Winklevoss Bitcoin Trust (COIN ETF) to Launch in 2014

wachtwoord

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: wachtwoord on September 17, 2014, 11:32:20 AM

ETF is not priced in at all. Just watch the price when they announce this is approved.

Absolutely it is - People might think to hold for a week or 2 here on Bitstamp and Huobi - but if price doubles that means the ETF price would double, therefore mean the USD wont be buying the coin off Nasdaq at a greater loop they will just wait until they figure where their entry level wants to be.

Its not like these coins are NEW and being purchased as such, these are old coins and without new fiat they sit in Winklviis hands, is this really what they want? More than likely no as they want to make USD off fees in the business otherwise they would have just held the coins in paper wallets themselves and saved a shit ton of money in not paying to get ETF passed.

I'm very sure you are very wrong. We'll see when the ETF is approved who of us is correct

wachtwoord

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Posted this in another thread to response to Cluster2k's comment - thought it would be good here

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: Cluster2k on September 17, 2014, 08:45:50 AM

The bitcoin ETF has already been priced in, as has increased retailer acceptance of bitcoin. We know it's going to happen, just not exactly when. Market participants read the same forums we do.

We need some good old markus and willy inspired manipulation of the market to make this rocket go boom again.

Yes & No

The ETF has been priced in accordingly in my views also, what we don't know is what is Winklvii is going to do with the USD income from the initial sells of the ETF shares.

There will be 1M shares (200,000 BTC) - which equate 1 share to 0.2BTC in principle (excluding holding fees, trading costs, etc) - So assuming right now at $450 per BTC a shares value is $90USD. Making the full 1M shares if they choose to sell that way worth $90 M USD (assuming someone buys all instantly)

Now what does the Winklvii do

1. Pocket $90 USD and hold onto their own personal BTC stash
2. Buy more BTC with for themselves and make profits off of holding/trades in ETF
3. Buy more BTC to add to the 1M shares at same rate of 0.2BTC/ETF share
4. Combo of all options

This is what is not priced into ETF

ETF is not priced in at all. Just watch the price when they announce this is approved.

maker88

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Quote from: ajareselde on September 17, 2014, 10:59:03 AM

Quote from: addroup on September 17, 2014, 10:08:05 AM

Quote from: MNDan on September 17, 2014, 10:03:55 AM

Why would anyone be "excited" about this ETF when Bitcoin has dropped over 50% of it's value since the beginning of the year? Now if it becomes available around the same time that we break this losing streak, then things could get crazy quick, but right now it wouldn't be looking like a very good investment to anyone IMHO.

It's a good investment because it dropped over 50%, not the contrary, now bitcoin is undervalued and will recover fast.

not everything is as black and white as you see it.
the whole market is still not big enough to not allow manipulation.
there is simply no way of knowing what will happen next, but as long as its still being talked about, its good to invest.
thats my opinion anyways..

Not big enough to allow manipulation? The bitcoin market is obviously hugely manipulated and has been all year. Small markets are not harder to manipulate than large ones, quite the opposite actually.

ajareselde

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Satoshi is rolling in his grave. #bitcoin

Quote from: addroup on September 17, 2014, 10:08:05 AM

Quote from: MNDan on September 17, 2014, 10:03:55 AM

Why would anyone be "excited" about this ETF when Bitcoin has dropped over 50% of it's value since the beginning of the year? Now if it becomes available around the same time that we break this losing streak, then things could get crazy quick, but right now it wouldn't be looking like a very good investment to anyone IMHO.

It's a good investment because it dropped over 50%, not the contrary, now bitcoin is undervalued and will recover fast.

not everything is as black and white as you see it.
the whole market is still not big enough to not allow manipulation.
there is simply no way of knowing what will happen next, but as long as its still being talked about, its good to invest.
thats my opinion anyways..

addroup

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Quote from: MNDan on September 17, 2014, 10:03:55 AM

Why would anyone be "excited" about this ETF when Bitcoin has dropped over 50% of it's value since the beginning of the year? Now if it becomes available around the same time that we break this losing streak, then things could get crazy quick, but right now it wouldn't be looking like a very good investment to anyone IMHO.

It's a good investment because it dropped over 50%, not the contrary, now bitcoin is undervalued and will recover fast.

sally87

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Quote from: MNDan on September 17, 2014, 10:03:55 AM

Why would anyone be "excited" about this ETF when Bitcoin has dropped over 50% of it's value since the beginning of the year? Now if it becomes available around the same time that we break this losing streak, then things could get crazy quick, but right now it wouldn't be looking like a very good investment to anyone IMHO.

Hello, this is creating a bubble. Don't you think? You read the document from the winklevoss? You saw that on btc-e the price went up to 3200€. And nobody knew why. Look this at youtube. ''Bitcoin naar 3200€ gestegen''.

MNDan

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Why would anyone be "excited" about this ETF when Bitcoin has dropped over 50% of it's value since the beginning of the year? Now if it becomes available around the same time that we break this losing streak, then things could get crazy quick, but right now it wouldn't be looking like a very good investment to anyone IMHO.

sally87

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When they come with it, the big boys will buy a lot first of all. And there is no regulation now so they can do that. And people from the nasdaq will do it either. Look on google and type bitcoin 3200euro on bitcointalk. They are not stupid and before the good news comes they will buy a lot. And nasdaq will not ban this, because David Lavalle said allready about Bitcoin to Nasdaq, ''It's a win-win situation". So what you think if the Vice-President of Nasdaq say this in a interview?

CryptoCarmen

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Quote from: stonerider on September 17, 2014, 08:24:24 AM

Has it been approved yet?

Might never be.

stonerider

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Has it been approved yet?

ltbharley

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: wachtwoord on September 17, 2014, 08:05:37 AM

Does anyone whether this will be public information immediately? I mean, it really is quite simple to take advantage of such knowledge in advance in the Bitcoin market and I doubt there exist any laws against it.

If/When the ETF is approved within 2 hours of approval it will be on the major media sites.

After that it will be 2-6 weeks before its released on the Nasdaq for purchasing, this will give people time to anticipate it. Some already are ready for it. Wink

2 hours is too much, by that time the value would have increased by 100%... I'd want to know the news after 1 second.

wachtwoord

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: wachtwoord on September 17, 2014, 08:05:37 AM

Does anyone whether this will be public information immediately? I mean, it really is quite simple to take advantage of such knowledge in advance in the Bitcoin market and I doubt there exist any laws against it.

If/When the ETF is approved within 2 hours of approval it will be on the major media sites.

After that it will be 2-6 weeks before its released on the Nasdaq for purchasing, this will give people time to anticipate it. Some already are ready for it. Wink

Okay, so an approval cannot be kept confidential (or tentatively approved) for a week or something before it's made transparent to the world?

wachtwoord

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Quote from: trotter55 on September 16, 2014, 12:48:26 PM

Quote from: grappa_barricata on September 16, 2014, 12:36:36 PM

When it will be about to be launched you will recognize it by the increased liquidity in the books of the exchanges. At that point you'll know that the launch is a matter of days.

If it launches the regulators will have to announce they have approved it first. Once the regulators either reject, or approve it they will announce their decision.

Does anyone whether this will be public information immediately? I mean, it really is quite simple to take advantage of such knowledge in advance in the Bitcoin market and I doubt there exist any laws against it.

g35fan

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Quote from: lyth0s on September 15, 2014, 01:39:27 AM

How long has it said "The Trust is a common law trust, formed on [ ], 2014 under New York law
pursuant to the Trust Agreement..." for? Was it recently updated to state this?

Bingo. It used to say 2013 and was updated to say 2014. It could very easily be updated to say 2015.

View this link to the way back machine screenshot back in 2013:

http://web.archive.org/web/20131025054554/http://www.nasdaq.com/markets/ipos/company/winklevoss-bitcoin-trust-909930-72927

grappa_barricata

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Quote from: trotter55 on September 16, 2014, 12:48:26 PM

Quote from: grappa_barricata on September 16, 2014, 12:36:36 PM

When it will be about to be launched you will recognize it by the increased liquidity in the books of the exchanges. At that point you'll know that the launch is a matter of days.

If it launches the regulators will have to announce they have approved it first. Once the regulators either reject, or approve it they will announce their decision.

That's a good point. Lets watch both the books depth and the official news channels then. I don't think it can be regulated out at this point.

trotter55

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Quote from: grappa_barricata on September 16, 2014, 12:36:36 PM

When it will be about to be launched you will recognize it by the increased liquidity in the books of the exchanges. At that point you'll know that the launch is a matter of days.

If it launches the regulators will have to announce they have approved it first. Once the regulators either reject, or approve it they will announce their decision.

grappa_barricata

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When it will be about to be launched you will recognize it by the increased liquidity in the books of the exchanges. At that point you'll know that the launch is a matter of days.

sally87

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Quote from: Hunyadi on September 16, 2014, 06:57:18 AM

Quote from: sally87 on September 16, 2014, 06:12:25 AM

Yes i'm here again Cheesy

Read this article. http://bostinno.streetwise.co/2014/07/10/nasdaq-coin-winklevoss-bitcoin-fund-ticker/

Do you have more links to old articles? Roll Eyes

David Lavalle said this 5 weeks ago. And for me this are not new articles, butt maybe for other people it is? Or i talk bullshit now. I don't thinks so. Everyday new people want to dicover Bitcoin or there come new members to bitcointalk. So for them it's interesting,l correct?

Hunyadi

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