'm glad I finally understand what kind of thing you're referring to.

But don't you want the whole money chain to be trustless? That's what I think we will have in the future. Instead of banks or mattresses the money will be stored on a distributed block chain. And instead of managing private keys, there will be a global user ID system that will keep the money safe and connected to individuals anonymously.

I could be wrong. Such user ID system is easier said than done. Biometrics can be shaky and counterfeit. ID cards can be stolen. Tricky problem.

We will see. Maybe you are right! That there will always be necessary to manage the security of private property oneself or having to trust a third party.

Not 1, not 2, not 3...(/lebron sarcasm off)  but 7  reasons about why today's cc are doomed!
Thanks Anders. This community has been looking for those reasons for 5 years. 

PS. My personal favorite: No.3 

At least in my country, storing money in a bank is mainly trustworthy because of the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation under which deposits to accredited banks are ensured by the USGovt even if the bank fails.  Before the FDIC, putting money under a mattress was a reasonable solution.  Longer term people would buy precious metal or whatever.  I just cant get on board with you that in the future, taking responsibility for yourself will be outdated.

There will be innovations! Thomas Edison failed lots of times before he came up with a functioning light bulb. However, from a conspiracy theory perspective Bitcoin is an invention made by a big power group, and they are one step ahead and will introduce a new cryptocurrency and Bitcoin is "only" their pilot project. So the innovations in this case are then already done. I still think the bitcoin price may reach $5,000 though.

How many people store money under the mattress today? Sure, storing money in the bank is also old-fashioned compared to the future. The trustless part of cryptocurrencies is a major step forward. But trusting oneself isn't trustlessness. That's why I consider having to manage security oneself will sooner or later become outdated.