Russian ruble is scam - page 6. | Bitcointalksearch.org

jostorres

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Quote from: davis196 on August 06, 2023, 06:28:40 AM

Quote from: two.625 on July 22, 2023, 07:09:30 AM

Over the past 123 years, the Russian ruble has defaulted three times. What is the probability of a fourth default?

Why are you talking about the Russian ruble in particular? Basically every fiat currency is a more or less a scam.
Do you think that the US dollar, Euro, Chinese Yuan and British pound are better? I don't think so.
I remember some news from 2022, claiming that Russia was in a technical default(unable to pay it's foreign debts due to the western sanctions). Well, this didn't have any obvious impact over the Russian economy. Russia has big currency reserves(some of them are blocked in western banks) and low government debt. I don't think that Russia will go bankrupt anytime soon(and I'm not a fan of Putin).

Yes. He didn't provide more info there which makes us confused if what he was trying to explain. But if I were to guess, it has something to do with the loan? Because he uses the word default there. Maybe fiat is that bad because their value decreases over time but I won't totally called them as a scam because people are still benefiting from them.

We need them to buy our needs except maybe if we are living on Venezuela or on those reported countries where the value of their money is almost zero now. In between Rubble and the US dollar, I think the US dollar is much better and stronger even though there are rumors that they are also in debt and they may not pay.

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Quote from: Sithara007 on August 09, 2023, 03:47:07 AM

Ruble has considerably weakened so far this year. At the beginning of the year, it was trading against the USD at a rate of 1 USD = 60 RUR. Now the exchange rate has gone down to 1 USD = 97 RUR. The fact that the Russian government is allowing this to happen, tells us what are their priorities. When the exchange rate goes down, it benefits the exporters. Those who export grain, oil and gas from Russia are benefitting from the devaluation of the Russian Ruble. At the same time, imports will be down since they have become more expensive. Perhaps this is what the regime wants.

Not sure why they would try to do so, because even though it could make some sense, their biggest ally is China, a country that lives thanks to the high exportation rate, to the point they need to devaluate the Yuan to keep their competitiveness up to and not lose clients.

Russia cannot aspire to turn into a second China if they do not have the huge income of money China has and if they still have the international sanctions over them. That is a big diffference, China may be one of the biggest foes of USA, but both parts are aware they need each other to keep the economical quo status. USA does not need Russia economically, nor the Western Allies.

For now, it is about a handful of countries in the BRICS, Cuba and others which are willing to do business with the Kremlin. Imo

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Quote from: Sithara007 on August 09, 2023, 03:47:07 AM

Ruble has considerably weakened so far this year. At the beginning of the year, it was trading against the USD at a rate of 1 USD = 60 RUR. Now the exchange rate has gone down to 1 USD = 97 RUR. The fact that the Russian government is allowing this to happen, tells us what are their priorities. When the exchange rate goes down, it benefits the exporters. Those who export grain, oil and gas from Russia are benefitting from the devaluation of the Russian Ruble. At the same time, imports will be down since they have become more expensive. Perhaps this is what the regime wants.

And the government cannot make a currency corridor, because this will lead to the growth of the shadow market. The exchange rate of the ruble is falling because more products are imported into the country than are exported from it. And this is a great opportunity for businesses to earn good money by opening production facilities in Russia.

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Ruble has considerably weakened so far this year. At the beginning of the year, it was trading against the USD at a rate of 1 USD = 60 RUR. Now the exchange rate has gone down to 1 USD = 97 RUR. The fact that the Russian government is allowing this to happen, tells us what are their priorities. When the exchange rate goes down, it benefits the exporters. Those who export grain, oil and gas from Russia are benefitting from the devaluation of the Russian Ruble. At the same time, imports will be down since they have become more expensive. Perhaps this is what the regime wants.

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Quote from: Wend on August 08, 2023, 10:41:40 AM

Quote from: DrBeer on August 08, 2023, 03:15:57 AM

1 ruble, now worth 1 cent. A strong ruble, with 40% of the world's resources behind it, the geopolitical leader of the world, the world's second army, oil and gas - on which the whole world depends. It is now worth 1 cent, 1/100th of a dollar, which is "not backed by anything", which "everyone refuses to give up".

That was of course a joke ! No, about 1 ruble=1 cent is a fact, a joke about the dollar not secured and not needed by anyone

And now it is not a joke at all - you know what the Russian government is proud of ? They are proud of the fact that due to this wild inflation, the volume of unsecured money supply (they consider it "profit" for some reason) increased by 1 trillion rubles !
Here are the news headlines "The government made a trillion on the collapse of the ruble" ? Grin

Can you offer some coins backed by gold or any asset, even USD? There is no denying that the ruble is depreciating because of US and Western sanctions. But I remember there was a time when it returned to its pre-war value and now it's depreciated again. That suggests that the ruble will also be able to recover in the future. Moreover, it is important that the Russian economy remains resilient to millions of sanctions and cannot collapse or go bankrupt as many Western media are claiming.

No ! And no one will ! That's exactly what I'm saying-- no one can:
- to back the currency with real gold
- to accept it as a new standard for international settlements !

The USA is no exception here, and it is pointless to argue about the problems that Nixon recognized, whether one likes the USA or not.

But let me clarify - the US dollar is not backed by gold, it is backed by economic, political, military, technological, .... and other advantages that are often unattainable by other countries and even unions !
That is why I explain - until there is a country/union with such a set of powerful characteristics - all the stories about replacing the dollar with some surrogates are just "wet dreams" and cheap populism !

Wend

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Quote from: DrBeer on August 08, 2023, 03:15:57 AM

1 ruble, now worth 1 cent. A strong ruble, with 40% of the world's resources behind it, the geopolitical leader of the world, the world's second army, oil and gas - on which the whole world depends. It is now worth 1 cent, 1/100th of a dollar, which is "not backed by anything", which "everyone refuses to give up".

That was of course a joke ! No, about 1 ruble=1 cent is a fact, a joke about the dollar not secured and not needed by anyone

And now it is not a joke at all - you know what the Russian government is proud of ? They are proud of the fact that due to this wild inflation, the volume of unsecured money supply (they consider it "profit" for some reason) increased by 1 trillion rubles !
Here are the news headlines "The government made a trillion on the collapse of the ruble" ? Grin

Can you offer some coins backed by gold or any asset, even USD? There is no denying that the ruble is depreciating because of US and Western sanctions. But I remember there was a time when it returned to its pre-war value and now it's depreciated again. That suggests that the ruble will also be able to recover in the future. Moreover, it is important that the Russian economy remains resilient to millions of sanctions and cannot collapse or go bankrupt as many Western media are claiming.

DrBeer

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1 ruble, now worth 1 cent. A strong ruble, with 40% of the world's resources behind it, the geopolitical leader of the world, the world's second army, oil and gas - on which the whole world depends. It is now worth 1 cent, 1/100th of a dollar, which is "not backed by anything", which "everyone refuses to give up".

That was of course a joke ! No, about 1 ruble=1 cent is a fact, a joke about the dollar not secured and not needed by anyone

And now it is not a joke at all - you know what the Russian government is proud of ? They are proud of the fact that due to this wild inflation, the volume of unsecured money supply (they consider it "profit" for some reason) increased by 1 trillion rubles !
Here are the news headlines "The government made a trillion on the collapse of the ruble" ? Grin

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Quote from: Latviand on August 06, 2023, 09:42:31 PM

Quote from: 19Nov16 on August 04, 2023, 09:47:05 AM

Financial problems that occur with Ruble also occur a lot with other countries, but I'm sure that the Russian government will do everything to be able to make Rubles normal again, and we who hold Rubles don't worry because everything will get better soon.

Not really, other countries don't start invading neighboring countries and face sanctions that destroy their economy. Yes, they will do everything in their power but I am sure that most Russians will have to suffer from the currency devaluing. Regarding getting better, if the war continues, I don't think that being better is going to come to the citizens soon. Putin wants to absorb Ukraine so I am sure that he will do everything to do that including facing another default.

I agree with you. With the way things are going right now and how Putin is acting, wanting so absorb Ukraine badly, it will take for some time for everything to be better for the citizens. The effects of what happened cannot just be shoved back and act as if nothing happened, like everything can go back to the way it used to be in a snap. It will take years for everything to go back to normal, not even better.

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Quote from: 19Nov16 on August 04, 2023, 09:47:05 AM

Financial problems that occur with Ruble also occur a lot with other countries, but I'm sure that the Russian government will do everything to be able to make Rubles normal again, and we who hold Rubles don't worry because everything will get better soon.

Not really, other countries don't start invading neighboring countries and face sanctions that destroy their economy. Yes, they will do everything in their power but I am sure that most Russians will have to suffer from the currency devaluing. Regarding getting better, if the war continues, I don't think that being better is going to come to the citizens soon. Putin wants to absorb Ukraine so I am sure that he will do everything to do that including facing another default.

Wend

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Quote from: Unbunplease on August 06, 2023, 05:38:06 PM

Quote from: davis196 on August 06, 2023, 06:28:40 AM

Why are you talking about the Russian ruble in particular? Basically every fiat currency is a more or less a scam.
Do you think that the US dollar, Euro, Chinese Yuan and British pound are better? I don't think so.
I remember some news from 2022, claiming that Russia was in a technical default(unable to pay it's foreign debts due to the western sanctions). Well, this didn't have any obvious impact over the Russian economy. Russia has big currency reserves(some of them are blocked in western banks) and low government debt. I don't think that Russia will go bankrupt anytime soon(and I'm not a fan of Putin).

The problem is that we do not know how much a currency is backed by gold. Officially, yes, it is backed by gold, but in reality, maybe all the vaults have been looted and instead of gold bars there are fake ones? There are real gold bars on the outside, but not inside. How do we know? We don't. We have to take your word for it. Bitcoin, at least it has the appearance of a blockchain.

Today, no coins are backed by gold, the abolition of the gold standard was implemented in 1971 due to increased demand for the currency, while gold hoarding became increasingly difficult. It can be said that fiat is just a paper with no value, their value is determined by the government, so it is a government protected scam. It can collapse at any time when the government is no longer able to protect it.

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Quote from: davis196 on August 06, 2023, 06:28:40 AM

Why are you talking about the Russian ruble in particular? Basically every fiat currency is a more or less a scam.
Do you think that the US dollar, Euro, Chinese Yuan and British pound are better? I don't think so.
I remember some news from 2022, claiming that Russia was in a technical default(unable to pay it's foreign debts due to the western sanctions). Well, this didn't have any obvious impact over the Russian economy. Russia has big currency reserves(some of them are blocked in western banks) and low government debt. I don't think that Russia will go bankrupt anytime soon(and I'm not a fan of Putin).

The problem is that we do not know how much a currency is backed by gold. Officially, yes, it is backed by gold, but in reality, maybe all the vaults have been looted and instead of gold bars there are fake ones? There are real gold bars on the outside, but not inside. How do we know? We don't. We have to take your word for it. Bitcoin, at least it has the appearance of a blockchain.

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Quote from: davis196 on August 06, 2023, 06:28:40 AM

Quote from: two.625 on July 22, 2023, 07:09:30 AM

Over the past 123 years, the Russian ruble has defaulted three times. What is the probability of a fourth default?

Why are you talking about the Russian ruble in particular? Basically every fiat currency is a more or less a scam.
Do you think that the US dollar, Euro, Chinese Yuan and British pound are better? I don't think so.
I remember some news from 2022, claiming that Russia was in a technical default(unable to pay it's foreign debts due to the western sanctions). Well, this didn't have any obvious impact over the Russian economy. Russia has big currency reserves(some of them are blocked in western banks) and low government debt. I don't think that Russia will go bankrupt anytime soon(and I'm not a fan of Putin).

The issue is the real value and providing value to the currency.
For example, the U.S. does not have all the world's reserves of natural resources, but the dollar is still the most desirable currency, and the most liquid.

The Russian ruble looked pretty good until 2014, it's true and it's silly to deny it. "Supported" the ruble:
- Oil and gas
- Powerful military-industrial complex
- Russia's high international status
- Sufficiently deep integration into the world economy, especially into the EU economy
- Sufficiently good relations with leading Western countries.

After 2014 this began to "melt", and after 2022 - simply collapsed ! And the whole problem is that russia has driven itself into the worst position of all time - now it is a pariah country, the government is a toxic contact, the army is a fake, the economy is a fake, a terrorist country,.... In short the full gentleman's kit.... mega-loser! And the trends in russia and its economy are not positive at all.
That's why the ruble looks so bad now, and in a quarter - let's revisit the issue, I'm sure you will have no questions and doubts about the ruble.

davis196

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Quote from: two.625 on July 22, 2023, 07:09:30 AM

Over the past 123 years, the Russian ruble has defaulted three times. What is the probability of a fourth default?

Why are you talking about the Russian ruble in particular? Basically every fiat currency is a more or less a scam.
Do you think that the US dollar, Euro, Chinese Yuan and British pound are better? I don't think so.
I remember some news from 2022, claiming that Russia was in a technical default(unable to pay it's foreign debts due to the western sanctions). Well, this didn't have any obvious impact over the Russian economy. Russia has big currency reserves(some of them are blocked in western banks) and low government debt. I don't think that Russia will go bankrupt anytime soon(and I'm not a fan of Putin).

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Quote from: Fortify on August 05, 2023, 04:46:36 AM

Quote from: two.625 on July 22, 2023, 07:09:30 AM

Over the past 123 years, the Russian ruble has defaulted three times. What is the probability of a fourth default?

The Ruble is probably more protected that previous situations, because Putin made an active attempt to build up reserves and cut as much debt as possible before he decided on the disastrous attempt at invading Ukraine. However the world has only become more globalized in the last few decades, so it's impossible to cut off ties completely and ultimately nobody now wants to touch the ruble at all. That means in order to trade and buy exports from other countries, they have to offer other things or a very unfavorable rate, if they can even get past the sanctions that are currently imposed. At the moment the Russian economy is slowly disintegrating and the reserves have pretty much disappeared. Instead of selling at premium rates to their next door neighbors, they are having to accept dismal trades and cover long distance transport costs too.

"We do not have an external debt", "Yes, look at the external debt of the United States"!
The eternal theme for intellectual masturbation in Russia

Well, how else to convince yourself that everything is fine with you, or rather justify that around you is "good", although you yourself understand that this is the level of a third world country

Here are the countries with even less external debt:
Venezuela 0 billion USD
Burundi May 2023 0.614 billion USD
Swaziland Q1/23 USD 0.814 billion
Lesotho Q3/22 USD 0.818 billion
Liberia Q1/23 USD 1.136 billion
Botswana Q3/22 USD 1.271 billion
Chad Q4/16 USD 1.36 billion
Belize 2022 1.363 B USD
Guyana Q4/22 USD 1.572 billion
......

Russia Q2/23,348 billion USD

Tell me - do you really believe that the minimum amount of external debt speaks of a high standard of living? Or about economic stability?

Well, the question is about the stability of the steering wheel - name the list of countries conducting transactions in rubles, and the turnover of this trade in rubles?

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Quote from: two.625 on July 22, 2023, 07:09:30 AM

Over the past 123 years, the Russian ruble has defaulted three times. What is the probability of a fourth default?

The Ruble is probably more protected that previous situations, because Putin made an active attempt to build up reserves and cut as much debt as possible before he decided on the disastrous attempt at invading Ukraine. However the world has only become more globalized in the last few decades, so it's impossible to cut off ties completely and ultimately nobody now wants to touch the ruble at all. That means in order to trade and buy exports from other countries, they have to offer other things or a very unfavorable rate, if they can even get past the sanctions that are currently imposed. At the moment the Russian economy is slowly disintegrating and the reserves have pretty much disappeared. Instead of selling at premium rates to their next door neighbors, they are having to accept dismal trades and cover long distance transport costs too.

DrBeer

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Quote from: mindrust on July 31, 2023, 11:52:49 PM

Russian Ruble is a scam just like the USD. Back in the 70’s USD defaulted too when they removed the USD from the gold standard. Right now every FIAT currency is a scam because nothing is backing them. The central banks can create FIAT out of thin air unlike gold which you need to work hard to get it from the ground. Don’t be so hopeless though, every FIAT currency in history failed and that means any FIAT currency in existence right now will also fail.

Quite a controversial comparison

Tell me - in what currency do ...Russian aligarchs and the Kremlin top brass have most of their savings? I'll give you a hint - in dollars

And tell me - what famous people keep their savings in rubles ? Can't name them ? So no one can name

Or another question - in international trade, what currency everyone wants to receive - dollar or ruble ?

Perhaps in some sense all fiat is a fake. But there is a fake that has international support and demand (US dollar), and there is a real scam, or rather worthless and really, nothing secured papers (Russian ruble).

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Quote from: RewFrew on August 04, 2023, 05:01:38 PM

No i Couldn't think Russian Ruble is scam. After start Russia Ukraine War Russian Ruble has been more popular and more strong. Now a days many country using ruble for trading with Russia. Because Russia did it mandatory to trade means import export with Russia. So ruble now very strong. Mainly European Union dependent on russian gas. They are buying gas from Russia by Ruble. So i thinl day by day ruble being strong not scam.

The aim of those Russian measures, by imposing the use of the ruble for trade exchanges with it, is a response to its withdrawal from the Swift system, before it decided at a later time to stop gas supplies through pipelines. Russia knew that this option could not be pursued, because it is almost impossible for countries to provide that amount of liquidity in the ruble.
The ruble generally has a good position in the global market as one of the strongest major currencies, and even in the reality of the international crisis that Russia is currently going through, the BRICS countries with Russia's strategic allies around the world will not stop supporting it. This is within the framework of the anti-dollar policy as well.

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The possibilities of default of the Russian ruble do not make "scam" to the official and consolidated currency of a nation, it may be a volatile currency negatively at present but to assert it as a scam is too severe, it is like saying that an entire country does not exist or that it was falsely created only to profit and that is too far-fetched, beyond this and as mentioned in other answers, it is necessary to separate feelings from reality and above all in the socio-economic aspects of any analysis, and with this to understand that the Russian ruble is an aspect linked to a nation that in this particular case will see its currency plummeting because the West punishes in this way the actions that do not serve its interests whenever it has the possibility.

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Quote from: two.625 on July 22, 2023, 07:09:30 AM

Over the past 123 years, the Russian ruble has defaulted three times. What is the probability of a fourth default?

It’s not but its a fiat currency where the government have the full control.
Failing currency doesn’t mean a scam one as this is still their commodity and currency. If you’re not using Ruble then don’t stress yourself with this because fiat currency will always experience inflation and the worst is, getting defaulted which came from the poor government system. Let’s see if they will rise this time as the USD is showing its weakness for the past Months and many are predicting the rise of the BRICS countries.

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No i Couldn't think Russian Ruble is scam. After start Russia Ukraine War Russian Ruble has been more popular and more strong. Now a days many country using ruble for trading with Russia. Because Russia did it mandatory to trade means import export with Russia. So ruble now very strong. Mainly European Union dependent on russian gas. They are buying gas from Russia by Ruble. So i thinl day by day ruble being strong not scam.

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