█▓▒░-< [ZPOOL.CA][BTC Multipool] The miners multipool >-░▒▓█ Paid 925+ BTC - page 46.

tbearhere

legendary

Activity: 3164

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Quote from: Spiffy_1 on July 31, 2016, 01:21:15 PM

So if the lottery resets every time a block is found and you start over from scratch, wouldn't the chance of winning increase with more players on your team even though your payout goes down with more miners?

Are you replying to me?

If so yes.
But the extra coins where do they go with one miner only.

ComputerGenie

hero member

Activity: 1092

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Retired IRCX God

Quote from: tbearhere on July 31, 2016, 01:15:14 PM

Multiple blocks every second.... yes just looked at my cmd window... funny multiple blocks.

You are not the entire network. Undecided

pallas

legendary

Activity: 2716

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Black Belt Developer

Quote from: Spiffy_1 on July 31, 2016, 01:21:15 PM

So if the lottery resets every time a block is found and you start over from scratch, wouldn't the chance of winning increase with more players on your team even though your payout goes down with more miners?

Exactly. So in the long term, you get the same amount of coins.

Spiffy_1

full member

Activity: 235

Merit: 100

So if the lottery resets every time a block is found and you start over from scratch, wouldn't the chance of winning increase with more players on your team even though your payout goes down with more miners?

tbearhere

legendary

Activity: 3164

Merit: 1003

Quote from: ComputerGenie on July 31, 2016, 01:09:55 PM

Quote from: pallas on July 31, 2016, 01:05:33 PM

And it looks like this is not clear yet: "the probability of finding a block doesn't depend on the time passed since the last block was found".

That's especially true when (like I said before) the entire network is finding multiple blocks every second.

Multiple blocks every second.... yes just looked at my cmd window... funny multiple blocks.

tbearhere

legendary

Activity: 3164

Merit: 1003

Quote from: ComputerGenie on July 31, 2016, 01:03:12 PM

The pool (all miners collectively) tuns in a total amount of "shares".
You get paid for your shares based on how many shares you have of the total number.

If the pool submitted 200 shares and 2 of them were yours then you have 2% of the payout.

If the pool submitted 2000 shares and 2 of them were yours then you have 0.2% of the payout.

If the pool submitted 200 shares and 200 of them were yours then you have 100% of the payout.

Now i'm confused what happens if i'm the only one mining and i hit a block

ComputerGenie

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Activity: 1092

Merit: 552

Retired IRCX God

Quote from: pallas on July 31, 2016, 01:05:33 PM

And it looks like this is not clear yet: "the probability of finding a block doesn't depend on the time passed since the last block was found".

That's especially true when (like I said before) the entire network is finding multiple blocks every second.

pallas

legendary

Activity: 2716

Merit: 1094

Black Belt Developer

And it looks like this is not clear yet: "the probability of finding a block doesn't depend on the time passed since the last block was found".

ComputerGenie

hero member

Activity: 1092

Merit: 552

Retired IRCX God

The pool (all miners collectively) tuns in a total amount of "shares".
You get paid for your shares based on how many shares you have of the total number.

If the pool submitted 200 shares and 2 of them were yours then you have 2% of the payout.

If the pool submitted 2000 shares and 2 of them were yours then you have 0.2% of the payout.

If the pool submitted 200 shares and 200 of them were yours then you have 100% of the payout.

tbearhere

legendary

Activity: 3164

Merit: 1003

Quote from: ComputerGenie on July 31, 2016, 12:36:16 PM

Quote from: tbearhere on July 31, 2016, 12:24:47 PM

You mean if the pool hit a block at exactly 1pm and exactly at that point everyone turns their miners off and I start mining and hit a block in 3 minutes at 1% I only get 1% of the coins? What happens to the rest? thx
Or if i'm the only one mining at that point i start out at 100% and stay there?

What I mean is that any given hashrate is worth a specific "value".
In the long term, if....
x=140 coins
and you have:
10% of x
or
1% of 10x
it doesn't matter the size of the pool, you still get 14 coins.

The pool could grow exponentially and it wouldn't effect you per rate "profit".

This is especially true with something like lbry where the network is confirming in blocks per second.

Ok understood but if the pool hit a block at exactly 1pm and exactly at that point everyone gets paid and turns their miners off and I start mining in the pool alone and hit a block in 3 minutes at 1% I only get 1% of the coins? What happens to the rest? thx

pallas

legendary

Activity: 2716

Merit: 1094

Black Belt Developer

Blah blah.
It's pretty simple.
Pool hashrate means variance.
Worker difficulty means variance.
Both do not affect payouts.
For example mining lbry on zpool I've been lucky and got much more than expected.

ComputerGenie

hero member

Activity: 1092

Merit: 552

Retired IRCX God

Quote from: joblo on July 31, 2016, 12:33:50 PM

Not quite.

Hash x = payout y

Like electricity it's paid by the total (kWh) not the rate (kW).

If the town uses 1,000kWh and you use 100kWh and you pay $14 USD
or
if the town uses 10,000,000,000,000kWh and you use 100kWh, you still pay $14 USD
Undecided

ComputerGenie

hero member

Activity: 1092

Merit: 552

Retired IRCX God

Quote from: tbearhere on July 31, 2016, 12:24:47 PM

You mean if the pool hit a block at exactly 1pm and exactly at that point everyone turns their miners off and I start mining and hit a block in 3 minutes at 1% I only get 1% of the coins? What happens to the rest? thx
Or if i'm the only one mining at that point i start out at 100% and stay there?

What I mean is that any given hashrate is worth a specific "value".
In the long term, if....
x=140 coins
and you have:
10% of x
or
1% of 10x
it doesn't matter the size of the pool, you still get 14 coins.

The pool could grow exponentially and it wouldn't effect you per rate "profit".

This is especially true with something like lbry where the network is confirming in blocks per second.

joblo

legendary

Activity: 1470

Merit: 1114

Quote from: ComputerGenie on July 31, 2016, 12:05:52 PM

Hashrate of x = payout of y.

Not quite.

Hash x = payout y

Like electricity it's paid by the total (kWh) not the rate (kW).

tbearhere

legendary

Activity: 3164

Merit: 1003

Quote from: ComputerGenie on July 31, 2016, 12:05:52 PM

Quote from: joblo on July 31, 2016, 11:56:48 AM

The pool is just the accumulation of all the hash submitted by its users.

BINGO!

Ignoring difficulty increases:

Hashrate of x = payout of y.

It doesn't matter if the pool has a 200MH, 20GH, 20TH, or 200PH rate; you get paid the same amount per your hash.

Quote from: joblo

The pool buying tickets makes no sense.

"The pool" being the members of the pool as a single collective.

You mean if the pool hit a block at exactly 1pm and exactly at that point everyone turns their miners off and I start mining and hit a block in 3 minutes at 1% I only get 1% of the coins? What happens to the rest? thx
Or if i'm the only one mining at that point i start out at 100% and stay there?

tbearhere

legendary

Activity: 3164

Merit: 1003

Enter into the equation probability and time to hit a block that's the problem.
I'm getting 20 coins a day elsewhere pool 160gh 2 blocks an hr. 1.2 gh... here no coins a day at 3 gh. If 10-20gh pool and me 1.2 gh coins by advantage 30. The equation for this is complex it takes calculus to figure one out.
Because of a variables ... time to hit a block advantage time to hit a block. difficulty hitting a block.. amount of algorithms to solve a block .. other pools hashrates ect ect ect.
If I see zpool hashrate up to about 10-20gh i'm in.

Of course we can hit a bitcoin block with a cpu's hashrate of 1 kh in 1 minute of mining if we solo mine it but... Wink

ComputerGenie

hero member

Activity: 1092

Merit: 552

Retired IRCX God

Quote from: joblo on July 31, 2016, 11:56:48 AM

The pool is just the accumulation of all the hash submitted by its users.

BINGO!

Ignoring difficulty increases:

Hashrate of x = payout of y.

It doesn't matter if the pool has a 200MH, 20GH, 20TH, or 200PH rate; you get paid the same amount per your hash.

Quote from: joblo

The pool buying tickets makes no sense.

"The pool" being the members of the pool as a single collective.

tbearhere

legendary

Activity: 3164

Merit: 1003

Looks like I started something. Grin

joblo

legendary

Activity: 1470

Merit: 1114

Quote from: ComputerGenie on July 31, 2016, 11:20:22 AM

Quote from: joblo on July 31, 2016, 11:08:52 AM

Hashrate, or more specifically hashes are like lottery tickets.

The more tickets you have the more chances you have a winning ticket.
If you buy solo you need to have a winning ticket but you get the entire jackpot. If you pool your tickets you
gate a share of the jackpot if anyone in the pool holds the winning ticket based on the number of tickets in the pool.

Now change tickets to hashes and jackpot to block in the above.

That's kind of a bad analogy.
The problem with it (in the context of pool mining) is that you skip the part where you don't get more tickets because the pool buys more tickets.
Let's suppose:
The pool finds 10 jackpots per day*
You hold 10% of all tickets; you get 10% of the total jackpots (or 1 jackpot).
The pool grows 10x and scoops 10x more jackpots (100 jackpots per day*)
You now hold 1% of all tickets and you get 1% of the total jackpots(or 1 jackpot).

*for ease of explaining

Wrong. The tickets are only valid for one jackpot, then everyone starts from zero. Beyond that I have no clue what you are
trying to say.

The pool buying tickets makes no sense. The pool manager can mine like any other user. The pool is just the accumulation
of all the hash submitted by its users.

ComputerGenie

hero member

Activity: 1092

Merit: 552

Retired IRCX God

Quote from: joblo on July 31, 2016, 11:08:52 AM

Hashrate, or more specifically hashes are like lottery tickets.

The more tickets you have the more chances you have a winning ticket.
If you buy solo you need to have a winning ticket but you get the entire jackpot. If you pool your tickets you
gate a share of the jackpot if anyone in the pool holds the winning ticket based on the number of tickets in the pool.

Now change tickets to hashes and jackpot to block in the above.

That's kind of a bad analogy.
The problem with it (in the context of pool mining) is that you skip the part where you don't get more tickets because the pool buys more tickets.
Let's suppose:
The pool finds 10 jackpots per day*
You hold 10% of all tickets; you get 10% of the total jackpots (or 1 jackpot).
The pool grows 10x and scoops 10x more jackpots (100 jackpots per day*)
You now hold 1% of all tickets and you get 1% of the total jackpots(or 1 jackpot).

*for ease of explaining

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