Well I don't think you need to know this level of detail for account closure. The mere fact that turtlehurricane named his business "USA Crypto Coins LLC" makes it pretty obvious to what he does. C'mon, banks are not that dumbfounded. By now, they're well aware of bitcoin and crypto currency in general.
Majority of the gnomes that work at the physical branch still won't have a clue what bitcoin is. It's the ones in the back office (customers can't reach them) that has the authority of make the decision on account closures based on what they see. These guys are the ones that are fully aware and trained to spot for certain patterns and types of activity. Your business name just makes it so much more easier for them.
Topic: ... - page 2. (Read 8391 times)
I definitely used the bank to send money through venmo/paypal, but didn't receive any money, besides cash deposits I made myself. It could be due to funds movement, but it was a very small amount of activity compared to what I move through my personal account at another bank.
In total I moved a little over $9,000 through the account over the course of 5 months, which is pretty much nothing for a business bank account.
In total I moved a little over $9,000 through the account over the course of 5 months, which is pretty much nothing for a business bank account.
but technically you did receive money.. the $9k got into the account somehow.. lol
so $1800 a month for 5 months, did the bank know your standard income and was standard income below $1800 a month?
was any of the funding paypal due to a negative balance that caused paypal to request funding due to a chargeback scammer?
i dont need to know numbers, just yes or no will do. and sorry if getting personal, we simply want to get an idea of circumstances that could highlight banks decisions, rather than speculate based on lack of info
Don't do any business at all with any Too Big too Fail Banks & Corporations!
===============================================
Don't Reward Failure with Bailouts and Bonuses!
Real Capitalism never has and never will reward failure.
Welcome to Corporate Fascism and centrally planned communistic tendencies.
=================================================
http://projects.propublica.org/bailout/list
STOP aiding and abetting the worst enemies of Capitalism!
=====================================
Switch over to local and regional banks, or credit unions, that DIDN'T receive any bailouts.
http://projects.propublica.org/bailout/list
If your financial institution is on the following list it is your civic duty to close those accounts:
http://projects.propublica.org/bailout/list
They LOST.
They Failed.
http://projects.propublica.org/bailout/list
They must be allowed to fail. Same for the shareholders & bondholders.
And stronger hands must be allowed to take over the reins.
What part of any of this do you folks not comprehend?
Instead we drag this Greater Depression out for decades and enable the same losers to stay
in power and control, while being made 100% whole in their illegal hordes of wealth that they
all rightfully lost back by the end of 2008.
GET REAL.
=======
Reality Check:
==========
No one is going to bail YOU out should you fail. Nor should they. And nothing is too big to fail.
In fact all the banks are far too large to ever be bailed out. Same for GM & Chrysler, and scores
more. Nothing is ever to big to fail except society itself, and maybe...certain smaller depositors
as a safeguard against corporate misbehavior. http://projects.propublica.org/bailout/list
A Lesson in Capitalism
==============
Capitalism is like Nature in that it is self balancing. It's the finest thing ever devised, and it's
currently no longer practiced in the USA, the U.K., and Europe.
The biggest banks were all found guilty of serious felonies. So far no one has been brought
to any sense of justice, let alone sent to the failure bin. Mere fines that amount to chump change
for these corporate felons is further insult to injury. http://projects.propublica.org/bailout/list
What to do:
========
CLOSE ALL YOUR ACCOUNTS at Failed Institutions until their turned over to stronger hands.
All shareholders and bondholders must also fail too. No one is above the law. No one must be
allowed to be above the law. http://projects.propublica.org/bailout/list
And stick all that nonsense straight up your commie/fascist/corporate asshole if you don't 100%
agree. Also prepare to be financially destroyed along with your corporate masters,
You corporate parasitical maggots! http://projects.propublica.org/bailout/list
(if you believe in bailouts for failure your a parasitical maggot).
http://projects.propublica.org/bailout/list
Capitalism died along with America a long time ago. While we were all sleepwalking.
=====================================================
Wake UP and do your civic duties. Or soon you will find out first hand how awful corporate fascism
and centrally planned communistic planning truly is for yourselves, if not already.
example: The Fed is a centrally planned committee of private, criminal banksters, anserable to no one,
whom are your real masters, as well as the USA's masters until told otherwise. Their your centrally
planned phony-communist/neo-fascist masters. Get over it. That's the real truth you cannot yet accept.
CAPITALISM NEVER REWARDS FAILURE. Their Losers. Capitalism never rewards Losers & crooks.
=============================================================
What next? Maybe more Bailouts & Bonuses for more failure just to add insult to injury? O wait, they
will insiston that too, just to keep their underlings from squealing on their own corporate bosses by crying
foul. Or instead straight out robbing your bank accounts with Bank "bail-in's". Yes, that's next. Brace to be
robbed, AGAIN, one way or another. Until finally we decide not to allow such grave injustices and harms by
rewarding any more FAILURES.
What will it take to get it through all your thick heads? Really? What will it take?
CAPITALISM NEVER REWARDS FAILURE.
http://projects.propublica.org/bailout/list
Satoshi Nakamoto with his Bitcoin genius creation understands this.
Bitcoin is Monetary Freedom.
im prepared to think that the reason for turtlehurricane's scenario to be due purely based on mentioning that the account's business plan was bitcoin related, as appose to any actually money movements flagging it..
but then i keep reading turtle hurricane say that
yet also saying
so i am hesitant to rule out the chance that it could be related to a flag due to a funds movement..
and i think others who are trying to figure out if there are any patterns to bank closures, have picked up on this point. he either used the bank account to send or receive money. or the account never had a single dime in it, ever.. it cant be both
but then i keep reading turtle hurricane say that
Quote
I didn't do any ACH transactions with my Wells Fargo accounts.
yet also saying
Quote
Some of those transactions were out of this business account that got shutdown, but it's not like the transactions explicitly said Bitcoin, they just said Venmo/PayPal.
so i am hesitant to rule out the chance that it could be related to a flag due to a funds movement..
and i think others who are trying to figure out if there are any patterns to bank closures, have picked up on this point. he either used the bank account to send or receive money. or the account never had a single dime in it, ever.. it cant be both
A review of your posting history reveals you aren't just trading through exchanges but also sell directly. No wonder you were banned.
Did you do a lot of ACH between banks?
That alone will raise a lot of red flag even if you are not dealing with bitcoin.
ok cheers for your explanation.
in the UK i told my bank manager (local branch not the HQ) that my business plan was bitcoin related and so far 'touch wood' my bank manager loves me, and had no issues.
other people in the UK fall into 2 categories why their accounts were stopped
1. they didnt mention it was bitcoin related but got wire transfer reversal scammed and the scammer mentioned bitcoin which made the victims (account holder) account frozen due to an inconsistency as to what his 'business' was
2. the standard income (job/social security payment) was small vs the amount of funds going back and forth which could be deemed as laundering.
not many were having accounts shut down purely on the basses of mentioning bitcoin as many of them had active accounts for a couple years with full banks knowledge of it being bitcoin related.
i guess that in america just mentioning bitcoin when opening a new account must be an issue. especially if you never been a victim to a chargeback or were dealing with more money movement then your normal weekly income.
one last question.
ever been paypal chargeback scammed, which put your paypal into negative balance where you had to fill it up using your business account because of a paypal demand for funds?
in the UK i told my bank manager (local branch not the HQ) that my business plan was bitcoin related and so far 'touch wood' my bank manager loves me, and had no issues.
other people in the UK fall into 2 categories why their accounts were stopped
1. they didnt mention it was bitcoin related but got wire transfer reversal scammed and the scammer mentioned bitcoin which made the victims (account holder) account frozen due to an inconsistency as to what his 'business' was
2. the standard income (job/social security payment) was small vs the amount of funds going back and forth which could be deemed as laundering.
not many were having accounts shut down purely on the basses of mentioning bitcoin as many of them had active accounts for a couple years with full banks knowledge of it being bitcoin related.
i guess that in america just mentioning bitcoin when opening a new account must be an issue. especially if you never been a victim to a chargeback or were dealing with more money movement then your normal weekly income.
one last question.
Quote
Some of those transactions were out of this business account that got shutdown, but it's not like the transactions explicitly said Bitcoin, they just said Venmo/PayPal.
ever been paypal chargeback scammed, which put your paypal into negative balance where you had to fill it up using your business account because of a paypal demand for funds?
This would be a reasonable explanation if I did any bank transactions with people, but I didn't. No one deposited to my account, nor did I send or receive any wires.
I think this is part of the reason banks ban Bitcoin users though, since they expect that sorta thing to happen eventually.
I think this is part of the reason banks ban Bitcoin users though, since they expect that sorta thing to happen eventually.
so if you never done any banking involving bitcoin. then how on earth did the banks link you as being a bitcoiner??
after all they can only stop it for bitcoin purposes, if they knew you were into bitcoins. so explain to me how you became linked as being a bitcoin user??
You don't need an MSB license to trade Bitcoin, period. It's considered property, not currency.
Is this a joke? You obviously have not been keeping up with recent legalities when it comes to buying/selling bitcoins. Our US government is confused as hell when categorizing bitcoin. One branch (IRS) claims it as property, hence will get taxed as such, but another branch (FINCEN) deems it as a currency.
What do you think happened to Mike Caldwell and his Casascius coins? Do you think he just stopped making them because he got bored of making money? This is exactly why TitanBTC now has license and is regulated by FINCEN before selling their coins.
Each country has different laws and regulation for bitcoin, but individuals complying with government rules is another matter. In the US, any time you make a capital gain, you should pay taxes on it to the IRS. Do you think most people even bother to do this? Do you personally file taxes when doing bitcoin transactions? So yes, a lot of people do not comply with capital gain taxes, nor MSB license. And it's not "according to me", I do not make up these regulations.
When you do small transactions for buying and selling btc for leisure, then it's probably ok to not be registered through FINCEN. But the fact that you have a LLC business dedicated to crypto trading means that you should get a license. It's going through a BUSINESS account, not a personal account.
"You don't really need it [MSB] unless you're a big company like Coinbase or Bitpay." <-- Can you please cite where you got this info, or is it your own opinion?
From my experience (2 closed bank accounts), banks just don't have time and effort to deal with those security charges by the finance inspection organization, so they shutdown your account to buy some peace
If you buy and sell bitcoins privately, you will get many strange scam and payments from illegal activities like stolen accounts, selling drug or weapon, and money laundering scheme. Naturally the law enforcement will find your account info during some mission and ask bank why you are connected with such people
Since you don't personally know these guys, so you are not responsible, banks security department can't charge you, but they would simply shutdown your account to avoid further trouble
I don't think they really care threat of bitcoin, bitcoin still worth so little, not worth worrying. If bitcoin really takes off and become some star investment, they can even make money out of it (providing physical secure storage, exchange, insurance etc...)
If you buy and sell bitcoins privately, you will get many strange scam and payments from illegal activities like stolen accounts, selling drug or weapon, and money laundering scheme. Naturally the law enforcement will find your account info during some mission and ask bank why you are connected with such people
Since you don't personally know these guys, so you are not responsible, banks security department can't charge you, but they would simply shutdown your account to avoid further trouble
I don't think they really care threat of bitcoin, bitcoin still worth so little, not worth worrying. If bitcoin really takes off and become some star investment, they can even make money out of it (providing physical secure storage, exchange, insurance etc...)
johny J:
did you ever have any wire transfer reversal requests made against you by 'chargeback scammers' or are you hypothesizing potential reasons?
From my experience (2 closed bank accounts), banks just don't have time and effort to deal with those security charges by the finance inspection organization, so they shutdown your account to buy some peace
If you buy and sell bitcoins privately, you will get many strange scam and payments from illegal activities like stolen accounts, selling drug or weapon, and money laundering scheme. Naturally the law enforcement will find your account info during some mission and ask bank why you are connected with such people
Since you don't personally know these guys, so you are not responsible, banks security department can't charge you, but they would simply shutdown your account to avoid further trouble
I don't think they really care threat of bitcoin, bitcoin still worth so little, not worth worrying. If bitcoin really takes off and become some star investment, they can even make money out of it (providing physical secure storage, exchange, insurance etc...they have very strong security infrastructure, which bitcoin community are lacking)
If you buy and sell bitcoins privately, you will get many strange scam and payments from illegal activities like stolen accounts, selling drug or weapon, and money laundering scheme. Naturally the law enforcement will find your account info during some mission and ask bank why you are connected with such people
Since you don't personally know these guys, so you are not responsible, banks security department can't charge you, but they would simply shutdown your account to avoid further trouble
I don't think they really care threat of bitcoin, bitcoin still worth so little, not worth worrying. If bitcoin really takes off and become some star investment, they can even make money out of it (providing physical secure storage, exchange, insurance etc...they have very strong security infrastructure, which bitcoin community are lacking)
This happens all the time unfortunately. Banks are scared silly of Bitcoin. Cryptocurrency is a direct and tangible threat to the fractional reserve banking ponzi scheme...
thats true, but then there are scammers like yourself moriarty, which make your statements a little hypocritical
to turtle hurricane.
have you in the last few months ever done any:
1)localbitcoin trades
2)localbitcoin trades where the other party then attempted a wire transfer reversal on you (chargeback scammer tried to abuse you)
3)exchange transfers but never done localbitcoins
4)exchange transfers but never done and localbitcoins
5)other bitcoin related service(please list)
if exchanges were used, could you mention which main exchange you used especially the one used mostly near to the time of the 'decision'
i ask this as i am trying to build up a list of patterns from people finding banks not being friendly. to figure out what is triggering the decisions to close accounts
feel free to PM me details if you dont want the services used made public
have you in the last few months ever done any:
1)localbitcoin trades
2)localbitcoin trades where the other party then attempted a wire transfer reversal on you (chargeback scammer tried to abuse you)
3)exchange transfers but never done localbitcoins
4)exchange transfers but never done and localbitcoins
5)other bitcoin related service(please list)
if exchanges were used, could you mention which main exchange you used especially the one used mostly near to the time of the 'decision'
i ask this as i am trying to build up a list of patterns from people finding banks not being friendly. to figure out what is triggering the decisions to close accounts
feel free to PM me details if you dont want the services used made public
You don't need an MSB license to trade Bitcoin, period. It's considered property, not currency.
Is this a joke? You obviously have not been keeping up with recent legalities when it comes to buying/selling bitcoins. Our US government is confused as hell when categorizing bitcoin. One branch (IRS) claims it as property, hence will get taxed as such, but another branch (FINCEN) deems it as a currency.
What do you think happened to Mike Caldwell and his Casascius coins? Do you think he just stopped making them because he got bored of making money? This is exactly why TitanBTC now has license and is regulated by FINCEN before selling their coins.
Sad to read this, because it will make things a lot harder for the people affected in the short-midterm. On the other hand - nice to read this, because banks are starting to take themselves out of business with such behavior. Banks generating pissed off ex-customers will only help bitcoin adoption.
Bitcoin is the future. Bank can either adapt or die. It seems that most choose the latter option.
ya.ya.yo!
Bitcoin is the future. Bank can either adapt or die. It seems that most choose the latter option.
ya.ya.yo!
A review of your posting history reveals you aren't just trading through exchanges but also sell directly. No wonder you were banned.
I've heard this happening way too much. I have an account at wells fargo and used to transfer my bitcoins from mining to my personal account. So far, I haven't had an issue, but I have only transfered a little bit since last December, before banks really knew what bitcoin was. The best thing to do is never mention bitcoin, I wonder if coinbase is on their radar.
We all want banks to eventually go away, but right now we have to have them, no other way to turn our coin into fiat when needed. Well, there is, but its a pain. Buy gold, have it shipped, then sell gold at pawn shop. That may be the future of selling coin, but for now, Im hodling but it would nice to know that my account is safe..
We all want banks to eventually go away, but right now we have to have them, no other way to turn our coin into fiat when needed. Well, there is, but its a pain. Buy gold, have it shipped, then sell gold at pawn shop. That may be the future of selling coin, but for now, Im hodling but it would nice to know that my account is safe..
Bitpay, Coinbase or Overstock can apply for their own banking license if the banks are stupid enough to close their accts. We're talking millions of dollars monthly here.
A review of your posting history reveals you aren't just trading through exchanges but also sell directly. No wonder you were banned.
Jump to: