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DannyHamilton

legendary

Activity: 3514

Merit: 4895

Quote from: abbeytim on August 19, 2015, 10:27:03 AM

ok what I don't understand is bitcoinxt and bitcoin core mining same blocks now or are they split and will each have separate diff

Right now? Today?

The only thing that is different is the version number, but bitcoin code accepts all blocks created by bitcoinxt and bitcoinxt accepts all blocks created by core.

In the future, bitcoinxt may possibly begin creating blocks that bitcoin core refuses to accept (and vice versa).

abbeytim

sr. member

Activity: 438

Merit: 250

ok what I don't understand is bitcoinxt and bitcoin core mining same blocks now or are they split and will each have separate diff

jaredboice

hero member

Activity: 560

Merit: 500

Quote from: Lauda on August 18, 2015, 11:31:42 AM

Quote from: DannyHamilton on August 18, 2015, 11:07:44 AM

What do you think altcoins are?

99% of all altcoins ARE disputed forks of bitcoin.

An altcoin is THE RESULT OF someone creating a fork that only a portion of users decide to mine and use.

Nope, this doesn't work with ignorant people and some XT supporters. The last time that I used this statement, I received a nice piece of ad hominem in return. This is why theymos has called XT a programmed altcoin, I believe. It does make sense (to me).

XT is divide et impera at its finest.

Update:
Excellent quoted post that I have missed. That is definitely useful for further discussions.

If Divide and Conquer is what it actually is, then one must wonder what actual topics were discussed behind closed doors when Gavin met with the CIA

sAt0sHiFanClub

hero member

Activity: 546

Merit: 500

Warning: Confrmed Gavinista

Quote from: kwukduck on August 18, 2015, 03:45:47 PM

Can't expect anything else from mainstream media. They live on drama.
Then again if this scares people they obviously don't know what they have invested in in the first place, better to get rid of them if you ask me.

Bloody media and their 'truths'... Should not be allowed. Can they not be silenced?

sAt0sHiFanClub

hero member

Activity: 546

Merit: 500

Warning: Confrmed Gavinista

Quote from: turtlehurricane on August 18, 2015, 08:36:47 AM

Community needs to aggressively educate BitcoinXT supporters.

How do you reckon industry leading retards are going to educate anyone? Grin

Give me an example of this'education' you propose to give? Whats your key point to stick to 1mb?

kwukduck

legendary

Activity: 1937

Merit: 1001

Can't expect anything else from mainstream media. They live on drama.
Then again if this scares people they obviously don't know what they have invested in in the first place, better to get rid of them if you ask me.

conspirosphere.tk

legendary

Activity: 2352

Merit: 1064

Bitcoin is antisemitic

Quote from: zeroday on August 18, 2015, 02:30:53 PM

Can somebody explain why some people disagree with the necessity of increasing block size ?
It should be increased to allow further BTC development, but harsh forking to XT without consensus is harmful, IMO.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.12176765

Quote

Quote from: knight22 on Today at 03:30:06 AM

Quote

BitcoinXT is just a fall back plan

no: it's an inside job to destroy it, pure & simple:
https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/block-size-bitcoin-not-scale-effectively/

And it has good chances to succeed even if it does not get implemented, by dividing the community, crashing the price and so expectations, and obstructing a real solution to spam (attacks or crap indifferently) like this one:

http://cointelegraph.com/news/114791/litecoin-shows-there-is-a-simple-fix-for-spam-attacks-on-bitcoin

more:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.12157254

Mickeyb

hero member

Activity: 798

Merit: 1000

Move On !!!!!!

Quote from: quakefiend420 on August 18, 2015, 12:14:08 PM

I don't like the increase schedule in XT, my hope is that XT is the catalyst to get Core team to agree on some sort of increase and we can reassess later once we see how other scaling solutions are progressing. Just because the network moves to 8MB blocks now doesn't mean that we're beholden to the every two years schedule built into XT now.

This is exactly my hope as well. I don't know about the others, but I refuse to believe that Gavin has become corrupt. I think he would have easily settled to 4MB block, just if there was consensus.

His XT move is a bluff as well in my opinion. If it works, great, we will have 8MB blocks. But it probably won't get 75% of the nodes on board. So when the XT starts approaching 35%-40%, core devs will start panicking and then the negotiation time will start. Then we will get some consensus and finish this drama.

forlackofabettername

full member

Activity: 150

Merit: 100

Quote from: Thekool1s on August 18, 2015, 12:49:59 PM

Can someone link me to thread which explains this "XT" Thing, I clearly dont understand what the situation is going in bitcoin technical world. What is bitcoin XT? Is it for faster or bigger transactions? I cant understand a bit can someone explain or link me to where get started about this situation?

The real insight to get the bigger pricture, not that manipulative crap these Gavincoiners post on here:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/fork-off-919629

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/bitcoin-20mb-fork-941331

bimasena25

full member

Activity: 187

Merit: 100

https://bitcointester.com/

panic not so good
will decrease coin value more
just sit down, n think plan strategy for worst situation, my friend

zeroday

donator

Activity: 784

Merit: 1000

Can somebody explain why some people disagree with the necessity of increasing block size ?
It should be increased to allow further BTC development, but harsh forking to XT without consensus is harmful, IMO.

johnyj

legendary

Activity: 1988

Merit: 1012

Beyond Imagination

Quote from: Amph on August 18, 2015, 09:29:11 AM

Quote from: Kazimir on August 18, 2015, 09:13:42 AM

Exactly.. Regardless whether Bitcoin XT will get enough nodes or miners to fork, or not, is not very important. And sure, Bitcoin will be able to handle this, technically.

What IS important is the very bad influence this all has on the market and trust in Bitcoin by the general audience. Lots of (unnecessary) confusion, panic, harm to Bitcoin's reputation, stalling it's acceptance and growth.

the very bad influence seems already started the price is tanking slowly but inexorably, i'm sure it has to do with the fork and XT, but if true that it will be possible to double spend your coins then in the case that the price will fall to 50% we have still the same value

Could be far below that, because the biggest promise of bitcoin - limited supply - is broken. It means it does not make any sense to use it as a currency or store value, once in a while its price will crash by 50% when core devs disagree with each other

No, it basically killed the whole concept of currency of limited supply, and then we'd back to the fiat world and forget about this programmer's game

Then there is a chance that a new coin which have built-in mechanism to prevent a protocol change will take over. This kind of design should be in there in the first place

Scaccomatt0

legendary

Activity: 1120

Merit: 1000

https://cryptoworld.io

It would be nice to keep the [block chain] files small as long as we can.
The eventual solution will be to not care how big it gets.

I bet 100BTC that if I ask media and the majority of journalists to explain what's the bitcoinXT situation, I'll receive a bunch of trolling words.

Thekool1s

legendary

Activity: 1512

Merit: 1218

Change is in your hands

Quote from: meono on August 18, 2015, 12:54:09 PM

Quote from: Thekool1s on August 18, 2015, 12:49:59 PM

Can someone link me to thread which explains this "XT" Thing, I clearly dont understand what the situation is going in bitcoin technical world. What is bitcoin XT? Is it for faster or bigger transactions? I cant understand a bit can someone explain or link me to where get started about this situation?

\

Start with this: https://medium.com/@octskyward/why-is-bitcoin-forking-d647312d22c1

Worth the read

Then read this : https://bitcoinxt.software/

Thanks meono, Your help is appreciated

meono

full member

Activity: 196

Merit: 100

Quote from: Thekool1s on August 18, 2015, 12:49:59 PM

Can someone link me to thread which explains this "XT" Thing, I clearly dont understand what the situation is going in bitcoin technical world. What is bitcoin XT? Is it for faster or bigger transactions? I cant understand a bit can someone explain or link me to where get started about this situation?

\

Start with this: https://medium.com/@octskyward/why-is-bitcoin-forking-d647312d22c1

Worth the read

Then read this : https://bitcoinxt.software/

Thekool1s

legendary

Activity: 1512

Merit: 1218

Change is in your hands

Can someone link me to thread which explains this "XT" Thing, I clearly dont understand what the situation is going in bitcoin technical world. What is bitcoin XT? Is it for faster or bigger transactions? I cant understand a bit can someone explain or link me to where get started about this situation?

Denker

legendary

Activity: 1442

Merit: 1016

Quote from: quakefiend420 on August 18, 2015, 12:14:08 PM

Quote from: dothebeats on August 18, 2015, 12:06:23 PM

Minimum benefits, lots of potential damages. XT only worsen the situation of bitcoin. Investors are panicking now because of the "split" which is just unnecessary. Idk why they are pushing bigger block size when in fact 1mb is just right in this current times. What's the most plausible explanation why they are pushing higher block size?

1MB isn't right. We're already at 50% capacity(and increasing). I think the recent stress tests showed us that 1MB isn't sufficient.

LN looks great, but it's not ready yet and won't be for a while. This will help hold us over until other scaling solutions are ready to be deployed.

I don't like the increase schedule in XT, my hope is that XT is the catalyst to get Core team to agree on some sort of increase and we can reassess later once we see how other scaling solutions are progressing. Just because the network moves to 8MB blocks now doesn't mean that we're beholden to the every two years schedule built into XT now.

Really good post.I'm thinking the same. We need bigger blocks and off chain solutions in the future.So both sides should find an arrangement. I would be happy with an increase up to 4MB already. But fact is something hs to happen.

quakefiend420

legendary

Activity: 784

Merit: 1000

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: quakefiend420 on August 18, 2015, 12:14:08 PM

Quote from: dothebeats on August 18, 2015, 12:06:23 PM

Minimum benefits, lots of potential damages. XT only worsen the situation of bitcoin. Investors are panicking now because of the "split" which is just unnecessary. Idk why they are pushing bigger block size when in fact 1mb is just right in this current times. What's the most plausible explanation why they are pushing higher block size?

1MB isn't right. We're already at 50% capacity(and increasing). I think the recent stress tests showed us that 1MB isn't sufficient.

LN looks great, but it's not ready yet and won't be for a while. This will help hold us over until other scaling solutions are ready to be deployed.

I don't like the increase schedule in XT, my hope is that XT is the catalyst to get Core team to agree on some sort of increase and we can reassess later once we see how other scaling solutions are progressing. Just because the network moves to 8MB blocks now doesn't mean that we're beholden to the every two years schedule built into XT now.

The stress tests proved that blocksize isn't an issue. I love how some people come to the completely opposite conclusion.

Even with magnitudes more transactions than usual the network ran smoothly. The doomsday backlog that the stress test people projected never materialized, transaction fees went up to balance the spam and legitimate transactions continued to go through in the next block.

The Bitcoin Core team said block size doesn't need to be increased, and many people here have that view. Propaganda in the media is tricking many into thinking this is an issue when it is not.

And what about when those spam transactions are real users trying to really use the network? Do you propose a constant bidding war between users trying to get their transactions confirmed? All that's going to do is frustrate users and stall adoption.

dothebeats

legendary

Activity: 3542

Merit: 1352

Quote from: quakefiend420 on August 18, 2015, 12:27:53 PM

Quote from: dothebeats on August 18, 2015, 12:25:58 PM

Quote from: quakefiend420 on August 18, 2015, 12:14:08 PM

Quote from: dothebeats on August 18, 2015, 12:06:23 PM

Minimum benefits, lots of potential damages. XT only worsen the situation of bitcoin. Investors are panicking now because of the "split" which is just unnecessary. Idk why they are pushing bigger block size when in fact 1mb is just right in this current times. What's the most plausible explanation why they are pushing higher block size?

1MB isn't right. We're already at 50% capacity(and increasing). I think the recent stress tests showed us that 1MB isn't sufficient.

LN looks great, but it's not ready yet and won't be for a while. This will help hold us over until other scaling solutions are ready to be deployed.

I don't like the increase schedule in XT, my hope is that XT is the catalyst to get Core team to agree on some sort of increase and we can reassess later once we see how other scaling solutions are progressing. Just because the network moves to 8MB blocks now doesn't mean that we're beholden to the every two years schedule built into XT now.

I agree that there will come a time that 1MB isn't just enough to handle all the transactions in the network, but aggressively increasing the block size to 8MB is just way too high. There should be another solution to this impending problem other than increasing it by 8x.

Keep in mind, just because the max is 8MB doesn't mean that we start getting 8MB blocks immediately. That just gives us breathing room to not need to do another hard fork for a while to let other scaling solutions mature.

Yes, raising it to 8MB doesn't necessarily mean that we are getting 8MB blocks, but the point here is even 2MB will give us "room for breathing" when it comes to transactions of the current times while the devs are working on a way to patch this up for long. Only stress-testing on the network cause the rise in transactions, when in reality 1MB is still sufficient for the network to go on without backlogs.

quakefiend420

legendary

Activity: 784

Merit: 1000

Quote from: dothebeats on August 18, 2015, 12:25:58 PM

Quote from: quakefiend420 on August 18, 2015, 12:14:08 PM

Quote from: dothebeats on August 18, 2015, 12:06:23 PM

Minimum benefits, lots of potential damages. XT only worsen the situation of bitcoin. Investors are panicking now because of the "split" which is just unnecessary. Idk why they are pushing bigger block size when in fact 1mb is just right in this current times. What's the most plausible explanation why they are pushing higher block size?

1MB isn't right. We're already at 50% capacity(and increasing). I think the recent stress tests showed us that 1MB isn't sufficient.

LN looks great, but it's not ready yet and won't be for a while. This will help hold us over until other scaling solutions are ready to be deployed.

I don't like the increase schedule in XT, my hope is that XT is the catalyst to get Core team to agree on some sort of increase and we can reassess later once we see how other scaling solutions are progressing. Just because the network moves to 8MB blocks now doesn't mean that we're beholden to the every two years schedule built into XT now.

I agree that there will come a time that 1MB isn't just enough to handle all the transactions in the network, but aggressively increasing the block size to 8MB is just way too high. There should be another solution to this impending problem other than increasing it by 8x.

Keep in mind, just because the max is 8MB doesn't mean that we start getting 8MB blocks immediately. That just gives us breathing room to not need to do another hard fork for a while to let other scaling solutions mature.

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