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Topic: [WTS] 6/23 Order for 3 Jalapeno - Lowered price! - page 2. (Read 3865 times)

legendary
Activity: 952
Merit: 1000
Due to release delays, I wouldn't be surprised if the only people who are going to ever see a positive ROI on their BFL ASIC orders are those who are wisely trying to sell them before they ship to folks who haven't sat down and done the math.

Their pre-order pool is going to be so big that it will be self-destructive to the very miners who thought they were going to have an edge.

1) Considering I bought these back in June when the price was lower, I spent almost the same # of BTC as what I'm selling them for. And yet my estimated ROI is anywhere from 2-6 months, depending on how those first 2 months go.

2) Have you actually sat down and done the math of how many BTC you can get with 10GH/s? Taking into account shipping times, difficulty recalculation timing, and estimated difficulty? As I said, its anywhere from 40-80BTC.

3) I don't think that's true. Compare the current Single to the SC Single: It's ~48x as fast, at 2.16x the price. That's a 22x performance boost for every Bitcoin (or dollar) spent. But then we have to take into account the reward half. So, as long as the difficulty doesn't go over ~11x what it is now (which would be a ~250THs network), a SC Single will mine the same BTC/day as a current Single in today's market. This is what BFL said would happen, abeit eventually. Who knows how long it will take to get to that point (6 months? 1 year?), so in the mean time, they are insanely more profitable.

3.b) If you think the market will reach numbers larger than 250TH/s in the next 6-12 months, then you have to hope that the USD/BTC price will rise to keep mining on the same level of profitability.
legendary
Activity: 952
Merit: 1000
Quote
<@gribble> Estimated time of bitcoin block reward halving: Fri Nov 30 13:24:00 2012
BFL is currently estimating delivery of product in November, when they were initially estimating October.
It would not be out of the question to assume that there will be another delay forthcoming.
I included a November 1st ship date in my estimations. Seeing how that's 40 days away, and we havn't heard of any major delays, I don't see how that's unreasonable.
sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 250
Quote
<@gribble> Estimated time of bitcoin block reward halving: Fri Nov 30 13:24:00 2012

BFL is currently estimating delivery of product in November, when they were initially estimating October.
It would not be out of the question to assume that there will be another delay forthcoming.

Due to release delays, I wouldn't be surprised if the only people who are going to ever see a positive ROI on their BFL ASIC orders are those who are wisely trying to sell them before they ship to folks who haven't sat down and done the math.

Their pre-order pool is going to be so big that it will be self-destructive to the very miners who thought they were going to have an edge.
hero member
Activity: 956
Merit: 1001
Quote
<@gribble> Estimated time of bitcoin block reward halving: Fri Nov 30 13:24:00 2012

BFL is currently estimating delivery of product in November, when they were initially estimating October.
It would not be out of the question to assume that there will be another delay forthcoming.
legendary
Activity: 952
Merit: 1000
Just so I'm clear - you want somebody to reimburse you for the profit you would have made if you'd run them yourself, absorb the operating costs of running them and extend the time taken to break even by operating them in the new year at a decreased reward (25 btc rather than 50) and increased difficulty?
Huh?

First, I'm more than happy to mine with these on my own. Yes they're for sale, but it's not like I can lose if they don't sell: I'll just mine with them, and make plenty of BTC.

Second, the "operating costs" are next to nothing. These will use almost nothing for electricity, and will be insanely profitable at the beginning.

Third, these are expected to ship WELL BEFORE the reward half, so it's estimated that you will be able to mine for a good month or two at 50BTC/block. This first month is the most profitable, which makes it the most important (hence why I'm offering overnight shipping, so you get them faster).

Lastly, the profits are unknown. As I said, the estimated profits are anywhere from 40-80BTC, so I priced these at 60 (plus the cost of the hardware), which is smack dab in the middle. If you think you can earn more than 60BTC before the end of the year, then this sale is MORE profitable than ordering from BFL directly (and getting an order number in the 8 or 9000s). If you don't think you can make at least 60BTC, then you're better off ordering from BFL directly. It's a gamble.
member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
Litecoin Core Developer

Just so I'm clear - you want somebody to reimburse you for the profit you would have made if you'd run them yourself, absorb the operating costs of running them and extend the time taken to break even by operating them in the new year at a decreased reward (25 btc rather than 50) and increased difficulty?

legendary
Activity: 952
Merit: 1000
OP and title have been updated. Price has been lowered.
legendary
Activity: 952
Merit: 1000
Per Jalapeno at 100% PPS you'd be earning BTC8.6/week at the current difficulty/reward, I don't see how you'd get anything close to BTC10/week by the time these ship. If BFL does do the big batch shipment to start, by the time you get the unit and turn around and reship it, you'd probably be lucky to earn BTC10 in the first week with all three mining. That's assuming that BFL stays on target and ships early November; the new expected date for block reward halving is December 1st. If BFL's schedule slips a few weeks and these don't arrive in people's hands before Thanksgiving, the block reward could halve before your buyer even receives them and you could easily be looking at less than BTC1/day for all three by the time you start mining.

That said, I'll offer you a 50% markup on the $150 price of them plus an extra BTC5 for shipping and offer BTC60 for all three.
I think 60BTC is too low, but PM sent to negotiate.
Me and MrTeal worked out that these 3 jalapenos are expected to make approximately anywhere from 40-80BTC between receipt of the units and the end of the year, depending on BFL shipping times, how much they ship (and the difficulty adjustment), the timing of the shipment in correlation to the block recalculations, whether other ASIC competitors ship their products, etc. That said, I'll sell them for 60BTC + the current cost of the hardware, 36BTC, for a total of 96BTC.
legendary
Activity: 952
Merit: 1000
Per Jalapeno at 100% PPS you'd be earning BTC8.6/week at the current difficulty/reward, I don't see how you'd get anything close to BTC10/week by the time these ship. If BFL does do the big batch shipment to start, by the time you get the unit and turn around and reship it, you'd probably be lucky to earn BTC10 in the first week with all three mining. That's assuming that BFL stays on target and ships early November; the new expected date for block reward halving is December 1st. If BFL's schedule slips a few weeks and these don't arrive in people's hands before Thanksgiving, the block reward could halve before your buyer even receives them and you could easily be looking at less than BTC1/day for all three by the time you start mining.

That said, I'll offer you a 50% markup on the $150 price of them plus an extra BTC5 for shipping and offer BTC60 for all three.
I think 60BTC is too low, but PM sent to negotiate.
legendary
Activity: 1274
Merit: 1004
Per Jalapeno at 100% PPS you'd be earning BTC8.6/week at the current difficulty/reward, I don't see how you'd get anything close to BTC10/week by the time these ship. If BFL does do the big batch shipment to start, by the time you get the unit and turn around and reship it, you'd probably be lucky to earn BTC10 in the first week with all three mining. That's assuming that BFL stays on target and ships early November; the new expected date for block reward halving is December 1st. If BFL's schedule slips a few weeks and these don't arrive in people's hands before Thanksgiving, the block reward could halve before your buyer even receives them and you could easily be looking at less than BTC1/day for all three by the time you start mining.

That said, I'll offer you a 50% markup on the $150 price of them plus an extra BTC5 for shipping and offer BTC60 for all three.
legendary
Activity: 952
Merit: 1000
Bump
legendary
Activity: 952
Merit: 1000
Bump
legendary
Activity: 952
Merit: 1000
What are you looking for, ballpark? I have no idea what the going rate is for these...
They're expected to make ~10(+/- 3)BTC a week (before the difficulty shoots up), so I've been quoting people about ~40-50BTC.
Per Jalapeno? So triple retail? For the price you want for 2 of these (7GH/s) I could just go buy a bASIC (27GH/s)...

So, is yours a trade-in order or a straight cash order? I'd think the latter may be worth more, depending on the (as yet unknown) details of BFL's trade in scheme.
Mine was originally a 6/3 order for a Single, but after the ASICs came out, I had my order changed to the 4 Jalapenos. I believe it does count under the 1/3 for trade-ins, however, if you really want to know.

I'm all for competition, but by the time you get your bASIC a month or two after I get these, the difficulty will already be magnitudes higher than what it is now. And when these are making 1BTC/day each at today's difficulty, time is of the essence.
You really think you're getting these next month?
I don't know when I"m getting them. I do know I'm in the first batch, and the latest report from BFL_Josh is late October / early November. IIRC, Tom said the bASIC will ship ~ Novemeber/December. According to my math, that's a 1-2 month difference.
sr. member
Activity: 336
Merit: 250
What are you looking for, ballpark? I have no idea what the going rate is for these...
They're expected to make ~10(+/- 3)BTC a week (before the difficulty shoots up), so I've been quoting people about ~40-50BTC.
Per Jalapeno? So triple retail? For the price you want for 2 of these (7GH/s) I could just go buy a bASIC (27GH/s)...

So, is yours a trade-in order or a straight cash order? I'd think the latter may be worth more, depending on the (as yet unknown) details of BFL's trade in scheme.
Mine was originally a 6/3 order for a Single, but after the ASICs came out, I had my order changed to the 4 Jalapenos. I believe it does count under the 1/3 for trade-ins, however, if you really want to know.

I'm all for competition, but by the time you get your bASIC a month or two after I get these, the difficulty will already be magnitudes higher than what it is now. And when these are making 1BTC/day each at today's difficulty, time is of the essence.
You really think you're getting these next month?
legendary
Activity: 952
Merit: 1000
What are you looking for, ballpark? I have no idea what the going rate is for these...
They're expected to make ~10(+/- 3)BTC a week (before the difficulty shoots up), so I've been quoting people about ~40-50BTC.
Per Jalapeno? So triple retail? For the price you want for 2 of these (7GH/s) I could just go buy a bASIC (27GH/s)...

So, is yours a trade-in order or a straight cash order? I'd think the latter may be worth more, depending on the (as yet unknown) details of BFL's trade in scheme.
Mine was originally a 6/3 order for a Single, but after the ASICs came out, I had my order changed to the 4 Jalapenos. I believe it does count under the 1/3 for trade-ins, however, if you really want to know.

I'm all for competition, but by the time you get your bASIC a month or two after I get these, the difficulty will already be magnitudes higher than what it is now. And when these are making 1BTC/day each at today's difficulty, time is of the essence.
sr. member
Activity: 336
Merit: 250
What are you looking for, ballpark? I have no idea what the going rate is for these...

They're expected to make ~10(+/- 3)BTC a week (before the difficulty shoots up), so I've been quoting people about ~40-50BTC.
Per Jalapeno? So triple retail? For the price you want for 2 of these (7GH/s) I could just go buy a bASIC (27GH/s)...

So, is yours a trade-in order or a straight cash order? I'd think the latter may be worth more, depending on the (as yet unknown) details of BFL's trade in scheme.
legendary
Activity: 952
Merit: 1000
Bump.
legendary
Activity: 952
Merit: 1000
Bump. Gimme an offer!
legendary
Activity: 952
Merit: 1000
Bump
legendary
Activity: 952
Merit: 1000
They can be broken or half-working, I just need it for a SC upgrade.

You know BFL will be testing the singles before the honor the trade in and won't honor the value for broken ones right? Let me see if I can dig up the post.

Can you show me where you saw this? I've been watching almost all of the BFL threads, and I've never heard of this.

I looked a while and didn't see. I would email their support and ask before buying broken ones in hope of full trade-in value. I'm 95% sure I saw one of the BFL accounts post that on these forums somewhere since July. They have 3-4 accounts and a lot of posts, I don't have time to check them all.

I just decided to buy another one from BFL, rather than deal with worrying about whether they will take a not-working one back. Plus, not many people are ordering them, and BFL_Josh is doing some good stuff there, so shipping times are coming down!

In the mean time, I've had plenty of PMs, but I'm still accepting offers on the remaining 3.
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