Topic: [2019-06-07] India Proposes 10-Yr Jail For Crypto Use, May Introduce own crypto - page 2. (Read 8076 times)
June 11, 2019, 08:09:13 AM
This news has attracted a lot of attention from mainstream media here in India. The social media is also very active regarding this topic. And the best thing is that 90% of those who commented are fiercely against any move to penalize the Bitcoin holders. But then, the current government is being run by some religious hardliners and just a few months back they had banned porn!!
June 10, 2019, 10:11:50 AM
I am from India, and I don't think that this is fake news. First of all, the government had earlier also tried to ban cryptocurrency.
the worst thing a government can do is:
- be really serious about doing something
- failing to do it
because it makes them look weak (which is a pretty accurate description of their regulatory capabilities vis a vis cryptocurrencies; weak)
it's highly likely that the main reason no government has implemented a serious ban is because the are afraid it won't work, and they have too much to lose in those circumstances
so, that's not a very good reason. let's take a look at your 2nd reason
And secondly, this news was published in reputed sites and those who mentioned in this article have not denied it yet. But I have high hopes on the new financial minister. She is highly qualified and well educated.
all these so-called "reputed" news sites frequently back the government or corporate class' view of just about everything. So maybe the scare tactics are real, but the news is still (ugh) fake. A real report about something that's not going to happen is a real report, you're right about that, lol
The fact remains: no one, anywhere, has or will implement an effective ban. The governments appear to be "playing for time", as they say in sports commentary. Look what they've done with their time so far (10 whole years): a big, fat nothing
June 10, 2019, 09:04:05 AM
actually , every single news outlet has published the same paragraph and people from India are saying its fake news
the thing is that this abstract is taken out of context and it describes only if bitcoin is used in certain illegal activities as described in subsections (which they do not show)
so , generally this sounds like fake news , probably this regulation will be less stringent as everyone is expecting
but only time will tell , we shall see very soon what it is in reality
the thing is that this abstract is taken out of context and it describes only if bitcoin is used in certain illegal activities as described in subsections (which they do not show)
so , generally this sounds like fake news , probably this regulation will be less stringent as everyone is expecting
but only time will tell , we shall see very soon what it is in reality
I am from India, and I don't think that this is fake news. First of all, the government had earlier also tried to ban cryptocurrency. And secondly, this news was published in reputed sites and those who mentioned in this article have not denied it yet. But I have high hopes on the new financial minister. She is highly qualified and well educated.
June 10, 2019, 07:34:57 AM
I think that even though it is possible to write this into legislation, it's still somewhat of a scare tactic from the government.
The fact is that when you pursue these draconian measures and regulations surrounding bitcoin, you'll find that if you want to have any kind of enforceability you'll need to invest millions of dollars into transaction tracking mechanisms, investigations, etc. They're still essentially relying on people to follow these laws, which in practice probably will not happen even if they were implemented.
It still baffles me why they would go to such lengths to try and ban bitcoin, as opposed to integrating it as a legitimate part of their economy instead.
The fact is that when you pursue these draconian measures and regulations surrounding bitcoin, you'll find that if you want to have any kind of enforceability you'll need to invest millions of dollars into transaction tracking mechanisms, investigations, etc. They're still essentially relying on people to follow these laws, which in practice probably will not happen even if they were implemented.
It still baffles me why they would go to such lengths to try and ban bitcoin, as opposed to integrating it as a legitimate part of their economy instead.
actually , every single news outlet has published the same paragraph and people from India are saying its fake news
the thing is that this abstract is taken out of context and it describes only if bitcoin is used in certain illegal activities as described in subsections (which they do not show)
so , generally this sounds like fake news , probably this regulation will be less stringent as everyone is expecting
but only time will tell , we shall see very soon what it is in reality
June 09, 2019, 06:32:11 PM
I think that even though it is possible to write this into legislation, it's still somewhat of a scare tactic from the government.
The fact is that when you pursue these draconian measures and regulations surrounding bitcoin, you'll find that if you want to have any kind of enforceability you'll need to invest millions of dollars into transaction tracking mechanisms, investigations, etc. They're still essentially relying on people to follow these laws, which in practice probably will not happen even if they were implemented.
It still baffles me why they would go to such lengths to try and ban bitcoin, as opposed to integrating it as a legitimate part of their economy instead.
The fact is that when you pursue these draconian measures and regulations surrounding bitcoin, you'll find that if you want to have any kind of enforceability you'll need to invest millions of dollars into transaction tracking mechanisms, investigations, etc. They're still essentially relying on people to follow these laws, which in practice probably will not happen even if they were implemented.
It still baffles me why they would go to such lengths to try and ban bitcoin, as opposed to integrating it as a legitimate part of their economy instead.
June 09, 2019, 12:07:05 PM
its not a law just yet it is one of the bills
but this is simply the oddest and craziest proposal that I have seen:
they want to punish people for HOLDING, possessing cryptocurrencies , not trading, not mining - just having
and it is a non-bailable , up to 10 years imprisonment ... if it passes it would be the most retarded law ever
I pity my Indian brothers, the country has tons of problems as it is and they do not want to have troubles for simply having coins in their wallets
well , another thing is how on Earth are they planning to enforce the law , as ridiculous as it is , it has to be enforced to work
you can't expect the police to run after people in e-cafes who just opened an online bitcoin wallet or something
but this is simply the oddest and craziest proposal that I have seen:
they want to punish people for HOLDING, possessing cryptocurrencies , not trading, not mining - just having
and it is a non-bailable , up to 10 years imprisonment ... if it passes it would be the most retarded law ever
I pity my Indian brothers, the country has tons of problems as it is and they do not want to have troubles for simply having coins in their wallets
well , another thing is how on Earth are they planning to enforce the law , as ridiculous as it is , it has to be enforced to work
you can't expect the police to run after people in e-cafes who just opened an online bitcoin wallet or something
June 09, 2019, 11:15:54 AM
I didn't noticed this news until today, when one of my friends informed me about this. I am really concerned now about my coins. Spoke to some friends and the majority were planning to sell the coins soon. Only a few are planning to hold on to them in case the government bans BTC. I haven't decided what to do about it yet... but for sure I am not going to break any law.
June 09, 2019, 08:14:42 AM
The vast majority of the Indian population lives in urban slums and rural areas and most of them are ignorant about cryptocurrency. If the government labels Bitcoin as a currency of criminals and tax evaders, then these people will believe the government version without any reservation.
And secondly, I am not sure about the number of active Bitcoin users in India. A conservative estimate would be around 1 million. Out of that, the serious users may number around 100,000. Among this subgroup, I expect at least 80% to fall in line with the government directive and quit the cryptocurrency market. And what we can do with the remaining 20,000 individuals, in a country of 1.4 billion people?
And secondly, I am not sure about the number of active Bitcoin users in India. A conservative estimate would be around 1 million. Out of that, the serious users may number around 100,000. Among this subgroup, I expect at least 80% to fall in line with the government directive and quit the cryptocurrency market. And what we can do with the remaining 20,000 individuals, in a country of 1.4 billion people?
I watch some documentaries about India, and I have some idea how things work there. One of the big problems is education, some person (maybe the minister of education) say that India needs one new school every ten minutes, to educate all children - this is of course impossible. With less educated people, and a relatively poor infrastructure it's easier to manipulate people, especially if this involved a fear from ones who make laws.
You're probably right, it is difficult to imagine country with such huge number of people when whole Europe have around half of that number, and there is still no universal agreement how to deal with cryptocurrency. The things may not look good at this time for India, but there is always the possibility that all this remains only proposal.
June 09, 2019, 07:07:29 AM
Even though it seems like a remote possibility if it had happened for the rest of the world, I think that you need to take any rumours coming from the Indian government or the RBI very seriously, given the fact that it was wiling to essentially through the entire nation into a cash crunch for a publicity stunt of "cracking down on corruption".
Besides, it wouldn't be surprising if some negative action is taken in terms of crypto restrictions occur in the near future. They've already driven out the majority of crypto exchanges from their country due to the RBI restrictions on banks, which isn't getting lifted any time soon. They've also shown no interest in a new regulatory framework, which means that this type of thing is inevitable.
The irony here
Besides, it wouldn't be surprising if some negative action is taken in terms of crypto restrictions occur in the near future. They've already driven out the majority of crypto exchanges from their country due to the RBI restrictions on banks, which isn't getting lifted any time soon. They've also shown no interest in a new regulatory framework, which means that this type of thing is inevitable.
Quote
India Proposes 10-Yr Jail For Crypto Use, May Introduce own crypto
The irony here
June 09, 2019, 12:18:33 AM
For the past several days, I am trying to get the approximate number of Bitcoin users in India, but no reliable stats are available for the same. I found one Forbes article dated 2017, and it claims that there are some 1.5 million users in India:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/sindhujabalaji/2017/11/15/why-indias-bitcoin-scene-is-thriving-despite-a-cold-shoulder-from-the-central-bank/#30ca444b28cd
Since these figures are two years old, I expect that the numbers are higher now.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/sindhujabalaji/2017/11/15/why-indias-bitcoin-scene-is-thriving-despite-a-cold-shoulder-from-the-central-bank/#30ca444b28cd
Since these figures are two years old, I expect that the numbers are higher now.
June 08, 2019, 09:23:18 AM
There are two reasons why I believe that this news story is not fake. A few years back, RBI was quite serious about banning Bitcoin. At that point of time, some of the governmental advisers were in favor of this move and some others were opposed to it. Those who were opposed to it ultimately gained the upper hand and convinced the then RBI governor (Urjit Patel) that a ban can't be implemented. But even after that, there have been constant calls from the first camp to revise the policy.
India has the odds stacked against it when it comes to crypto, but that only makes it more likely for fud spreaders to exploit India's anti crypto attitude in order to have the price move down, which it didn't in this case. I want to see them either accept or reject it, and as long as that isn't the case I don't add much value to rumors.Secondly, this news has appeared in some of the most reliable mainstream media outlets, such as Bloomberg and Money control (the latter is the number one financial website in India).
I am not aware of Money Control's integrity when it comes to their publications, but Bloomberg has proven to not be a reliable news outlet at all. They have released negative news articles about Bitcoin in the past that turned out to be fake. They also seem to be anti Bitcoin, so it doesn't surprise me at all that they spread fake news. 
June 08, 2019, 09:18:10 AM
There are two reasons why I believe that this news story is not fake. A few years back, RBI was quite serious about banning Bitcoin. At that point of time, some of the governmental advisers were in favor of this move and some others were opposed to it. Those who were opposed to it ultimately gained the upper hand and convinced the then RBI governor (Urjit Patel) that a ban can't be implemented. But even after that, there have been constant calls from the first camp to revise the policy.
Secondly, this news has appeared in some of the most reliable mainstream media outlets, such as Bloomberg and Money control (the latter is the number one financial website in India).
Secondly, this news has appeared in some of the most reliable mainstream media outlets, such as Bloomberg and Money control (the latter is the number one financial website in India).
https://www.coindesk.com/reserve-bank-of-india-denies-involvement-in-draft-bill-to-ban-cryptocurrencies
The RBI is saying they know nothing about this at all. You'd expect them to have a teensy bit of input into something so fundamental. Then again nothing is surprising about politics.
I have seen various Indian people on social media say that they aren't aware of this news at all. They're either not following the right local news sources, or this whole story is bogus meant to drag the price down. We have seen various fake news attempts already to manipulate the price and it wouldn't suprise me if this fits in that category too.
Considering that the smart money isn't reacting to this I would say this story is bogus, or the market doesn't care about India, which would be a good outcome in case it turns out to be true. Time will tell.
Considering that the smart money isn't reacting to this I would say this story is bogus, or the market doesn't care about India, which would be a good outcome in case it turns out to be true. Time will tell.
No one care what India does. The only time news like this affects things is in regions with strong markets. India has never been one of those regions. There may be lots of people there. Hardly any of them have much to do with BTC.
June 08, 2019, 08:58:12 AM
I have seen various Indian people on social media say that they aren't aware of this news at all. They're either not following the right local news sources, or this whole story is bogus meant to drag the price down. We have seen various fake news attempts already to manipulate the price and it wouldn't suprise me if this fits in that category too.
Considering that the smart money isn't reacting to this I would say this story is bogus, or the market doesn't care about India, which would be a good outcome in case it turns out to be true. Time will tell.
Considering that the smart money isn't reacting to this I would say this story is bogus, or the market doesn't care about India, which would be a good outcome in case it turns out to be true. Time will tell.
There are two reasons why I believe that this news story is not fake. A few years back, RBI was quite serious about banning Bitcoin. At that point of time, some of the governmental advisers were in favor of this move and some others were opposed to it. Those who were opposed to it ultimately gained the upper hand and convinced the then RBI governor (Urjit Patel) that a ban can't be implemented. But even after that, there have been constant calls from the first camp to revise the policy.
Secondly, this news has appeared in some of the most reliable mainstream media outlets, such as Bloomberg and Money control (the latter is the number one financial website in India).
June 08, 2019, 07:43:58 AM
A bit too much noise going on in the past few weeks/months re India and their goings on with crypto. What I'd really like to know about this so-called draft regulation is, who's behind it exactly?
You'd think it's at least got a shade of the central bank but RBI's response this week to a Rights to Information request flat out says they were never involved in it.
So it's just the mysterious government officials... so they're going to jail all their rich guys and Bollywood crypto influencers now?
You'd think it's at least got a shade of the central bank but RBI's response this week to a Rights to Information request flat out says they were never involved in it.
So it's just the mysterious government officials... so they're going to jail all their rich guys and Bollywood crypto influencers now?
I have seen various Indian people on social media say that they aren't aware of this news at all. They're either not following the right local news sources, or this whole story is bogus meant to drag the price down. We have seen various fake news attempts already to manipulate the price and it wouldn't suprise me if this fits in that category too.
Considering that the smart money isn't reacting to this I would say this story is bogus, or the market doesn't care about India, which would be a good outcome in case it turns out to be true. Time will tell.
June 08, 2019, 07:34:19 AM
But voting for another party is hardly going to bring any change. As far as I know, none of the political parties have supported the idea of legalizing Bitcoin in India. Also, Bitcoin users are not an important voting bloc in India.
I've already asked a question about the existence of political alternatives, and if there is no real one, then people in India who want changes should take action in this matter. Is it possible that there are no young and educated people to launch a party that would be friendly toward cryptocurrency?
The vast majority of the Indian population lives in urban slums and rural areas and most of them are ignorant about cryptocurrency. If the government labels Bitcoin as a currency of criminals and tax evaders, then these people will believe the government version without any reservation.
And secondly, I am not sure about the number of active Bitcoin users in India. A conservative estimate would be around 1 million. Out of that, the serious users may number around 100,000. Among this subgroup, I expect at least 80% to fall in line with the government directive and quit the cryptocurrency market. And what we can do with the remaining 20,000 individuals, in a country of 1.4 billion people?
June 08, 2019, 07:33:44 AM
A bit too much noise going on in the past few weeks/months re India and their goings on with crypto. What I'd really like to know about this so-called draft regulation is, who's behind it exactly?
You'd think it's at least got a shade of the central bank but RBI's response this week to a Rights to Information request flat out says they were never involved in it.
So it's just the mysterious government officials... so they're going to jail all their rich guys and Bollywood crypto influencers now?
You'd think it's at least got a shade of the central bank but RBI's response this week to a Rights to Information request flat out says they were never involved in it.
So it's just the mysterious government officials... so they're going to jail all their rich guys and Bollywood crypto influencers now?
June 08, 2019, 05:52:35 AM
Back in 2016, almost 90% of the fiat currency was made invalid and for many months after that the people faced extreme difficulty in making payments. The reason given was that the government want to encourage digital transactions and they want to punish the individuals who hold unaccounted money. Almost the entire population was affected by that measure and still the government was voted back to power (with an enlarged majority).
Indeed. Which is why I think this is much more credible than the average threat. They're just about mindless and nasty enough to do it. If that's what the people want to do to themselves then they're welcome to it.
June 08, 2019, 05:18:13 AM
In any way, Bitcoin is unstoppable and you can still hide ownership of your bitcoins and then spend them online or in another country where they are Bitcoin friendly. I would hoard the coins and then take a Bitcoin holiday in another country and spend money like crazy... Fck them out of taxes, because they do not deserve the taxes on Bitcoin if they ban it.
I think people do not just have to comply with the laws which limit fundamental human freedoms, and in this case even if you hold some crypto it is a criminal offense - even China does not have such strict laws. If the person is cautious and does not use any official channels for buying / selling crypto, I think it can stay under the radar of authority.
But voting for another party is hardly going to bring any change. As far as I know, none of the political parties have supported the idea of legalizing Bitcoin in India. Also, Bitcoin users are not an important voting bloc in India.
I've already asked a question about the existence of political alternatives, and if there is no real one, then people in India who want changes should take action in this matter. Is it possible that there are no young and educated people to launch a party that would be friendly toward cryptocurrency?
June 08, 2019, 01:54:04 AM
Was unable to finish reading the article but I knew India is a country which has different ethic and belief (religious) long ago and the rules/regulations used a some certain states are not accept or allow in some other States which was also the reason why it hard for crypto currency to be legalized there. However, what I read acoupke of days back is that crypto trading, holding and selling is allow in India and there even a couple of months old exchange site (wazrix) which I think it from there.
Is there something I'm missing?
Is there something I'm missing?
Nope. It's a proposal, nothing more. However what makes this stand out is the people who are proposing are influential and India's viciousness when it comes to screwing with the financial freedom of their people. It's extreme but the things they've already carried out are extreme.
Back in 2016, almost 90% of the fiat currency was made invalid and for many months after that the people faced extreme difficulty in making payments. The reason given was that the government want to encourage digital transactions and they want to punish the individuals who hold unaccounted money. Almost the entire population was affected by that measure and still the government was voted back to power (with an enlarged majority).
June 07, 2019, 07:34:22 PM
Was unable to finish reading the article but I knew India is a country which has different ethic and belief (religious) long ago and the rules/regulations used a some certain states are not accept or allow in some other States which was also the reason why it hard for crypto currency to be legalized there. However, what I read acoupke of days back is that crypto trading, holding and selling is allow in India and there even a couple of months old exchange site (wazrix) which I think it from there.
Is there something I'm missing?
Is there something I'm missing?
Nope. It's a proposal, nothing more. However what makes this stand out is the people who are proposing are influential and India's viciousness when it comes to screwing with the financial freedom of their people. It's extreme but the things they've already carried out are extreme.
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