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Topic: XTnodes.com added a new chart: The number of mined Bitcoin XT blocks - page 2. (Read 3890 times)

legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1072
Crypto is the separation of Power and State.
I have 100 bitcoins on my XT client.  I will sell them for $50 each.  But I guess since its just a altcoin nobody here would be interested?

Get real.

$25 for the lot and I'll take them off your hands.

Assuming this is a real offer and they are using the current stable xt client I would buy them all.

You two's XT white knighting warms my usually aloof Fire Dragon's heart.

So selfless.  So courageous.   Cry
legendary
Activity: 1876
Merit: 1000

You keep using that word, i dont think you know what it means

Maybe you can go and live in China USA to understand what dictationship censorship propaganda means

Fixed it for you.   Smiley

fixed it for you both
legendary
Activity: 2492
Merit: 1491
LEALANA Bitcoin Grim Reaper
I have 100 bitcoins on my XT client.  I will sell them for $50 each.  But I guess since its just a altcoin nobody here would be interested?

Get real.

$25 for the lot and I'll take them off your hands.

Assuming this is a real offer and they are using the current stable xt client I would buy them all.
legendary
Activity: 2604
Merit: 3056
Welt Am Draht
I have 100 bitcoins on my XT client.  I will sell them for $50 each.  But I guess since its just a altcoin nobody here would be interested?

Get real.

$25 for the lot and I'll take them off your hands.
legendary
Activity: 910
Merit: 1000
I have 100 bitcoins on my XT client.  I will sell them for $50 each.  But I guess since its just a altcoin nobody here would be interested?

Really?

Pretty sure there has been no fork yet.



So you're saying its not a altcoin?
legendary
Activity: 2492
Merit: 1491
LEALANA Bitcoin Grim Reaper
I have 100 bitcoins on my XT client.  I will sell them for $50 each.  But I guess since its just a altcoin nobody here would be interested?

Really?

Pretty sure there has been no fork yet.

legendary
Activity: 2492
Merit: 1491
LEALANA Bitcoin Grim Reaper
Quote
Until the 'C' word is reached, there's no change.
I wonder if you call 75% of miners a consensus. Because it's not, it's ridiculous.

You should be thankful we didn't need a hard fork to introduce the 1MB cap in the first place, otherwise there's a possibility it might still be 32MB (or was it 33.5MB?).  I suppose you think Bitcoin would have broken and died by now if the 1MB cap hadn't happened?  


There's a high probability it can possibly go wrong with this approach, I simply detest it.

You can detest it all you like, but if you use Bitcoin, this is what you're signing up for.  Bitcoin can fork at any time for any reason if enough users want it to.  If you can't handle that, there are plenty of closed-source projects that might suit you better.  You have a vote if you choose to use it, but that's all.  Either go with the flow or go somewhere else.  It's up to you.  


Quote
Imagine if I came up with a new IP protocol (for argument's sake we'll call it IPvXT ) that added support for new features for the internet but only if the majority of the internet used it.  Until then it remains fully compatible with the current IPv4 or IPv6 implementations and you argued that using it means you aren't using the internet anymore.  You're using an altnet.  It just sounds farcical.
The analogy is flawed, because internet is not a consensus-critical network. There can be any number of protocols in use, e.g. IPv4 and IPv6 currently. Internet is not defined by a single universal protocol, Bitcoin is.

I never said it was a good analogy, it's not like there's anything else I can really compare Bitcoin to, is there?  Still doesn't make it an altcoin, though.


Quote
If XT deviates from Bitcoin's blockchain without consensus then I'll be right there with you dismissing it as an altcoin, but until then you either sound like you're calling it an altcoin out of ignorance or malice.  I honestly can't decide which it is.
Oh ok, so I'm either ignorant or malicious. The possibility of yourself being wrong is not even considered, I guess.

I'm not one of those people who are too stubborn to admit when they're wrong (as per my previous post).  If you can convince me I'm wrong, I'll concede.  It's not my fault you're doing a really bad job of convincing me.   Tongue

Not.  An.  Altcoin.

Omg the last paragraph made me laugh ahaha!

Oh the free entertainment from the Bitcoin community.

Priceless! Grin
legendary
Activity: 1596
Merit: 1005
★Nitrogensports.eu★
After reading this thread I can say one thing. Stop argue people. You are all like children who think their toy is the best and better than their friends.
That is the major flaw of bitcoin in my opinion, democracy is not always good, everyone have their own opinion and it is hard to find the best solution.
Usually you need to sacrifice something to gain another and it is not easy choice. With XT vs Core is exactly the same, only time will tell who was right.
legendary
Activity: 910
Merit: 1000
I have 100 bitcoins on my XT client.  I will sell them for $50 each.  But I guess since its just a altcoin nobody here would be interested?
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1072
Crypto is the separation of Power and State.
Bitcoin can fork at any time for any reason if enough users want it to

Incorrect.  Bitcoin is not a democracy.  EG, even if 99% of the drooling masses want to raise the 21e6 coin limit, La Serenissima will simply ignore them.
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1072
Crypto is the separation of Power and State.

You keep using that word, i dont think you know what it means

Maybe you can go and live in China to understand what dictationship censorship means

Fixed it for you.   Smiley
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1072
Crypto is the separation of Power and State.

It's one thing to support bigger blocks, and another to support Bitcoin XT with its (potential) dictator. I was actually supporting XT at first until he started proposing weird ideas, such as the dictatorship or ignoring the 'longest chain' using 'checkpoints'. Ignoring consensus and dictating is one of the prime reasons for which I do not think that it should be considered as a valid hard fork candidate.


The drooling masses are clamoring for a Strong Man to take them into space faster than the free world, IE a Stalin for Satoshi's Gagarin.

What is it with dictators and checkpoints anyway?  Hearn (not theymos) is the "epitome of authoritarianism."   Cheesy
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1072
Crypto is the separation of Power and State.
If >75% say otherwise, then by definition, Bitcoin XT is Bitcoin.

Incorrect.  Nodes and miners are irrelevant.  The economic majority is what matters:


Activating a hardfork based on what miners do is really bad. You could easily have a situation where 75% of miners support XT but none of the big Bitcoin exchanges or businesses do. Then miners would start mining coins that they couldn't spend anywhere useful, and SPV users would find that they can't transact with the businesses they want to deal with. The currency would be split, and in this case XT would be in a far weaker position than Bitcoin. The possibility of this sort of network/currency split is what makes XT not a "legitimate hardfork", but rather the programmed creation of an altcoin. A consensus hardfork can only go forward once it has been determined that it's nearly impossible for the Bitcoin economy to split in any significant way. Not every Bitcoin user on Earth has to agree, but enough that there won't be a noticeable split.

Bitcoin is not ruled by miners. In a hardfork, miners barely matter at all. (Softforks are different.) What's important is what the economy does.

Stay in school, kid.   Wink
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1072
Crypto is the separation of Power and State.
Can a moderator move this to the altcoin section please? I dont remember XT-coin having anything to do with Bitcoin last I checked.

Please read BIP101 before you try to comment

Please read

https://bitcoin.org/en/posts/hard-fork-policy

before you try to comment.



Activating a hardfork based on what miners do is really bad. You could easily have a situation where 75% of miners support XT but none of the big Bitcoin exchanges or businesses do. Then miners would start mining coins that they couldn't spend anywhere useful, and SPV users would find that they can't transact with the businesses they want to deal with. The currency would be split, and in this case XT would be in a far weaker position than Bitcoin. The possibility of this sort of network/currency split is what makes XT not a "legitimate hardfork", but rather the programmed creation of an altcoin. A consensus hardfork can only go forward once it has been determined that it's nearly impossible for the Bitcoin economy to split in any significant way. Not every Bitcoin user on Earth has to agree, but enough that there won't be a noticeable split.

Bitcoin is not ruled by miners. In a hardfork, miners barely matter at all. (Softforks are different.) What's important is what the economy does.
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1072
Crypto is the separation of Power and State.
It seems most people are too lazy to even care about the blocksize debate and they will keep running Core out of habit.

And/or most people understand the technical issues and risks involved with bigger blocks and contentious hard forks.

Keep making more creative excuses for XT's utter failure.  You're going to need them!   Wink
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1072
Crypto is the separation of Power and State.
You forgot to add a picture of the chart...




OMG WHO CENSORED THAT CHART?  WAS IT HITLER-THERMOS?!?  EPITOME OF AUTHORITARIANISM CONFIRMED!!1!

 Cheesy
legendary
Activity: 3948
Merit: 3191
Leave no FUD unchallenged
Quote
Until the 'C' word is reached, there's no change.
I wonder if you call 75% of miners a consensus. Because it's not, it's ridiculous.

You should be thankful we didn't need a hard fork to introduce the 1MB cap in the first place, otherwise there's a possibility it might still be 32MB (or was it 33.5MB?).  I suppose you think Bitcoin would have broken and died by now if the 1MB cap hadn't happened?  


There's a high probability it can possibly go wrong with this approach, I simply detest it.

You can detest it all you like, but if you use Bitcoin, this is what you're signing up for.  Bitcoin can fork at any time for any reason if enough users want it to.  If you can't handle that, there are plenty of closed-source projects that might suit you better.  You have a vote if you choose to use it, but that's all.  Either go with the flow or go somewhere else.  It's up to you.  


Quote
Imagine if I came up with a new IP protocol (for argument's sake we'll call it IPvXT ) that added support for new features for the internet but only if the majority of the internet used it.  Until then it remains fully compatible with the current IPv4 or IPv6 implementations and you argued that using it means you aren't using the internet anymore.  You're using an altnet.  It just sounds farcical.
The analogy is flawed, because internet is not a consensus-critical network. There can be any number of protocols in use, e.g. IPv4 and IPv6 currently. Internet is not defined by a single universal protocol, Bitcoin is.

I never said it was a good analogy, it's not like there's anything else I can really compare Bitcoin to, is there?  Still doesn't make it an altcoin, though.


Quote
If XT deviates from Bitcoin's blockchain without consensus then I'll be right there with you dismissing it as an altcoin, but until then you either sound like you're calling it an altcoin out of ignorance or malice.  I honestly can't decide which it is.
Oh ok, so I'm either ignorant or malicious. The possibility of yourself being wrong is not even considered, I guess.

I'm not one of those people who are too stubborn to admit when they're wrong (as per my previous post).  If you can convince me I'm wrong, I'll concede.  It's not my fault you're doing a really bad job of convincing me.   Tongue

Not.  An.  Altcoin.
legendary
Activity: 1386
Merit: 1009
Quote
Until the 'C' word is reached, there's no change.
I wonder if you call 75% of miners a consensus. Because it's not, it's ridiculous. There's a high probability it can possibly go wrong with this approach, I simply detest it.

Quote
It conforms to all the current limits and is following the current protocol to the letter.  Ergo, it's Bitcoin but with a vote for a possible future change.  It sends and receives Bitcoin transactions on the Bitcoin blockchain.  It. Is. Bitcoin.   If it had already forked and was producing 8mb blocks on a separate blockchain without a majority agreeing, then and only then would it be an altcoin.
It is extending the current protocol in its consensus-enforcing part. Because it says: after 2016-something if 75% miners have done something, we can produce larger blocks. It implicitly states it can do something the current protocol doesn't allow, under certain conditions that you call 'consensus' (which is far from the real consensus). It can disguise as an ordinary client in the meantime, doesn't matter, it won't make it Bitcoin.

It's not like protocol will be changed only if 75% miners agree, it's already changed by adding this very condition. Protocol amounts to all consensus-critical rules, implicit and explicit, that are written in the software.
Quote
Imagine if I came up with a new IP protocol (for argument's sake we'll call it IPvXT   Grin ) that added support for new features for the internet but only if the majority of the internet used it.  Until then it remains fully compatible with the current IPv4 or IPv6 implementations and you argued that using it means you aren't using the internet anymore.  You're using an altnet.  It just sounds farcical.
The analogy is flawed, because internet is not a consensus-critical network. There can be any number of protocols in use, e.g. IPv4 and IPv6 currently. Internet is not defined by a single universal protocol, Bitcoin is.
Quote
If XT deviates from Bitcoin's blockchain without consensus then I'll be right there with you dismissing it as an altcoin, but until then you either sound like you're calling it an altcoin out of ignorance or malice.  I honestly can't decide which it is.
Oh ok, so I'm either ignorant or malicious. The possibility of yourself being wrong is not even considered, I guess.
legendary
Activity: 3948
Merit: 3191
Leave no FUD unchallenged
It's disheartening to see this from forum staff.

I stopped reading at this point. WTF people, does having a stupid label make me a kind oh God or something like that?

*goes register an alt NAO

Actually, you're quite right in that regard.  My apologies.  I shouldn't hold admins, moderators or other staff members to a higher standard than others (unless they're using their mod-powers to move legitimate threads into altcoins unilaterally).  That's no different to people holding developers to a higher standard than others.  At the end of the day we should all remain objective and consider all views on an equal footing.
legendary
Activity: 1974
Merit: 1030
It's disheartening to see this from forum staff.

I stopped reading at this point. WTF people, does having a stupid label make me a kind oh God or something like that?

*goes register an alt NAO (edit: and not visiting this thread again)
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