A Texas Town’s Misery Underscores the Impact of Bitcoin Mines Across the U.S. - page 3.

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: philipma1957 on August 15, 2024, 10:55:23 PM

Bitcoin is a tool which can be used for good or bad.

This forum is a tool to be used for good or bad.

I bolded a line above. That is you using the forum for bad.

Sad because this was a really decent thread you opened.

And you just shit all over the place.

The reality is Pennsylvania and Texas had shit laws and shit companies decided to behave in a shit manner.

And bitcoin is wrongly stated to m be the bad guy.

Maybe bitcoin needs to transition to something more environmentally friendly so that it doesn't cause so much noise pollution and fossil fuel useage. I can't be neutral about something like that. sorry.

Unfortunately it seems like you feel like because states don't have specific laws about being an a-hole to your neighbor, you can go ahead and do it and that's not your fault? actually you agree that these were shit companies acting bad. so good for you but it shouldn't take laws to stop a-holes from being a-holes.

philipma1957

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on August 15, 2024, 09:11:03 PM

https://www.lancasterfarming.com/country-life/outdoors/pennsylvania-game-commission-working-to-quiet-noise-concerns-from-bitcoin-mine/article_f5d37020-54bf-11ef-87f5-a3df59f854c0.html

In 2022, an energy company established a bitcoin mine — large generators and banks of computers to generate the cryptocurrency — on a gas well pad on the game lands in Horton Township.

The operation was powered by natural gas from the well, and noise from the cooling fans soon began to annoy neighbors and users of the game land.

so they are running generators from the natural gas from the well, polluting the environment with combustion byproducts and also noise pollution and they didn't even ask for permission or anything. That's about the most environmentally unfriendly way to mine bitcoin there is. Using gas from wells. . Bitcoin sucks.

Bitcoin is a tool which can be used for good or bad.

This forum is a tool to be used for good or bad.

I bolded a line above. That is you using the forum for bad.

Sad because this was a really decent thread you opened.

And you just shit all over the place.

The reality is Pennsylvania and Texas had shit laws and shit companies decided to behave in a shit manner.

And bitcoin is wrongly stated to m be the bad guy.

larry_vw_1955

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https://www.lancasterfarming.com/country-life/outdoors/pennsylvania-game-commission-working-to-quiet-noise-concerns-from-bitcoin-mine/article_f5d37020-54bf-11ef-87f5-a3df59f854c0.html

In 2022, an energy company established a bitcoin mine — large generators and banks of computers to generate the cryptocurrency — on a gas well pad on the game lands in Horton Township.

The operation was powered by natural gas from the well, and noise from the cooling fans soon began to annoy neighbors and users of the game land.

so they are running generators from the natural gas from the well, polluting the environment with combustion byproducts and also noise pollution and they didn't even ask for permission or anything. That's about the most environmentally unfriendly way to mine bitcoin there is. Using gas from wells. Bitcoin sucks.

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Quote from: mikeywith on August 13, 2024, 06:25:08 PM

Quote from: DaveF on August 13, 2024, 09:48:23 AM

Just as a data point it's not impossible to do.
GE Aerospace, Rolls-Royce, Pratt & Whitney and others all have jet engine test facilities that you cannot hear a 100,000 lbf engine running full throttle from outside the building.

Now, is the cost of doing something like that worth it to a miner? Probably not. But don't say it can't be done.

-Dave

That's a good point, but those engines don't need to run 24/7/365, you don't have a dozen engines running at the same time and place, and the building has 4 walls, so soundproofing is very easy when cooling isn't an issue, with mining, it's a whole different level, you are basically operating with only 2 full walls, if you sum the remaining of the intake and exhaust walls maybe you get 3 walls at best.

As silly as it sounds, it's a lot easier to silence a fighter jet engine than to silence a miner. Cheesy

Miners also don't have the ability to generate enough air pressure to though a full size truck though the air.

I agree it's a totally different thing, just making the point that you can run something like that and not have people nearby notice there is no reason other then cost / time / effort that you can't have engineers do the same. Or at least make it quiet enough that the neighbors don't complain. There was a large mine in an old data center here on LI that was close to 2 MW it was on the 2nd floor of a building.

You would never have known that it was there if you were even on the 1st floor. BECAUSE IT WAS DESIGNED AS A PROPER DATA CENTER with cooling and insulation and everything else.

It's now hosting about 1MW of AI crap in about 20000 SQF and yet again stand outside and it's as quiet as a library. And AI stuff is running denser / hotter then miners.

-Dave

philipma1957

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on August 14, 2024, 07:19:17 PM

Quote from: mikeywith on August 14, 2024, 01:07:11 PM

At the scale of 300MW it might be cheaper if they paid a compensation to all affected houses, I don't what would be a good amount but i am sure some free monthly income would make the noise a lot more bearable, to a certain extent even comforting to hear.

the only fair compensation is to buy their house from them at above market prices so they can buy another house somewhere else. no one is going to be happy having to listen to noise even if you pay their cable bill...

it is fixable. 15 eh is

about 600000 a day or 220 million in gross income

Now they pay around 2.5 cents a kwatt and they get bonus money not to mine in the summer if it is hot.

so 300 x 24 = 7200 megawatts at 25 dollars each is 180,000 a day or 66 million

so they earn around 220-66 = 154,000,000 a year.

wow fuck what a sad fucking world the fine as I read is 500 a day or 182,500 a year.

so you make 154 million a year and get fined 182,500 a year

they should make all of the owners listen to the 103db

for months on end

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: mikeywith on August 14, 2024, 01:07:11 PM

At the scale of 300MW it might be cheaper if they paid a compensation to all affected houses, I don't what would be a good amount but i am sure some free monthly income would make the noise a lot more bearable, to a certain extent even comforting to hear.

the only fair compensation is to buy their house from them at above market prices so they can buy another house somewhere else. no one is going to be happy having to listen to noise even if you pay their cable bill...

mikeywith

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Quote from: philipma1957 on August 13, 2024, 06:36:25 PM

At the scale of 300MW it might be cheaper if they paid a compensation to all affected houses, I don't what would be a good amount but i am sure some free monthly income would make the noise a lot more bearable, to a certain extent even comforting to hear.

The above is not a joke, in my country, people who live next to cement factories and oil drilling areas where they flare gas and shit get some good benifit like health insurance and whatnot, since you can't build everything in places where nobody lives, might as well give them some of the profit.

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: philipma1957 on August 13, 2024, 12:28:36 AM

103 db nonstop sound is pretty much unbearable to live with.

well yeah that's why it prevents people from enjoying the use of their property and forces them to stay inside their house where maybe the noise level is lower. but not non-existant. it's probably still possible to hear it. apparently lawnmowers are only 75 to 95 dB so it's kind of equivalent to have a next door neighbor who runs their lawnmower 24/7/365. you're definitely going to be hearing it even if you're inside your house.

Quote

the plant should do a better job than 103 db.

but remember, they dont think there is a problem. they claim to be unaware of any noise issues. that's how it always is with people who cause these types of problems. you ask them if they can hear anything and they say "no". that's why the authorities always have to get involved because they will never do anything themself...

philipma1957

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Quote from: mikeywith on August 13, 2024, 06:25:08 PM

Quote from: DaveF on August 13, 2024, 09:48:23 AM

Just as a data point it's not impossible to do.
GE Aerospace, Rolls-Royce, Pratt & Whitney and others all have jet engine test facilities that you cannot hear a 100,000 lbf engine running full throttle from outside the building.

Now, is the cost of doing something like that worth it to a miner? Probably not. But don't say it can't be done.

-Dave

That's a good point, but those engines don't need to run 24/7/365, you don't have a dozen engines running at the same time and place, and the building has 4 walls, so soundproofing is very easy when cooling isn't an issue, with mining, it's a whole different level, you are basically operating with only 2 full walls, if you sum the remaining of the intake and exhaust walls maybe you get 3 walls at best.

As silly as it sounds, it's a lot easier to silence a fighter jet engine than to silence a miner. Cheesy

yeah but some containers properly done are pretty quiet.

texas is hot and dry. the container we switched to has a water wall which really helps cooling.

some where I have a photo of it on this site.

if all they used were these containers sound would not be 103db

these containers can do .6 megawatts. that means they would need 500 containers. we got ours on a fire sale about 25k

so thats 12.5 million and a fucking constant lake of water as one container uses 100gallons a day.

thats 50,000 gallons of water for 500 :hundred containers.

so serious money spent to cool and manage sound.

300 mega watt plant is fucking huge. as a mega watt will be 250 s21s

so 300 x 250 = 75,000 s21s which is

15,000,000 th
15,000. ph
15. eh

about 2.5% of the whole network.

mikeywith

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Quote from: DaveF on August 13, 2024, 09:48:23 AM

Just as a data point it's not impossible to do.
GE Aerospace, Rolls-Royce, Pratt & Whitney and others all have jet engine test facilities that you cannot hear a 100,000 lbf engine running full throttle from outside the building.

Now, is the cost of doing something like that worth it to a miner? Probably not. But don't say it can't be done.

-Dave

That's a good point, but those engines don't need to run 24/7/365, you don't have a dozen engines running at the same time and place, and the building has 4 walls, so soundproofing is very easy when cooling isn't an issue, with mining, it's a whole different level, you are basically operating with only 2 full walls, if you sum the remaining of the intake and exhaust walls maybe you get 3 walls at best.

As silly as it sounds, it's a lot easier to silence a fighter jet engine than to silence a miner. Cheesy

philipma1957

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Quote from: DaveF on August 13, 2024, 09:48:23 AM

Just as a data point it's not impossible to do.
GE Aerospace, Rolls-Royce, Pratt & Whitney and others all have jet engine test facilities that you cannot hear a 100,000 lbf engine running full throttle from outside the building.

Now, is the cost of doing something like that worth it to a miner? Probably not. But don't say it can't be done.

-Dave

yeah sound can be played with I would love to check out the mine to see what they did to attempt to lesson the sound.

DaveF

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Just as a data point it's not impossible to do.
GE Aerospace, Rolls-Royce, Pratt & Whitney and others all have jet engine test facilities that you cannot hear a 100,000 lbf engine running full throttle from outside the building.

Now, is the cost of doing something like that worth it to a miner? Probably not. But don't say it can't be done.

-Dave

philipma1957

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on August 12, 2024, 09:50:04 PM

Quote from: mikeywith on August 12, 2024, 04:48:57 AM

I don't know the whole context, but it is possible that they meant they were not aware that the noise reaches that far

they can't go out into the community and see if the noise reaches it ? but yet they can spend millions of dollars to set up a mining facility. i call BS on that. they were just hoping no one would complain.

Shirley says that he is monitoring the decibel levels of the facility. Texas state law stipulates that a noise is considered unreasonable if it exceeds 85 decibels. For comparison, vacuum cleaners often run at around 75 decibels—and a cardiologist told TIME in 2018 that chronic exposure to anything over 60 decibels had the potential to do harm to the cardiovascular system. Shadden took her own readings at her house near the Bitcoin mining facility that reached 103 decibels.

103 decibels seems like a very large noise level to have to listen to 24/7/365. But I'm not sure I believe some of those residents saying how they had all kinds of health problems from the noise. I think people have a way of lying about stuff like that. Just to try and make a point. Noise doesn't cause tumors and things like that. So those residents should stick to the truth and not try and embellish anything. It just makes them look bad when they do that.

103 db nonstop sound is pretty much unbearable to live with.

the plant should do a better job than 103 db.

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: mikeywith on August 12, 2024, 04:48:57 AM

I don't know the whole context, but it is possible that they meant they were not aware that the noise reaches that far

they can't go out into the community and see if the noise reaches it ? but yet they can spend millions of dollars to set up a mining facility. i call BS on that. they were just hoping no one would complain.

Shirley says that he is monitoring the decibel levels of the facility. Texas state law stipulates that a noise is considered unreasonable if it exceeds 85 decibels. For comparison, vacuum cleaners often run at around 75 decibels—and a cardiologist told TIME in 2018 that chronic exposure to anything over 60 decibels had the potential to do harm to the cardiovascular system. Shadden took her own readings at her house near the Bitcoin mining facility that reached 103 decibels.

103 decibels seems like a very large noise level to have to listen to 24/7/365. But I'm not sure I believe some of those residents saying how they had all kinds of health problems from the noise. I think people have a way of lying about stuff like that. Just to try and make a point. Noise doesn't cause tumors and things like that. So those residents should stick to the truth and not try and embellish anything. It just makes them look bad when they do that.

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on August 12, 2024, 01:04:55 AM

those people that work at the mining operation must be lying to the press when they say that they didn't notice the loud noises then Shocked

either that or they have severe hearing loss and that's why they don't notice but it sounds like somewhere that would be unbearable to work. job benefits: $20 per hour plus hearing loss

I don't know the whole context, but it is possible that they meant they were not aware that the noise reaches that far, maybe they park their car right next to the farm, wear those heavy ear protection, walk in, do the work, jump back to the car.

I mean unless they stand near those houses -- they won't be able to tell, but to say they did not know that miners make a ton of loud noise would be a straightout lie.

@phill, yup the more you try silence them, the hotter they get, at 7000 rpm even a single miner can make up to 90 decibles at 10 meter distance.

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: mikeywith on August 11, 2024, 08:07:48 PM

Many people underestimate the noise level that miners make, but in a farm where we had no more than 200 something miners, right on the exhaust side, it was as loud as 120-130db, which is as loud as a jet, powerful it could break your ear drum if you stay there for too long without wearing ears protection.

those people that work at the mining operation must be lying to the press when they say that they didn't notice the loud noises then Shocked

either that or they have severe hearing loss and that's why they don't notice but it sounds like somewhere that would be unbearable to work. job benefits: $20 per hour plus hearing loss

philipma1957

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Quote from: mikeywith on August 11, 2024, 08:07:48 PM

Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on July 30, 2024, 01:59:08 AM

i'm not really sure what a "sound wall" is exactly. but the mining operators like to spit out that phrase as though it's the solution to the noise problem when i'm not really sure how effective those things are.

They are somewhat effective, if you have ever lived next to a highway you would be able to tell. Cheesy

Obviously, they won't make those massive farms 100% silent, from personal experience, I was able to hear "very slightly" the noise from my farm from a 2 km distance, it was on a quiet winter night, obviously, if you don't know where the sound is coming from, at that distance it would just sound like a truck engine somewhere a bit far, but once your ears grasp what miners noise actually is, you will be able to tell, the whistling sound that miners make due to heatsink design and high RPMs is exceptional.

Many people underestimate the noise level that miners make, but in a farm where we had no more than 200 something miners, right on the exhaust side, it was as loud as 120-130db, which is as loud as a jet, powerful it could break your ear drum if you stay there for too long without wearing ears protection.

One thing that would bring the noise level down close to silent for those who live like 1000 meters away would be to get the fans to spin below 3000RPM, that's when they get very quiet, if they spin anywhere near 7000RPM no sound barrier on planet earth would stop the noise from traveling a few kilometers away.

yeah there is some you can do. but if you are sticking with stock 7000 rpm fans that come with the s21 they are noisy . and you need more space to lower sounds .

you can not restrict the airflow too much or you won’t cool the gear.

you also need to be willing to lose hash rate if you aircool in the summer and the temps are over 35c or 93 f

hot weather hurts air cooling a lot.

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on July 30, 2024, 01:59:08 AM

i'm not really sure what a "sound wall" is exactly. but the mining operators like to spit out that phrase as though it's the solution to the noise problem when i'm not really sure how effective those things are.

They are somewhat effective, if you have ever lived next to a highway you would be able to tell. Cheesy

Obviously, they won't make those massive farms 100% silent, from personal experience, I was able to hear "very slightly" the noise from my farm from a 2 km distance, it was on a quiet winter night, obviously, if you don't know where the sound is coming from, at that distance it would just sound like a truck engine somewhere a bit far, but once your ears grasp what miners noise actually is, you will be able to tell, the whistling sound that miners make due to heatsink design and high RPMs is exceptional.

Many people underestimate the noise level that miners make, but in a farm where we had no more than 200 something miners, right on the exhaust side, it was as loud as 120-130db, which is as loud as a jet, powerful it could break your ear drum if you stay there for too long without wearing ears protection.

One thing that would bring the noise level down close to silent for those who live like 1000 meters away would be to get the fans to spin below 3000RPM, that's when they get very quiet, if they spin anywhere near 7000RPM no sound barrier on planet earth would stop the noise from traveling a few kilometers away.

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: philipma1957 on August 03, 2024, 08:32:10 PM

................................................... !
................................................... ! !
good sound walls are .................... ! ! !

two, three or four layers the sound is forced to angle up an away

or https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aGRhEmZaO8

I had 4 of these they sent the sound up they were 30 inches with 24 inch fans

this was good enough to not be loud

hmm i thought sound walls were walls on the perimeter of the building kind of like a huge fence but solid but from that video it looks like they are inside the building as part of the ceiling. that would certainly be cheaper to install something like that.

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on July 30, 2024, 01:59:08 AM

Quote from: NotATether on July 27, 2024, 03:21:55 AM

There are farms in suburban areas without sound walls??

Always thought this was a generally accepted requirement.

i'm not really sure what a "sound wall" is exactly. but the mining operators like to spit out that phrase as though it's the solution to the noise problem when i'm not really sure how effective those things are. i guess each situation has to be evaluated on a case by case basis to see if the sound level is acceptable for people that live nearby. but to me, any noise at all that can still be heard decreases the quality of life of those residents and i am sure they feel the same way. unless you can eliminate 100% of the noise then it's still going to bother some people.

................................................... !
................................................... ! !
good sound walls are .................... ! ! !

two, three or four layers the sound is forced to angle up an away

or https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aGRhEmZaO8

I had 4 of these they sent the sound up they were 30 inches with 24 inch fans

this was good enough to not be loud

https://roofvents.com/retrofit-gravity-vents-aura-vent/av-30-rf-aura-vent-30-inch-diameter-retrofit/

if you added the fan they moved 3000cfm

if you got a 48 inch and added a fan they moved 7000 cfm

very quiet since much of the noise is muffled by the vents

Topic: A Texas Town’s Misery Underscores the Impact of Bitcoin Mines Across the U.S. - page 3. (Read 1408 times)