Private Keys should be kept because this is the only proof that you own the bitcoin and not by someone else. Unlike having property like house and lot to have clear concrete evidence of ownership by having a certificate of ownership or transfer of certificate title with the name of the owner.
I truly was amazed by blockchain and how it works. My conception was wrong for thinking that bitcoin sits in the digital wallet but it is not.
Topic: Your keys, your bitcoin? - page 4. (Read 1138 times)
im currently using a wallet that i dont held my private keys . is this mean that i dont own the coins that i see inside my wallet ? but the point is i can withdrew this coins or i can use this inside their platform .
thats more important but let say if im a trader or a investor that owns a large portion of coins dedicated only for those business i think ill prefer a wallet that i can hold my private keys with me .
thats more important but let say if im a trader or a investor that owns a large portion of coins dedicated only for those business i think ill prefer a wallet that i can hold my private keys with me .
You own it as logn as your account is in good standing where you held your coins, that is why they always ask for KYC to verify the identity of the owner of the coins, this is for future reference in case of hacked ir suspicious activity in your account, they can disable your account if they see unusual activity in your account and eventually lose your account and your coins as well, your account is your private key in that site.
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It's possible if the address happen to be owned by husband and wife and since it's a conjugal property, two persons can own one address and one private keys any court will rule that what husband owns or wife owns at the time of their marriage can be considered conjugal properties I consider Bitcoin as both investment and assets.
It makes sense. Even they will have to go to the court, law has something to do with sharing properties. Bitcoin's not exempted. If husband and wife knew the private keys, the both person owned it already.
"Not your keys, not your bitcoin", that's why it's strongly advice not to share it with anyone and keep it in a very safe place because once the private keys are being taken away or even saw that by someone, it wouldn't be yours anymore.
Should the California court provide a thread in bitcointalk forum where people can provide their BTC address and sign a message?
The court will probably just assume they both own the coins unless one of them can prove whether one stole the keys from the other. This is going to be hard. If they can both agree to flip a coin to resolve the issue, the easier for the court to settle.
Hey, I still got a method here that can help you prove your ownership.
Double-signature method
A way of proving yourselves at the time of doubt when any of your keys get stolen. You can use 2 unique addresses from 2 different wallets (and the wallets should allow you signing messages). You should sign one message from address X stating that the said address (X) is yours and that you are also going to sign the same message from address Y (that another wallet) that you possess the address X. Do it vice versa for address Y too. This way, you'll have your worth proven in times when your keys ever get stolen (it's like a 2FA) and now, don't tell me that both keys may get stolen (lolz). Just store both of them on 2 different devices (one of them should be kept on a device that always remains offline).
Should the California court provide a thread in bitcointalk forum where people can provide their BTC address and sign a message?
The court will probably just assume they both own the coins unless one of them can prove whether one stole the keys from the other. This is going to be hard. If they can both agree to flip a coin to resolve the issue, the easier for the court to settle.
@OP, what a difference you've come up with! Amazing, seriously!
I do agree that if a person has the exact private key that you own, then you're probably caught under a mess. Remember one thing though that if a private key gets compromised, no one's stupid enough to wait for even a second sweeping it off and taking those coins somewhere else (maybe to an exchange where s/she would sell it immediately). It's sometimes good not to have our coins in our possession but that time is when bad luck strikes, else our coins are best under our possession when we hold the private key. Why not buy a hardware wallet with an insurance instead?
I do agree that if a person has the exact private key that you own, then you're probably caught under a mess. Remember one thing though that if a private key gets compromised, no one's stupid enough to wait for even a second sweeping it off and taking those coins somewhere else (maybe to an exchange where s/she would sell it immediately). It's sometimes good not to have our coins in our possession but that time is when bad luck strikes, else our coins are best under our possession when we hold the private key. Why not buy a hardware wallet with an insurance instead?
Technically there is no such way to prove ownership of private keys. That's how a decentralized system works. There is no way to record your IP during private keys creation. So no way to prove ownership of private keys. As you said in your last reply, the only way to reveal your privacy. That's the reason why its important to keep safe your private keys. This isn't a centralized system and there are no records about you as a person.
im currently using a wallet that i dont held my private keys . is this mean that i dont own the coins that i see inside my wallet ? but the point is i can withdrew this coins or i can use this inside their platform .
thats more important but let say if im a trader or a investor that owns a large portion of coins dedicated only for those business i think ill prefer a wallet that i can hold my private keys with me .
thats more important but let say if im a trader or a investor that owns a large portion of coins dedicated only for those business i think ill prefer a wallet that i can hold my private keys with me .
For example if you have fund to a different exchanges where you don't have own private key, it means you still owned it but it will have a bigger chance to lost from your hands because someone in exchange can have access in your wallet and have a chance to move your funds on their own wallet. That's why i didn't stay my funds in any crypto exchange for so long. If i earned profit ,I move immediately to my own wallet with private key so that more secured.
That's why DEXes and non custody are our future
Any decentralized exchanges and exchange services operate on smart contracts.If you connect your wallet to an unaudited smart contract, then you risk losing your coins.
Fraudsters can easily steal your money without knowing your private keys.
You need to be careful in both cases.
That's why DEXes and non custody are our future
im currently using a wallet that i dont held my private keys . is this mean that i dont own the coins that i see inside my wallet ? but the point is i can withdrew this coins or i can use this inside their platform .
thats more important but let say if im a trader or a investor that owns a large portion of coins dedicated only for those business i think ill prefer a wallet that i can hold my private keys with me .
thats more important but let say if im a trader or a investor that owns a large portion of coins dedicated only for those business i think ill prefer a wallet that i can hold my private keys with me .
It's not that simple. You still owe your coins but to my opinion not having access to the private key is a bit risky. You have to actually have trust that no one else will not have access to your wallet by sharing the key with someone else or misuse it in some other way. I always prefere wallets that enable me access to the private key.
That's why they say, keep your private keys safe. Imagine finding out what is the private key for that address: 1A1zP1eP5QGefi2DMPTfTL5SLmv7DivfNa
Everyone would be satoshi out of nowhere.
If someone gets access to your private keys, you can't prove that he isn't the owner as well. But the main problem is if you have funds in the address. If you have no funds what's the problem? Have you contacted to any important person that you'll communicate if you first prove you own an address?
Everyone would be satoshi out of nowhere.
If someone gets access to your private keys, you can't prove that he isn't the owner as well. But the main problem is if you have funds in the address. If you have no funds what's the problem? Have you contacted to any important person that you'll communicate if you first prove you own an address?
Obviously it will not make much sense or importance if a private key is known and no coin is found there. Because you can generate another at will but the fear is losing a key with loads of coin. It won't be a good story haha.
I like to use a wallet I have control through the phrase.
When i first heard about this news about California having this kind of law being passed, my first impression really was a positive one. I simply thought that it is nice having a new law regarding bitcoin which makes its name a bit more famous and would he recognized by more people. But when I read your post, I suddenly realized how scary the new law that the Californian's government has passed. I mean, a hell lot of things can go wrong with this law since it can be exploited in many ways. Man, I wish they had put more thought into this law before even passing it.
This is a typical Bitcoin saying to make a person understand that, if you don't have the private keys to your Bitcoins, they're basically not yours anymore.. as in, someone else should have it then (a custodial wallet, an exchange etc) so you don't have control.
This is self-explanatory, you don't have access, then it is not yours.
That's just easy to understand so as much as possible always keep in mind that private keys are very important when you are a bitcoin investor. Don't let other people steal it, know it, and have access to it so that your assets will become safe and secured in your own hands only. When you want to access an exchange, choose an exchange with good reviews.
im currently using a wallet that i dont held my private keys . is this mean that i dont own the coins that i see inside my wallet ? but the point is i can withdrew this coins or i can use this inside their platform .
You only get the feeling of owning these coins. If the owner of that platform wants to take out your coins, they can do it. Think of it as sending some money to my card but being able to spend it and see the balance at any time. We both have access to it, and there may be even other parties (my family?) with access to it as well. I promise you they're yours, but how do you know they are going to stay yours in the future as well?I think this is just overcomplicating the entire thing. Just get an open source, non-custodial wallet and keep your private keys wherever you keep your most valuable/important stuff. I don't understand why people choose custodial wallets over decentralized and open source ones. It's your money, why share it?
im currently using a wallet that i dont held my private keys . is this mean that i dont own the coins that i see inside my wallet ? but the point is i can withdrew this coins or i can use this inside their platform .
thats more important but let say if im a trader or a investor that owns a large portion of coins dedicated only for those business i think ill prefer a wallet that i can hold my private keys with me .
thats more important but let say if im a trader or a investor that owns a large portion of coins dedicated only for those business i think ill prefer a wallet that i can hold my private keys with me .
If the California Court Said *Not your keys , not your Bitcoin's* , will the court allow the scams if some third party source decided to suddenly shut down their wallets and decided that it was legal to not give the respective bitcoins to their owners ?
I do believe the court shouldn't have said something so bluntly.
I do believe now a days due to KYC the problem is much easier to solve in case of any dispute , since bank accounts and wallets is now most of the times linked therefore people should not be afraid to do it if... They are holding a huge amount of Bitcoins legally.
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Plus I do believe that sharing your keys should only be done in cases where its absolutely necessary with a person you trust the most.
As for me my wallet provides an option where my bitcoins can go to my family if accidentally god forbid I died , therefore my mom will get access to my account and be contacted by the agency.
Explore your options, don't just share your private keys .
I do believe the court shouldn't have said something so bluntly.
I do believe now a days due to KYC the problem is much easier to solve in case of any dispute , since bank accounts and wallets is now most of the times linked therefore people should not be afraid to do it if... They are holding a huge amount of Bitcoins legally.
____
Plus I do believe that sharing your keys should only be done in cases where its absolutely necessary with a person you trust the most.
As for me my wallet provides an option where my bitcoins can go to my family if accidentally god forbid I died , therefore my mom will get access to my account and be contacted by the agency.
Explore your options, don't just share your private keys .
It's impossible to have a bitcoin address owned by two people unless the address is empty.
Assuming two people own the private key of an address containing bitcoin, one of them will move the fund to a new address. The owner will be the person who has the private key of the new address.
It's possible if the address happen to be owned by husband and wife and since it's a conjugal property, two persons can own one address and one private keys any court will rule that what husband owns or wife owns at the time of their marriage can be considered conjugal properties Assuming two people own the private key of an address containing bitcoin, one of them will move the fund to a new address. The owner will be the person who has the private key of the new address.
I consider Bitcoin as both investment and assets.
The problem with the "your key, your bitcoin" thing is that most of the time, people share their shit to others, sometimes intentionally (to brag about it), impress someone (you trust your date aren't you?) or in some cases accidentally (slips about it and ends up telling about it).
things that are sometimes unintentional because of the arrogance that happens and want to show off what they have. but it is an ordinary human instinct that sometimes does not realize that what is done will have an impact on the losses that occur. There should be certain things that others shouldn't know but because of the high ego it can happen accidentally.
What I understood from the replies above is that in order to prove ownership of private keys in case there is a situation when several people have access to it and therefore can sign a message, a public address should be linked to your identity and the very first transaction associated with that address must be also linked to your identity.
It is a very effective way to say I am the real owner, but not suitable for most bitcoiners since it implies that the whole bitcoin network is now regulated and every transaction is now being cleared by authorities. This is ridiculous and doesn't make any sense, because in such case, bitcoin wouldn't exist already.
If authorities cannot append KYC procedure and identity to every transaction and public address, they need to either ban the network, divide it(black market, grey market, white market) or abandon the idea of regulating it.
What do you think?
It is a very effective way to say I am the real owner, but not suitable for most bitcoiners since it implies that the whole bitcoin network is now regulated and every transaction is now being cleared by authorities. This is ridiculous and doesn't make any sense, because in such case, bitcoin wouldn't exist already.
If authorities cannot append KYC procedure and identity to every transaction and public address, they need to either ban the network, divide it(black market, grey market, white market) or abandon the idea of regulating it.
What do you think?
We have this very useful thread here on our forum which is : http://Stake your Bitcoin address here, wherein, it's purpose is to secure your bitcointalk account, but you can actually use your bitcointalk account to do the same thing with your bitcoin wallet.
Your keys, your account? What if someone steal private key used to sign a message, how can I prove that my account is mine? Jump to: