Topic: Would you live on a seastead? (Read 535 times)

Yes and No. YES because as a persona who loves some peace and calm far away from human noise and machines its a great idea. Also because I love playing with water, water sports.
No because safety is kind of not really guaranteed with the current unstable global climate change. And a seastead its a very expensive thng to build looking at the type of modern technology needed to have a satisfied one that meets the requirements as recommended by engineers. 

The idea of the seastead is very great or you can say that it is the most unique or most interesting idea i have ever heard, But i have some question  that the standard of the living of the people is increasing day  by day but already some people are living in the middle class but they do not have enough money to live like a place like this. But if the company is supported this idea by the people then that means the idea is great and people are willing to pay for this.

That would be amazing right.

I think this could have great potential. It reminds me of some of Jacques Fresco's ideas. I'm pretty sure he even talked about building cities on the water. Some people are concerned about there not being enough land for people to live on. I don't think that's actually a problem, but if it were, there is certainly plenty of water to live on. I love the idea of having a clean slate when it comes to government and law. In many countries, so many stupid laws have been created over the years that it is virtually impossible to clean them up. It would be great to start from scratch. I think that a community like this will attract some of the most progressive thinker on our planet, plus they automatically have to be rich to get in on this project in the early stages. I think it's something I would definitely try. Maybe it would even be so good I would stay there for good.

I've read about this before. I think that one of the main ideas is that you can basically start your own society independent of other governments' rules. I think they are just starting in conjunction with other countries because you need a base to start building from. I've read that one application of seasteading could be to have skilled programmer from India, for example, like off the coast of California. It could be easier than having them immigrate to the United States. They could just work from the water and people from the "mainland" could come and visit them as needed. They also probably wouldn't have to pay taxes, which sounds pretty nice. I think I would give it a shot.

Aw, you're just upset because you want all that ocean-going plastic for yourself when you get your floating island built.

 

There are tons of plastic on land. Maybe that could be burned for electricity before trying to get the nano-particles from the ocean.

You could scour the oceans for all that discarded plastic that is floating around in them - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Pacific_garbage_patch - burn it to boil water in a small steam engine onboard your vessel, use the engine to generate electricity for your crypto mining.

Living on the sea is what I would have dreamed of. But this requires a lot of money, which I do not have. I think that these funds will appear in me in the crypto currency.

I personally couldn't , I dont like the idea of it , but i know others who would really be intrested in this and would be willing. I think it would take courage

Blue Frontiers is looking at the initial homes to be around $200k per home on average.

Unlike land though, the hope is that the cost of manufacturing for these seasteads comes down making property cheaper with more innovation.

I think this is more convenient to criminals to serve as their hometown and by thus way their would be a lot of process implemented and they cannot esccape at high levels of security. I think it is not applicable to serve as a homeland. For vacation purposes rather it could be.

Looking at the project the pilot project will likely need to still import food. Space will be a premium and building farmland vs oceanfront property for tourists will tend toward the profit made from tourists.

Not until the cost of the platforms is down very low will farming be more prevalent. But the company, Blue21, that is doing the design for the Floating Island Project is already working on floating farms.

Energy, water, etc. will be created on the platform.

When will floating island nations be able to produce and manufacture all the goods we need to live?

In a tsunami the safest place to be is floating on the water far away from shore. You probably wouldn't even notice.

It is a great thing to see this kind of innovation. But if I would offered to have it, I would probably say no. Yes, government somehow sucks but it is better to have it. I don't know but I think government makes everything just perfectly ordered. Another thing is it is not safe to have it because it is full of danger in sea than of the land. Another thing is that I am afraid of seas as I see it as an empty space. This is just my opinion. I would still choose to be here in what I used to be.

I guess that for the foreseeable future, we shall not consider a seastead as a permanent place to live. But it could be a good place for a summer vacation, or a second home. I sure could enjoy spending a few weeks a year there. More? I need to give it a try, first. So I'll hope they'll start with the building of a nice hotel.

A bit like the people from New York who all their life, go to Florida for their summer vacation, before moving there permanently when they retire.

I prefer to belong to any state. And do not be in free swimming. But everyone can choose the state and everyone can move there.

It would be fun living there. It is very beautiful. But I think it is safer in the country.

This is a very next concept but for the sake of tsunamis, I think that i am going to say a big no with them being so far away from others, what will happen in the case of an emergency.

The hope is for it to be a great hub for blockchain incubation. The whole economy will be crypto based so anyone in this field will find a welcome environment for doing so.

As well as just about anything you would do in any city.

My idea is to open up an underwater bar that you have to SCUBA dive to.

The reality is that most people do not truly want freedom. They just like the slogans.

For the rest of us, there's Bitcoin and seasteading.

The promise of the kind of freedom it can give is very enticing but at the same time, it's also frightening--- let's not forget "Lord of the Flies". 

It is nice and all living in the sea, but what if a very strong typhoon passes by? Is it any safer than being on land instead?

@Elwar, pretty convincing answer.

I like the idea, I'll be watching with interest.

I prefer to live in the mainland, and have a house in the village, not on seastead, because the main reason I do not like to live here is because I am not good at swimming and scared with water, so although attractive and luxurious, I still prefer to live in the township land, though small but comfortable in my feelings

As the tech improves the ability to live on any part of the ocean will grow.

The first seastead will likely be in a calm lagoon by a host country. The evolution from there will be to build 12nm out from a nation in a location with waves. Once that has proven itself then a seastead 200nm out will be the goal. At that point you're in the open ocean and it's mostly the same other than going where there are less hurricanes and less rogue waves.

It is likely that going into any area with large waves will require floating wave breakers and those will likely use the power of the waves to create energy.

The earth is covered 70% by water. There is more space to live there than on land. I doubt any single entity can buy every seastead considering even a small group of people can find an open part of the water to move and not be under their thumb.

This is definitely a situation where technology will ruin the plans of centralized powers, much like Bitcoin.

I like to adventure and enjoy the quiet and not too special places where it is comfortable but I do not like to live on the sea

I realise it may take a while, but...

Won't this idea eventually suffer from the same problems that land based homesteading did? There are only so many inhabitable parts of the ocean, and the good spots will naturally attract more people, which in turn will naturally attract intelligent psychopaths that want to impose self-serving rules on those living there. How do you vote with your house if smart egomaniacs create a worldwide seasteading governance cartel? These clever assholes will even collude to make the rules are superficially different between the seastead communities, and so the illusion of choice begins all over again.

Or is the tech likely to become so flexible that a very high percentage of the ocean (60-80% maybe?) is affordably inhabitable?

It's just a great idea! I would really like to live in such a place. The only thing I don't understand is whether it is moving or standing still?

No, I like solid ground and nature too much to give it up. However, I'll be rooting for seasteads to succeed in a big way.

Judging by the photograph, it will be something like a floating island. Of course, this is very interesting. However, to maintain order, you will need to create something like a microstate. In any case, it would be possible to create decentralized stock exchanges and exchange kriptovalyuty.

I guess I'm too new to this forum to easily figure out how to vote yes. But I am planning to have a residence on the first seastead as well. I've been working on this project since 2011, and I am excited to see it taking shape. We're lucky to have @elwar on the team. I probably won't post much here, but I know Elwar can answer questions about Blue Frontiers and The Seasteading Institute.

The idea is very good and attractive, but there is a question as a legislative part will be carried out and who will monitor performance of laws. Or in plans some subspecies of anarchy?

The ICO thread is here:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/annicovar-blue-frontiers-varyon-sustainable-floating-islands-3708700

Go check it out.

Feel free to discuss seasteading in this thread.

What types of governments do you think the different seasteads will produce? Do you think some will win out and some lose if people can vote with their homes.

There will be an alt coin thread dedicated specifically to the token, Vary on.

This one is for discussion of sea steading in general and the current project under way to make sea steading happen.

It is Bitcoin and block chain related in that most of the economy and governance will be block chain based and Bitcoin will certainly be popular at most of the businesses along with basically any currency anyone wants to accept.
The nice thing about this is that Blue Frontiers has first mover advantage. No competitors. The Sea standing
 Institute, which was founded by Patri Friedman and funded initially by Peter Thiel, has been around since 2008 but they merely promote the idea of sea standing and do research. They're non-profit so they can't actually build anything.

Your former engineering questions answer the latter question about why a host country is needed.

Previous seasteading projects focused on having a seastead out in international waters (200nm away from any country) with estimates being in the hundreds of millions of dollars (just look at the cost of an oil rig to get an idea of cost). The hope is that we can come up with some better engineering that will get that price down over time. There are so many different things to consider when trying to create a seastead in international waters that not experimenting would be a rather foolish way to risk so much money.

This has resulted in considering a phased approach.

Phase 1 is building a pilot seastead in a protected lagoon of a host country.
Phase 2 is moving/building 12nm out from that location giving more sovereignty while having the challenge of open water, while maintaining a lifeline to the host nation.
Phase 3 is full sovereignty 200nm out in international waters.

Having a host country lets Blue Frontiers build in a protected lagoon which allows for working out such concepts as you mentioned, governance, citizenship, sustainability, engineering, etc. All things that might sound good on paper but once on an actual seastead might have complications that nobody ever considered. It also allows some hybridization so that baby steps can be taken. Food, for example, will be difficult to grow initially and is likely more cost effective to just buy it from the host nation. Internet can more easily be transmitted to the seastead. Many initial requirements can be covered in an incremental approach which allows Blue Frontiers to raise a smaller amount of money up front and grow from there.

A host country also gives the protection of the military which would be an even larger economic cost to a fledgling new seastead in international waters.

With the Special Economic Zone Blue Frontiers will be given some economic leeway which will allow for some initial experiments in governance but will still be under French Polynesia criminal law so rape, theft, murder, etc will have a fully functional justice system to take care of such things without needing to start from scratch.

fascinating concept - very waterworld. i love it.

but i wonder how big can the structure get vertically and horizontally? what happens during a (rare) typhoon or tsunami? what is in place to guarantee a democratic approach to governance, and would there be citizenship and all the other things that come with being a part of a country?

why on earth does seasteading need a host country??

Happy to see this discussion starting. We will be creating a thread for Varyon as well as for our ICO bounty program this week if anyone is interested in learning more and following our progress.

The first seastead will not be affordable for everybody (the same price per square meters as in big cities).
At the beginning a car was very expensive and only a few people can afford it. Nowadays a lot of people own a car or rent one.
There should be a start for living on water and this start is happening now.
And there will be cryptocurrencies to use, buy services there.

I think eventually it will be affordable. You at least need low income workers for many things so you would be required to have low costing housing.

The plan is to have seasteads all over the world and once they're in international waters there will be no visa requirements (other than local requirements).

I agree. Building something in middle of the sea is daunting and it will take several years before that will happen. It would be much better to do a gradual approach such as starting in a protected body of water like a lagoon or bay with calm waters. Get all of the logistics figured out there, the engineering, the social challenges, everything you can figure out while still within a safe distance of land to get through that first phase.

Then you can move 12nm out into the ocean where you're still close to land for many supply/logistic type of things but you are challenged by the waves and other things, but at that point you have more national sovereignty. You're protected by the host nation's military but are outside of the jurisdiction of most of their laws which allows you to experiment even more with new social structures.

Then finally you move 200nm out where you have full sovereignty. At that point you're looking to start a nation and have to be out that far to get started. That is certainly a decade away for sure.

This is the approach Blue Frontiers is taking. They will start in a protected lagoon off of one of the islands of French Polynesia. Then go from there. But the key is to at least get started so we're not waiting 100 years to finally start utilizing the 70% of the earth that is covered by oceans.

No!
simply because it is not even created yet. we are talking about years in the future which may not even become a possible thing due to political reasons. not to mention the logistics of it! we are talking about a construct (houses) in the middle of ocean. the pictures look pretty in calm sea under the clear sky while sun is shinning but that is not how the sea always looks! the conditions can be brutal even in the safest places.

plus how much does it cost to maintain such a structure every year? keep in mind we are talking about a big structure at sea under constant corrosion in salt water, under constant pressure, different forces, ... so we have a combination of "corrosion and fatigue". who wants to live in a place that can have a catastrophic failure because of stress-corrosion cracking?

another thing that i can't wrap my head around is the dynamic nature of it!

If it had not been for you, I still did not find out what that already is. I would like to have a piece of paradise and come there when I want, but not on a permanent basis. On the ground, storms are easier to carry))

This isn't a discussion about an alt coin, it's a discussion about seasteading.

While Blue Frontiers is doing an ICO for their seastead token (Varyon), I'll leave Blue Frontiers to create a thread in the altcoin section to discuss Varyon.

We need Bitcoin people to get involved in seasteading so that bitcoin can be an integral part in the blockchain based protocols on the seasteads for things like governance, voting, property registration, etc.  Maybe using something like Rootstock or other Bitcoin advances to do so. Implementing Lightning Network as the popular payment system for most seasteads..

The idea of seasteading always sounded appealing to me, but I wonder what would it be like to actually live there and. I have a suggestion that this topic should be moved on altcoin discussion since this isn't discussing and  It could be a good place to spend a vacation, but no more than that.

It's not about no government.

I see it as a blank slate with which you can create something great.

Imagine every country's government as a painting. The country has chosen one painting as their national painting and it is that nation's painting. Maybe every couple of years they may add a tiny change or tweak a color, maybe a tiny dog in the painting did not have any eyes drawn originally and after years of discussion they decide to draw one white eye after much debate, though the painting essentially stays the same. This goes on for centuries with just a tweak here and there. They even decide that their style of painting is the best and that any other country choosing a different style is bad and they go to war over these differences.

Meanwhile, artists all over the world look at these paintings and believe that there could be something better...the centuries old paintings are dull and boring. Warhol comes along, Picasso shows up...Dali wants to change things a bit. But they can't create anything new because there are no blank canvasses in the world. They might have great ideas but there is no place for them to express them. And the world doesn't get to enjoy their paintings.

But then seasteading comes along and says...here are many blank canvasses. Try out some new paintings. Some will be shit because we haven't had any new paintings in hundreds of years. Some will copy the old paintings with some minor changes that other countries had already discussed. But some will be the Picassos, the Warhols, the Dalis...new and interesting. Unlike anything that has come before. Nothing that was allowed to come before. Hell, while old countries will be looking at paintings, we could be watching movies in full surround sound or in a VR world. Leaving them all behind to their legacy systems. Much like what we are doing with Bitcoin as money.

Know that man really needs a rule. Without such provision may occur. If you choose to live in seastead, whatever you want, you will live comfortably free of all governmental rules. A rule created just for comfort and billing in a casual atmosphere does not happen.

For the final seasteads (out in international waters) you would likely move to a seastead because of the laws (or lack thereof).

I suppose it will be like if you were go to Amsterdam right now. How do you know the drug and prostitution laws there? They're so different from the rest of the world. You just google it. There's probably a page for tourists for the basic stuff, then the actual full text of the laws on another website.

I have lived all over the world. Before you get to a new country or soon after you arrive you do a bit of research on things you should know in your new country.

As for how those laws are decided or implemented? I am hoping that it will be mainly blockchain based (for most of the cities...some may want to be old school, who knows) voting systems with public ledgers and verifiable proofs.

Im planning to move out when i retired from work,that means in five years from now i will be on that decision and if given a chance to live in that kind of peaceful environment then would love to spend rest of life in the middle of the sea but my only concern is im based on asia and as i am reading your post this sounds like its too far from my place and i may not be qualify

The company was founded in January of 2017 and have been going strong ever since. A lot of work with the French Polynesian government, they have a partnership with a company out of the Netherlands that builds floating structures (Blue21). There are many partners being worked on with several big name advisers such as Ethereum's Daniel Nagy, Lara Stein (founder of TEDx), Gaspard Koenig (runs the premier libertarian think tank in France who advised the head of the IMF in France who just recently endorsed blockchain technology).

The nice thing about this is that Blue Frontiers has first mover advantage. No competitors. The Seasteading Institute, which was founded by Patri Friedman and funded initially by Peter Thiel, has been around since 2008 but they merely promote the idea of seasteading and do research. They're non-profit so they can't actually build anything.

Successful cities need a variety of infrastructures, such as roads, electricity power plants, network connectivity, water and sewer lines, and so forth. At small scales we could probably design this infrastructure to be completely modular. But that approach doesn’t scale, at some point we need expensive fixed infrastructure, like multi-lane highways, bridges, water mains, subway lines, airports, which only make economic sense if built on a geographically stable foundation. Such infrastructure wouldn’t be feasible in a “dynamic” city, and without such infrastructure it’s hard to imagine a city of even modest size being viable. It could be a good place to spend a vacation, but no more than that.

A very nice place to be a place to live, and I am very interested to be able to live there, and how I can to settle on the floating island.

With strong team, strategic partnership and long term planning I have a feeling that this will be a successful project. Do you have a strong competitor on seasteading industry?

There will be an alt coin thread dedicated specifically to the token, Varyon.

This one is for discussion of seasteading in general and the current project under way to make seasteading happen.

It is Bitcoin and blockchain related in that most of the economy and governance will be blockchain based and Bitcoin will certainly be popular at most of the businesses along with basically any currency anyone wants to accept.

I could see eventually some sort of basket of the most stable currencies being used, or some combination with metals. But that is the whole point of competing seasteads. They can figure out what is best.

I'll leave the alt coin thread for the actual company, Blue Frontiers. I do not represent or speak for Blue Frontiers, I just support the project.

It is a very special place and island, I am very interested to live on the island, and I will tell my friends and relatives to offer to stay there.

Seems a good way of living and I think varyon has made a unique project. I have a suggestion that this topic should be moved on altcoin discussion since this isn't discussing about bitcoin here, and I think it can create more traffic out there. Hope it will be moved and accept my suggestion.

The first seasteads will be in French Polynesia under French Polynesian criminal laws and military protection.

I am very happy to be able to stay there, because I am sure I can be more comfortable and not many rules to live there, how can I stay there.

It seems very nice and nice place, but I do not like to live in a wounded place that is not recognized by any country, because I prefer to live in the country and I think it's safer.

The idea of seasteading always sounded appealing to me, but I wonder what would it be like to actually live there. What are the costs of living, what kind of jobs can I get there, what is it like to live in the ocean (I've never been on any ship)? So, maybe I wouldn't be able to live there even if I wanted to for one of those reasons, but I would definitely want to visit a seastead at some point of my life.

That's very good and I also want to live there, I'm sure there must be many enthusiasts from various countries, how much to spend to stay there.

I've also moved to Tahiti to see this project through so if I can do anything about it, this project will happen 

Seasteading is the concept of creating permanent dwellings at sea, called seasteads, outside the territory claimed by any government. The term is a combination of the words sea and homesteading.

The basic premise is that if you don't like your government, you can float your house to another city/nation that is more to your liking. Essentially voting with your house.


If you have any questions let me know, I've been involved in seasteading since 2008 and am currently volunteering for the The Floating Island Project in French Polynesia to get the world's first seastead up and floating by 2021.