Over at these:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=22426.640
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=9047.520
FPGA is used exclusively with the actual costs of the boards being designed somewhat equivalent. Mhash's are about a quarter of the Butterfly labs card though but wattage is similar, they do say they use a combination of ASIC and FPGA.
ASIC can handle loop unrolling while outsource the hashing to the fpga? The open source crew are trying to fit everything on to the FPGA and were running into real estate issues. For the price the ASIC would most likely have to be off the shelf though.
My bet is that they have a solution, but it will still take a year to pay for itself.
Topic: 1GH/s, 20w, $500 — Butterflylabs, is it a scam? - page 48. (Read 123109 times)
Also, if they fail to deliver the products and your pre order money was just use to prototype etc. then you are really screwed. Pre ordering is pretty risky IMHO I never do it not even if they promise the moon and beyond 
Have I misunderstood something or doesn't PayPal allow cancellation of payments within 60 days? I'm not saying this isn't a scam, I have no idea whether it's a scam, but as far as I know, you can cancel a payment when done via PayPal within 60 days. As far as I've understood, in case of PayPal, the burden of proof for the buyer is relatively small, while in the case of the seller it's heavier. I'd never sell anything while charging via PayPal, but buying seems pretty safe to me (based on the stories I've heard).Have anyone had other experiences with PayPal?
Paypal policy is 45 days. A CC usually allows 60 days but the standard scam is to promise shipping in 8 weeks, and then there is a slight "delay" but don't worry we will give you upgraded shipping in x days. x days happens to be just past 60 days and when nothing arrives you have no recourse to a chargeback per your credit card agreement.
Also, if they fail to deliver the products and your pre order money was just use to prototype etc. then you are really screwed. Pre ordering is pretty risky IMHO I never do it not even if they promise the moon and beyond
Have I misunderstood something or doesn't PayPal allow cancellation of payments within 60 days? I'm not saying this isn't a scam, I have no idea whether it's a scam, but as far as I know, you can cancel a payment when done via PayPal within 60 days. As far as I've understood, in case of PayPal, the burden of proof for the buyer is relatively small, while in the case of the seller it's heavier. I'd never sell anything while charging via PayPal, but buying seems pretty safe to me (based on the stories I've heard).Have anyone had other experiences with PayPal?
If they did not make the pre order 500 bucks fiasco then there would not be any money to run away with 
in the first place.
Also, if they fail to deliver the products and your pre order money was just use to prototype etc. then you are really screwed. Pre ordering is pretty risky IMHO I never do it not even if they promise the moon and beyond
Fools and their money.
in the first place. Also, if they fail to deliver the products and your pre order money was just use to prototype etc. then you are really screwed. Pre ordering is pretty risky IMHO I never do it not even if they promise the moon and beyond
Fools and their money.
I preordered Skyrim. First time I've ever pre-ordered anything. Steam better deliver, goddamnit.
Well I think we both agree the risk is different if pre-ordering from a reputable company like Steam which has delivered before in the past and is well known compared to the risk of pre-ordering from a random startup located in a restaurant that has not delivered anything but a couple of pretty pics yet etc.
I think he was making a joke and likewise he isn't eternally concerned about exchange rate between bacon covered hotdogs and fiat currency.
If they did not make the pre order 500 bucks fiasco then there would not be any money to run away with in the first place.
Also, if they fail to deliver the products and your pre order money was just use to prototype etc. then you are really screwed. Pre ordering is pretty risky IMHO I never do it not even if they promise the moon and beyond
Fools and their money.
in the first place. Also, if they fail to deliver the products and your pre order money was just use to prototype etc. then you are really screwed. Pre ordering is pretty risky IMHO I never do it not even if they promise the moon and beyond
Fools and their money.
I preordered Skyrim. First time I've ever pre-ordered anything. Steam better deliver, goddamnit.
Well I think we both agree the risk is different if pre-ordering from a reputable company like Steam which has delivered before in the past and is well known compared to the risk of pre-ordering from a random startup located in a restaurant that has not delivered anything but a couple of pretty pics yet etc.
If they did not make the pre order 500 bucks fiasco then there would not be any money to run away with in the first place.
Also, if they fail to deliver the products and your pre order money was just use to prototype etc. then you are really screwed. Pre ordering is pretty risky IMHO I never do it not even if they promise the moon and beyond
Fools and their money.
in the first place. Also, if they fail to deliver the products and your pre order money was just use to prototype etc. then you are really screwed. Pre ordering is pretty risky IMHO I never do it not even if they promise the moon and beyond
Fools and their money.
I preordered Skyrim. First time I've ever pre-ordered anything. Steam better deliver, goddamnit.
If they did not make the pre order 500 bucks fiasco then there would not be any money to run away with in the first place.
Also, if they fail to deliver the products and your pre order money was just use to prototype etc. then you are really screwed. Pre ordering is pretty risky IMHO I never do it not even if they promise the moon and beyond
Fools and their money.
in the first place. Also, if they fail to deliver the products and your pre order money was just use to prototype etc. then you are really screwed. Pre ordering is pretty risky IMHO I never do it not even if they promise the moon and beyond
Fools and their money.
I sincerely wish we would have made it to release before someone mentioned us on this forum.
Launching a website and asking for pre-orders didn't help.
baaaaaaaaaaam. they seem to have the PR approach of a child with asperger's.
I sincerely wish we would have made it to release before someone mentioned us on this forum.
Launching a website and asking for pre-orders didn't help.
Interesting tidbit on the BFL preorder page:
"Funds: Pre-order funds are not held in escrow so if you aren't comfortable with our using your payment to prepare your product, you are encouraged to wait and make your order after post production units become available at the standard price of $599."
The short version: NO REFUNDS!
BFL, if you care to dispel these ongoing rumors that you're not a real business, here's what you can do: invite Inaba to stop by your offices and show him around. Show him your lab space and equipment. Let him hook one of your test units up to his pool for a few minutes.
You can refute all of the nay-sayers, myself included, by giving a trusted member of the bitcoin community a peek at your stuff. If Inaba says you're legit then I'm on board too.
"Funds: Pre-order funds are not held in escrow so if you aren't comfortable with our using your payment to prepare your product, you are encouraged to wait and make your order after post production units become available at the standard price of $599."
The short version: NO REFUNDS!
BFL, if you care to dispel these ongoing rumors that you're not a real business, here's what you can do: invite Inaba to stop by your offices and show him around. Show him your lab space and equipment. Let him hook one of your test units up to his pool for a few minutes.
You can refute all of the nay-sayers, myself included, by giving a trusted member of the bitcoin community a peek at your stuff. If Inaba says you're legit then I'm on board too.
Completely agree. This is why I keep thinking this is a scam. Lots of promises and no delivering to anyone ? Live demo event ? When ? Where ?
Interesting tidbit on the BFL preorder page:
"Funds: Pre-order funds are not held in escrow so if you aren't comfortable with our using your payment to prepare your product, you are encouraged to wait and make your order after post production units become available at the standard price of $599."
The short version: NO REFUNDS!
BFL, if you care to dispel these ongoing rumors that you're not a real business, here's what you can do: invite Inaba to stop by your offices and show him around. Show him your lab space and equipment. Let him hook one of your test units up to his pool for a few minutes.
You can refute all of the nay-sayers, myself included, by giving a trusted member of the bitcoin community a peek at your stuff. If Inaba says you're legit then I'm on board too.
"Funds: Pre-order funds are not held in escrow so if you aren't comfortable with our using your payment to prepare your product, you are encouraged to wait and make your order after post production units become available at the standard price of $599."
The short version: NO REFUNDS!
BFL, if you care to dispel these ongoing rumors that you're not a real business, here's what you can do: invite Inaba to stop by your offices and show him around. Show him your lab space and equipment. Let him hook one of your test units up to his pool for a few minutes.
You can refute all of the nay-sayers, myself included, by giving a trusted member of the bitcoin community a peek at your stuff. If Inaba says you're legit then I'm on board too.
Well I disagree less is more.
I actually agree with you 100% -- less is more. But it still has to be well-designed and intuitive. Google and Apple both accomplish this nicely.Edit: Having a search box in the *header* that changes depending on context and doesn't notify the user about it is not intuitive. Being in the header implies that it is site-wide, and nowhere is the user clued in that their search was magically limited (when they didn't expect it).
These problems would all be fixed if there was a notice on the search results:
* "Searching in thread X, search entire board"
* "Searching in forum X, search entire board"
clicking the link would run the search again, without the limit.
Well I disagree less is more.
Kinda like:
Kinda like:
Yeah, the search function only works for whatever subsection you are in, so if it's a thread, it searches the thread, or if you are on a sub-board, it'll only search that.
*puts on UX design hat*
1. Not very discoverable
2. Hinders searching whole site (you have to go back to the index to search the whole site?)
3. Many users may not realize their search had been limited by thread/forum and give up searching
Not too impressive, I must say.
Search should be a drop down with two search boxes, one to search everywhere, and a context-sensitive search box labeled "search thread" or "search forum" depending on where you are.
What we need is a "search in thread" feature.
We have one. Just use the search box while in a thread.
Yeah, the search function only works for whatever subsection you are in, so if it's a thread, it searches the thread, or if you are on a sub-board, it'll only search that.
What we need is a "search in thread" feature.
We have one.
Just use the search box while in a thread. BF Labs Inc. will not be involving itself ...
Sorry for the stupid question... what state is Butterfly Labs incorporated in?read the entire thread before asking duplicate questions and making duplicate posts
Wouldn't it have been faster to just answer the question?
There is a BF Labs incorporated in WY in August of this year.
What we need is a "search in thread" feature.
Hi guys,
Just a quick note.
BF Labs Inc. will not be involving itself in any wagers. If our generous friend would follow through on their promise of a $10,000 bounty for producing a unit with performance as described, we'll be happy to claim that amount in the name of a charity of the board's choice. However, no such bounty has been placed in escrow and I don't think anyone truly expects our generous friend to follow through.
Regarding your individual wagers, I would be careful to allow for some upside flexibility in the performance claims. It would be unfortunate if you were to loose a wager should the unit exceed expectations, due to a badly worded bet definition.
I'm not saying the units perform differently than our purchase guarantee as stated on the site. Just choose your words carefully.
Kind regards,
BFL
Just a quick note.
BF Labs Inc. will not be involving itself in any wagers. If our generous friend would follow through on their promise of a $10,000 bounty for producing a unit with performance as described, we'll be happy to claim that amount in the name of a charity of the board's choice. However, no such bounty has been placed in escrow and I don't think anyone truly expects our generous friend to follow through.
Regarding your individual wagers, I would be careful to allow for some upside flexibility in the performance claims. It would be unfortunate if you were to loose a wager should the unit exceed expectations, due to a badly worded bet definition.
I'm not saying the units perform differently than our purchase guarantee as stated on the site. Just choose your words carefully.
Kind regards,
BFL
While you're here..
1. Did you receive my PM a few days ago?
2. Can you verify the board density in the 1050MHs unit. I.e. is it 1-dual chip board, or 2-dual chip boards? or what?
Cheers,
Derek
Hi. Yes, I received your PM and I will respond. I apologize for the delay, but I don't check the PM's frequently. I'll reply with my company email and we can continue that discussion there.
Regarding the board density, what you see is what you get. The posted photos are of the units we are preparing.
I understand speculation is rampant, and I sincerely wish we would have made it to release before someone mentioned us on this forum. Please be patient and allow us the time we need to finish our work. All questions will be answered to full satisfaction during our live demo event.
Thanks,
BFL
BF Labs Inc. will not be involving itself ...
Sorry for the stupid question... what state is Butterfly Labs incorporated in?read the entire thread before asking duplicate questions and making duplicate posts
Wouldn't it have been faster to just answer the question?
There is a BF Labs incorporated in WY in August of this year.
BF Labs Inc. will not be involving itself ...
Sorry for the stupid question... what state is Butterfly Labs incorporated in?read the entire thread before asking duplicate questions and making duplicate posts
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