Author

Topic: [XMR] Monero Speculation - page 1008. (Read 3314350 times)

legendary
Activity: 1092
Merit: 1000
October 11, 2016, 05:13:22 AM
...

As long as there are other people contributing, why should I do it? And if there is no other people contributing, then why to hold Monero?
That's exactly the argument why I thought it would have been a good idea to fund marketing and development from the block rewards, not from the pockets of bagholders.
I think Darkcoin has that sort of approach and I consider it good for long haul not to be dependent on the generosity of bagholders.


There are at least two very valid reasons why diverting a portion of the block rewards to development or some other project such as marketing is not a good idea at all.

1) Regulatory compliance.

This is the elephant in the room in crypto currency and Monero is one of very few crypto currencies that has avoided some very serious regulatory compliance risks. The critical aspect of this is the guidance that was issued by FinCEN in March of 2013. https://www.fincen.gov/sites/default/files/shared/FIN-2013-G001.pdf. In order for a crypto currency to be compliant while at the same time avoiding the requirement of registration as a Money Services Business, and consequential AML/KNC requirements, the crypto currency must qualify as a "De Centralized Virtual Currency" under the guidance. This means that the block rewards have to go in their entirety to the miners and cannot be diverted for other purposes such as to fund development or marketing. If the block rewards are diverted in such a manner then those who are administering the diverted block rewards would be very likely be considered to be "administrators" or "exchangers" under the guidance, be required to register as MSBs and be subject to AML/KNC reporting requirements among other requirements. Ripple has already been subject to regulatory enforcement over this very issue. While I am not aware, at this time, of any regulatory action over this against Dash, the risk in that case likely remains very high. While this is specific to the United States, the reality is that the United States is at least for the time being, the world leader in financial regulation in particular because of the reserve currency status of the United States dollar.

In summary one needs to keep one's hands out of the till, block rewards, in order to keep the regulator away.

2) Coin Security.

Unlike Bitcoin like coins, in Monero the block rewards are needed in order to maintain the security of the POW. One cannot rely upon transaction fees for this at any point in the future. The reason for this is the adaptive blocksize limit. This by the way is also the reason why the tail emission is so critical to the security of Monero.

In summary one needs to keep one's hands out of the till, block rewards, in order to keep the 51% attacker away.

Edit: I should also point out that even in Bitcoin like coins, fees alone may not be sufficient to secure the coin in the absence of a block reward.

I agree on this. Block rewards are needed for the miners but I meant there could have been "a small mining tax". 1 % of every block reward going to the development is currently something like 0.10 XMR and the rest 9.90 XMR goes to the miners. Given the declining block reward, anyway the block reward will be 9.90 XMR soon so it would not have affected too much for network security IMO, actually quite the opposite - some miners might reason that the coin is more valuable since the development funding is secured and not relies on donations (which are based on volunteering and at some point there will not be people who desires to donate, that is the case somewhat with btc which has hard time to find donators and thus the foundation suffers from financial difficulties).

The funding system of Darkcoin is its strength IMO. Also the price is relative stable with Darkcoin. This doesn't mean I support Darkcoin but I am facing the reality here. The funding seems to work fine with Dark coin.
The fact that Monero development is based on donation is short sighted decision - the development goes on as long as there are enough people willing to give up coins and once that source dries up there will be no development/development is only slow.
So far the donations have been abudant but that may not be the case in 2-3 years from now.
sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 250
hero member
Activity: 493
Merit: 551
October 11, 2016, 02:46:25 AM

There are at least two very valid reasons why diverting a portion of the block rewards to development or some other project such as marketing is not a good idea at all.

1) Regulatory compliance.

This is the elephant in the room in crypto currency and Monero is one of very few crypto currencies that has avoided some very serious regulatory compliance risks. The critical aspect of this is the guidance that was issued by FinCEN in March of 2013. https://www.fincen.gov/sites/default/files/shared/FIN-2013-G001.pdf. In order for a crypto currency to be compliant while at the same time avoiding the requirement of registration as a Money Services Business, and consequential AML/KNC requirements, the crypto currency must qualify as a "De Centralized Virtual Currency" under the guidance. This means that the block rewards have to go in their entirety to the miners and cannot be diverted for other purposes such as to fund development or marketing. If the block rewards are diverted in such a manner then those who are administering the diverted block rewards would be very likely be considered to be "administrators" or "exchangers" under the guidance, be required to register as MSBs and be subject to AML/KNC reporting requirements among other requirements. Ripple has already been subject to regulatory enforcement over this very issue. While I am not aware, at this time, of any regulatory action over this against Dash, the risk in that case likely remains very high. While this is specific to the United States, the reality is that the United States is at least for the time being, the world leader in financial regulation in particular because of the reserve currency status of the United States dollar.

In summary one needs to keep one's hands out of the till, block rewards, in order to keep the regulator away.

If this is true, then ZCash is going to face real problems as an US-company, or better said their miners.
hero member
Activity: 742
Merit: 501
October 11, 2016, 12:39:51 AM

I personally wonder why Monero gets more attention now in their board than at the time the XMR implementation happened and were announced at their community board.

E: I'm curious when i see the chart since last week we had a steady up and down. So I ask myself who are these people who are loosing money with XMR in every day trading? Is someone here who trades with permanent loss?

No clue. Have you seen aminorex around?
legendary
Activity: 3836
Merit: 4969
Doomed to see the future and unable to prevent it
October 10, 2016, 07:33:42 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JskRVoI3PFM


Shit and this just got away. Sad

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Doctor-Strange-169-1968-Marvel-Silver-Age-Key-Issue-Movie-Announced/272400456877?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D39241%26meid%3Dee7107dcd7084b2eb4d9bb863ec82b5c%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D232102640515


thanks Hueristic. Cant baghold  so keeping BTC right now. Its minute price changes is a blessing in itself. Still looking at XMR though. Its movement and suggestions from forum members is helping me on the whole shape of the game.

NP. Smiley

Happy Page 1200  Smiley

Maybe we will hit 0.012 in the next week ....we will see

Or... a return back to over $12 would be nice too, eh?  Tongue

NOT YET! I have alot of coins to get back. Smiley
hero member
Activity: 608
Merit: 509
October 10, 2016, 05:56:11 PM
Happy Page 1200  Smiley

Maybe we will hit 0.012 in the next week ....we will see

Or... a return back to over $12 would be nice too, eh?  Tongue
legendary
Activity: 2282
Merit: 1050
Monero Core Team
October 10, 2016, 05:32:35 PM
...

As long as there are other people contributing, why should I do it? And if there is no other people contributing, then why to hold Monero?
That's exactly the argument why I thought it would have been a good idea to fund marketing and development from the block rewards, not from the pockets of bagholders.
I think Darkcoin has that sort of approach and I consider it good for long haul not to be dependent on the generosity of bagholders.


There are at least two very valid reasons why diverting a portion of the block rewards to development or some other project such as marketing is not a good idea at all.

1) Regulatory compliance.

This is the elephant in the room in crypto currency and Monero is one of very few crypto currencies that has avoided some very serious regulatory compliance risks. The critical aspect of this is the guidance that was issued by FinCEN in March of 2013. https://www.fincen.gov/sites/default/files/shared/FIN-2013-G001.pdf. In order for a crypto currency to be compliant while at the same time avoiding the requirement of registration as a Money Services Business, and consequential AML/KNC requirements, the crypto currency must qualify as a "De Centralized Virtual Currency" under the guidance. This means that the block rewards have to go in their entirety to the miners and cannot be diverted for other purposes such as to fund development or marketing. If the block rewards are diverted in such a manner then those who are administering the diverted block rewards would be very likely be considered to be "administrators" or "exchangers" under the guidance, be required to register as MSBs and be subject to AML/KNC reporting requirements among other requirements. Ripple has already been subject to regulatory enforcement over this very issue. While I am not aware, at this time, of any regulatory action over this against Dash, the risk in that case likely remains very high. While this is specific to the United States, the reality is that the United States is at least for the time being, the world leader in financial regulation in particular because of the reserve currency status of the United States dollar.

In summary one needs to keep one's hands out of the till, block rewards, in order to keep the regulator away.

2) Coin Security.

Unlike Bitcoin like coins, in Monero the block rewards are needed in order to maintain the security of the POW. One cannot rely upon transaction fees for this at any point in the future. The reason for this is the adaptive blocksize limit. This by the way is also the reason why the tail emission is so critical to the security of Monero.

In summary one needs to keep one's hands out of the till, block rewards, in order to keep the 51% attacker away.

Edit: I should also point out that even in Bitcoin like coins, fees alone may not be sufficient to secure the coin in the absence of a block reward.
legendary
Activity: 2492
Merit: 1491
LEALANA Bitcoin Grim Reaper
October 10, 2016, 05:16:40 PM
Happy Page 1200  Smiley

Maybe we will hit 0.012 in the next week ....we will see
newbie
Activity: 24
Merit: 0
October 10, 2016, 05:08:31 PM
thanks Hueristic. Cant baghold  so keeping BTC right now. Its minute price changes is a blessing in itself. Still looking at XMR though. Its movement and suggestions from forum members is helping me on the whole shape of the game.
sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 250
October 10, 2016, 02:43:27 PM
Checked DNM again:

From 04.10.2016

Quote
Setting:

Stimulants - Speed
Level 5 - 10

Monero: 39
Bitcoin: 405

= 9,62%

XTC - Pills
Level 6 - 10

Monero: 40
BTC: 450

= 8,88%

I checked again:

Stimulants - Speed (3976 total offers)
Level 5 - 10

XMR: 32
BTC: 411

= 7,78%

XTC - Pills (11860 total offers)
Level 6 - 10

BTC: 465
XMR: 47

= 10,10%

So we have -1,84% at speed and plus +1,22% at XTC Pills.

Considering that the Pill part is 3 times as big as the speed part we have a positive development.

Moreover new community qoutes from Alphabay (im lazy to make all the time screenshots, look for yourself if you doubt):

Quote
   My other products i offer are fentanyl lollipops 1.7mg & 3mg of fent per lollipop Fentanyl blotters 100$ for 100 500ug/mcg hits and right now it's alice in the wonderland 100 hit pics of alice standing beside the mushroom looking at the cattipillar smoking hooka real nice blotters came out nice the fent is caked on the pic of the blotter it looks like it laid good
    the lollipops are on sale 7 for 49 usually 10-15 each so big sale there very good.

    oh i almost forgot i am doing 300 dollar ounces with monero only.

    sale goes on until oct-12/wednesday
    

fastpacks2, Oct 9, 2016 at 2:22 AM

Quote
   Best way to do it without getting caught is to authorize fake purchases /sales for fake digital services like internet marketing to a person completely unrelated to you, someone who also has a business account and has connections to turn the funds in to monero, BTC or some other cryptocurrency after being tumbled.
    

Ubermensch, Oct 9, 2016 at 5:24 PM

Quote
   
    Hello I have $10m worth of jewelry I would like to sell for HALF of at only $5m I am accepting Monero and Bitcoin with Alphabay escrow.
    

Colosseum, Oct 8, 2016 at 11:53 PM

I personally wonder why Monero gets more attention now in their board than at the time the XMR implementation happened and were announced at their community board.

E: I'm curious when i see the chart since last week we had a steady up and down. So I ask myself who are these people who are loosing money with XMR in every day trading? Is someone here who trades with permanent loss?
full member
Activity: 532
Merit: 101
October 10, 2016, 02:11:33 PM
OK, right now is a classic shakeout going on. Don't fall for it. But don't buy unless you can handle the floor dropping before a rise.
trading is more of a mind-game than analyzing, you have to keep your cold, it's too late to sell now, you have to baghold, maybe buy some more if you can afford it(good opportunity). I see that shorters has returned another 100xmr too be now, this saved their asses Grin

I see buy-orders pining up now, a lot of people are taking this(possibly last) chance to get some cheap xmr, i could have increased my holdings by selling above 0.012 earlier but i don't like to sell cheap in order to buy even cheaper later.
legendary
Activity: 3836
Merit: 4969
Doomed to see the future and unable to prevent it
October 10, 2016, 01:52:22 PM
As a newbie in crypto especially in crypto trading it's a bit dissapointing I didn't buy enough xmr when its price was at 0.010 when I had the opportunity few days ago. Sad

Yup, this is all I have to play with. Smiley

Code:
2016-10-10 16:58:21 Buy 0.01117601 4.19240319 0.04685433
2016-10-10 16:42:10 Buy 0.01149990 5.94628419 0.06838167
2016-10-09 23:55:11 Sell 0.01222499 9.44042626 0.11540911

But starting with dust and adding some sig funds I'll keep building (or lose it all in one big whale move LOL).

Cheesy
sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 250
October 10, 2016, 01:51:37 PM
As a newbie in crypto especially in crypto trading it's a bit dissapointing I didn't buy enough xmr when its price was at 0.010 when I had the opportunity few days ago. Sad

I think you will have this opportunity sooner as expected!

Hope so Smiley but who knows...maybe the 110 is the new 100
sr. member
Activity: 476
Merit: 250
October 10, 2016, 01:45:46 PM
As a newbie in crypto especially in crypto trading it's a bit dissapointing I didn't buy enough xmr when its price was at 0.010 when I had the opportunity few days ago. Sad

I think you will have this opportunity sooner as expected!
legendary
Activity: 2576
Merit: 1860
October 10, 2016, 01:41:58 PM
As a newbie in crypto especially in crypto trading it's a bit dissapointing I didn't buy enough xmr when its price was at 0.010 when I had the opportunity few days ago. Sad
sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 250
October 10, 2016, 01:31:01 PM
Just short it on every rise, and you will be fine. Look at the Lending page, when you see large amounts of coins, and low fees, expect dump.

until that time it doesn't come back down....

Ya at this stage its probably better to just possess the coins. They can drop in price, okay. Doesn't matter cause -for me- 100 is a price, this coin can and will always reach Smiley

"100" is without a problem

I meant if it will drop hard again below 100 than it will return to 100 anyway
sr. member
Activity: 419
Merit: 250
October 10, 2016, 01:03:45 PM


Yup!  Its open season on Bears!




It looks like bears hunt hunters Smiley
legendary
Activity: 1092
Merit: 1000
October 10, 2016, 01:03:01 PM
No I do not know.
newbie
Activity: 22
Merit: 0
October 10, 2016, 01:00:13 PM
I don't have alter ego (s).

Of course you do.

Perhaps you are NRG as well... After all you have newbie status.

You know that's not the case.
legendary
Activity: 1092
Merit: 1000
October 10, 2016, 12:58:55 PM
I don't have alter ego (s).

Of course you do.

Perhaps you are NRG as well... After all you have newbie status.
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