Will the world soon become tired of the US dollar? - page 2.

DrBeer

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Quote from: shield132 on February 14, 2024, 06:13:35 AM

Quote from: STT on February 11, 2024, 07:43:35 PM

Vietnam for example can undercut China production cost apparently, though cost is only one factor. China has a falling working population which naturally forces up costs, India has great growth for some time in the future but the ability to harness that potential is an open question still. Its never straightforward.

Vietnam can undercut China's production cost but Vietnam doesn't have as much experience in production as China has. Besides costs, we have to consider that factories are already built in China which is another investment and will Vietnamese workers be able to work as fast as Chinese workers do? Companies will have to invest money to improve the skills of Vietnamese workers. China has an advantage over other countries that will be hard to take from them.

Quote from: DrBeer on February 14, 2024, 05:41:13 AM

One simple question - why would normal countries move away from a stable and secured dollar that is guaranteed to be accepted by the whole world for payment ?

Because they don't want to be under the influence of America. It's a huge mechanism of control. Tell me a single reason why dollar, a paper is better than gold standard?

Wonderful answer, thank you so much for it ! In a way I was waiting for it

One question and one clarification then:
1. Can you give arguments in favor of your assumption about "they don't want to be under the influence of America" ?
How do you think the EU's dependence on the US manifests itself, when settling on the world market in dollars and Euros ? Let me make it clear - the Euro is a freely convertible currency, not pegged to the dollar

2. About paper and gold - I absolutely agree with you. But one question - how in the modern world to make sure that countries have declared gold reserves? China and Russia, for example, constantly declare that they buy it in huge quantities, but ... all information on gold reserves (and other key indicators) is CLOSED. In China for 15 years, in Russia for the last 2 years they have classified most of the figures.... How will you confirm the "gold standard" if it's all gold only on paper ? Very interesting to hear the conceptual model of auditing gold reserves, at least in the above countries !

Claudksg

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The world can never get tired of the dollar,the dollar has put it self in a level that it's part of the world's reserved currency.its accepted in so many countries in the world, which the us government has been a lender of the dollar to so many countries over decades.and it has been part of the world's currency for trading.so feel it going to be hard to get tired of the dollar.

slapper

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Quote from: bbigtart on February 11, 2024, 11:37:35 PM

Quote from: serveria.com on February 06, 2024, 06:25:53 PM

Quote from: pinggoki on January 10, 2024, 01:31:26 AM

They'll get tired of it as soon as the empire of US government falls, that's the only way that it can make the world lose interest in the US dollar, the global market is so tied with the US as it's global currency that it's difficult to say that the world will ever get tired. I don't think that people will get tired of it that easy, maybe a flash crash on the USD and we will see something different and I'm proven wrong that we will quickly get tired and replace US dollar but seeing the influence of USA to other countries, I think that it's going to be difficult to happen.

It will, believe me. Same thing happened to all the global reserve currencies before. Pounds, francs, reals, guldens they all are history as a global currency. Same fate awaits the US dollar, the question is not if but when...

Which I believe. In the history of human civilization, no country's glory has lasted forever. The success of a country always ends in collapse, whether due to political, economic factors, natural disasters and so on. Now the signs are in America.

Indeed, currently the US is strong because of the dollar. There is currently little discourse in some countries about the impact of the dollar. The symptoms are starting to be felt, especially if all countries start joining BRICS and start abandoning the dollar. Is the US still strong enough to impose an embargo and become the world's policeman with the power of the dollar? because all countries need dollars, exports and imports use dollars. Therefore, the US arbitrarily imposes an embargo if a country does not comply.

So I believe the dominance of the dollar will end because many countries are fed up with the dollar monopoly system.

We know civilizations emerge and fall from history. However, examining the dollar's dominance reveals worldwide economic interdependence. The dollar is more than currency - it underpins the financial system. However, reliance fosters resentment, which complicates matters. Nations gathering around BRICS? That's strategic pivot, not guesswork. Not only "fed up" - they want autonomy. No doubt, the U.S. has led the world economy with the dollar. But every tool has limits, including the dollar

Your take on economic leverage and embargoes? Right on. Power dynamics change. How and when the dollar's supremacy will decline is the question. The U.S. must adjust as countries diversify away from the dollar. No giant is falling, but the global economy is changing. Adaptability and resilience are key

shield132

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Quote from: STT on February 11, 2024, 07:43:35 PM

Vietnam for example can undercut China production cost apparently, though cost is only one factor. China has a falling working population which naturally forces up costs, India has great growth for some time in the future but the ability to harness that potential is an open question still. Its never straightforward.

Vietnam can undercut China's production cost but Vietnam doesn't have as much experience in production as China has. Besides costs, we have to consider that factories are already built in China which is another investment and will Vietnamese workers be able to work as fast as Chinese workers do? Companies will have to invest money to improve the skills of Vietnamese workers. China has an advantage over other countries that will be hard to take from them.

Quote from: DrBeer on February 14, 2024, 05:41:13 AM

One simple question - why would normal countries move away from a stable and secured dollar that is guaranteed to be accepted by the whole world for payment ?

Because they don't want to be under the influence of America. It's a huge mechanism of control. Tell me a single reason why dollar, a paper is better than gold standard?

DrBeer

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Quote from: Abiky on February 13, 2024, 09:22:21 AM

Exactly. Empires rise and fall. The US is no exception. We're already seeing countries moving away from the USD. The Biden administration has accelerated the process by weaponizing the currency. Without strong support from leading countries, the USD will eventually lose its position as the reserve currency of the world. This could take a few years or decades to happen.

My guess is that either Bitcoin, the Euro, or the Chinese Yuan will take over the world as the world's next reserve currency. The question is: Are we ready for this change? No one can predict the future, so lets hope for the best.

One simple question - why would normal countries move away from a stable and secured dollar that is guaranteed to be accepted by the whole world for payment ?
Euro is a good currency, but it has many problems - the EU is not homogeneous, and has a lot of economies that create "ballast". The purpose of the ecu/euro was not so much to fight the dollar as to unify payments in Europe. Chinese yuan ? Don't be ridiculous - the Chinese economy is in a very difficult situation with a very bad outlook. Bitcoin ? Never a decentralized currency system will become international. It is simply not profitable for the world economy to switch to a basket of multi-currencies, especially dubious ones like the yuan. There may be settlements in national currencies between some countries/unions, for internal settlements, but the world market works on the dollar, and there is no substitute for it yet

Abiky

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Quote from: bbigtart on February 11, 2024, 11:37:35 PM

Which I believe. In the history of human civilization, no country's glory has lasted forever. The success of a country always ends in collapse, whether due to political, economic factors, natural disasters and so on. Now the signs are in America.

Indeed, currently the US is strong because of the dollar. There is currently little discourse in some countries about the impact of the dollar. The symptoms are starting to be felt, especially if all countries start joining BRICS and start abandoning the dollar. Is the US still strong enough to impose an embargo and become the world's policeman with the power of the dollar? because all countries need dollars, exports and imports use dollars. Therefore, the US arbitrarily imposes an embargo if a country does not comply.

So I believe the dominance of the dollar will end because many countries are fed up with the dollar monopoly system.

Exactly. Empires rise and fall. The US is no exception. We're already seeing countries moving away from the USD. The Biden administration has accelerated the process by weaponizing the currency. Without strong support from leading countries, the USD will eventually lose its position as the reserve currency of the world. This could take a few years or decades to happen.

My guess is that either Bitcoin, the Euro, or the Chinese Yuan will take over the world as the world's next reserve currency. The question is: Are we ready for this change? No one can predict the future, so lets hope for the best.

bbigtart

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Quote from: serveria.com on February 06, 2024, 06:25:53 PM

Quote from: pinggoki on January 10, 2024, 01:31:26 AM

They'll get tired of it as soon as the empire of US government falls, that's the only way that it can make the world lose interest in the US dollar, the global market is so tied with the US as it's global currency that it's difficult to say that the world will ever get tired. I don't think that people will get tired of it that easy, maybe a flash crash on the USD and we will see something different and I'm proven wrong that we will quickly get tired and replace US dollar but seeing the influence of USA to other countries, I think that it's going to be difficult to happen.

It will, believe me. Same thing happened to all the global reserve currencies before. Pounds, francs, reals, guldens they all are history as a global currency. Same fate awaits the US dollar, the question is not if but when...

Which I believe. In the history of human civilization, no country's glory has lasted forever. The success of a country always ends in collapse, whether due to political, economic factors, natural disasters and so on. Now the signs are in America.

Indeed, currently the US is strong because of the dollar. There is currently little discourse in some countries about the impact of the dollar. The symptoms are starting to be felt, especially if all countries start joining BRICS and start abandoning the dollar. Is the US still strong enough to impose an embargo and become the world's policeman with the power of the dollar? because all countries need dollars, exports and imports use dollars. Therefore, the US arbitrarily imposes an embargo if a country does not comply.

So I believe the dominance of the dollar will end because many countries are fed up with the dollar monopoly system.

Hispo

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Quote from: trendcoin on February 11, 2024, 07:34:22 PM

The world has to get tired of the US dollar, but it also has to get tired of fiat currencies. Nothing changes for us if we replace one fiat currency with another... When elephants fight, the grass gets trampled more. Whether an elephant wins or loses does not mean anything to us. Of course, instead of one elephant being king, it is better if two elephants are of equal power and find a compromise, because then they won't fight temporarily and they won't hurt the grass. However, getting rid of the elephants should be our priority...

If we talk from the point of view of a person which values the complete decentralization of economy, then yes. Getting rid of Fiat as an applied economical concept in your nations and in the international market would be an ideal scenario, though in real life the ideal scenarios barely happen and are very difficult to find or reach.
What I am personally expecting to happen is Bitcoin and other alternative currencies to co-exist with the traditional assets and Fiats on the long term; governments are not willing to lose control over the macroeconomcal factors which influence on the value of goods and services, to accelerate or deaccelerate inflation in society, etc. I would be even willing to theorize those governments with a very high local/public spending would not be even willing to break even if they did not have the ability to print more more or acquire more debt. It would take the price of Bitcoin to reach new high levels and those republics to heavily invest in mining infrastructure in order to continue to function and fun themselves, in a world where money is Bitcoin alone. They will never be willing to go through those situation, Thurs their antagonistic position on BTC and alternative currencies.

STT

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Its been a long time coming is what we can say for sure, I can bring up a video of France's leader post WW2 complaining about the amounts of excessive spending by USA in its space program vs USSR and how they would only take gold in great doubt at the long term value of Dollar. That leader was proved right to a large extent as dollar notes have declined greatly yet Dollar is king still and backer of the global reserve system used by most nations central banks.

Quote

BRICS now controls almost 28% of a global economy

Control is a strong word in a free market economy. The production by many countries is vital to the success of others but theres always some other nation who wants that business also. Vietnam for example can undercut China production cost apparently, though cost is only one factor. China has a falling working population which naturally forces up costs, India has great growth for some time in the future but the ability to harness that potential is an open question still. Its never straightforward.

trendcoin

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The world has to get tired of the US dollar, but it also has to get tired of fiat currencies. Nothing changes for us if we replace one fiat currency with another... When elephants fight, the grass gets trampled more. Whether an elephant wins or loses does not mean anything to us. Of course, instead of one elephant being king, it is better if two elephants are of equal power and find a compromise, because then they won't fight temporarily and they won't hurt the grass. However, getting rid of the elephants should be our priority...

South Park

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Quote from: serveria.com on February 08, 2024, 09:45:18 AM

It's very logical, unfortunately governments are anti-Bitcoin by design. To them, Bitcoin means anarchy, tax evasion, money laundering and other crime. There are some pro-Bitcoin governments, mostly thanks to several personalities (like Nayib Bukele) who are Bitcoin hodlers themselves. But give Bitcoin some time and I'm sure it will become a global reserve currency eventually.

Governments are on the business of printing money and bitcoin is a competitor that affects them directly, as if they were to print more of their currency but a significant amount of people are holding bitcoin then they cannot use the inflation tax against them, so most governments will resist bitcoin, especially those that are the most powerful, fortunately many other countries will see in bitcoin an opportunity to bring investments to their country and they will be willing to accept losing some control just to bring so of that wealth to their territory, which is why I think bitcoin still has a bright future despite all the measures which governments around the world have taken against it.

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Quote from: Abiky on February 06, 2024, 02:56:40 PM

Quote from: Barikui1 on February 05, 2024, 03:27:48 AM

Yes, It's very obvious that most countries around the world expecially the brics nations are no longer using dollars to trade again, due to the fact that most of them knows that the American are now using it as a weapon against countries around the world that doesn't do their bidings, and to me this is the beginning of the end of the dollar dominance in world trade, because when the brics nations finally launch the brics currency, the us dollar would not be needed anymore by the brics nations, even now, they have stop using the us dollar, so the dedollarization process is already on now.

Weaponizing currencies was never a good idea. It adds more "fuel" to rising geopolitical tensions. Countries must work together to make our world a better place. I'm afraid the COVID-19 pandemic and wars have damaged the mainstream economy to a point beyond repair. The US has its days numbered due to ever-increasing national debt. With more countries abandoning the USD, it should only be a matter of time before American hegomony becomes history.

Instead of BRICS having its own currency, why not adopt Bitcoin instead? With some countries already adopting it as legal tender, there's a possibility Bitcoin will become the reserve currency of the world. That's assuming scaling and volatility issues are put down to rest. It's an uncertain future, so we can only hope for the best. Undecided

It's very logical, unfortunately governments are anti-Bitcoin by design. To them, Bitcoin means anarchy, tax evasion, money laundering and other crime. There are some pro-Bitcoin governments, mostly thanks to several personalities (like Nayib Bukele) who are Bitcoin hodlers themselves. But give Bitcoin some time and I'm sure it will become a global reserve currency eventually.

WillyAp

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Quote from: tread93 on February 03, 2024, 09:31:30 PM

I highly doubt it.

People have been saying that the US dollar will become less of a reserve currency globally for decades now. And its status has simply not changed. And it's not going to until there is a system reset worldwide where all fiat depreciate in value.

true and it shows the detachment of Poiticians to citizens

Davian144

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Quote from: NewRanger on February 03, 2024, 11:39:01 PM

Quote from: Cryptomultiplier on January 09, 2024, 05:45:02 PM

Are we seeing a time where BRICS currency and cryptocurrencies are the answer to a world tired of the us dollar?

In reality, the world is still very dependent on the dollar, for example in the aspect of international trade. Indeed, the BRICS Countries are doing this as an effort to reduce dependency and we must respect that too. Regarding the relevance of the BRICS cryptocurrency, I think that as long as there is supply and demand in the cryptocurrency market, it will work and on the other hand it requires strong cooperation and coordination so that it can run according to the initial goals.

In terms of seeking strong cooperation and coordination between cryptocurrency and BRICS for the same goal, it will certainly not be easy because each party also has its own concept which should not be disturbed by the same goal. Although this must be done so that some or all countries no longer have dependence on the dollar currency in any way, including in terms of international trade.

Because when there are more currencies that are willing to be accepted into international trade, of course the dollar is no longer seen as the only currency that can be used in international trade. So the association of countries that are members of BRICS can respect each other's concepts so that their goals can run smoothly to shift the dependence of many countries on the dollar currency.

slapper

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Quote from: Abiky on February 06, 2024, 02:56:40 PM

Quote from: Barikui1 on February 05, 2024, 03:27:48 AM

Yes, It's very obvious that most countries around the world expecially the brics nations are no longer using dollars to trade again, due to the fact that most of them knows that the American are now using it as a weapon against countries around the world that doesn't do their bidings, and to me this is the beginning of the end of the dollar dominance in world trade, because when the brics nations finally launch the brics currency, the us dollar would not be needed anymore by the brics nations, even now, they have stop using the us dollar, so the dedollarization process is already on now.

Weaponizing currencies was never a good idea. It adds more "fuel" to rising geopolitical tensions. Countries must work together to make our world a better place. I'm afraid the COVID-19 pandemic and wars have damaged the mainstream economy to a point beyond repair. The US has its days numbered due to ever-increasing national debt. With more countries abandoning the USD, it should only be a matter of time before American hegomony becomes history.

Instead of BRICS having its own currency, why not adopt Bitcoin instead? With some countries already adopting it as legal tender, there's a possibility Bitcoin will become the reserve currency of the world. That's assuming scaling and volatility issues are put down to rest. It's an uncertain future, so we can only hope for the best. Undecided

Currency weaponization is a bad game. But that the mainstream economy is irreparable? This is exaggerated. Resilient economies adapt. The US national debt is massive, but it won't end American dominion. Countries have recovered from adversity throughout history

Your Bitcoin plan? Visionary, not just viable. Countries adopting Bitcoin as legal tender is a brave move toward financial sovereignty and away from currency conflicts. Do not oversimplify. Making Bitcoin a worldwide reserve currency involves more than addressing scalability and volatility. It requires a paradigm shift in how governments value and trust digital assets

BRICS adopting Bitcoin? The notion is intriguing, yet it avoids consensus. Each member has its own economic objective, making a coordinated Bitcoin move difficult but not impossible. Can these nations choose global stability over personal gain? It's ambitious but possible. Bitcoin supporters want a decentralized future where financial power is spread, not concentrated

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Quote from: pinggoki on January 10, 2024, 01:31:26 AM

They'll get tired of it as soon as the empire of US government falls, that's the only way that it can make the world lose interest in the US dollar, the global market is so tied with the US as it's global currency that it's difficult to say that the world will ever get tired. I don't think that people will get tired of it that easy, maybe a flash crash on the USD and we will see something different and I'm proven wrong that we will quickly get tired and replace US dollar but seeing the influence of USA to other countries, I think that it's going to be difficult to happen.

It will, believe me. Same thing happened to all the global reserve currencies before. Pounds, francs, reals, guldens they all are history as a global currency. Same fate awaits the US dollar, the question is not if but when...

Abiky

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Quote from: Barikui1 on February 05, 2024, 03:27:48 AM

Yes, It's very obvious that most countries around the world expecially the brics nations are no longer using dollars to trade again, due to the fact that most of them knows that the American are now using it as a weapon against countries around the world that doesn't do their bidings, and to me this is the beginning of the end of the dollar dominance in world trade, because when the brics nations finally launch the brics currency, the us dollar would not be needed anymore by the brics nations, even now, they have stop using the us dollar, so the dedollarization process is already on now.

Weaponizing currencies was never a good idea. It adds more "fuel" to rising geopolitical tensions. Countries must work together to make our world a better place. I'm afraid the COVID-19 pandemic and wars have damaged the mainstream economy to a point beyond repair. The US has its days numbered due to ever-increasing national debt. With more countries abandoning the USD, it should only be a matter of time before American hegomony becomes history.

Instead of BRICS having its own currency, why not adopt Bitcoin instead? With some countries already adopting it as legal tender, there's a possibility Bitcoin will become the reserve currency of the world. That's assuming scaling and volatility issues are put down to rest. It's an uncertain future, so we can only hope for the best. Undecided

shield132

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The world might change USD with a new currency because empires never last forever and America will fall but the problem is that the world significantly depends on USD and it will be painful to change it with something different. For example, in my country we have a national currency but we value things in USD, we trade in USD when we want to buy or sell a house, car, smartphone or etc. We all value Bitcoin in USD, which should give everyone a good answer. When we want to convert bitcoin to national currency, we might directly see the price in national currency but it's firstly converted in USD and then from USD to national currency.
Process of changing USD with something new will be hard and painful because there will be a fight for leadership.

Barikui1

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Yes, It's very obvious that most countries around the world expecially the brics nations are no longer using dollars to trade again, due to the fact that most of them knows that the American are now using it as a weapon against countries around the world that doesn't do their bidings, and to me this is the beginning of the end of the dollar dominance in world trade, because when the brics nations finally launch the brics currency, the us dollar would not be needed anymore by the brics nations, even now, they have stop using the us dollar, so the dedollarization process is already on now.

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Quote from: Abiky on February 04, 2024, 08:23:32 PM

Quote from: magneto on February 02, 2024, 06:57:10 AM

I highly doubt it.

People have been saying that the US dollar will become less of a reserve currency globally for decades now. And its status has simply not changed. And it's not going to until there is a system reset worldwide where all fiat depreciate in value.

In that instance, I don't think that the replacement would be any other fiat currency either, no matter how strong their economy may be. It is almost guaranteed to be a cryptocurrency, and BTC is the most obvious candidate at the moment.

Empires are not meant to last forever. The Roman Empire was thought to be "invincible", only to be defeated by barbarians. I believe the same fate awaits the US in the long run. Slowly but surely, the US Dollar will lose its position as the reserve currency of the world.

The "de-dollarization" process has already begun. Add to that the rising national debt of trillions of USD, and you will realize that the collapse of American hegemony is imminent. Maybe it won't happen during our lifetimes. But it will happen sooner or later. The question is: How prepared the world is after a sudden collapse of the US Dollar? Grin

one day the world will inevitably have to prepare to face this, remembering that it is true that nothing is eternal, for example we have to change our behavior during a pandemic, and everyone must be able to survive to earn income to support their survival, even though it is difficult , but until now in fact many have been able to survive, and provide new habits, where we are now used to the online system

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