Zerocoin, the bitcoin killer? Time will tell but I say yes

TonyT

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Quote from: maxxoccupancy on February 23, 2014, 10:00:29 AM

Whether the answer is ZeroCoin or something else, I think that we have seen that there are enough problems already with the Bitcoin protocol and approach to mining that something else may be necessary to protect a buy in from loss due to government efforts to seize or trace funds, scams, and volatility. There's no question in my mind that there's a tremendous need for an anonymous digital currency. My investment in the protocol is to push the bleeding edge. Get more people into this to try it out, find out what works and what doesn't, then

Ethereum is, in my mind, a great evolutionary step forward in digital currency. However, putting everything behind the Bitcoin brand name is a strategy that I don't entirely agree with. For the time being, I think that we need a whole marketplace of altcoins that employ and different technology and different ideas.

I agree. And I agree with Dalmar that anonymity by black marketeers spurred the creation of bitcoin, sort of like porn spurred the development of the mainstream internet. Follow the money... I see a bright future for Zerocoin, and a not so bright future for bitcoin, especially after the Mt. Gox fiasco and impending regulation, see below.

TonyT

http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2014/02/26/japan-studies-regulation-of-bitcoin-after-mt-gox-goes-dark/?_php=true&_type=blogs&_r=0

February 26, 2014, 8:40 am
Now, Nations Mull the Ways to Regulate Bitcoin

anti-scam

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COINECT

Quote from: illodin on February 23, 2014, 05:48:31 PM

Quote from: anti-scam on February 23, 2014, 10:24:35 AM

Zerocoin's "business model" is inherently flawed. It involves complex cryptography with anonymity implications so it has to be open source to be trusted, but if it is open source then it can be easily copied by Bitcoin. The only point to releasing it as its own currency is for a nice pump and dump.

They could just release the source under a strict license that prohibits its use anywhere else.

Then the protocol would simply be reimplemented. It wouldn't be as trivially easy, but a community with billions of dollars could easily get it done.

illodin

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Quote from: anti-scam on February 23, 2014, 10:24:35 AM

Zerocoin's "business model" is inherently flawed. It involves complex cryptography with anonymity implications so it has to be open source to be trusted, but if it is open source then it can be easily copied by Bitcoin. The only point to releasing it as its own currency is for a nice pump and dump.

They could just release the source under a strict license that prohibits its use anywhere else.

msin

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Quote from: infofront on February 23, 2014, 11:17:45 AM

Anoncoin is adding the zerocoin protocol. http://www.reddit.com/r/Anoncoin/comments/1x71aj/zerocoin_update/

Keep in mind zerocoin is more of a protocol than a currency. We don't know if or when the researchers might actually release a coin into the wild. It looks to me like they'd just release a set of technical specs. So if Anoncoin can pull it off, Anoncoin basically will be zerocoin.

Yeah, Nxt is about to release zerocoin as well.

danonthehill

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I seriously doubt the dev's intentions for the Zerocoin protocol. Take a look at them. All are from the faculty at John Hopkins University: 2 PHD students and there supervisor professors, and I seriously question that such an institution would be associated with research that leads to a commercial venture that would grant anonymity to terrorists or criminals. This is an ivory-tower coin masquerading as something street. I doubt further that the devs would have any long term commitment to a community in which they have no roots.

infofront

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Shitcoin Minimalist

Quote from: Skinnkavaj on February 23, 2014, 02:03:35 PM

Isn't darkcoin (already released) anonymous and kinda defeats Zerocoin purpose?

Darkcoin uses the coinjoin protocol which is mostly anonymous, but there are lots of tricks and exploits for someone (especially a government)to be able to figure out a user's identity. So it's really not much better than bitcoin for anonymity. It's just hyped.

Skinnkavaj

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English Motherfucker do you speak it ?

Isn't darkcoin (already released) anonymous and kinda defeats Zerocoin purpose?

anti-scam

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Quote from: infofront on February 23, 2014, 11:17:45 AM

Anoncoin is adding the zerocoin protocol. http://www.reddit.com/r/Anoncoin/comments/1x71aj/zerocoin_update/

Keep in mind zerocoin is more of a protocol than a currency. We don't know if or when the researchers might actually release a coin into the wild. It looks to me like they'd just release a set of technical specs. So if Anoncoin can pull it off, Anoncoin basically will be zerocoin.

The Zerocoin devs have already committed to releasing a currency. The next version of the Zerocoin paper will be presented in May at which point we can expect to see more info.

infofront

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Shitcoin Minimalist

Anoncoin is adding the zerocoin protocol. http://www.reddit.com/r/Anoncoin/comments/1x71aj/zerocoin_update/

Keep in mind zerocoin is more of a protocol than a currency. We don't know if or when the researchers might actually release a coin into the wild. It looks to me like they'd just release a set of technical specs. So if Anoncoin can pull it off, Anoncoin basically will be zerocoin.

anti-scam

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Quote from: Dalmar on February 23, 2014, 10:47:36 AM

Quote from: anti-scam on February 23, 2014, 10:39:19 AM

I don't believe that. It's the standard conspiracy theorist line but if you examine closely you will see that the core developers gave the original Zerocoin protocol a fair shake and rejected it for technical, not political, reasons.

Did you not watch the NY hearings? All those 'big shots' of the bitcoin world were ass kissing the regulators and constantly hammering on that bitcoin has a public ledger. It was like their most important argument for requesting light regulation.

Also, we already know by now that the bitcoin foundation is corrupt. Chances of full anonymity implementation of a mainstream bitcoin are very slim.

They said it because it was true. They didn't say that it couldn't change. If the core developers won't move on it, there are always other segments of the community who will. Ultimately miners and full nodes will decide.

Dalmar

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Life is short, practice empathy in your life

Quote from: anti-scam on February 23, 2014, 10:39:19 AM

I don't believe that. It's the standard conspiracy theorist line but if you examine closely you will see that the core developers gave the original Zerocoin protocol a fair shake and rejected it for technical, not political, reasons.

Did you not watch the NY hearings? All those 'big shots' of the bitcoin world were ass kissing the regulators and constantly hammering on that bitcoin has a public ledger. It was like their most important argument for requesting light regulation.

Also, we already know by now that the bitcoin foundation is corrupt. Chances of full anonymity implementation of a mainstream bitcoin are very slim.

maxxoccupancy

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Bitcoin, Litecoin, Dogecoin, etc, are brands, just like NIKE, SONY, and Apple. When you look at Nike, they don't ever talk about the technology and features that go into each shoe. Perhaps they have better materials and stronger springs--who knows. In their advertising, they talk about self-improvement--ordinary people pushing themselves just like our great athletes do.

I help authors, speakers, a startups with branding. In this cluttered, busy world, people won't remember much about us, so we have to be very clear about what we want them to remember about our coin. Brands are communicated in images, advertisements, news stories, and even through the customer service experience.

No doubt that Bitcoin got off on the wrong foot.

anti-scam

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Quote from: Dalmar on February 23, 2014, 10:32:02 AM

Quote from: anti-scam on February 23, 2014, 10:24:35 AM

Zerocoin's "business model" is inherently flawed. It involves complex cryptography with anonymity implications so it has to be open source to be trusted, but if it is open source then it can be easily copied by Bitcoin. The only point to releasing it as its own currency is for a nice pump and dump.

Bitcoin probably wont ever implement full anonymity as many are trying to push it into the mainstream and acceptance by traditional finance and regulators. Current system is 'good enough' for bitcoin.

I don't believe that. It's the standard conspiracy theorist line but if you examine closely you will see that the core developers gave the original Zerocoin protocol a fair shake and rejected it for technical, not political, reasons.

Dalmar

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Life is short, practice empathy in your life

Quote from: anti-scam on February 23, 2014, 10:24:35 AM

Zerocoin's "business model" is inherently flawed. It involves complex cryptography with anonymity implications so it has to be open source to be trusted, but if it is open source then it can be easily copied by Bitcoin. The only point to releasing it as its own currency is for a nice pump and dump.

Bitcoin probably wont ever implement full anonymity as many are trying to push it into the mainstream and acceptance by traditional finance and regulators. Current system is 'good enough' for bitcoin.

As for other altcoins copying zerocoin's code, they won't be as valuable and respected by the crypto community as the first mover. Look at all those early bitcoin copy cats, none of them ever came close in value and respect.

anti-scam

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Zerocoin's "business model" is inherently flawed. It involves complex cryptography with anonymity implications so it has to be open source to be trusted, but if it is open source then it can be easily copied by Bitcoin. The only point to releasing it as its own currency is for a nice pump and dump.

Pentax

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not a chance, as far as I'm concerned.

Nothing that isn't widely adopted has any chance of overtaking bitcoin. less demand = less demand. bitcoin has headwinds already in terms of regulation. I can't wait to see what fincen thinks of zerocoin.

zerocoin is a niche currrency. while I do think it has innovation, irrespective of whether it is good or bad, it is not going to gain the widespread adoption that bitcoin has due to it's very nature.

I think we'll see lots of niche currencies and they actually have a shot at some sort of market, as they serve a purpose not already served, relative to all of these other naked pump and dumps that bring no innovation and spring up like so many weeds in a field.

corebob

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Quote from: Dalmar on February 23, 2014, 09:49:21 AM

Quote from: corebob on February 23, 2014, 09:42:30 AM

The only "better" bitcoin out there as I see it is darkcoin.

It has world class developers behind it and its not just a bitcoin clone.
They take privacy and neutrality seriously, and it is not pre-mined in any way.
Jesus, I can't believe anyone buying into a coin that isn't open from day one.

Thats the only real competition to bitcoin I have found so far.

You are obviously hyping up a coin you are holding. Darkcoin is nowhere near as innovative or comparable to Zerocoin.

I'm not holding any darkcoin yet. I have been looking into what projects has competent coders behind it, and darkcoin, with their libbitcoin codebase is one of them.
And I'm sure there is others too. Without competent people working on the projects its just not going to make it in the long run.
Most altcoins out there is just another bitcoin clone. I doubt they can make it, specially not those who doesn't allow people to start mining from day one.

maxxoccupancy

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Whether the answer is ZeroCoin or something else, I think that we have seen that there are enough problems already with the Bitcoin protocol and approach to mining that something else may be necessary to protect a buy in from loss due to government efforts to seize or trace funds, scams, and volatility. There's no question in my mind that there's a tremendous need for an anonymous digital currency. My investment in the protocol is to push the bleeding edge. Get more people into this to try it out, find out what works and what doesn't, then

Ethereum is, in my mind, a great evolutionary step forward in digital currency. However, putting everything behind the Bitcoin brand name is a strategy that I don't entirely agree with. For the time being, I think that we need a whole marketplace of altcoins that employ and different technology and different ideas.

Dalmar

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Life is short, practice empathy in your life

Quote from: corebob on February 23, 2014, 09:42:30 AM

The only "better" bitcoin out there as I see it is darkcoin.

It has world class developers behind it and its not just a bitcoin clone.
They take privacy and neutrality seriously, and it is not pre-mined in any way.
Jesus, I can't believe anyone buying into a coin that isn't open from day one.

Thats the only real competition to bitcoin I have found so far.

You are obviously hyping up a coin you are holding. Darkcoin is nowhere near as innovative or comparable to Zerocoin.

LiteCoinGuy

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In Satoshi I Trust

Zerocoin is probably not a bitcoin killer but could get in the top 5 cryptocurrencies for sure. if you want to learn more:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.3878992

Topic: Zerocoin, the bitcoin killer? Time will tell but I say yes (Read 3507 times)